Tsillah Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Again - IMHO - there's no issue whatsoever, other than people wanting something which is truly op with the least amount of effort possible. You take the point of view of overall effort, I take the point of view of individual effort. As I explained people in smaller guilds will have to put in more effort. Asking it to be less is not about the least amount of effort but about not costing more effort for the same thing for the individual player. Are you saying that 5 million credits is the same effort as 1 million credits? And how exactly is a guild ship op? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Heh. I would say the chances this goes live are pretty good, considering their track record with feedback on the PTS. Seems a bit steep to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrgames Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million isn't a lot. I wouldn't call my guild larger by any means. About 200 members. Most people in the guild has 2-5 alts in the guild. At most there are about 10 active players in the guild. There is 47 million in the guild bank. 50 million isn't a lot. Flagship should be something a guild works for as a guild. If you aren't working as a guild than why do you need access to guild conquest quest? Sound more like the problem is most people complaining about the price is a group of selfish individual who aren't willing to work to get something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tsillah Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million isn't a lot for us and since everybody must be the same it's must automatically be cheap for everybody else as well. Fixed it for ya. Honestly, jokes aside, it really depends on the guild but I am guessing that far from every guild has that kind of money in their guild bank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyOldMystic Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Bioware you wanted feedback for the pts week for guild ships but theres no point let me lay this out for you. If a guild does this via dailies they are going to burn there members out and end up unsubing or quitting the game. Not to mention given the lack of customization in this game up to this point people are already extremely tired of dailies. Secondly if people try to sell whats in there guild bank or sell what they craft the market will become flooded with the same items, ergo prices will drop drastically. If people try to get items off operations and sell them the same result will apply. Essentially this leaves only one option cartel coins, and honestly I think thats maybe what you want, but even then the price on the current cartel items at the time of the guild ship release will drop. It will drop because guilds will be buying the items only to turn around and sell them for the guild ships. Essentially 50 mill is a bad move all around. To further the point guilds still have to pay for the ground guild strongholds, and thats going to cost several million credits. You want to keep it at 50 mill fine but make it a buy one get one free type of deal. If a guild buys the ship they get the guild stronghold on the ground too. If you do not want to go that route atleast lower the cost of each to 15mill so a guild only has to come up with 30mill total. Last but not least this will in effect kill off all small guilds, because people will leave and want to join the guilds with a guild ship. This presents another critical problem, you are unable to raise the guild membership cap from 500 to 1000. So what are you saying to all those people when the large guilds start capping out at 500? Your SOL? Please consider dropping the price on the guild ships by allot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) You take the point of view of overall effort, I take the point of view of individual effort. As I explained people in smaller guilds will have to put in more effort. Asking it to be less is not about the least amount of effort but about not costing more effort for the same thing for the individual player. Are you saying that 5 million credits is the same effort as 1 million credits? I take the point as it should be perceived, the key word being "GUILD" last I checked. I already pointed out an alternative for smaller guilds, which sounds logical IMHO. And how exactly is a guild ship op? If you're running out of breathing room, as far as arguments are concerned, you could do a better job trying to mask it. It is op for the same reasoning that the "Crest of the Dread Master" is op for example, namely because it requires people to come together and do their very best at something which is labeled as an "MMORPG". Again, as usual, individuals just want something op with the least amount of effort attached to it. It's not something new truth be told. Edited July 24, 2014 by Darth_Wicked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvertone Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I wouldn't call my guild larger by any means. About 200 members. On the two PvP servers I play on, a 200 member guild would be considered HUGE. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadin Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million isn't a lot. I wouldn't call my guild larger by any means. About 200 members. Most people in the guild has 2-5 alts in the guild. At most there are about 10 active players in the guild. There is 47 million in the guild bank. 50 million isn't a lot. Flagship should be something a guild works for as a guild. If you aren't working as a guild than why do you need access to guild conquest quest? Sound more like the problem is most people complaining about the price is a group of selfish individual who aren't willing to work to get something. Wow, what do you consider a large guild? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Wow, what do you consider a large guild? I'm curious myself. A guild with more than 30 people or so is really large for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrgames Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 On the two PvP servers I play on, a 200 member guild would be considered HUGE. Just sayin' WOW lets not read the full post and quote part of it. 200 members, most are alts, some are good people that are taking a break. There are about 10 active players in the guild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrgames Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Wow, what do you consider a large guild? There is a difference between guild members and active members. Since guild members count alts and people that may not play anymore. With only about 10 active members in the guild it would be a small guild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadin Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) The only issue I have with this is that after talking with our guildies about this, one of my friends (we all know each other IRL) already was talking about dropping some serious money on the CM to then turn them into credits via the GTN. I quickly squashed this idea but that's because I can do that and he knows why I feel that way. Sadly I'm betting a lot of other people will turn to this as well. Now with that said, people are free to spend their own money how they see fit but I just don't like the fact that the option is there. I can resist the urge to go down this path but others might not have the patience to earn it in-game instead of buying their way to it. But then that turns this discussion to something else so I'll just stop right there. There is a difference between guild members and active members. Since guild members count alts and people that may not play anymore. With only about 10 active members in the guild it would be a small guild. Ah I took '200 members' to mean individuals, not 200 alts. Gotcha. Edited July 24, 2014 by Kadin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 The only issue I have with this is that after talking with our guildies about this, one of my friends (we all know each other IRL) already was talking about dropping some serious money on the CM to then turn them into credits via the GTN. I quickly squashed this idea but that's because I can do that and he knows why I feel that way. Sadly I'm betting a lot of other people will turn to this as well. Now with that said, people are free to spend their own money how they see fit but I just don't like the fact that the option is there. I can resist the urge to go down this path but others might not have the patience to earn it in-game instead of buying their way to it. But then that turns this discussion to something else so I'll just stop right there. You went there already. I could be wrong but I doubt Bioware is to be admonished or held accountable over the possibility people are unable to restrain themselves, your friend included it would seem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lotharofxev Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 So smaller guilds will be gated out of content I suppose as long as individual members can gain or have access to the same content, shouldn't be a problem. This seems a bit "EQish" to me, and if guild flagships also offer bonuses to exp / rep / damage or whatever above and beyond the normal guild bonus, I have an issue. We left EQ when it became apparent that there was a two-tier system - Raiders and then everyone else. If EA begins moving towards a bonus for big guilds, simply because of size, we'll probably start looking elsewhere. Hey, I'm sure being a small guild they won't miss our 14 monthly subscription fees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthTHC Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million is nothing, if your guild saw the writing on the wall when flagships were first announced and started saving way back then. 50 million is a lot if your members lack a think-ahead buffer (don't be ashamed, most people do) and like to spend credits like they're drunken marines on shore leave on Nar Shaddaa. 50 million per ship is going to send demand for credit sellers through the roof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Well, I for one would enjoy the side effect of lowered prices on the GTN from all of the CM purchases to fund this....thing. I am curious though...is there some reason why some of you feel Darth Wicked is not entitled to his opinion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhaegrant Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) 50 million credits for a Guild Ship is virtually free. When Legacy launched it cost 5 million credits to put a GTN terminal in your ship. And, those last couple of bank tabs weren't cheap either. Look at the sort of prices 'Exclusive' gear sells for on the GTN. Revans mask has remained in excess of 10 million, not uncommon for mounts to be in the 5+million mark, what was the resale price of the Walker from the last CM pack? It's not hard to sit down and run through the dailies with the weekly bonus quest to pick up about 2 million. Have 10 players in your guild willing to do this and you're looking at less than a month. I guess the real value of the Guild Flagship will only become apparent when we learn more about the conquest system and what it will involve. Just out of curiosity, how much does it currently cost to unlock all the bank tabs for a guild bank? Edited July 24, 2014 by Vhaegrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreadtechSavant Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 My guild(s) not having one, only one of them could buy it, but its just not worth it. This is something the guild has decided. The other two guild simply could not attain this sort of creds because the members are not glued to the laptops to constantly do all the **** suggested they need to do to get it. Still that's how we see it, if others guilds want it, go for it and enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TravelersWay Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million isn't a lot. I wouldn't call my guild larger by any means. About 200 members. Most people in the guild has 2-5 alts in the guild. At most there are about 10 active players in the guild. There is 47 million in the guild bank. 50 million isn't a lot. Flagship should be something a guild works for as a guild. If you aren't working as a guild than why do you need access to guild conquest quest? Sound more like the problem is most people complaining about the price is a group of selfish individual who aren't willing to work to get something. I think the more important question is why are people "working"? This is a game, it's supposed to be an escape from work. If something in a game requires, or feels like, work then it's a badly designed game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickious Posted July 24, 2014 Author Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) Maybe I was abit disllusioned because I thought they were going to make basic capital ships inexpensive, where the real cost is buying the upgardes to the ship that enables more features, bigger ship, more benefits etc. Maybe its time to find a better guild, where I don't feel like i can trust people to actually contribute, instead of just laying it all on a few people. Edited July 24, 2014 by Nickious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vandicus Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I think the more important question is why are people "working"? This is a game, it's supposed to be an escape from work. If something in a game requires, or feels like, work then it's a badly designed game. Operations feel like work for some people. PvP feels like work for some people. Crafting and schematics feels like work to some people. However, that doesn't mean we're going to see achievements and decorations and reputation handed out to those people who feel like those activities are work. 50 million, while a significant amount of cash, can be acquired in a relatively short time frame with some effort. In a long time frame(say 6 months), it can be acquired casually, even by a single individual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Wicked Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 50 million credits for a Guild Ship is virtually free. When Legacy launched it cost 5 million credits to put a GTN terminal in your ship. And, those last couple of bank tabs weren't cheap either. (...) I payed 8(!) or 10(!!) million for Rocket Boost, shortly after it was made available. Had a competition with a couple of guildies back then, to see who would get it first. Good old days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvertone Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 (edited) I guess the real value of the Guild Flagship will only become apparent when we learn more about the conquest system and what it will involve. This is a good point. The entire conquest system might be trash. Personally, I'm hoping the Planetary Conquest system might be something like this, without the heavy PvP factor of course. Edited July 24, 2014 by DarthOvertone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreadtechSavant Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 Anything is achievable if you want it, I just don't want it at that cost so wont be getting it. The players here who are saying its too much have every right too, same as you have the right to say its fine and we are getting it. Player were asked, remember that they were asked to post if they thought the cost was too high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iDraxter Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I payed 8(!) or 10(!!) million for Rocket Boost, shortly after it was made available. Had a competition with a couple of guildies back then, to see who would get it first. Good old days. omg dude why did you remind me:D:D:D My main is still my Bounty Hunter how could I not buy it myself when it came out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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