Would you support a quarterly release schedule if it meant more complete updates?

[annabethchase]

There is one slight problem. What you consider content I may not and what I consider content you may not. See that is the problem. Everyone has their own definition of content based on their style of play.

 

I don't think anyone paying a sub viewed an update centered around a 1 button push slot machine as MMO content.

[BuriDogshin]

You cannot make a course correction if you make the entire trip in one leap.

So I prefer that content come out incrementally.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I don't think anyone paying a sub viewed an update centered around a 1 button push slot machine as MMO content.

 

I did.

[BuriDogshin]

I don't think anyone paying a sub viewed an update centered around a 1 button push slot machine as MMO content.

You must have missed the Kingpin Rancor Fever that infected many of the players I know. It' is a phenomena you would not have seen in a single player game.

[TX_Angel]

no it wouldn't haters would still hate. they could release new content on a DAILY basis and haters would hate. you see it was the new strongholds. something people had been asking for since launch. yet some people are dismissing it as "not real content" because it isn't related to the one narrow singular thing said person does in game.

 

No, we're dismissing it as "not real content" because NOTHING ELSE is coming out around it...

 

If we had 3.0 coming out this summer, if we had several new HM flash points, if we had another op or two... something besides what we've gotten... I'd be thrilled with GSH as it stands.

 

The problem is, it is ALL we're getting all summer long. The various events? Meh, nothing new other than a pointless casino that doesn't even have REAL GAMES in it. So I log in to... click over and over with nothing to see other than a green or red circle?

 

Really? THAT is content?

[TX_Angel]

You must have missed the Kingpin Rancor Fever that infected many of the players I know. It' is a phenomena you would not have seen in a single player game.

 

Of course not, because in a single player game, when a "hard to find" item becomes "too hard to find", you just hack it to get it, or use the cheat codes...

 

Fallout 3 is a perfect example of this... There are some very hard to get to spots in that game, some hard to find special weapons.

 

All are just a HEX code away from poofing into your inventory, as many as you'd like.

 

I played that game twice from start to finish without cheating, then once I'd done that, I went back and played it with the codes for fun, unlocking all kinds of fun stuff and teleporting to all the good parts.

 

Can't do that in a MMO, yet... but give it time, they are moving in that direction...

[Halinalle]

No, we're dismissing it as "not real content" because NOTHING ELSE is coming out around it...

 

If we had 3.0 coming out this summer, if we had several new HM flash points, if we had another op or two... something besides what we've gotten... I'd be thrilled with GSH as it stands.

 

You just proved his point.

 

Shorter cycle would only mean that we'd get smaller updates more often. CCP changed to rapid release cycle of 6 weeks/expansion recently and in EVE that makes sense. That doesn't mean similar cycle works for every game.

[BrintoSFJ]

So you are trying to say they will still release less than nothing with a desgise of "new content" but do it even slower? how about they don't release any content anymore? since the release of df and dp 10 months ago we still have not seen any new ops. this year they released only 3 new tactical fp, of course another 1 is on the way; that makes it 4. We got gsf; an entirely new game mode which less than 5% playerbase even try. we got new wz maps which can be made by anyone with semi decent skill in animation. we are getting housing which should have been in the game at launch 3 years ago; after 3 years of begging and then it is done in a worse manner than any current game that has housing. you call these updates?

[Aries_cz]

So you are trying to say they will still release less than nothing with a desgise of "new content" but do it even slower? how about they don't release any content anymore? since the release of df and dp 10 months ago we still have not seen any new ops. this year they released only 3 new tactical fp, of course another 1 is on the way; that makes it 4. We got gsf; an entirely new game mode which less than 5% playerbase even try. we got new wz maps which can be made by anyone with semi decent skill in animation. we are getting housing which should have been in the game at launch 3 years ago; after 3 years of begging and then it is done in a worse manner than any current game that has housing. you call these updates?

 

Just because you do not like certain content does not mean it is not content.

 

GSF is liked by many people, but probably not as much as was hoped (because people fear to try it for some reason). I fail to understand why, it is fun and easy to learn. But I guess it is not good enough to those "uber PvP masters", because their PvP gear counts for nothing and they need skill.

New maps are not as easy as you imagine. If you think it is simply slapping few objects together, you have no idea how development works. FYI, the longest part of any development is testing.

Housing is not considered a crucial piece of any game that is not focused on that, because it is in most cases very niche thing. So it shouldn't have been at launch. And as far as calling it the worst manner possible, you must be a seer to know it will be awful without even playing it. It seems to me that BW tried to make it much less niche thing and open it to masses.

[Tsillah]

GSF is liked by many people, but probably not as much as was hoped (because people fear to try it for some reason). I fail to understand why, it is fun and easy to learn.

 

The biggest problems GSF has is a clunky UI for building your ships, uneven teams which are not fun battles and a lack of maps. Also the bomber ships really didn't help. I think the reason why people "fear" GSF is because actually the controls do take time to get used to and it's not as easy as you suggest. At least not as easy to get good at in a short time and add to that grossly uneven teams of experienced players vs new starters and yeh, people are gonna leave it cause it's just no fun to lose massively like that. I've see too many matches from the losing and the winning side like that. If you are unlucky to have a few noob teams to start off with it can be a frustrating experience.

 

All in all I don't believ GSF is actually that easy to learn, especially if you never played flights sims before and because of the uneven teams it's also not very fun. So really for a new player I can't imagine that many of them find it easy or fun. At least when it just came out we were all basically noobs but team matching fails because there are not enough people playing to make it work.

[Darth_Wicked]

Just because you do not like certain content does not mean it is not content.

 

GSF is liked by many people, but probably not as much as was hoped (because people fear to try it for some reason). I fail to understand why, it is fun and easy to learn. (...)

 

I haven't tried GSF. I have no fear of it.

 

I just don't have any interest whatsoever in PvP for the most part, which is what GSF is aimed at. I have engaged in PvP in the past for the SOLE PURPOSE of obtaining the occasional rare or different LS hilt or armor piece but that's it.

 

From my understanding, GSF doesn't exactly provide or rewards players with anything remotely interesting truth be told. Even better, if I got it right, you can't even unlock decorations(!!!) while doing stuff with GSF, including parking the ships you unlock as you go.

 

Talk about wasted opportunity.

 

Again, no fear but rather TOTAL LACK OF INCENTIVE, at least as far as I'm concerned. Big difference.

Edited July 24, 2014 by Darth_Wicked

[Tsillah]

You just proved his point.

 

Shorter cycle would only mean that we'd get smaller updates more often. CCP changed to rapid release cycle of 6 weeks/expansion recently and in EVE that makes sense. That doesn't mean similar cycle works for every game.

 

I would be happy with a twice a year content patch schedule as long as it was a a good amount of solid content. If this game had started with more basic features, they wouldn't have needed to've been added as "content" later.

[eartharioch]

Just because you do not like certain content does not mean it is not content.

 

GSF is liked by many people, but probably not as much as was hoped (because people fear to try it for some reason). I fail to understand why, it is fun and easy to learn.

 

Cite, please. Both for "many" people liking it and *anybody* fearing to try it.

 

Also, define "trying" it -- do you mean people are afraid to start the tutorial, or that the utter craptasticness of the tutorial scares them away? If you mean that people won't even launch the tutorial because of the bad rap that GSF gets, that's not 'fear', that's informed consumers making a choice. If you mean the tutorial drives people away, that's also not fear, it's a failure on the part of the devs to make the game accessible to new players.

 

Or do you mean that after passing the "trying it" stage and actually playing a few games that people figure out what people are talking about when they talk about "horrible interface and controls", "incredibly unbalanced teams", "no learning mode", and "getting pwned by overgeared players." Or do you really think that gear matters more in Bolstered ground PVP than unbolstered, gear-based GSF?

 

Or maybe it isn't that the game isn't is as good as the early X-Wing and Tie Fighter games from the early 90s, maybe it's just the fact that the only things you can "earn" are credits and XP (easily obtainable in the ground environment) and Fleet Comms, which I think are valued less than Classic Comms. You can't loot anything, your companions have no personality and (unlike the ground game) are chosen solely for their bonus, and they don't do anything while you don't have them selected (unlike ground companions that can run crafting missions). I haven't tried, but I'm pretty sure that GSF is so disconnected from the ground game that companions can run crafting missions while copiloting your ship.

 

Now, I'm not saying that GSF didn't have potential, or that it was a waste of resources to try, since many people complained about the PVE space game, but don't try to pin the lack of GSF popularity on people's *fear* of trying it.

[Aries_cz]

The biggest problems GSF has is a clunky UI for building your ships

I guess it depends on what people expect. I never thought of the UI as clunky. You pick a ship, you pick the parts. However, my experience with ship games is fairly limited.

uneven teams which are not fun battles

This i agree is the main problem of GSF, but I believe that it stems from not enough people actively playing, as the system is supposed to put people with matching "upgrade levels" together. But It runs into the same problem as RWZ, where it will try to put otgether teams of similar ratings, but when it cannot do so, it will lower the requirements.

lack of maps

We could probably use more than 5 maps, true.

Also the bomber ships really didn't help.

i think it brings another way to play, but there are of course places where bomber shines and where it is absolutely awful, just like other classes.

I think the reason why people "fear" GSF is because actually the controls do take time to get used to and it's not as easy as you suggest. At least not as easy to get good at in a short time and add to that grossly uneven teams of experienced players vs new starters and yeh,

My only "space sim game" was DarkStar One (which was more arcade than sim), and I got the hang of the controls quite easily. And I already talked about uneven teams

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I haven't tried GSF. I have no fear of it.

 

I just don't have any interest whatsoever in PvP for the most part, which is what GSF is aimed at. I have engaged in PvP in the past for the SOLE PURPOSE of obtaining the occasional rare or different LS hilt or armor piece but that's it.

 

From my understanding, GSF doesn't exactly provide or rewards players with anything remotely interesting truth be told. Even better, if I got it right, you can't even unlock decorations(!!!) while doing stuff with GSF, including parking the ships you unlock as you go.

 

Talk about wasted opportunity.

 

Again, no fear but rather TOTAL LACK OF INCENTIVE, at least as far as I'm concerned. Big difference.

Well, sure, if you are so absolutely opposed against PvP, you will not like it. However, many people simply dislike PvP because it is very gear dependent. GSF is a bit better at that (meaning you can still beat someone without many upgrades). As for incentives, [DAILY] and [WEEKLY] GSF missions are giving regular Fleet commendations now, so that is nice if you want to get some of the rewards (they could throw in reputation tokens as well, IMO). And IIRC, they never said that there will be no GSF decorations in Strongholds, they are mostly avoiding those decoration hooks or plopping a sandcrawler there (because lulz).

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Cite, please. Both for "many" people liking it and *anybody* fearing to try it.

From listening to some of the recent podcasts (sorry, no idea which one) I gathered that there are GSF guilds on some servers and people leveling purely through GSF.

 

Also, define "trying" it -- do you mean people are afraid to start the tutorial, or that the utter craptasticness of the tutorial scares them away? If you mean that people won't even launch the tutorial because of the bad rap that GSF gets, that's not 'fear', that's informed consumers making a choice. If you mean the tutorial drives people away, that's also not fear, it's a failure on the part of the devs to make the game accessible to new players.

The tutorial is a bit weird, I will give you that. But when someone refuses to try it just because it has a bad rep, I don't think that is a informed decision (IRL, sure, but not in game). It is absolutely free, and at worst you waste about 30 minutes of your time (a whole 1 cent of your purchased game time).

 

Or do you mean that after passing the "trying it" stage and actually playing a few games that people figure out what people are talking about when they talk about "horrible interface and controls", "incredibly unbalanced teams", "no learning mode", and "getting pwned by overgeared players." Or do you really think that gear matters more in Bolstered ground PVP than unbolstered, gear-based GSF?

Again, I mentioned that the interface has different impact on different people, I find it quite good. However, it shows all the information you need, and you can move majority of the pieces in interface editor.

I have also spoken about controls, which are in my opinion, as someone who never played space game, easy.

I have already spoken about teams being unbalanced. And while I feel that GSF could benefit from some sort of bolster, I still think it is much less gear dependent that ground game.

 

Or maybe it isn't that the game isn't is as good as the early X-Wing and Tie Fighter games from the early 90s, maybe it's just the fact that the only things you can "earn" are credits and XP (easily obtainable in the ground environment) and Fleet Comms, which I think are valued less than Classic Comms. You can't loot anything, your companions have no personality and (unlike the ground game) are chosen solely for their bonus, and they don't do anything while you don't have them selected (unlike ground companions that can run crafting missions). I haven't tried, but I'm pretty sure that GSF is so disconnected from the ground game that companions can run crafting missions while copiloting your ship.

I never played those games, so cannot say. However, looking at YouTube videos of them, I think that GSF looks pretty similar to that (except it is not first person by default).

There could be more rewarding things, sure, just not sure what you would imagine looting from space. I imagine it could give Hyperspace Armada reputation in addition to Fleet comms, which are somewhat useful to get loot boxes, etc.

Companions are chosen on their bonuses, sure, but you also choose your companions in the ground game based on what you need (healer, tank, DPS). And they can still run crafting while you pilot, if you task them to do so before launching.

[TUXs]

I don't think anyone paying a sub viewed an update centered around a 1 button push slot machine as MMO content.

Agreed!!!

 

And of course the usual suspects disagree with you...shocking huh?

[Reno_Tarshil]

Agreed!!!

 

And of course the usual suspects disagree with you...shocking huh?

 

C'mon TUXs I expected more from you...

[TUXs]

C'mon TUXs I expected more from you...

In what way? She had a valid point...the casino "event" sure as hell wasn't an "update" that helped this game long term...it was meant to drain credits Reno, nothing more. The normal people of course loved it and think it was a truly amazing "update". I disagree with them.

[Reno_Tarshil]

In what way? She had a valid point...the casino "event" sure as hell wasn't an "update" that helped this game long term...it was meant to drain credits Reno, nothing more. The normal people of course loved it and think it was a truly amazing "update". I disagree with them.

 

I love my Tommy Gun I worked for. Having 2 of them will help my roleplaying in the game long term.

 

Different opinions TUXs.

[Klarick]

What I mean is, BioWare moves to a rough 13 week schedule, and in exchange, we get to do away with the 3 months to release the same content plan that they did for GSF and are doing for GSH, we get complete raids instead of 2/3rds of one now, and NiM pimped as its own content later, etc.

 

Basically, it would help BioWare to stop treating us like we're stupid, and updates would be an event. Patches and combat balancing can be done as needed.

 

Thoughts?

 

No. The schedule works fine as is. Your post, as is your style, makes implications that are not true. "Bioware treating us like we're stupid". LOL, where do you get this stuff? You are a well known QQr, as that sentence proves.

 

Try asking questions without the QQ. I doubt you can.

[TUXs]

I love my Tommy Gun I worked for. Having 2 of them will help my roleplaying in the game long term.

 

Different opinions TUXs.

 

That's shallow Reno....just because you got a shiney from the "event" doesn't mean it was a good "update". It sucked.

[Reno_Tarshil]

That's shallow Reno....just because you got a shiney from the "event" doesn't mean it was a good "update". It sucked.

 

Again different opinions, you say it sucked, so it sucks for you. I say it was enjoyable and I had fun and that's how it was for me.

[TUXs]

Again different opinions, you say it sucked, so it sucks for you. I say it was enjoyable and I had fun and that's how it was for me.

I had fun too, to an extent - but I also know, from how quickly it emptied, that we were the few who did. I try not to be myopic in the things I observe.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I had fun too, to an extent - but I also know, from how quickly it emptied, that we were the few who did. I try not to be myopic in the things I observe.

 

I only speak for myself and that is why I responded with I did to the user you quoted because they said no paying sub would say that when it simply wasn't true.

[ZionHalcyon]

I side with Tux on this.

 

It just feels that BioWare could put poop on a stick and call it content, and while most people would complain that what is obviously poop on a stick smells bad, Reno would chime in to be a contrarian, and say "Is not poop! Is Feature!" And go on and on about having poop that smells like poop is game immersion...

Edited July 24, 2014 by ZionHalcyon

[Reno_Tarshil]

I side with Tux on this.

 

It just feels that BioWare could put poop on a stick and call it content, and while most people would complain that what is obviously poop on a stick smells bad, Reno would chime in to be a contrarian, and say "Is not poop! Is Feature!" And go on and on about having poop that smells like poop is game immersion...

 

Actually I wouldn't, poop is disgusting and I can do without it in my game. What I don't understand is why you can't accept that others see it as content even if you don't?