AP Powertech needs a serious nerf.

[Natharon]

Lol, tunnel them, we have no defenses. Seems to be a fair trade off currently.

[DethlaHadyn]

Let the dust settle.

 

The crying here is all coming from the inexperienced lower level players getting rolled by higher level experienced players who have access to more utilities. The real problem is the PvP brackets in where lowbies aren't standing a chance.

 

Powertechs without their cooldowns actually drop really fast. The problem with some people in this thread is that they've lost to a powertech who had all of his available. Once people learn how to counter the new tier of class abilities, we'll see less qq.

 

Face it people. There will always be someone who plays better than you, regardless of class.

[mmmbuddah]

They can give that skill to marauders. They would need that.

 

This skill isn't that OP. It's on a 3 minute CD, and I don't need it that much. When I am focused this skill won't help me to survive and in a 1:1 I don't need it either. I would not miss it!

 

Edit: what do you mean all the time?

Well, what I should have said, is, when I play warzones I tend to go against teams that are comprised of 4 assassins and whatever else, then when I attack ANY assassins, I can NEVER cc them...-ever- because they have that immune to everything ability. If one class has an immune to everything ability, ALL classes should get that one ability. End of story.

[Aetideus]

PT/VG's are fine. Yes, their burst is killer...however, there's a reason we are typically focused first: we are squish.

 

Seriously. PT/VG are the 3rd easiest kill right now. I'd say Mercs/Mando's are number 1, and Operatives/Scoundrels are #2.

 

It's funny, currently at pre rwzs are targeted and die in secs xD. Crap spec against team play, so far with no healer. Players start learning how to counter this, and is no nice spectacle.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Aetideus

[Hei_Atzfel]

Powertechs without their cooldowns actually drop really fast.

 

Okay honestly, can we just stop this nonsense? Every single class and/or spec in the entire game drops really fast without cooldowns. That's the very nature of how the game works.

[Czaro]

Okay honestly, can we just stop this nonsense? Every single class and/or spec in the entire game drops really fast without cooldowns. That's the very nature of how the game works.

 

Yeah I agree that every class die quickly without dcds, but PT has let's say one decent dcd in ap now which is Energy Shield... Kolto is **** in this spec and it's on 3min cd. Should I count assassin's dcds or jugg's or sorcs or maras?

If they are going to nerf burst I want Pyro's Kolto Overload back.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Czaro

[KainrycKarr]

Just need to make a few small tweaks.

 

1. Shoulder cannon needs to go BACK to it's 1.5s CD, changing it from unloading in 3.5s to 10.5s.

 

This will fix the insane burst/opener.

 

2. Tune down the Heroic speed boost utility from 45% increase to 25% increase.

 

This makes it both still useful, but a little less insane.

[Czaro]

SC was on 1s ICD pre 3.0.

[foxmob]

Yeah I agree that every class die quickly without dcds, but PT has let's say one decent dcd in ap now which is Energy Shield... Kolto is **** in this spec and it's on 3min cd. Should I count assassin's dcds or jugg's or sorcs or maras?

If they are going to nerf burst I want Pyro's Kolto Overload back.

 

kolto is a stun breaker that almost immediately gets you up to 35%, and when used properly, will not only break but get you to 35% at which point you pop medpack for an almost instant 70% hp. it's no ED by any means, but it's incredibly useful. honestly, I think it's much better than a straight 25% DR. HTL, Adrenaline Rush and Sonic Round are the most valuable survival tools for a tactics VG imo. the only problem is that sonic round is also our aoe taunt, so I don't normally hold onto it for self defense. and it pisses me off that I should have to make that decision every time I think about dropping an aoe taunt. of course I want to taunt the grp that isn't attacking me.

 

anyway, I really do think VG tactics defenses are perfectly fine. I think some other ACs/specs have too much on the dcd options, and I'd rather be brought up to their level than nothing, but I honestly think they should be nerfed down to us. I don't like all these "hard checks" to dmg that half the ACs have. I think very small windows of resistances are good (e.g., shroud, UDR, dodge), but the long lasting "do not attack" or CC abils are just silly. short duration "resists/absorbs" and 20-30% DRs. all this other stuff is just stupid. reduce dmg output if you need to, but enough with the uber dcds.

[Aetideus]

Okay honestly, can we just stop this nonsense? Every single class and/or spec in the entire game drops really fast without cooldowns. That's the very nature of how the game works.

 

Apparently this spec is AP and tactics revolve around disabling AP or healer first. Mercs on the other hand are complete crap. Not balanced at all those two specs.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Aetideus

[Czaro]

kolto is a stun breaker that almost immediately gets you up to 35%, and when used properly, will not only break but get you to 35% at which point you pop medpack for an almost instant 70% hp. it's no ED by any means, but it's incredibly useful. honestly, I think it's much better than a straight 25% DR. HTL, Adrenaline Rush and Sonic Round are the most valuable survival tools for a tactics VG imo. the only problem is that sonic round is also our aoe taunt, so I don't normally hold onto it for self defense. and it pisses me off that I should have to make that decision every time I think about dropping an aoe taunt. of course I want to taunt the grp that isn't attacking me.

 

Kolto right now is a massive **** that pretends to keep you at 35%HP. Let's calculate smth: AVG HP for PT AP is 42k. 35% of it's HP is 14700HP. If you are going to meet burst class at this situation let be honest you are already dead. Stun breaker is really situational and personally i do not take it because when I use it I'll lose 30% dmg red while stunned. Better is to spend point to healing rockets that will heal you up also when you are stunned.

 

About 30% def chance from mass taunt. It's really good ability but I also hate to choose between taunt or dcd that works randomly.

 

I agree that PT has insane burst and it needs to be toned down. But when I see people crying that AP is op i want to laugh. Without a healer ap pt is nothing. He's a priority target that dies in a seconds. He's defensive is attack. He's like kamikaze.

 

The most broken classes are atm madness sins and sorcs. I'm not saying PT's burst isn't but honestly... Inquisitors can make easily 2,5k++ dps. (I've even seen once that sorc made 3900+dps) and they have better dcds than powertechs.

[killerbugz]

I'm not usually one to call for nerfs but PT's AP burst is completely imbalanced at the moment. It needs a serious tone down very soon.

 

 

I dont know what class/spec you main but i main a dps scoundrel and PT's have been my nemesis for quite some time.

 

After rolling one I learned how to deny them their bread and butter.

 

When i face a pt these are my rules

 

Do everything in my power to delay that rail shot crit at beginning of engagement.

 

If they hold the line i cc and wait

 

to actually get the killing blow( beating the low hp amazing heal they get i can't remember name)I dump everything i got into them right when i start hearing that dam heal go off.

 

Any class/spec that gets the jump on you is going to be a tough fight.If you get the jump on pt they burn pretty quickly.Their strength just makes them a higher priority.

 

imo post 3.0 everyone seems strong

[AlrikFassbauer]

Let the dust settle.

 

The crying here is all coming from the inexperienced lower level players getting rolled by higher level experienced players who have access to more utilities. The real problem is the PvP brackets in where lowbies aren't standing a chance.

 

Powertechs without their cooldowns actually drop really fast. The problem with some people in this thread is that they've lost to a powertech who had all of his available. Once people learn how to counter the new tier of class abilities, we'll see less qq.

 

Face it people. There will always be someone who plays better than you, regardless of class.

 

This is one of the more ... balanced ... answers here. Thank you.

 

I hate it, though, being facerolled in lkower brackets. It just feels bad. Because people will say that I'm a BAD not seeing that I had no chance to begin with.

People actually admitting that one has no chance when being focused by 3 players are THAT scarce that I'd almost give out a prize for finding replies stating it.

[HaoZhao]

The only really big fix that PTs need right now is losing the 75% sped bonus on HO. That utility really belongs on mercenaries, not PTs who were already the kings of kiting even without it.

[Zoom_VI]

If I was in charge, SC would go on a 1.5 sec ICD, or one rocket every GCD, or the full complement of 7 rockets in 7 GCDs.

 

The only really big fix that PTs need right now is losing the 75% sped bonus on HO. That utility really belongs on mercenaries, not PTs who were already the kings of kiting even without it.

 

To be fair 10s of 75% speed is kinda ridiculous on anything. It should be no more than 45%. But yeah mercs could really use something nowadays.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Zoom_VI

[Lhancelot]

The only really big fix that PTs need right now is losing the 75% sped bonus on HO. That utility really belongs on mercenaries, not PTs who were already the kings of kiting even without it.

 

Very good point, mercs have a few issues but one big one is the inability to survive any focus at all, they have zero survivability. This buff on mercs would be so helpful!

 

As for that being the only issue with PTs/VGs I fear I feel differently, as their burst is too big. Sure, if you are really paying attention and have fast reflexes you can manage to survive their burst. But if you are slow to react they literally can totally wipe you out dead in a matter of secs.

 

Add in another decent dps, like a good sin/shadow and you truly have no chance to live, no relfexes will save you from the instantaneous burst of damage you get from them.

 

I have had some pvp matches against a really good stealth and a good PT, I can't even manage bubble on my healing sorc their burst is so surprisingly fast.

 

I will be taking damage healing myself thinking, "ok this is manageable healing healing healing..." when literally within 3 secs I get popped with bursts of damage and stuns that completely blow me up before I can even press bubble. I am just like, holy****.... I just got roffelstomped.

 

This is too much. Some of the power in pvp needs to be shifted to some of the other classes, and any PT/VG that who argues this burst + insanely high crit damage is fair, well I would question your motives and reasoning.

 

The only kind of player who would say this is working fine are either not so good players who now find success on the PT/VG class with the overpowered abilities and burst, or they are the type who doesn't like fair fights and they like to win and win as easily as possible.

 

The problem with the way this class is working now, is that good players or great players can take this already very easy class to play and just totally demolish weaker classes, which is every other class in pvp.

 

Pvp is about burst, and this burst is not fair. I have no worries though, I know as well as everyone else that PTs/VGs will get nerfed asap.

 

I just wish when that happens, some kind of adjustment will be made to Mercs and Snipers. Both classes have been gimped particularly in ranked 4 vs 4. How long do these classes have to not be viable for ranked? This is total bullcrap.

 

I would enjoy seeing other classes in ranked besides Juggs, PTs, Sorcs, Ops, and Sins. This limitation to who enters ranked makes ranked pops happen less.

 

If Bioware wanted ranked to be this 4 vs 4 setup, then why do they not fix the classes that cannot do it? How long do these classes have to remain broken for ranked before it is addressed? Fix the classes that are OP'd, and fix the classes that are gimped already! PLEASE!!!

[SkyLordJaden]

they seem pretty balanced to me if you compare them to sorcs and sins

 

my balance fix would be:

 

1) remove force storm crit / surge buff from lightning sorc tree

2) reduce dot spread damage for sins and sorcs (like dots do 50% of damage on the targets they were spread to)

3) Make shoulder cannon respect the gcd

 

Might not fix everything but a lot of the big issues atm would be fixed like this, imho.

 

Im sorry but putting shoulder cannon on gcd would be the biggest nerf to the class in existence. At most it will do 2k damage and then using it on gcd would only be good over rapid shots. Ap is fine as it is, people just have no clue how to avoid being kited

[Zoom_VI]

As for that being the only issue with PTs/VGs I fear I feel differently, as their burst is too big. Sure, if you are really paying attention and have fast reflexes you can manage to survive their burst. But if you are slow to react they literally can totally wipe you out dead in a matter of secs.

There is this thing called thermal detonator, it is absolutely necessary to use if you are going to get that "insane burst" an interesting property of Thermal detonator is that before if goes off, it sits on you for a full three seconds before going off , it even has a audio cue too.

 

I'm sorry but if you need more than 3sec of reaction time, I don't think you are going to be doing well in PvP against anything at all.

 

I have had some pvp matches against a really good stealth and a good PT, I can't even manage bubble on my healing sorc their burst is so surprisingly fast.

Proof of italicized.

 

 

 

This is too much. Some of the power in pvp needs to be shifted to some of the other classes, and any PT/VG that who argues this burst + insanely high crit damage is fair, well I would question your motives and reasoning.

The only issue with tacitcs is that SC has no ICD, anyone who understands how the class works has realized this within a week of 3.0 dropping.

 

A glass cannon should hit hard, and I do not want to go back to the dark ages of 2.0-2.4 where VGs where a glass peashooter that everyone laughed at.

 

they are the type who doesn't like fair fights and they like to win and win as easily as possible.

This is kinda rich coming from a sage.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Zoom_VI

[Zoom_VI]

Ap is fine as it is, people just have no clue how to avoid being kited

 

Being able to fire 7 rockets in 2 GCDs isn't "fine."

 

Shoulder cannon was meant to supplement your burst, in its current state, shoulder cannon *is* your burst.

Edited December 21, 2014 by Zoom_VI

[DethlaHadyn]

Okay honestly, can we just stop this nonsense? Every single class and/or spec in the entire game drops really fast without cooldowns. That's the very nature of how the game works.

 

 

So let's reduce their DPS potential and keep them squishy? In ranked, you won't see these 17.5k pt crits. More commonly I've seen an average of 11.5-13k crits against properly geared opponents. Remember that's also with double relic procs. Now if the damage was reduced to 7.5-10k, would that really make a difference? A good pt(with cooldowns lol), is going to drop you anyways. It's the Mandalorian code, drop them before they drop you.

 

 

Show us the place where the "bad pt" touched you.

[DethlaHadyn]

Being able to fire 7 rockets in 2 GCDs isn't "fine."

 

Shoulder cannon was meant to supplement your burst, in its current state, shoulder cannon *is* your burst.

 

Stop making it sound like they have access to their cannons all the time. The cooldown is a long one. I'd also point out that non-crit hits for around 1-1.2k. So multiply that by 4..... Or even 7.....

 

Anyone who's complaining about shoulder cannon either needs to go drop a deuce, or go get laid.

[HaoZhao]

Stop making it sound like they have access to their cannons all the time. The cooldown is a long one. I'd also point out that non-crit hits for around 1-1.2k. So multiply that by 4..... Or even 7.....

 

Anyone who's complaining about shoulder cannon either needs to go drop a deuce, or go get laid.

 

It doesn't matter if the cooldown is long. If the burst is strong enough to take out a healer who then has to go behind a forcefield and sit on his thumbs while everyone else on his team gets clobbered due to the lack of heals, then the long cooldown was more than worth it. In the case of areans, taking out a player with fast burst can decide the outcome of the round, turning the match into a quick 4 on 3.

Edited December 21, 2014 by HaoZhao

[sanchito]

Im sorry but putting shoulder cannon on gcd would be the biggest nerf to the class in existence. At most it will do 2k damage and then using it on gcd would only be good over rapid shots. Ap is fine as it is, people just have no clue how to avoid being kited

 

it would still be better than anything else while you are stunned, that is actually the point of this ability

[Selenial]

Stop making it sound like they have access to their cannons all the time. The cooldown is a long one. I'd also point out that non-crit hits for around 1-1.2k. So multiply that by 4..... Or even 7.....

 

Anyone who's complaining about shoulder cannon either needs to go drop a deuce, or go get laid.

 

Youre not taking opening burst into account In that both a FR relic and a SA relic will be popped while they spam shoulder canon, I've seen it hit consecutively for 3k.

 

The burst is ridiculous and anyone denying that is living in a dream world. Hell, in the operative stream Musco said something along the lines of;

"Class balance isn't final, people shouldn't expect them to stay where they are when 3.0 drops. I can tell you now there will be posts on the forums complaining about Nerfs to their class, and Nerfs will happen. We still don't know how classes will perform in the meta and there will be adjustments, it's inevitable."

[Lhancelot]

There is this thing called thermal detonator, it is absolutely necessary to use if you are going to get that "insane burst" an interesting property of Thermal detonator is that before if goes off, it sits on you for a full three seconds before going off , it even has a audio cue too.

 

I'm sorry but if you need more than 3sec of reaction time, I don't think you are going to be doing well in PvP against anything at all.

 

 

Proof of italicized.

 

 

 

 

The only issue with tacitcs is that SC has no ICD, anyone who understands how the class works has realized this within a week of 3.0 dropping.

 

A glass cannon should hit hard, and I do not want to go back to the dark ages of 2.0-2.4 where VGs where a glass peashooter that everyone laughed at.

 

 

This is kinda rich coming from a sage.

 

Crinn, I love the fact you have to make this personal by mentioning my statements are "rich coming from a sage", but firstly I am a healing sage/sorc.

 

Secondly, my experiences so far in ranked has shown me that healing classes across the board put up the same numbers, indicating to me that the healers are very closely balanced to eachother now.

 

I don't need to say names. I can say that I see merc healers, and ops healers doing exactly the same as sorc healers in ranked/regs.

 

Now back to the point. This thread was regarding VG/PT insanely overpowered bursts in pvp. Not about sages/sorcs.

 

The funny part is, VG/PTs were a pretty strong class even before 3.0, so hearing you say you "don't want to go back to the dark ages" before 3.0, well, that says a lot.

 

If you thought they were gimpy then I only can smh. If you think now they are working as intended, well, again I smh.

 

Every class played by other players realizes that VG/PTs are NOT working as intended. Prepare yourself for the nerf, buddy. And enjoy your overpowered bursts while they last. they will be addressed soon.