The fleet is sooooooo quiet now ( cricket.... cricket)

[KumbayaGOD]

i notice after the patch removing ultimate com from tfb, snv, dp and df , the chat asking to form group is complete gone now ( harbinger server)

the only way to get ultimate is thru nim DF/DP which is impossible for pug, HM 55 ops ( mere 10 ult for weekly) which usually SNV HM is doable in pug if they can survive olok and styrak while TFB most pug failed on operator 9, DF and DP HM not much pug doing it

HM fp 3x ( also takes long time to find in GF, only do 1 time) --- get 10 ultimate

tactical flash point 3x --- meh get only 4 ultimate

 

now it leaves only TOS 16m ( which also broken on third boss) and also ravager 16m ( which take such long time to pug)

 

it never been quieter in ops after the patch , maybe something need to be done so casual raider can still do something

 

I now log in to do pvp only, pvp wise not affected on que time

[jono_shadow]

first off, let me say that the comms gear is c***, only half useful item is the offhand, maybe ear aswell.

 

secondly, the change is very very nice, people shouldnt get top tier gear(comms version) so easierly,

if you know how to play your class, you can do the sm versions of the new ops in the blue 178 gear you get from lvling up(done that as tank, with no augments, 47k hp and to be fair, i forgot to add colour crystals, lol)

i feel that the top tier gear, should only be gettable by people that can clear top tier content, now that might seem elitist, but if people cant clear old 55 content as a lvl60, then its not a question of needing gear, its an issue of people not knowing how to play there class or (more likly) not knowing how each boss fight works.

yes, tfb hm 3rd boss is very hard for some people, "must kill all red"

for S&V 5th boss can be painful if people take the wrong droids, "all blue works on sm so it must work on HM and NIM"

DF HM 4th boss lag is annoying and last boss's orbs, "ive got an orb on me, but im a mdps so must stay on boss and let the orb explode at 5stacks in the middle of the boss"

DP HM 3rd boss, you sort of need people to talk about the crystals locations, and agree ahead of time which is top/bottom lef/right

as for the new ops, ive not done them on 16man sm, only 8 man and mostly with guildes to gear them up for hm.

 

as said above, if people know how to play, they can clear content with the story line gear.

there is nothing stoppping people doing the old content, just beacuse there isnt any top tier comms any more, isnt a good reason.

another good thing aboutit, it might stop people going into pvp with comms pve gear(atleast top tier comms gear) you still get lots of people in 186 comms gear in pvp

 

overal this post of just to give another point of view, it is not posted as a dig to puggs or in anyway to seem eiletist

Edited January 17, 2015 by jono_shadow

[dbears]

Agree with Jono. Shouldn't get top tier comm gear from old sub-60 content. If you want current tier gear, do the current content.

 

Call me elitist, idc. That's what I believe.

 

Instead of forming those groups for 16man TFB and SNV for comms, for them for Ravagers or TOS (when they get fixed, of course lol)

Edited January 18, 2015 by dbears

[Zohkar]

I wouldn't be apposed if they put them back for NiM TFB or S&V. Maybe even HM (TFB, S&V, DF, DP, or TC) because I don't care how easy you think it is, mechanics are mechanics and even a level 60 can't survive those if they don't do them correctly. Right now allies channel (the channel to get raids) is dead on my server. Yes we could try to pug 16 man Ravanger's and Temple of Sacrifice, but good luck. Most raids fail on boss two like the days of Draxus and especially boss three since at least one of the operations is having some kind of sync issue on the cross.

 

I sit in the game on average of 14-16 hours a day, and I love to raid, but now there is no reason to play as much or at all after I do my daily's because the game just got extremely boring. While ultimate gear is considered the top tier gear it is poorly optimized and was just a make casual players feel good about having something to wear since raid content just isn't dropping loot correctly atm and two many bugs on the current tier.

[verfallen]

first off, let me say that the comms gear is c***, only half useful item is the offhand, maybe ear aswell.

 

secondly, the change is very very nice, people shouldnt get top tier gear(comms version) so easierly,

if you know how to play your class, you can do the sm versions of the new ops in the blue 178 gear you get from lvling up(done that as tank, with no augments, 47k hp and to be fair, i forgot to add colour crystals, lol)

i feel that the top tier gear, should only be gettable by people that can clear top tier content, now that might seem elitist, but if people cant clear old 55 content as a lvl60, then its not a question of needing gear, its an issue of people not knowing how to play there class or (more likly) not knowing how each boss fight works.

yes, tfb hm 3rd boss is very hard for some people, "must kill all red"

for S&V 5th boss can be painful if people take the wrong droids, "all blue works on sm so it must work on HM and NIM"

DF HM 4th boss lag is annoying and last boss's orbs, "ive got an orb on me, but im a mdps so must stay on boss and let the orb explode at 5stacks in the middle of the boss"

DP HM 3rd boss, you sort of need people to talk about the crystals locations, and agree ahead of time which is top/bottom lef/right

as for the new ops, ive not done them on 16man sm, only 8 man and mostly with guildes to gear them up for hm.

 

as said above, if people know how to play, they can clear content with the story line gear.

there is nothing stoppping people doing the old content, just beacuse there isnt any top tier comms any more, isnt a good reason.

another good thing aboutit, it might stop people going into pvp with comms pve gear(atleast top tier comms gear) you still get lots of people in 186 comms gear in pvp

 

overal this post of just to give another point of view, it is not posted as a dig to puggs or in anyway to seem eiletist

 

 

Its quite fine if you are in a guild with a bunch of HM raiding people. However you are losing sight of the main point that you cannot deny, even with great principles.

 

Fleet is dead. Fairly sure its widespread. The new content is still full of very annoying bugs and its very hard to pug, even more so 16m.

 

And that's to make SM.

 

The truth is, who really use ultimates? Its not top raiders, as you said its mostly thrash. The mods are ok, without being the best, the rest, enhencements are crap, and the armoring lack set bonus (no argument that they should give any, that would be retarded)

 

The thing however that is important is that while the game released a lot of end-game content, most of it is now unplayed with every big expension release. And the way to keep content alive isn't that complicated, it has to be worth doing. Otherwise people don't bother move on alts or other games altogether once their one night of raid a week is done.

 

So you say "old content shouldn't reward new gear". But how game breaking is it really to keep some of it still? Tbh the way forward is not imo to kill every old content, but to keep it alive. My idea? Allow a level 60 version, sm mechanics, of all old ops. They proved they have the scale with level technology before. So I doubt it would be very complicated, and those could reward a small ammount of ultis.

 

But the thing is, if most content is unaccessible to the player majority that is not in a progression raid team, and that this content is the main source of ultimate commendations, you'll just get people moving away from the game, and rather boring night on fleets.

 

HM FP could use a 5 ultimate comms for the GF daily instead of elites also. MIght bring more people in queue, and at least its endgame right?

 

TL:DR : Old content being played is not a bad thing, it gives content, keep the fleet alive, allow new players to do the old ops, and ultimate comms are just the best carrot to ensure they remain alive by keeping old players interested in running them. Thats a fact we have to work with.

Edited January 19, 2015 by verfallen

[SBR_QuorTek]

Its quite fine if you are in a guild with a bunch of HM raiding people. However you are losing sight of the main point that you cannot deny, even with great principles.

 

Fleet is dead. Fairly sure its widespread. The new content is still full of very annoying bugs and its very hard to pug, even more so 16m.

 

And that's to make SM.

 

The truth is, who really use ultimates? Its not top raiders, as you said its mostly thrash. The mods are ok, without being the best, the rest, enhencements are crap, and the armoring lack set bonus (no argument that they should give any, that would be retarded)

 

The thing however that is important is that while the game released a lot of end-game content, most of it is now unplayed with every big expension release. And the way to keep content alive isn't that complicated, it has to be worth doing. Otherwise people don't bother move on alts or other games altogether once their one night of raid a week is done.

 

So you say "old content shouldn't reward new gear". But how game breaking is it really to keep some of it still? Tbh the way forward is not imo to kill every old content, but to keep it alive. My idea? Allow a level 60 version, sm mechanics, of all old ops. They proved they have the scale with level technology before. So I doubt it would be very complicated, and those could reward a small ammount of ultis.

 

But the thing is, if most content is unaccessible to the player majority that is not in a progression raid team, and that this content is the main source of ultimate commendations, you'll just get people moving away from the game, and rather boring night on fleets.

 

HM FP could use a 5 ultimate comms for the GF daily instead of elites also. MIght bring more people in queue, and at least its endgame right?

 

TL:DR : Old content being played is not a bad thing, it gives content, keep the fleet alive, allow new players to do the old ops, and ultimate comms are just the best carrot to ensure they remain alive by keeping old players interested in running them. Thats a fact we have to work with.

 

It is all fine the content drop Elite commendations (192) which should be good enough.... for casual people it just take longer to get the 198 off-hand or pieces for com gear.

 

Which is fine enough, used to be like that in the past too.

 

When SnV was introduced it was only TFB and SnV that would drop ultimate coms in 16man sm also classic Ops EV/KP weekly gave and FP weekly keep in mind we also had a 55 to gain then, when DP/DF came out it wss DF/DP as well with SnV and TFB due to the good mods dropped off comgear at least then the cycle went back to zero with Rav and ToS starting all over again... it is a normal cycle, new level cap at 60 and rinse and repeat back to the start point again.

 

Problem is basically that the two new Operations is somewhat bugged, especially the underlurker in ToS... the vision need to be drawn away from ultimate commendations and into getting 192 token gear instead which in ravagers almost can give an entire group 1 piece each of token gear in 8 man, that is even a bigger reward than ultimate commendations and you can technically get 1 piece per run which I believe you could not buy a single piece of com gear with either.

 

People need to focus on the mission and get their head out of the *** and realize that this is what you should be looking and that this is the droids you are looking for as well.

[verfallen]

It is all fine the content drop Elite commendations (192) which should be good enough.... for casual people it just take longer to get the 198 off-hand or pieces for com gear.

 

Which is fine enough, used to be like that in the past too.

 

When SnV was introduced it was only TFB and SnV that would drop ultimate coms in 16man sm also classic Ops EV/KP weekly gave and FP weekly keep in mind we also had a 55 to gain then, when DP/DF came out it wss DF/DP as well with SnV and TFB due to the good mods dropped off comgear at least then the cycle went back to zero with Rav and ToS starting all over again... it is a normal cycle, new level cap at 60 and rinse and repeat back to the start point again.

 

Problem is basically that the two new Operations is somewhat bugged, especially the underlurker in ToS... the vision need to be drawn away from ultimate commendations and into getting 192 token gear instead which in ravagers almost can give an entire group 1 piece each of token gear in 8 man, that is even a bigger reward than ultimate commendations and you can technically get 1 piece per run which I believe you could not buy a single piece of com gear with either.

 

People need to focus on the mission and get their head out of the *** and realize that this is what you should be looking and that this is the droids you are looking for as well.

 

The change they made to commendation gear quality is what is fine in keeping thing fair, but the impression of progression is important too. Seeing as you can straight out buy from crafter BiS 192, does it really matter how fast people get 198 very-not-bis? In 1,0, you could get BiS 2nd to last tier from commendation, that was a bit strange true, casual were rather close to full 63 people.

 

In 2,0, you could get best mods from commendations of the 2nd to last tier. bit more balanced.

 

In 3,0, they I think made commendation gear what it should be, and the access to it should also reflect what we had in 2,0.

 

But so long as full token 192 beats 198 comm gear, I do not see the problem, and I think its fairly psychological to call that top tier gear. its far from.

[KumbayaGOD]

we have to understand that this game cater all aspect of players from casual raider, semi hardcore or even hardcore or even solo player

and all MMO most player are casual players ( this is the truth)

So if you only see one aspect of players then the game itself wont sustain and finally stop and pull the plugs

 

the reason there are casual raider so people can gear their alt and enjoy the game ( that the main point in gaming)

not many people like to wiped for 3-5 hours just to down 1 boss ( like hardcore player) , most pug if you failed max 3 times they will bailed

 

The mmo game is about grinding , because no developers can make game content fast enough to even pace with the players

so they need to use this same content and ask people to do it over and over again and what the incentive ? the comm and gear --- that is the mmo game engine now

 

so i would suggest somehow still have ops to run like people said scale to 60 or something or just HM get ult com but now the ops just dead

many people said ult gear is thrash but that the incentive right ? otherwise why they need to grind again if you already max out your elite from token or pre 3.0.2 ops

 

the new ops ? ravager 16m often failed on 3rd boss or 2nd boss even and TOS often stops on 2nd boss as third boss is broken , if they fix it then it is better but still only 2 ops

 

so people have not much things to do , HM FP not many pops , so now you only want to pvp and dailies

Edited January 19, 2015 by KumbayaGOD

[Delvosh]

It may sounds kinda weird but I think if bioware changed basic coms color to blue, elite coms to purple, and ultimate coms to deep purple people would be a lot happier to run things for "purple coms" maybe?

[Alanbra]

Also don't forget that when 2.0 launched, the weekly for TFB and S&V were the 2nd boss (later moved to third) so most people could reasonably expect to at least get some coms from those two ops. Now with the last boss being the weekly people have little hope of getting those weeklies done unless they get lucky and get into an 8 man sm run. (and then you have to hope Cora doesn't bug out)

 

With elite comm gear now being roughly equal to itemized 186, and ultimate comm gear roughly equal to itemized 192, end game has been reduced to " use basic comms to get 186, run the new ops in sm until geared enough to run them in hm"

 

It's not too surprising that fleet chat no longer has lots of LFG in it.

[KumbayaGOD]

i also notiice that fleet in harbinger now alot quieter in population , now i often see like 100-120 people on fleet while before 3.0 around 160-170 easy

[BlueShiftRecall]

I'm on the Harbringer and have noticed especially during the evenings (AU time) on the Republic side that there is not a single chance at doing ToS or Rav and only a small chance of getting any old 16m op's. The only time I even have a chance at doing any op's any more is on the weekend, I work during the day when most US people are online and by the time I come home fleet chat is dead (not including gold spammers) as by this time in the US it's very early morning and even then before this recent update there were usually enough people I would often see a few 16m popping up but not anymore. I have seen people people advertising for at least 1hr+ for people to join both new and old 16m op's and now it's not just tanks they're dying to find but they're even having a hard time finding DPS willing to do the older op runs. Edited January 20, 2015 by BlueShiftRecall

[Ruskaeth]

I certainly hope this makes guilds more pro-active in a) creating raid teams and b) arranging raids c) recruiting people for raiding.

[wainot-keel]

I certainly hope this makes guilds more pro-active in a) creating raid teams and b) arranging raids c) recruiting people for raiding.

 

SM pugs are 'casual' not only because of the supposed/expected skill of their members, is also about doing something on the spur of the moment. Planning a raid, setting up the event, picking up the team, etc, etc,... well, kind of is the opposite of that.

Sometimes, when people log in, they don't know what are they going to do, just play whatever, a "schedule" to do something is certainly not required to play.

Perhaps when you saw the event on the guild calendar you weren't in the mood for a sm ops later on that day, but then you would have joined one. Or the other way around, and instead of doing the ops you would have liked just another episode of whatever on netflix...

[AlrikFassbauer]

On VC, things are as always, I think. But it's an tiny server anyway.

[sithBracer]

BW actually made this same mistake in 2.X with EC. EC hm was as hard mechanic-wise are tfb and SnV hm, maybe even harder, yet it did not even give as decent rewards as SnV and TFB sm did, so people chose to not play it. We begged BW to make it a 55 or to give out rewards similar to 55 sm ops, but they wouldn't budge. EC remained a dead operation throughout 2.X. Only a few raid teams did it just for fun and/or to get the tank mount in NiM.

 

I agree that hm SnV/TFB should give some decent rewards. Even at 60 HM/NiM is not easy for a pug to get through. If they don't give out decent rewards then it will be EC all over again; except I doubt progression guilds will do those for fun since they have been so overdone by now.

[bdatt]

I mostly just do 2 nights of progression, due to having a wife and baby, but my guild runs old ops every week for decor/mounts. We just don't pug any open spots because you don't need a full group for anything and even in small groups nothing takes very long. So lack of fleet pugs doesn't necessarily mEan lack of people running old content.

 

Ravagers/ToS is a different story. Clearly still needs rebalancing and updated 16m loot tables to be more viable, especially ToS. I personally won't ever set foot into 16m if I will have a 50% less chance at a token. Well at least until we're a couple more tiers higher in geAR in 9 months.