NemuriKyoshiro Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 While I, personally, don't give a rat's a** about the Ultimate comms - as the gear you can get with them is useless anyway - I still think removing them from lvl55 ops was a terrible idea. Not because it makes gearing harder - but because it leaves most players with little to none incentive to do the old content. I like doing ops, you see. Whether it's a HM/NiM with my guild or a random SM pug at the fleet - its always fun. I was glad to see people forming more 16m 55 content pugs now that you can no longer use GF for it at 60. Just like old times, huh? Didn't last long though. The people running pugs are doing it for two reasons: the comms (majority) or the fun. Or both. Now when the first reason has been effectively eliminated, the second one will follow - since it'll be next to impossible to form a 55 ops pug now. The same happened to EV/KP/EC back in the day... So tell me, ladies and gentlemen - how often do you see a group forming for those now? Once in two weeks? Less, perhaps? At least, when we all were level 55, we had 4 more ops to run instead - S&V, TFB, DF and DP. Now we have only 2, which are still buggy - since there are way more glitches then those mentioned in the patch notes. I have a feeling that from now on the game will be incredibly boring for me, as well as for a good deal of others who run pugs just for the fun of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annabethchase Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Yeah, I am wondering what we are supposed to do on a daily basis now. 4 hm fp's that have no rewards and 2 ops. So basically we have 2 days covered unless you are capable of doing hard mode ops, which is a small % of players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZETA_SCORPII Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 While I, personally, don't give a rat's a** about the Ultimate comms - as the gear you can get with them is useless anyway - I still think removing them from lvl55 ops was a terrible idea. Not because it makes gearing harder - but because it leaves most players with little to none incentive to do the old content. I like doing ops, you see. Whether it's a HM/NiM with my guild or a random SM pug at the fleet - its always fun. I was glad to see people forming more 16m 55 content pugs now that you can no longer use GF for it at 60. Just like old times, huh? Didn't last long though. The people running pugs are doing it for two reasons: the comms (majority) or the fun. Or both. Now when the first reason has been effectively eliminated, the second one will follow - since it'll be next to impossible to form a 55 ops pug now. The same happened to EV/KP/EC back in the day... So tell me, ladies and gentlemen - how often do you see a group forming for those now? Once in two weeks? Less, perhaps? At least, when we all were level 55, we had 4 more ops to run instead - S&V, TFB, DF and DP. Now we have only 2, which are still buggy - since there are way more glitches then those mentioned in the patch notes. I have a feeling that from now on the game will be incredibly boring for me, as well as for a good deal of others who run pugs just for the fun of it. It was fun while it lasted! I'm more than likely gonna take a break until they release more level 60 Ops. Endgame got quite a boost when DF / DP were released and I hope we'll see history repeat itself later this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dras_Keto Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 It is a shame, however, that this will likely mean less participation in the old content. Thats the way its supposed to work though. You release a new expansion with a new level cap, all of the old content is supposed to be obsolete. Thats the entire point. There shouldnt be anyone disturbed that "oh noes, theres no reason to do the older content." It should be the other way around, people are supposed to go "Hey, Bioware, stop constantly rehashing content and calling it new. Its lame." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdatt Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Make the weekly classic be 55 story mode. About the same difficulty as HM EV. Maybe rotate 55 sm in GF too but only like 4 ultimates daily. Some change was needed and presumably always intended. Giving a little something back would be OK too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drockter Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 "Hey, Bioware, stop constantly rehashing content and calling it new. Its lame." There are threads about this as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakamp Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Therein lies the problem. It was not challenging. Therefore why should it reward gear that is nearly the best available? cause bw's boss, the market said they don't like play old school raids, u should un-sub and go back to EQ, that is the style u like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annabethchase Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Thats the way its supposed to work though. You release a new expansion with a new level cap, all of the old content is supposed to be obsolete. Thats the entire point. There shouldnt be anyone disturbed that "oh noes, theres no reason to do the older content." It should be the other way around, people are supposed to go "Hey, Bioware, stop constantly rehashing content and calling it new. Its lame." 4 flashpoints that reward elite comms, 2 Ops. That's not enough content to throw out the 55 stuff yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Killjoy Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Because people still took the time to do it. They sat thought 30-60 min worth of content. I fail to see why everything has to be "challenging". Who freaking CARES. I spent my time, I fail to see why the reward shouldn't be decent. That gives more incentive to do it in the first place. It isn't rewarding the best gear. Just Ultimate comms. I agree 100% with the OP. My problem is that there is essentially only 2 ops to do now, when we had 6 to do before. THAT is the problem with this entire thing. But if the "best" gear isn't super exclusive, how will they feel special for having it? if you're not doing top-end content..you don't need the top-end gear. end of discussion. What does "need" have to do with anything? Also.. they appear to have disrespected you by not ending the conversation. Edited January 13, 2015 by Max_Killjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taw_Kobalt Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The top tier ops, should drop the gear naturally, and should be the only source of the set bonuses The lower tier ops should drop the comms so that you can at least work towards better gear and get you to a point where you can actually do the new ops without pulling your hair out. Not everyone is a progression raider that enjoys wiping for 16 hours learning a new boss mechanic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heat-Wave Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Yeah, I am wondering what we are supposed to do on a daily basis now. 4 hm fp's that have no rewards and 2 ops. So basically we have 2 days covered unless you are capable of doing hard mode ops, which is a small % of players. Nothing, it is Bioware's nice way of saying that you need to take a break from the game for a few months. They don't need your sub until summer when they come out with more ops and flashpoints. I've already canceled my auto-renewal, I'll take another look in the summer, but there is nothing to do now. It is worse than when 2.0 hit, that was a major change in how comms worked and it included the excellent macrobionics and seeker droid missions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZETA_SCORPII Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Nothing, it is Bioware's nice way of saying that you need to take a break from the game for a few months. They don't need your sub until summer when they come out with more ops and flashpoints. I've already canceled my auto-renewal, I'll take another look in the summer, but there is nothing to do now. It is worse than when 2.0 hit, that was a major change in how comms worked and it included the excellent macrobionics and seeker droid missions. The sad thing is that BioWare put out some pretty fun raids! I would love to have a level 60 version of every Op! Who's gonna run EV, KP, EC, SnV, TFB, DF / DP (other than NiM), or TC now? People who are passing through leveling from 50-60? What a HUGE waste of potential endgame content! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NemuriKyoshiro Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The sad thing is that BioWare put out some pretty fun raids! I would love to have a level 60 version of every Op! Who's gonna run EV, KP, EC, SnV, TFB, DF / DP (other than NiM), or TC now? People who are passing through leveling from 50-60? What a HUGE waste of potential endgame content! Agree 100%. If BW think the old content is not challenging enough, they should make it challenging. Just upgrade those ops to 60 and put the ultimate comm rewards back. Because running 2 glitchy ops once a week is definitely not enough to keep anyone interested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafaman Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 So... no... change the Ultimate Comm pay out was not a nerf. It is, after this patch, as it should be. Ultimates should be rewarded in the highetst tier of content. No over leveling, or over gearing your way through. They have to be earned. Not sure why this is an issue really. You still get comms from the old content. You can go gear up with elites if you want, but if you want the high end you have to work for it. And really... it isn't work. You get to have fun doing it. Look... this game has been nerfed enough. Good god... when anything has any level or degree of difficulty BW acquiesce to those who feel entitled because they don't want to earn the rewards. It isn't about status or shiny gear... it is about learning how to play and earning the rewards that come along with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthSpuds Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 LOL - 4/10 on troll post... If folks didn't get up and knock out the 198 offhands for characters by now then it serves them right. Good on you Bioware... make folks go do the actual operations. Now that Ultimate Comm's are almost unobtainable any other way but 20 a week. So its OK for you to get welfare epics because you did it early in the release cycle; but everyone else can go swing and its their fault. And I thought SWtoR had one of the better player communities. All The Best Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JouerTue Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 nah it's a right decision, SNV/TFB are faceroll easy at 60 and why they should reward ultimates? so when full 198 comms heroes go to the new ops can carry all the bads in 192 tokens? it was too easy, rly TFB or DF? for ults?..i see people with 2-3 198 pieces while they didn't put a step in ravagers, nobody runs the new ops beside people who missed guild runs or have some alts, it's a good choice to incentivate people run the new content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedip_enguin Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) I do want the best gear. ! I have some good news for you, 198 comm gear is terribad, so this change doesnt affect you ability to get the best gear Edited January 13, 2015 by jedip_enguin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Pre 3.0 the classic ops (Lvl 50; EV, EC, & KP) didn't award Ultimate comms... not sure why classic ops now should. Oh you never ran [Weekly] Classic Ops then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tankerson Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 If 198 vendor gear is not the best ie no set bonus or BiS mods I don't really see the big deal, just because raiders feel the content is piss easy doesn't mean every one does. And to be fair if it gets people who dont raid get in to raiding, all the better. Little things like this make people pug together and play in groups meeting new people, just like when the gree pylons were giving lots of Xp, iv never seen so many people open world pvping for the control of pylons and it was fun as hell, but people squawked about that, and how many people go to illum and open world pvp now? Or open world pvp at all? very few. To be honest I think BW should just leave it, it's not game breaking and in fact affects other progression Raiders in no way, there gear will still be best, they will the world first, server first guys. No ones gona do **** for elite coms no one will be pug grouping ( or it's going to reduce a lot at least ) and people will quietly get bored and leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KTap Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 The sad thing is that BioWare put out some pretty fun raids! I would love to have a level 60 version of every Op! Who's gonna run EV, KP, EC, SnV, TFB, DF / DP (other than NiM), or TC now? People who are passing through leveling from 50-60? What a HUGE waste of potential endgame content! Even though I've run EV/KP/EC a lot, I haven't for a long time and a 10 level increase + nightmare difficulty would be a lot of fun imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommanderKeeva Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 They should have kept the Ultimate commendations for 55 Hard Modes at least. They're still pretty difficult and got several mechanics that will kill you no matter how much HP you have. I see what Bioware is trying to do, force people to do the new Operations, but guess what, people still won't PuG those. The Ravagers and Temple of Sacrifice are way too difficult for the average PuG in 192 gear and guilds won't spend time and money teaching random players the intricacies of Bulo and the Underlurker. Especially in 16man ops. This puts earning ultimate commendations well beyond the capabilities of most players and only serves to widen the gear gap further. I don't disagree that SM 55 Ops were too easy for comms, but with this decision you've left most people with no way to earn them. I'd like to see Ultimate comms brought back for 55 HM and NiM Operations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleonosis Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I see what Bioware is trying to do, force people to do the new Operations, but guess what, people still won't PuG those. The Ravagers and Temple of Sacrifice are way too difficult for the average PuG in 192 gear and guilds won't spend time and money teaching random players the intricacies of Bulo and the Underlurker. Especially in 16man ops. This puts earning ultimate commendations well beyond the capabilities of most players and only serves to widen the gear gap further. I don't disagree that SM 55 Ops were too easy for comms, but with this decision you've left most people with no way to earn them. I'd like to see Ultimate comms brought back for 55 HM and NiM Operations. ^this, Bulo might be easier after patch and there might be few more 16m PUGs, but I can't imagine 16m PUG run going past Underlurker. There will always be 1 person who will use knockdown protection and cross won't show up, or with insta cross most of ppl will be off position. Walkers are coordination/dps check too, random guy carrying the bomb whenever he want? Nope, I'm not going to wipe 100 times on Walkers just to wipe even more on Underlurker with PUGs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froippi Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 i have no problem with this change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PavSalco Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 (edited) Not everyone is a progression raider that enjoys wiping for 16 hours learning a new boss mechanic. If you wipe for 16 hours in the new operations in SM, you can't be called a progression raider I don't care about the changes. The gear that is affordable for commendations is not a good one, but I understand that for casuals 198 is a magic number which they want to get as fast as possible. It would be a nice incentive to leave Ultimates as a drop from the weekly bosses in hard modes of 55s OPS. Ultimates dropping from each boss would be too easy, that is why they should be restricted to the weekly boss. That sounds balanced. Edited January 13, 2015 by PavSalco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 i have no problem with this change Me neither. I am happy with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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