So about that CLOSED beta testing????

[LordArtemis]

That's not an argument.

 

Fair enough. It is a matter of fact statement.

I had no intent. I merely pointed it out.

Again, you misunderstand. You defined MY intent, and needed to defend that definition.

 

The intention was all yours.

...in your opinion, as you incorrectly defined it, lacking logic or reason in the process IMO.

 

I indicated I had no intent, other than keeping it fair and pointing out the facts. Unfortunately for your point my explanation of my intent is far more reputable than yours will ever be, considering you do not define anyone's intent but your own under ANY circumstances.

 

When you speak in the plural, it does require more than your words. You do not speak for others I believe.

 

As I have indicated on many occasions. I do, however, define what is important to me, and whether or not I grant merit. So you are absolutely wrong about any requirements in that respect. If you wish to say that is what is required for you to consider it valid, that is absolutely fair. Of course, I think I have made it clear whether or not that concerns me DW.

 

But you do not, under any circumstance define what is required when I post, short of pointing out the forum rules which are required for everyone.

 

If you do, you might as well prove it.

 

Again, fair enough. You could consider taking your own advice in this respect once in a while.

As you say, your post history speaks for itself. As does your intent. More often than not.

 

Fair enough. Although I disagree that my opinion represents some kind of threat, it is obvious I stand by my post history, as you likely do yours. And we can leave it at that.

Edited December 4, 2014 by LordArtemis

[Knorlac]

Expecting them to release an expansion or an update with ZERO issues whatsoever is a delusion. Same is true for every single developer in this planet.

 

Agreed on the zero bugs thing, that will never happen.

But having the final mission of the storyline bug out on you 95% of the time is a glaring issue that shouldn't have made it to live under any circumstances IMO. It lessens the enjoyment of the content and reflects poorly on the company IMO.

[LordArtemis]

Agreed on the zero bugs thing, that will never happen.

But having the final mission of the storyline bug out on you 95% of the time is a glaring issue that shouldn't have made it to live under any circumstances IMO. It lessens the enjoyment of the content and reflects poorly on the company IMO.

 

Well, to be fair serious bugs make it to live in all games, and do usually get fixed pretty quickly. In some cases the bug does not avail itself until it makes it to live.

 

I question the changes that they do not speak to, ones that will likely cause an uproar instead of the bugs. I think they could demonstrate a bit more insight into heading off negative reaction to changes they will obviously likely irritate some folks.

 

I try to give them a pass on bugs however, though some times I do poke fun at them a bit over it. Most of the time they have fixed any bugs that became apparent pretty quickly.

[Anzel]

I love how people are arguing, "no, no the game is fine for me. Yeah... just a few bugs. It's to be expected."

 

In the mean time the dev tracker and [bUG] section are filling up by the minute. LOL. I wish Michael Jackson would come by with some popcorn.

[Kadin]

I love how people are arguing, "no, no the game is fine for me. Yeah... just a few bugs. It's to be expected."

 

In the mean time the dev tracker and [bUG] section are filling up by the minute. LOL. I wish Michael Jackson would come by with some popcorn.

Do you want only people who have issues to respond or do you think it's fair for those of us who don't have issues to also give our assessment? And it's not an argument, it's reality for some of us.

[Khevar]

I wish Michael Jackson would come by with some popcorn.

We need Vincent Price back before that can happen.

[LordArtemis]

I love how people are arguing, "no, no the game is fine for me. Yeah... just a few bugs. It's to be expected."

 

In the mean time the dev tracker and [bUG] section are filling up by the minute. LOL. I wish Michael Jackson would come by with some popcorn.

 

If you feel you have a right to express your dissatisfaction with the current state of the game, which you naturally do, you should respect the right of others to express how they feel about it, including the notion that they do not feel it is a serious issue IMO. Naturally you do not need my approval, but IMO this would be good form.

 

If you intended to notify Bioware of your disappointment I believe you have accomplished that to the best of your ability. If you intend to change others opinions to your own, you may find that is a fools errand.

 

People will tend to think for themselves.

Edited December 3, 2014 by LordArtemis

[TravelersWay]

The last REAL test server was EQ1 test like in the first 3 expansions and base era. After casters realm was replaced by new MMO media outfits that had "beta" key events. Test servers have become more of just a dog and pony show from what I can see as to they will only maybe fix bugs but never make any changes from there dev plan.

 

Indeed. Unfortunately BioWare isn't the only developer to suffer from the problem of lack of proper testing and vetting of patches and expansions. Let's make no bones about it, games are going to be buggy and things broken - in MMOs even more so. But that is absolutely no reason that us as players (and consumers) should have to put up with those kinds of things when there are obviously things that developers can still do to help minimize the issues as much as possible.

 

There is absolutely no reason not to have a permanently enable test realm with it own community. It essentially would just be another live server, except it gets to see the patches/expansions ahead of time. Unfortunately, developers do not cultivate such a community, and everyone suffers because of it. Pure stupidity in my mind, but until the player community begins to demand more (and follows through with actions, such as not spending money), these situations will continue to happen.

[Anzel]

Indeed. Unfortunately BioWare isn't the only developer to suffer from the problem of lack of proper testing and vetting of patches and expansions. Let's make no bones about it, games are going to be buggy and things broken - in MMOs even more so. But that is absolutely no reason that us as players (and consumers) should have to put up with those kinds of things when there are obviously things that developers can still do to help minimize the issues as much as possible.

 

There is absolutely no reason not to have a permanently enable test realm with it own community. It essentially would just be another live server, except it gets to see the patches/expansions ahead of time. Unfortunately, developers do not cultivate such a community, and everyone suffers because of it. Pure stupidity in my mind, but until the player community begins to demand more (and follows through with actions, such as not spending money), these situations will continue to happen.

 

Yep, we had this in SWG and it worked really really well.

[undiess]

MFW PVP server. :^) Also, any information about live that was gained was from dulfy.net have you seen the immense amount of 3.0 information and guides? They're actually quite informative.

Yavin loading area will obviously be made neutral in due time, but it was really cute to use PvP server as an excuse. I think it says a lot about the point of this OP's thread that those closed beta testers didn't provide any useful feedback if even something simple as that shared starting area wasn't already made a neutral area and left a griefing ground.

Edited December 4, 2014 by undiess

[Sangrar]

Remember when everyone was all like, "Hey are you guys going to test this massive, fundamental change to the game we all pay for?"... and you guys were all like, "Oh, we're doing a special secret test. It'll be great!".

 

Yeah. Not so much. How about next time you know, maybe test something this big with people willing to help you out FOR FREE so that we aren't left with a bug ridden, barely playable system. Just because it builds on *your machine doesn't mean it's ok to deploy. Grace Hopper is rolling in her grave somewhere.

 

I don't think its the closed-testing itself that was the problem. I mean clearly people in the testing would have run into these problems too, thats not really it. And the lag issues were almost bound to happen with so many players making so many instances at once on Rishi and Yavin.

 

 

I see that 2 things might have happened, code word MIGHT, pure speculation but a theory nonetheless

 

1. Maybe some of these bugs were not present originally or were rectified but somehow made it into the live version

 

or 2. when the last expansion, strongholds, got pushed back, it delayed their development of this expansion a bit. The devs might have wanted to keep the release before the years close like originally promised, and, to their credit, for once they did in terms of a deadline, many people months ago doubted it. But however it might have been bad since it might have left less time to null stuff out and they ran out of time to make certain fixes

 

just my theories though

[demotivator]

Remember when everyone was all like, "Hey are you guys going to test this massive, fundamental change to the game we all pay for?"... and you guys were all like, "Oh, we're doing a special secret test. It'll be great!".

 

Yeah. Not so much. How about next time you know, maybe test something this big with people willing to help you out FOR FREE so that we aren't left with a bug ridden, barely playable system. Just because it builds on *your machine doesn't mean it's ok to deploy. Grace Hopper is rolling in her grave somewhere.

 

I'd say that if you weren't part of the closed test which is obvious given your post you actually don't know what you are talking about (since you weren't part of it). Hence you should just shut up instead of looking like an idiot.

[DarthVitrial]

I don't think its the closed-testing itself that was the problem. I mean clearly people in the testing would have run into these problems too, thats not really it. And the lag issues were almost bound to happen with so many players making so many instances at once on Rishi and Yavin.

 

 

I see that 2 things might have happened, code word MIGHT, pure speculation but a theory nonetheless

 

1. Maybe some of these bugs were not present originally or were rectified but somehow made it into the live version

 

That is what happened.

[DarthOvertone]

Thank you to everyone that paid to Beta test SoR during Early Access. Your suffering and effort will most certainly improve my SoR gaming experience down the road.

 

Honestly, thank you for the effort!

[Knorlac]

Well, to be fair serious bugs make it to live in all games, and do usually get fixed pretty quickly. In some cases the bug does not avail itself until it makes it to live.

 

I question the changes that they do not speak to, ones that will likely cause an uproar instead of the bugs. I think they could demonstrate a bit more insight into heading off negative reaction to changes they will obviously likely irritate some folks.

 

I try to give them a pass on bugs however, though some times I do poke fun at them a bit over it. Most of the time they have fixed any bugs that became apparent pretty quickly.

 

Fair enough, but I still find it unlikely that such a showstopping bug is likely to make it into live if thorough testing took place. Given the scope of the expansion, bugged quests are not so much forgivable IMO. It's not exactly a full blown expansion with 150+ quests to begin with.

 

Sure, some bugs are found too late to be patched out right away, but if your main story line can't be completed that is a major oversight IMO. I'm not dismissing the chance that this bug really never ocurred during testing entirely, but I find it unlikely tbh. And if they detected it before launch it would have warranted delaying the launch(yeah, this would've had the forums erupting in flames) or working overtime to iron it out IMO.

[Pietrastor]

On top of broken final boss fight 3.0 also broke GSF and GSH decorating system lol. Trully outstanding results from closed beta. Makes Assassin's Creed Unity look polished in comparsion

[Gentleman_snow]

As expansions go, this was a much smoother launch than I've seen for other games. See WoW's latest and Legacy of Romulus for STO last year as classic examples.

 

I'm sure they're hard at work on it for when open access goes live. They'll take care of it. Stop acting like they stole your wallet with a gun to your head. They're doing the best they can. Game's not perfect, but it's a better ride than most I've personally tried. YMMV.

[sloasdaylight]

Well it's a good thing the expansion hasn't officially launched yet, other wise BioWare would really have some egg on their face.

[TheSeventhJedi]

Gasp! A bug in an MMO! This is new, and definitely doesn't happen with regular patches! Open testing would have solved!!!!

[Anzel]

1.) We asked for a public test. This is a FACT. It's not up for debate.

2.) They chose to NOT have a public test. This is a FACT.

3.) The me launched with more bugs and regressions than acceptable. FACT.

4.) The overall product would have been more polished if they ran several builds through PTS. FACT.

[sloasdaylight]

1.) We asked for a public test. This is a FACT. It's not up for debate.

2.) They chose to NOT have a public test. This is a FACT.

3.) The me launched with more bugs and regressions than acceptable. FACT.

4.) The overall product would have been more polished if they ran several builds through PTS. FACT.

 

1) I suppose I can't really argue with this, since the requirements for saying "we" could be anything.

2) Can't argue with this.

3) Wrong, Shadow of Revan has not been officially released yet. Subscribers who pre-ordered by a certain date currently have early access to it, but the expansion doesn't officially launch until 9 December. Also, acceptable is a wildly subjective amount.

4) Uncertain.

[LordArtemis]

I think it could be argued that folks are testing it right now on live, since this is early access.

[Jadescythe]

1.) We asked for a public test. This is a FACT. It's not up for debate.

2.) They chose to NOT have a public test. This is a FACT.

3.) The me launched with more bugs and regressions than acceptable. FACT.

4.) The overall product would have been more polished if they ran several builds through PTS. FACT.

 

Numbers 3 and 4 are not fact, they are actually your opinion. Public test servers yield very little return outside of stress testing.

[Sangrar]

1.) We asked for a public test. This is a FACT. It's not up for debate.

2.) They chose to NOT have a public test. This is a FACT.

3.) The me launched with more bugs and regressions than acceptable. FACT.

4.) The overall product would have been more polished if they ran several builds through PTS. FACT.

 

you see, thats the problem right there with your argument over closed testing since...

 

1. there were still ACTUAL PLAYERS in there testing, FACT.

 

2. they would have seen these bugs, if the final version of PTS made it to live or if these bugs didn't somehow pop up in the live version, its kind of hard not to notice when a boss bugs out and makes it impossible to complete something. FACT

 

3. Saying that it would have been more polished had it been more public is speculation. FACT. Though personally, I find it a bit hard to believe that the people who were in the closed testing, being actual players who naturally wanted to try out this content, wouldn't have found the bugs, there would have been at least someone who did, I mean there was a thread a month or two back claiming mostly nightmare mode raiders had been invited ( not sure how true it is but that probably meant at least some did)

 

 

I am not saying there are no bugs, that is a fact, and not saying there wasn't closed testing, that is a fact, and as for the whole "we" thing as that other guy said a few posts above me, due to multiple meanings of "we" I can't really argue that. I myself have been having problems too thats been slowing me down, but still, the fact that it was a closed Beta test doesn't mean that that is the cause for all of this specifically, as, I cannot stress enough, there were still people in that test and everything who had eyes and could probably see some problems as they came up

[Kalfear]

Im still trying to wrap head around OP saying game is barely playable because the final boss is bugged.

 

One fight (and only if you do it solo is it undoable normally) doesnt make a entire product unplayable

 

YES, I also do not understand how this bug made it to release if ANY testing was done

Its NOT a server side bug

Its NOT a Lag issue

and it IS repeatable (IE: Happens more times then not) so easy to see.

 

There is a fundamental design flaw/issue in the final fight (IE using a dot more often then not breaks the fight and one of the NPCs that is always in fight has a dot attack). And the bugged portion of fight stems from that DOT ability thats applied by that NPC.

 

You can do EVERYTHING RIGHT on your side and the fight remains bugged because a NPC applies the DOT.

 

HOW does that make it past testing (if testing was truly done)

 

But thats 1 fight at the very end.

How that suddenly makes the entire product barely playable is beyond me.

 

But I also see why the product never went to open beta testing

its 2 days old and we are complaining about the final encounter being bugged

meaning a lion share of players already seen and done all (excluding ops that really only matter to a small minority of players anyways)

2 days and we are out of content once again on a PAID expansion

 

Dont get me wrong, loved my 2 days of Shadow of Revan

Rishii and Yacin 4 were great (for what they were)

but doubt ill be here in 363 days from now for the next 2 days worth of new content

Pretty sure Feb 24 will be my last day in SW:TOR because there is just to many good games (starting with Witcher 3 that day) coming out that will not get beat in 2 days.

 

I have guildies that now have 2 level 60s in 15 hours of play

 

Once again EA has shot themselves in foot making it to easy

 

I mean even in Rifts first expansion it held me for over a month with its content and areas

I doubt WOW players will be through all the content in 16 hours of play in their new expansion

 

SOR was a great concept made to easy that it ultimately holds only a few days (at best) of new content

the 5 levels take under 10 hours to acheive when not using xp boosts

the land mass is easily explored and completed

As a single player $3.00 DLC, SOR would be ok

As a $20.00 once a year MMO expansion,

it just doesnt live up to snuff