The Jedi Knight, and Sith Warrior classes need a huge buff.

[Xann]

Just when I was trying to figure out ways to like this game you go and say this...

 

Wow.

 

 

 

Wait...what? You don't like the idea of someone who chooses to solo be able to complete their own heroic story...solo?

 

You know that players can STILL FORM GROUPS, right?

 

I don't get how this is a bad thing.

 

Oh right. We all have to like what you like. Right.

[Battro]

Just when I was trying to figure out ways to like this game you go and say this...

 

Wow.

 

I group with a friend of mine for nearly everything, from planet arcs to heroics to bonus series missions, but as a rule we both solo all of our class content for spoilers' sake. I'd be pretty miffed if my friend or I were forced to spoil one another on the class stories (particularly because my friend has an agent that has progressed quite a bit less than my own!) because they tuned the content to require a group.

[dbbullock]

Hi guys,

 

There are many different subjects discussed in this thread and I would like to take the opportunity to give you some information on the topics at hand.

 

First off, we currently have no indication that any class needs a huge buff. Class balance is defined by the interaction between classes and changes we make to one class will, inevitably, move the balance towards or from other classes. Our data and testing currently indicates that the Juggernaut and Guardian AC could use some buffing up in two areas where we see them underperforming against our expectations.

 

Here are some of the things we're planning to roll out in the short term specifically regarding Sith Warriors and Jedi Knights :

 

• Mobility/Anti Kiting (PvP) – We agree with the sentiment voiced by the community that some Guardians and Juggernauts have to work harder than other classes to stay within effective combat range, putting them at a disadvantage. We intend to address this in an upcoming patch where, as a first step, Force Push will clear the cooldown of Force Leap, granting for more reliable in combat pursuit capabilities to the Advanced Class. Further changes will be made if necessary.
   
  
• DPS spec survivability (PvP and PvE) – The DPS specs on Guardian and Juggernaut are performing to our expectations when it comes to the ability to create damage, especially of the burst variety. However their survivability is lagging behind our expectations, especially in the later game, and we are going to start addressing that particular issue in an upcoming patch.

Our attention to the class obviously won't stop here. Balancing MMOs is a never ending endeavor and we're in for the long haul. For example, we are certainly aware that the Marauder and Sentinel are very gameplay intensive classes with some of the most complex rotations in the game. While we are currently looking at quality of life and usability improvements to increase the class' playability without compromising the unique aspects of the class, we don't have anything specific to announce just yet. We do however anticipate that some of the combat responsiveness improvements (AKA 'ability delay' - more on that here) being worked on by our engineering team will specifically aid both Marauder and Sentinel.

 

In regards to PvE balance, any place in the game where our data shows significant issues with the balance tuning for one or more classes or specs are of course also being looked at.

 

For example, Jedi Knights will be pleased to hear that we are working on tuning the final mission in their class chain to provide a better, more fun and more reliably solvable challenge (see a post from another member of my team here). Currently a large percentage of players bring a friend to solve this mission, which, while social and often more fun, is not in line with our stated goal of allowing players to progress solo through their class arc if they desire to do so. We're also looking at some companions with a critical eye to improve their viability for certain role/companion combinations.

 

I would also like to give you some general understanding about approach to class balancing and how you can aid us with your feedback:

 

• Now that we're out of the first few weeks of launch madness, you will see class and combat balance issues addressed with increased frequency. Larger scale gameplay changes and features are more likely to coincide with major content releases, but smaller scale changes and improvements can be expected to become part of our regular update schedule.
   
  
• Statements that we hate a specific class or faction, or that we intentionally underbalance certain classes to make it less popular are conspiracy theory territory. We have nothing to gain from such an approach – we want players to pick the class and faction they want to play and have confidence that they are able to perform their chosen role in the game. Anything that comes in the way of that goal is considered a balance issue for us.
   
  
• We make our balancing decisions based on a combination of internal and external testing and metrics. We don't make decisions based on who is the loudest on the forums. Community feedback is valuable in bringing issues to our attention and even to highlight possible solutions, which means that well written, constructive posts are the most effective way to communicate your wishes and feedback to us, rather than petitions and calls to nerf specific classes.
   
  
• Please understand that balance issues during the leveling process are different than issues at level 50 and are handled in different ways. If you feel your class has issues during your journey to 50, especially communicate the level range and area of the game where you are experiencing issues to aid our investigations. Player versus Player situations in during the leveling process are not always balanced at every level (a mathematical impossibility), but we are always willing to investigate.
   
  
• Just because we haven't mentioned the specific issue close to your heart in a post (such as the one above) doesn't mean we are unaware of it or that we don't want to address it. It would be impractical for us to comment on all investigations currently in the pipeline. That said, we definitely want to take a more open approach in regards to upcoming class changes.

 

Finally, I'd like to acknowledge, again, that we do understand that there is a desire for players to get more detailed information what happens to their character in combat. We agree with those requests and are working on various ways to, optionally, get more detailed data on your combat performance.

 

Thanks for your feedback!

 

-- Georg

 

I will say this - we do need the ability to stay in melee range. Give melee classes with snares a passive move-speed increase of 5% or so? That way, we ALWAYS have a passive benefit that doesn't require us to watch our CD's even more than we're already forced to do. It also doesn't force us to use very important positional abilities that already have a relatively short range to ... get in range? Seriously, waste a 1m cooldown so we can get 5 meters closer to our target. That's just great.

 

Secondly, our defense, even in non-Immortal specs, is fine. Intelligent use of our cooldowns gives us similar survivability to most other classes, barring Marauders, who have INSANE survivability. Instead, give us more reliable burst, or slightly tone up our passive damage to at least allow us to potentially outburst someone before they kill us. With no Relic buffs or Adrenals procced, my damage against similarly geared players (10% expertise) pretty much caps out at 2.5k crits on my hardest hitting abilities, thanks to a complete and total lack of Surge on PvP gear. I've had Operatives crit me with their Backstab for more than that when I've had the Expertise buff in Warzones, giving me over 25% expertise.

 

If we had offensive capabilities to make up for our defensive shortcomings, we'd be fine. The same works the other way, except bringing our defensive ability up to rival that of Powertech's or Sith Assassins still leaves us lightyears behind those classes in damage.

 

I'm geared in nearly full champion gear on my Jugg, yet even in a game with multiple pocket healers and the ability to stay on the offensive virtually 100% of the time, I still cannot break 300k damage in a full duration BG. That's not for lack of trying, or skill, or whatever. My build probably isn't ideal, since I don't run Rage, since I find it tedious and incredibly unfun to play, but is Vengeance so unviable in comparison that we should be the only AC in the game to be unable to get that medal, when other AC's can push 600-800k damage, nearly three times as much?

 

Yea, our damage is just fine[/], I'm sure.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Arzhanin
Rude comments

[SirSlayAlot]

 

Seriously..... Force push to refresh Leap? How in gods name do you honestly think those two work together?

 

I leap in. I get knockedback and snagged. I use force push to refresh leap. No can do... target out of range. Great idea.

 

 

And to say Guardians don't need a huge buff? Have you pvp'd at all... like ever in your own game? 10 times out of 10 you will see Guardians and Warriors at the bottom of the list.

Every..... single..... game....

 

 

Self healing hybrids are dominating. And there is nothing a Guardian can do about it.

Inquis casts self heal -> kick -> interupted -> Inquis casts heal again and again because kick doesn't silence it.

Point of kicking? Absolutely none, better off using that global for a offensive ability.

 

They outheal your damage output 3 to 1. Boy Pvp is just fun isn't it?

Edited January 11, 2012 by SirSlayAlot

[kendashFathbring]

 

Inquis casts self heal -> kick -> interupted -> Inquis casts heal again and again because kick doesn't silence it.

 

You just put the whole PvP issue in one sentence. There's nothing equal any tank can currently do to a caster that a caster can do to a tank. Root/Snare = Silence to a caster....but yeah, the interrupt is just broken. IF disruption/interrupt would actually do something instead of just having your target re-push another button, then it wouldn't be such a big issue.

[Waypoc]

Wait...what? You don't like the idea of someone who chooses to solo be able to complete their own heroic story...solo?

 

You know that players can STILL FORM GROUPS, right?

 

I don't get how this is a bad thing.

 

Oh right. We all have to like what you like. Right.

 

It's just the thinking on this is what's disturbing. It's a continuing trend in all things MMO.

 

Just my opinion.

[Covnam]

Hi guys,

 

• Mobility/Anti Kiting (PvP) – We agree with the sentiment voiced by the community that some Guardians and Juggernauts have to work harder than other classes to stay within effective combat range, putting them at a disadvantage. We intend to address this in an upcoming patch where, as a first step, Force Push will clear the cooldown of Force Leap, granting for more reliable in combat pursuit capabilities to the Advanced Class. Further changes will be made if necessary.

 

Our attention to the class obviously won't stop here. Balancing MMOs is a never ending endeavor and we're in for the long haul. For example, we are certainly aware that the Marauder and Sentinel are very gameplay intensive classes with some of the most complex rotations in the game. While we are currently looking at quality of life and usability improvements to increase the class' playability without compromising the unique aspects of the class, we don't have anything specific to announce just yet. We do however anticipate that some of the combat responsiveness improvements (AKA 'ability delay' - more on that here) being worked on by our engineering team will specifically aid both Marauder and Sentinel.

 

Thanks for your feedback!

 

-- Georg

 

As a Sentinel I find kiting to be an issue as well, so I hope that ways are being looked at for that class as well. I understand that as a melee dps class I can't expect to always be able to be on my target, but when I have to spin around to get a single hit in or get one hit and then I'm left out of range it's a little frustrating. I usually play a ranged dps class in mmo's so I don't know if this is par for the course, but I would like some more ways of dealing with that limited range. Even increasing the range of some of the Sentinel's few ranged attacks from 10m to 20 or 30m like Force Leap would be nice.

 

In regards to the complexity of Sentinels rotations I would definately have to agree on that and would like there to be a little trimming in that respect. I'm currently at level 47 and already I have 3 bars full of abilities and in an average boss fight (off the top of my head) I wouldn't be surprised if I use at least 10 different abilities. I don't have any other high level characters so I can't compare if they have a similar number of abilities, but I feel like that's a lot for a typical fight.

 

Too few options would be worse, but too many can be overkill.

[TerraFirmaGuild]

I'm a little confused at why your development team is trying to do a work around with refreshing our charge via push. Instead of replacing it with a pull. I'm no PvP designer or class designer, but this is just obvious stuff that comes easy to anyone actually playing the class. So say you want me to gap close easier. A Sage gains 20 yards on me after knocking me back after I charge, so I now have the option to push and refresh my charge. But wait...I can't push him. He's kiting me, and is already out of range. So I'm back where I started. Except this time, I have to tab push someone elses target and ruin their DPS rotation just to get close to the Pebble spammer that's widdling down my HP with a form of damage that tanks have ZERO reduction towards.

 

Something needs to be seriously looked over.

[McDaniels]

As a sentinel I don't want any significant changes made to this class...

 

While I agree that sentinel is a complex class that is very skill dependant, I don't see that as a bad thing like the devs seem to. The fact that most classes have spamable abilities like grav rounds that make them very simplistic is what makes sentinel seem complex in comparison.

 

DONT SIMPLIFY SENTINEL, MAKE OTHER CLASSES MORE COMPELX.

 

Don't make a class less skill dependant because many other classes aren't very skill dependent, people like it when skill plays a role in games and you can tell when someones a good player or not. So don't dumb down one of the only complicated classes in this game, instead make other classes more complex.

 

The fact that commandos pull the highest dps by spamming grav rounds isn't a good thing, it isn't fun, classes should need to use many abilities to be succesful. Sentinel rotations aren't that complicated compared to average MMO classes, they're just complicated compared to the spammable 1 ability "rotations" that some other classes have.

[Laids]

Sentinels have no single target burst and are too reliant on CD's to PVP, why hasn't this been mentioned?. Seriously I feel like a vanilla wow rogue or pom/pyro mage from WoW, the only difference being I have no burst.

 

If you intend Master Strike to work the way it does can we expect it to do a universal root for all Sentinel specs, because it's a joke right now.

[Theysay]

this has been my experience in pvp as an assassin

:guards/juggs = holly **** YOU ARE HARD TO KILL. 1v1, so many defensive cooldowns....i RARELY win.

Better off just ignoring you and doing whatever i can to stop wasting my time.

 

Healing operatives/scoundrels: hahahha eazy kill rofl, so easy. they need to be protected really good otherwise GG even then, usually more then just me targeting them. in a 1v1 its GG

stealth operatives/scoundrels. whoever gets the drop usually wins unless the other guy doesn't have some sort of important cooldown up or is SO BAD

 

powertechs/whatever the republic version is : i can usually kill these guys but meh not worth wasting my time if there are juicier targets about, cuz someone might attack me while im attacking the powertechs

mercs : if i catch these guys, get the drop on them, i can usually fk them up real bad, but if they catch me from range ZOMG it hurts SOOOOOOOOO BAD. ugh its pretty competitive if the other player is decent, but otherwise trololol all over them

 

snipers: lol srs? they do great dmg from really far but hahahah LOL they bad ezy kill

lulz i feel bad for killing them i really do.

 

sorcs/sages. eeaazy kill, sometimes a problem if REALLY well geared but otherwise i can usually kill them, they my usual prey

 

sentinels: marauders: pretty fairly moderate easy kill. if im same skill, i win. if they a LOT more skill - they win.

Edited January 11, 2012 by Theysay

[Lymain]

 

Self healing hybrids are dominating. And there is nothing a Guardian can do about it.

Inquis casts self heal -> kick -> interupted -> Inquis casts heal again and again because kick doesn't silence it.

Point of kicking? Absolutely none, better off using that global for a offensive ability.

 

Disruption isn't on the GCD...it doesn't cost you any offensive ability.

 

And you can use CCs between your interrupts to completely stop someone from casting for a while.

[Skaarrj]

I don't want to see tanks properly mitigating damage in pvp unless guard gets nerfed substantially. Especially when guarding a healer.

 

Do you realize how much of a nightmare it is killing two good and geared players such as a tank guarding a healer? It's hard as hell.

[kendashFathbring]

I don't want to see tanks properly mitigating damage in pvp unless guard gets nerfed substantially. Especially when guarding a healer.

 

Do you realize how much of a nightmare it is killing two good and geared players such as a tank guarding a healer? It's hard as hell.

 

Yes, it's more or less impossible because the fact that heals are insanely OP with current game mechanics. Would be solved easily with a silence-type of ability on any class. And i encourage team-pvp/game play like that, but you simply can't counter heals without proper interrupts.

[dargor-]

Nobody cares about your PvP.

 

They need PvE buffs.

Edited January 11, 2012 by dargor-

[dbbullock]

Disruption isn't on the GCD...it doesn't cost you any offensive ability.

 

And you can use CCs between your interrupts to completely stop someone from casting for a while.

 

I've noticed that Disruption very often doesn't interrupt heals, for whatever reason, be it latency or ability delay, and even if it does, they'll just switch to a different heal and outheal our damage anyway.

 

I've had level 30's outheal my burst/interrupt rotation consisting of Disruption and Force Choke. When their 1.5s heal heals for 2k+, and I don't can't out-dps that without incredible luck on crits, and even then am restricted to my rage pool (even crit Sundering Assaults only do ~1k damage, not enough to outdamage ANY heal,) it's just a losing battle even assuming we play perfectly.

[Syphid]

I hope they change Gravity in the Focus/Rage tree. Kind of lame that one of the penultimate skills in the tree does so little.

[kapxis]

I think alot of marauders don't realize they have more damage mitigation abilities than 'dps' jugg have. And that heavy armor means very little in the damage reduction. I'm not saying they don't deserve some attention too, but keep that in mind. Rage spec juggs also have no cc immunity at all. ( which is fair imo )

 

Also i agree that our damage is fine. It's true we are very slow starters.. and need to be post 40 to do respectable damage, but it's there. Jugg/guardian also should not have the same dps as a sniper for instance.. they are purely dps. Jugg/guardian have utility abilities meant to assist our teammates and we excel in team play, that is our niche. Even as dps spec.. if you aren't using your taunts and ally damage mitigation abilities you aren't playing your class right.

 

I like their approach to the issues, small steps will get us all to the end goal faster. As opposed to giant changes in either direction which make things very difficult to figure out where things went wrong.

 

However.. the suggested change for force leap/push does seem odd, it's counter productive somewhat, and if you're in position to push.. your probably in position to close the gap and attack. Our real issue is when we've been knocked 20-30m away and our charge is on cooldown while we watch our health go down looking like a fool waiting for it to either pop back up again.. or waddle over slowly to the enemy.. usually just in time to die. More damage mitigation seems appropriate.

[Hanscholo]

If you've played MMOs for 8 years then you would know what the rest of us know and that is if you want to faceroll with limited gear then you play a caster/ ranged class.

 

And if you want to do really well as melee then you should not have rolled a tank.

[Hanscholo]

then play something else, there are too many lightsaber people anyways.

 

Which is why the two most un loved classes in the popularity stakes faceroll in pvp....did anyone honestly not know that this was going to happen.

 

If sith and jedi wars rocked then you would have people playing a total of 4 classes.

[Delekahn]

Been reading the many pages and just based off the OP I have to say I'm a little relieved. Ive been frustrated for a while now on my Sentinel that I die so easily against 1 or 2 elites several levels below me, or a few strong's my level. I thought I was just a poor player but maybe I am not as bad as all that...

[Stalzy]

Wow. Just wow. This post blew me away. The PVP aspect of this game is that a semi-geared Jug annhilates people. Throwing off 5-7k crits. That's 50%-70% on most people. Also with their ability to Force Choke all while rotating through abilities and force push NOW with an instant leap goes unmatched.

 

The Jedi Sentinel need's at least 1 CC! Give us force push. Or an Aoe Pushback and you will see the QQ's stop.

 

Easily one of the most overlooked AC's.

[corebit]

Wow. Just wow. This post blew me away. The PVP aspect of this game is that a semi-geared Jug annhilates people. Throwing off 5-7k crits. That's 50%-70% on most people. Also with their ability to Force Choke all while rotating through abilities and force push NOW with an instant leap goes unmatched.

 

The Jedi Sentinel need's at least 1 CC! Give us force push. Or an Aoe Pushback and you will see the QQ's stop.

 

Easily one of the most overlooked AC's.

 

What a load of BS. I'm in near full Champion gear on my Guardian and the only way I can approach 5-6K is with Force Sweep, fully stimmed and buffed, and requiring Singularity fully stacked. I can only do that once in a while unlike other classes can just spam Grav Round/Tracer Missile and do more damage in the same time frame. Or just go Scoundrel/Op and 2-shot you.

 

And 6K 50%-70% of someone's health, are you joking?? Sure, if you are fighting lowbies all the time. Anyone who spends at least some time in PVP should have at least 15K.

Edited January 11, 2012 by corebit

[Lord_Ixigan]

Hmm...Well, I'm in pretty much full champ gear now on my Guard(armor and one arti, other stuff is cent) so that means I have at least some worth in this discussion.

 

What I've noticed so far:

 

Our highest damage tree by far is Focus. The rotation is actually fairly simple, but it's also VERY subject to being interrupted. Basically you spend a lot of time building up your multiplier for Force Sweep, which is on a 9s cd. In between this you might mix in Master Strike, which for me deals 3300-3800 damage...not too bad really.

 

HOWEVER. With how man knock-backs and how UNBELIEVABLY easy it is to kite a JK, even a JK who is focus and has Zealous leap, you can EASILY miss your Force Sweep if you aren't EXTREMELY careful. You have to basically sit there and wait...and wait...and time it PERFECTLY.

 

The only trade off is that if you are very quick you can actually deal a lot of damage.

 

Vigilance is, by and large, a better PvP spec because of all the built-in damage reduction and the 4s of immunity after a Leap. The only problem is that you have mediocre survivability and slightly more mobility due to your immunity, but you also have far less damage. So little damage, in fact, that it almost feels like a tank spec....except it's not. Because of its far lesser damage there is almost no point in taking Vig for PvP, even with all of the talents that are geared SPECIFICALLY for it.

 

 

@George

 

Attaching a cd reset for Leap onto Push wouldn't solve any of our issues. Leap is already on a low enough cd that it doesn't really matter. Besides that we need Push to remain as our tactical option for area control or denial....or just shoving people off of the bridges on Voidstar.

 

We do NOT need another button to push. We have too many as it is.

 

Here's what we NEED:

 

-Force Push reduced to a 30s cd. Most other knockbacks that are -AOE- have a 20s cd, why does our SINGLE TARGET knock-back have a 1min cd? Base cd of 30s, talented down to 20. Will allow it to fall in line with current knock-backs on other classes.

 

-Force Stasis needs to be instant cast, not a channeled ability. It's on a 1min cd....1min cd abilities aren't a mediocre damage channel that affects ONE person. This would also free up another skill point for the tank tree that would be WAY better spent on a better-designed skill. Lower cd to 45s or keep it at 1m and lower the level at which we get it to 12 or 14.

 

-Saber Throw needs a 15s or 20 s cd. This ability is PRIMARILY to grab a little aggro, build a little focus at range and/or stop someone from planting/capping a turret. That's it. Why does this have a 30s cd? It has a dead-zone unless you have gear that removes it...which is just plain bad design. Low damage, ranged focus builder needs a lower cd.

 

-Overpower and Pommel Strike....what is the point of these abilities? They do decent damage, but they do NOT work on anything above strong mobs. Why? Overpower seems like it was supposed to be our way to do some serious damage to players that have been slowed. I say this about Overpower because JKs have ONE slow that consumes a considerable amount of focus...I know I never use it.

 

Remove these abilities as they currently don't serve any real purpose. We can't use them against raid bosses and we can't use them against players...completely pointless abilities once you hit 50.

 

-Vigilance DPS has a few skill points that add burning effects to Overhead Slash and Blade Storm. Both of these passives require two points, but return VERY little damage in return. Why? The only real purpose of the passive for Overhead slash is to prevent stealth classes from vanishing, but Plasma Brand accomplishes this just as well and does far more damage. Why am I spending two skill points for a passive that adds ~300 damage over six seconds? Remove these passives or make them more useful so Vigilance will actually be a viable dps spec. It currently is not.

[Groundshark]

Hi guys,

 

There are many different subjects discussed in this thread and I would like to take the opportunity to give you some information on the topics at hand.

 

First off, we currently have no indication that any class needs a huge buff. Class balance is defined by the interaction between classes and changes we make to one class will, inevitably, move the balance towards or from other classes. Our data and testing currently indicates that the Juggernaut and Guardian AC could use some buffing up in two areas where we see them underperforming against our expectations.

 

Here are some of the things we're planning to roll out in the short term specifically regarding Sith Warriors and Jedi Knights :

 

• Mobility/Anti Kiting (PvP) – We agree with the sentiment voiced by the community that some Guardians and Juggernauts have to work harder than other classes to stay within effective combat range, putting them at a disadvantage. We intend to address this in an upcoming patch where, as a first step, Force Push will clear the cooldown of Force Leap, granting for more reliable in combat pursuit capabilities to the Advanced Class. Further changes will be made if necessary.
   
  
• DPS spec survivability (PvP and PvE) – The DPS specs on Guardian and Juggernaut are performing to our expectations when it comes to the ability to create damage, especially of the burst variety. However their survivability is lagging behind our expectations, especially in the later game, and we are going to start addressing that particular issue in an upcoming patch.

Our attention to the class obviously won't stop here. Balancing MMOs is a never ending endeavor and we're in for the long haul. For example, we are certainly aware that the Marauder and Sentinel are very gameplay intensive classes with some of the most complex rotations in the game. While we are currently looking at quality of life and usability improvements to increase the class' playability without compromising the unique aspects of the class, we don't have anything specific to announce just yet. We do however anticipate that some of the combat responsiveness improvements (AKA 'ability delay' - more on that here) being worked on by our engineering team will specifically aid both Marauder and Sentinel.

 

In regards to PvE balance, any place in the game where our data shows significant issues with the balance tuning for one or more classes or specs are of course also being looked at.

 

For example, Jedi Knights will be pleased to hear that we are working on tuning the final mission in their class chain to provide a better, more fun and more reliably solvable challenge (see a post from another member of my team here). Currently a large percentage of players bring a friend to solve this mission, which, while social and often more fun, is not in line with our stated goal of allowing players to progress solo through their class arc if they desire to do so. We're also looking at some companions with a critical eye to improve their viability for certain role/companion combinations.

 

I would also like to give you some general understanding about approach to class balancing and how you can aid us with your feedback:

 

• Now that we're out of the first few weeks of launch madness, you will see class and combat balance issues addressed with increased frequency. Larger scale gameplay changes and features are more likely to coincide with major content releases, but smaller scale changes and improvements can be expected to become part of our regular update schedule.
   
  
• Statements that we hate a specific class or faction, or that we intentionally underbalance certain classes to make it less popular are conspiracy theory territory. We have nothing to gain from such an approach – we want players to pick the class and faction they want to play and have confidence that they are able to perform their chosen role in the game. Anything that comes in the way of that goal is considered a balance issue for us.
   
  
• We make our balancing decisions based on a combination of internal and external testing and metrics. We don't make decisions based on who is the loudest on the forums. Community feedback is valuable in bringing issues to our attention and even to highlight possible solutions, which means that well written, constructive posts are the most effective way to communicate your wishes and feedback to us, rather than petitions and calls to nerf specific classes.
   
  
• Please understand that balance issues during the leveling process are different than issues at level 50 and are handled in different ways. If you feel your class has issues during your journey to 50, especially communicate the level range and area of the game where you are experiencing issues to aid our investigations. Player versus Player situations in during the leveling process are not always balanced at every level (a mathematical impossibility), but we are always willing to investigate.
   
  
• Just because we haven't mentioned the specific issue close to your heart in a post (such as the one above) doesn't mean we are unaware of it or that we don't want to address it. It would be impractical for us to comment on all investigations currently in the pipeline. That said, we definitely want to take a more open approach in regards to upcoming class changes.

 

Finally, I'd like to acknowledge, again, that we do understand that there is a desire for players to get more detailed information what happens to their character in combat. We agree with those requests and are working on various ways to, optionally, get more detailed data on your combat performance.

 

Thanks for your feedback!

 

-- Georg

 

Georg, thanks for this great post. It's good to know you guys are looking into our class. Some questions about your points, specifically for Juggernauts/Guardians --

 

We agree with the sentiment voiced by the community that some Guardians and Juggernauts have to work harder than other classes to stay within effective combat range, putting them at a disadvantage.

 

I'm glad you guys realize this... my Powertech buddy with similar gear and fully tank spec'd (I'm DPS spec'd) out damages me in every WZ, simply due to the fact that he can't be kited. Have you guys considered giving us more mobility, more burst or more mitigation to survive the onslaught while being kited?

 

For example, we are certainly aware that the Marauder and Sentinel are very gameplay intensive classes with some of the most complex rotations in the game.

 

Have you guys considered the rotations for Guardians/Juggernauts as well? It too can be complicated and takes some finesse and efficient decision making to play. A great example would be Sunder and Assault (Jugg). Why have both? The ability bloat in this game is huge as it is making things even more complicated for the Guardian/Juggernaut, why not remove the cooldown entirely on Sunder to have it replace assault?

 

[*]DPS spec survivability (PvP and PvE) – The DPS specs on Guardian and Juggernaut are performing to our expectations when it comes to the ability to create damage, especially of the burst variety. However their survivability is lagging behind our expectations, especially in the later game, and we are going to start addressing that particular issue in an upcoming patch.

 

I tend to agree with this. Shien and Shii-Cho forms in PvP are a death sentence when I'm targetted. I have to sit in Soresu if I want any kind of survivability which leads to rage starvation, especially while I'm not being targetted. Ideas would be to give more rage bonuses to Soresu in the Rage/Vengeance trees further up or (probably more intuitively) bonuses to survivability in Shii-Cho/Shien in their respective trees.

 

Mobility/Anti Kiting (PvP) – We agree with the sentiment voiced by the community that some Guardians and Juggernauts have to work harder than other classes to stay within effective combat range, putting them at a disadvantage. We intend to address this in an upcoming patch where, as a first step, Force Push will clear the cooldown of Force Leap, granting for more reliable in combat pursuit capabilities to the Advanced Class. Further changes will be made if necessary.

 

This is certainly a welcome change, but what about Obliterate? The description of the skill certainly sounds like it should close some distance, but it's only usable from 10m. Can we bump that up to something more substantial? Say, 30m with a slightly longer cooldown?