Pietrastor Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Before you nerf the machine pplease consider what it will ACTUALLY do to the crafting economy balance. It is NOT the machine that devauled Grade 11 materials but instead Grade 11 materials being added to Jawa vendors and thus benefiting Cartel whales who've been sitting on stacks of Jawa Junk from packs. Addition of the machine prevented them to be main benefactors of the change and allowing other players (including regular subscribers who pay for the game but don't spend $500 dollars monthly on packs) to obtain affordable materials for themselves as well. Cartel whales want the balance to tip in their favour again and they're mad they can't monopolize the market like they planned to do when new about Grade 11 mats hitting Jawa vendors came out and that's the main source of their complaints. Bioware talked alot how there's "too much credits in the economy" yet everyone knows it's very small portion of the playerbase that is sickly rich thanks to Cartel-to-credit transfers and the rest is average-to-low income majority of the playerbase. If you nerf the machine, the few sickly rich will become even richer and the rest will suffer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightSaberAddiCt Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kindredlight Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Agreed wholeheartedly. Even some non-whales are sitting on piles and piles of credits and controlling the markets through buyouts/resales. This should make things more universally available, and less intimidating to new folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I think making the coin cost 2k makes sense. I would rather see the rest of the drop rates and the like for the machine kept as is. I would also like to see some crew mission adjustments to keep them appealing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ekwalizer Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Before you nerf the machine pplease consider what it will ACTUALLY do to the crafting economy balance. It is NOT the machine that devauled Grade 11 materials but instead Grade 11 materials being added to Jawa vendors and thus benefiting Cartel whales who've been sitting on stacks of Jawa Junk from packs. Addition of the machine prevented them to be main benefactors of the change and allowing other players (including regular subscribers who pay for the game but don't spend $500 dollars monthly on packs) to obtain affordable materials for themselves as well. Cartel whales want the balance to tip in their favour again and they're mad they can't monopolize the market like they planned to do when new about Grade 11 mats hitting Jawa vendors came out and that's the main source of their complaints. Bioware talked alot how there's "too much credits in the economy" yet everyone knows it's very small portion of the playerbase that is sickly rich thanks to Cartel-to-credit transfers and the rest is average-to-low income majority of the playerbase. If you nerf the machine, the few sickly rich will become even richer and the rest will suffer I think making the coin cost 2k makes sense. I would rather see the rest of the drop rates and the like for the machine kept as is. I would also like to see some crew mission adjustments to keep them appealing. Well said OP. I too think that crew skills missions should be tweaked. The machines aren't the problem. The problem is the piss-poor return on skill missions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karellan Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Well said OP. I too think that crew skills missions should be tweaked. The machines aren't the problem. The problem is the piss-poor return on skill missions. This is the real issue. The return from mission skills is abysmally low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glower Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) Agreed wholeheartedly. Even some non-whales are sitting on piles and piles of credits and controlling the markets through buyouts/resales. This should make things more universally available, and less intimidating to new folks. Then buff gathering crew skills and missions, do not ruin them! But this is Bioware, right? Half-assed moves and stupid consequences. Edited January 16, 2015 by Glower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grombrinda Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Before you nerf the machine pplease consider what it will ACTUALLY do to the crafting economy balance. It is NOT the machine that devauled Grade 11 materials but instead Grade 11 materials being added to Jawa vendors and thus benefiting Cartel whales who've been sitting on stacks of Jawa Junk from packs. Addition of the machine prevented them to be main benefactors of the change and allowing other players (including regular subscribers who pay for the game but don't spend $500 dollars monthly on packs) to obtain affordable materials for themselves as well. Cartel whales want the balance to tip in their favour again and they're mad they can't monopolize the market like they planned to do when new about Grade 11 mats hitting Jawa vendors came out and that's the main source of their complaints. Bioware talked alot how there's "too much credits in the economy" yet everyone knows it's very small portion of the playerbase that is sickly rich thanks to Cartel-to-credit transfers and the rest is average-to-low income majority of the playerbase. If you nerf the machine, the few sickly rich will become even richer and the rest will suffer Totally agree.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSeventhJedi Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I'm pretty sure that everything is ruined forever no matter what they do. Or, at least, that's what the general consensus of forum posts seem to be about this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) I think making the coin cost 2k makes sense. No, because if you have max rep you could "win" and still lose 1500 creds. The cost of a coin needs to stay the same as the vendor value of a green rep item. I'm pretty sure that everything is ruined forever no matter what they do. Or, at least, that's what the general consensus of forum posts seem to be about this week. That's the general forum consensus for every MMO every week. Edited January 16, 2015 by branmakmuffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JattaGin Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Cartel whales want the balance to tip in their favour again and they're mad they can't monopolize the market like they planned to do when new about Grade 11 mats hitting Jawa vendors came out and that's the main source of their complaints. Bioware talked alot how there's "too much credits in the economy" yet everyone knows it's very small portion of the playerbase that is sickly rich thanks to Cartel-to-credit transfers and the rest is average-to-low income majority of the playerbase. If you nerf the machine, the few sickly rich will become even richer and the rest will suffer Spot-on! Exactly ^^this! I want all players to be able to get some nice decorations for their strongholds. The machines make exactly that possible. I'm sick of the attitude of some players who think that other players should not have everything. IT IS A GAME, not a real-life economy. How can anyone be angry that players with less time or credits can now afford more stuff to enjoy in their game? I think it is awesome! The drop rate does not need to be changed. Some people have been highly exaggerating here. (And just for the record: I have 20 millions+ and am crafting so I could easily complain as well. But I honestly think that much lower prices will do this game good. I want much more players to have much more stuff to enjoy in this game and have more fun. The more, the merrier!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalfear Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 lol imagine that, LA agreeing with a "dumb the game down thread" who would have thunk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mariojediwookie Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Before you nerf the machine pplease consider what it will ACTUALLY do to the crafting economy balance. It is NOT the machine that devauled Grade 11 materials but instead Grade 11 materials being added to Jawa vendors and thus benefiting Cartel whales who've been sitting on stacks of Jawa Junk from packs. Addition of the machine prevented them to be main benefactors of the change and allowing other players (including regular subscribers who pay for the game but don't spend $500 dollars monthly on packs) to obtain affordable materials for themselves as well. Cartel whales want the balance to tip in their favour again and they're mad they can't monopolize the market like they planned to do when new about Grade 11 mats hitting Jawa vendors came out and that's the main source of their complaints. Bioware talked alot how there's "too much credits in the economy" yet everyone knows it's very small portion of the playerbase that is sickly rich thanks to Cartel-to-credit transfers and the rest is average-to-low income majority of the playerbase. If you nerf the machine, the few sickly rich will become even richer and the rest will suffer The only thing I see them doing is bringing the average cost per purple mat won with the slot machine into balance with the gathering missions. Right now with all the stuff you can sell from the slot machine it's below 200 credits per coin. It's going to be pretty hard to balance gathering missions against that. Jawajunk needs to be in balance with the gathering missions, plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anzel Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Yeah, I don't see any need to nerf this one. I mean. Come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptwonline Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 One flaw with your argument: there is no guarantee--and to me it even seems unlikely--that they will nerf the slots enough to make them impractical for Jawa Junk and purple Grade 11 mats. This means that people will still be able to reasonably avoid the whales controlling these mats on the GTN and just farm them up themselves. For example, imagine if the Jawa Junk drop rate was halved. Instead of it taking me a weekend to get all the purple grade 11 mats I'll need for the entire expansion, it might take me up to a week instead. The cartel whales won't get my business, nor many other people's business either even after a nerf. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 I agree. I am not a super-special player. I have 6 soon to be 60 characters. Even with using Legacy suits, and only doing either PvP or PvE set for each character, not both, just to Augment I will need 5x14 = 70 Augments. 70 Augments equal 280 purple slicing parts that usually drop in 3’s. Which means I have to crit 93 times. I have Imperial Agent with Scorpio; Inquisitor with Andronikos and a BH with Mako (no crit bonus) and Treek running these missions on a 2x day re-log in schedule and so far I am able to cover 2 suits. That’s not counting crafting for PvE min-maxing and filling out the pieces where I don’t have enough comms for 186s (there is only so much comms one can get as ye average player by hitting L60!). Do you think I am going to go out and ruin the economy? I bought the machine not to print credits but to simply give me extra mats to equip my Legacy in the entry level end-game gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornyr Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Agreed. I think removing the grade 11 mats from the jawas will alleviate most of the impact the slot machines have on the economy. And I know crafters love the possibility of easily-obtainable top-tier mats. I too would love having easy access to everything I need. But those mats are rare for a reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 No, because if you have max rep you could "win" and still lose 1500 creds. The cost of a coin needs to stay the same as the vendor value of a green rep item. Fair enough, but I still feel strongly that 2k per would be a better price point. Note that I would obviously be very happy if it remains as is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Agreed. I think removing the grade 11 mats from the jawas will alleviate most of the impact the slot machines have on the economy. And I know crafters love the possibility of easily-obtainable top-tier mats. I too would love having easy access to everything I need. But those mats are rare for a reason. The mats are rare to add value. Current prices demonstrate they are FAR TOO RARE compared to prior tiers. This will not devalue top tier crafting mats...it will normalize them. The only folks that would be directly affected, IMO, are the ones that profit from overpriced top tier mats. And they should not be protected under any circumstances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 lol imagine that, LA agreeing with a "dumb the game down thread" who would have thunk Imagine that, Kalfear calling yet another game improvement "dumbing down the game". ...I know I am not surprised Get with the program Kalfear. This isn't 2004. Times are changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mornyr Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 (edited) The mats are rare to add value. Current prices demonstrate they are FAR TOO RARE compared to prior tiers. This will not devalue top tier crafting mats...it will normalize them. The only folks that would be directly affected, IMO, are the ones that profit from overpriced top tier mats. And they should not be protected under any circumstances. I don't think the drop rate for grade 11 mats is significantly lower than the grade 9's. We've had them for merely a month and a half. It takes time to accumulate many of them, and initially people used them to craft for themselves/their alts/their guildies before injecting them into the market. I have 10 toons with 3 crew skills at 500, distributed between crafting, gathering, and mission skills. I manage to rack up grade 11 purple mats much more quickly than I did the grade 9's. The problem isn't supply, the problem is that the demand hasn't stabilized yet. Edited January 17, 2015 by Mornyr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 I don't think the drop rate for grade 11 mats is significantly lower than the grade 9's. We've had them for merely a month and a half. It takes time to accumulate many of them, and initially people used them to craft for themselves/their alts/their guildies before injecting them into the market. I have 10 toons with 3 crew skills at 500, distributed between crafting, gathering, and mission skills. I manage to rack up grade 11 purple mats much more quickly than I did the grade 9's. The problem isn't supply, the problem is that the demand hasn't stabilized yet. Fair enough. My experience was much easier to gather green mats, much harder to get purple mats....but blues were about the same IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kourage Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Know why there's too many credits in the economy? Everything anyone wants comes from Cartel Coins, not credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfyde Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 No, because if you have max rep you could "win" and still lose 1500 creds. The cost of a coin needs to stay the same as the vendor value of a green rep item. I don't think you're supposed to break even with a slot machine. Especially if it's supposed to be a credit sink. They should remove the vendor value of those rep items altogether, so the 50k credits per stack of coins is a net loss from the economy. Remember they removed training costs; those credits need to be siphoned from the market some other way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuzluPasta Posted January 17, 2015 Share Posted January 17, 2015 Dont nerf the machine. At least do not touch it dropping cartel market certificates. Its the only way of getting them without spending an insane amount of real life money. The prices of mats dropped because they changed the costs to 1 and 3 jawa scrap, not because the machine is dropping tokens. Cartel packs have been dropping these from the start and nobody complained them being pay to win and asked for a nerf or removal. On the other hand the machine removes credits from the game and isnt pay to win mats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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