screw it... i ain't doin it anymore.

[Telos]

bombers and gunships... that's all gsf is anymore. bombers and gunships vs. other bombers and gunships. it was fun when it was new, and everyone was actually dogfighting in scouts and strikes with the occasional gunship, but now it's ruined. dogfighting is dead. nobody wants to fly a scout... can't get close to the gunship sitting with the bomber and all his mines and drones, every now and then you'll see a strike. not often. I've flat out shelved my fully mastered scout... one seismic mine concussion mine railgun drone seeker drone missile sentry drone and he's dead.

 

eso beta starts today, right?

[Sadishist]

GSF is still at it's infancy since it's very new; they are still being tweaked if you see the reddit data mines. Also new ships coming out 2.7, and new class of ships 2.8 Edited February 28, 2014 by Sadishist

[FridgeLM]

You're right.

 

Things were so much better when it was battle scouts and gunships.

Edited February 28, 2014 by FridgeLM

[Allintu]

So, in other words, it was better when you could just go around and rack up kills. It sucks now that you have to use some strat, maybe even try different loadouts, be a little sneaky.....change up your play style.

 

Boo-hoo to the cry babies that don't have an I win button anymore.

 

* forgot to add....I do have matches where it turns into a GS/bomber fest, but not all of them. It doesn't always start that way, however, they usually switch when panic strikes them. It tells me our team is doing something right by putting the pressure on, so they get on the FOTM ship.

Edited February 28, 2014 by Allintu

[mr_sim]

bombers and gunships... that's all gsf is anymore. bombers and gunships vs. other bombers and gunships. it was fun when it was new, and everyone was actually dogfighting in scouts and strikes with the occasional gunship, but now it's ruined. dogfighting is dead. nobody wants to fly a scout... can't get close to the gunship sitting with the bomber and all his mines and drones, every now and then you'll see a strike. not often. I've flat out shelved my fully mastered scout... one seismic mine concussion mine railgun drone seeker drone missile sentry drone and he's dead.

 

So really this is saying they are coordinated and your not. Bombers cannot dodge proton torpedoes and concussion missiles. Ion rail guns will mess up these peoples days too. Scouts have their big giant engines circle around and hit them from 2 sides or 3 sides.

 

Really the only thing missing would be another ship that can carry EMP missile. My quell is far too successful with clusters and protorps to want to change. Yet I would love to have an ship that can fire the EMP missile.

[mighty_joe]

the only time i really have a problem with bombers is when i dont realize it's a bomber and follow it closely in my strike fighter, because through the red mist of bloodlust i only see a slow-moving target...

 

the only times i really have a problem with gunships is when i miscalculate a head-on barrel roll approach and end up with no engine power at like 10km - or alternatively when i see only a slow moving target through the red mist of bloodlust and follow a bomber, not looking left or right

[FBPL]

the only time i really have a problem with bombers is when i dont realize it's a bomber and follow it closely in my strike fighter, because through the red mist of bloodlust i only see a slow-moving target...

 

the only times i really have a problem with gunships is when i miscalculate a head-on barrel roll approach and end up with no engine power at like 10km - or alternatively when i see only a slow moving target through the red mist of bloodlust and follow a bomber, not looking left or right

 

Oh I know the feeling of mis-timing a barrel roll headlong into a static GS, quickly followed by the bloom of my ships debris field...

[RiVaN_]

I fly a Mastered Flashfire and I have all of the components except turning thrusters on my flash maxed out. I have yet to find a load-out that allows me to succeed in a match when we are against 8 gunners and 4 bombers. My only hope is to switch to a ship I hate flying...

I don't have the coordination to successfully fly a Gunship and Bombers are to slow and boring. I want to dogfight, and I and don't like switching ships simply because something else is the FTOM.

 

Gunners and bombers are using better strategies now, congratulations to them for using the strengths of both ships together to build the perfect machine...

It sure takes the fun out of the match (for a scout or strike) when the other team is all gunships and bombers though. Since Gunners have a 10k-11k range and scouts have a 5k-4k range it, eventually becomes impossible to get close enough to get any damage on them.

 

I have noticed a SHARP decline in Starfighter que pops since the introduction of Bombers. Someone posted that GSF is still in it's infancy and has a lot more to offer. I agree with you completely, but if things keep going the way they are GSF may die before it becomes a toddler.

 

Usually if I have a complaint I try to think of a fix, unfortunately the only fix I can think of is give Scouts a higher survivability and a high damage weapon that can lock on to Gunships at long range. Maybe give the FlashFire some sort of defensive capability against mines. Right now matches suck on a scout.

I have to ask this question though, why is a maxed out scout so easily one-shotted by a ship that can kill us at 11000 meters? Since Gunners have the range, the fire power, the armor and the shields maybe that evasion you took away from the scouts was the balancing factor?? Just a thought...

[Sidenti]

I fly a Mastered Flashfire and I have all of the components except turning thrusters on my flash maxed out. I have yet to find a load-out that allows me to succeed in a match when we are against 8 gunners and 4 bombers. My only hope is to switch to a ship I hate flying...

I don't have the coordination to successfully fly a Gunship and Bombers are to slow and boring. I want to dogfight, and I and don't like switching ships simply because something else is the FTOM.

 

Gunners and bombers are using better strategies now, congratulations to them for using the strengths of both ships together to build the perfect machine...

It sure takes the fun out of the match (for a scout or strike) when the other team is all gunships and bombers though. Since Gunners have a 10k-11k range and scouts have a 5k-4k range it, eventually becomes impossible to get close enough to get any damage on them.

 

I have noticed a SHARP decline in Starfighter que pops since the introduction of Bombers. Someone posted that GSF is still in it's infancy and has a lot more to offer. I agree with you completely, but if things keep going the way they are GSF may die before it becomes a toddler.

 

Usually if I have a complaint I try to think of a fix, unfortunately the only fix I can think of is give Scouts a higher survivability and a high damage weapon that can lock on to Gunships at long range. Maybe give the FlashFire some sort of defensive capability against mines. Right now matches suck on a scout.

I have to ask this question though, why is a maxed out scout so easily one-shotted by a ship that can kill us at 11000 meters? Since Gunners have the range, the fire power, the armor and the shields maybe that evasion you took away from the scouts was the balancing factor?? Just a thought...

 

Of COURSE your dippy little Flashfire is gonna eat it against 8 gunners and 4 bombers! XD Scout craft aren't invincible fighters! They were never intended to be!

 

What you're asking is to turn the Flashfire into an omnicraft - something that's capable of handling EVERYTHING on the battlefield. No one ship is supposed to be able to do that, and guess what?

 

No one ship can. GSF is supposed to be about teamwork and coordination - not your best Maverick impersonation. This ain't Top Gun, man. -bp

[Docmal]

I fly a Mastered Flashfire and I have all of the components except turning thrusters on my flash maxed out. I have yet to find a load-out that allows me to succeed in a match when we are against 8 gunners and 4 bombers. My only hope is to switch to a ship I hate flying...

I don't have the coordination to successfully fly a Gunship and Bombers are to slow and boring. I want to dogfight, and I and don't like switching ships simply because something else is the FTOM.

 

Gunners and bombers are using better strategies now, congratulations to them for using the strengths of both ships together to build the perfect machine...

It sure takes the fun out of the match (for a scout or strike) when the other team is all gunships and bombers though. Since Gunners have a 10k-11k range and scouts have a 5k-4k range it, eventually becomes impossible to get close enough to get any damage on them.

 

I have noticed a SHARP decline in Starfighter que pops since the introduction of Bombers. Someone posted that GSF is still in it's infancy and has a lot more to offer. I agree with you completely, but if things keep going the way they are GSF may die before it becomes a toddler.

 

Usually if I have a complaint I try to think of a fix, unfortunately the only fix I can think of is give Scouts a higher survivability and a high damage weapon that can lock on to Gunships at long range. Maybe give the FlashFire some sort of defensive capability against mines. Right now matches suck on a scout.

I have to ask this question though, why is a maxed out scout so easily one-shotted by a ship that can kill us at 11000 meters? Since Gunners have the range, the fire power, the armor and the shields maybe that evasion you took away from the scouts was the balancing factor?? Just a thought...

 

You know what you need to help against 8 gunships and bombers? Teammates!

 

Seriously though... I have found that evasion build scouts are worthless anymore. I went with quick charge shield build and do much better. I tear it up in deathmatch but domination takes coordination with your team. Do not go near a heavily fortified position cause you will get eaten alive. Try hit and run tactics or coordinate a strike with some heavier friends. I find it interesting to ask a gunship or bomber if they want a fighter escort to assault a position. Then I cover them while they thin the node. It works great with just the two of you if you can keep fighters off his back.

[TUXs]

What? The only time I "don't" fly a scout is when I know we're better than the other team...gunships aren't any more of an issue now than they ever were and bombers just take a different approach...hit and runs...their drones/turrets have long cooldowns.

[mandoforlife]

I very rarely get matches where the majority of the enemy team is either a Bomber or a Gunship. I hate to say it, but you really should know how to approach a Gunship by now, they really aren't all that hard to take down, especially if a teammate tags along to help.

 

Bombers are a bit of a different story. I don't mind the minelayers at all, if a player puts a mine in a good position, and I get hit by it, good for them and shame on me. It was a stationary target that I ran in to (unless it was a Seeker Mine, but the radius on that isn't too bad). However, I think Dronelayers are gimmicky. I don't like that players can just set down railgun and missile drones and forget about them while they shoot at the enemy team. I think that's the issue most people have with bombers. The drones aren't going anywhere though, so if you get hit by one, hit R, then gun it down.

 

I don't find my GSF matches lacking dogfighting at all. I see more NovaDives than I used to, and strikes are gaining popularity. I myself favor my Quell and Blackbolt.

Edited February 28, 2014 by mandoforlife

[Armonddd]

I very rarely get matches where the majority of the enemy team is either a Bomber or a Gunship. I hate to say it, but you really should know how to approach a Gunship by now, they really aren't all that hard to take down, especially if a teammate tags along to help.

 

And what does a new player do (besides cry hax when he blows up with "no one" around or when a mine hits him from outside the big red shining circle)?

 

I've played a number of 8v8 domination matches where the enemy team is four bombers, two gunships, and two scouts and/or strikes. They're simply not fun, and I'm not exactly inexperienced. Likewise for TDM where four or five gunships hide behind a wall of mines and drones. I can't imagine a new player experiencing anything other than frustration at these tactics, and I likewise can't blame the enemy players for stacking mechanics that lead to such a handy victory. There really is a problem here.

[RiVaN_]

It seems as though the typical team composition is dependant on what server you are on.

Last Night on JC we seemed to have a lot of battles that were majority Gunships and bombers

 

I que with guild mates most of the time, between 4 and 8 of us on all at once (we rarely get in the same match on the same side, we are usually against each other) and the teamwork aspect makes it much more fun, however I played 20 battles last night and most of them were 12v12. Over these 20 battles most of the players on the other team were Gunships.

 

Yes I know how to approach a gunship, from behind, either above or below and quickly until they are in your range. The problem isn't approaching A gunship it is approaching 8 gunships all clustered together surrounded by a mine feild with 4 bombers watching over them and deploying repair drones. That is a no win situation.

 

Since I am almost always running with several guild mates I know my role; run in, save my speed boosts pop a few shots and get the enemy to follow me back to my gunships that are sitting and waiting for folks to come into range, turn and burn & kill what I can before they take all the fun.

 

The observation we made last night during a Death Match was that the other team had 8 gunships all clustered together and the final 4 ships were bombers. The gunships were doing an excellent job of watching each others backs and the bombers had mines and turrets spread out in a way that made approaching the group difficult. They literally had themselves set up in the perfect little pill box around one of the asteroids and it was nearly impossible to get at them. We lost the match squarely and my guild mates and I were the only ones to get any kills.

 

Congrats to those guys for having the perfect tactic and perfect team work, but this brings to light a possible problem, we had 4 of our 12 in TS and were coordinating our efforts to get in on them, the only ships that they lost were their bombers when we were able to get good hits on them while they were refreshing their mines and turrets. We couldn't get close to the gunships. Flying a scout or a strike in that match was suicide, so eventually it just became a Gunship vs Gunship battle. That was the 3rd of 20 battles and the rest of the night was similar; constant gunship battles.

 

So were we witnessing the future of GSF? I hope not.

 

I'm not asking for scouts to become the omnipresent attack ship I'm looking for either more survivability, (because a Mastered scout being 1-shot by a gunship seems a little unbalanced) or a lock on weapon (Long Range, high damage missiles, with a medium length lock on time) that can cause Gunships to run for cover. Gunships have 2 very high damage weapons, superior firepower, comparable armor and superior shields. The Scouts have speed and maneuverability which mean jack squat (even if you are running with team mates) against 8 gunships. You can't out run or out maneuver all of them.

IDK something just felt "off" last night, maybe it was my week long hiatus from GSF, but maybe it is the GS + bomber combo.

[FridgeLM]

And what does a new player do (besides cry hax when he blows up with "no one" around or when a mine hits him from outside the big red shining circle)?

 

This statement alone leads me to two possible conclusions.

 

1) for all your whining about bombers, you don't actually know how their mines work

2) Trigger radius indicators may not be representative of actual trigger radius if that radius has been upgraded

 

I think 1) because if it's an AOE mine, which every mine but seekers are, someone else can trip the mine and get you hit, because every AOE mine that I'm aware of has a detonation radius a great deal larger than the trigger. Of course, maybe nobody tripped it. In this case it's because the minelayer pushed out a new mine and went over the cap, detonating the old one and doing damage (tested this, this is 100% how AOE mines behave).

 

2) is just speculation, and I don't even know if the big red field is supposed to be indictative of their trigger radius.

 

I've played a number of 8v8 domination matches where the enemy team is four bombers, two gunships, and two scouts and/or strikes. They're simply not fun, and I'm not exactly inexperienced. Likewise for TDM where four or five gunships hide behind a wall of mines and drones. I can't imagine a new player experiencing anything other than frustration at these tactics, and I likewise can't blame the enemy players for stacking mechanics that lead to such a handy victory. There really is a problem here.

 

Translation: "I've had bad games where the enemy team is about ten times more organized than my own."

 

We all have. That there's more team play possible is not a problem. Your team was terrible for not jumping in strike fighters and ruining their day - everyone should have a Quell or Pike in their loadout. Everyone. And you don't necessarily need EMP missiles to deal with bombers, but perhaps in this situation it would've been appropriate - not to mention EMPing a gunship and disabling its systems and engine/shield will ensure its demise.

Edited February 28, 2014 by FridgeLM

[Armonddd]

This statement alone leads me to two possible conclusions.

 

1) for all your whining about bombers, you don't actually know how their mines work

2) Trigger radius indicators may not be representative of actual trigger radius if that radius has been upgraded

 

It's actually option 2. I've tried it. I'm not sure if the indicator is even representative of the base trigger radius. A new player will surely not know about the problem.

 

Your team was terrible for not jumping in strike fighters and ruining their day - everyone should have a Quell or Pike in their loadout. Everyone.

 

When did we stop talking about new players, who might think "this pike looks like it'll suck because people know how to break missile locks"? Hell, some of them don't even know the pike is different from the starguard, or even that it exists. The game's tutorial is just that bad. Yet because of a complete lack of matchmaking, these players are thrown up against people who know how to cheese gunships and bombers.

Edited February 28, 2014 by Armonddd

[FridgeLM]

There exists matchmaking but the longer the queue goes the more likely it'll be to allow a mismatch. It's pretty unfortunate, and you have a case re: new players. GSF very much drops a new person in the deep end, some people can swim eventually but a lot don't bother.

[Costello]

I really hope that Bioware read this post and appreciate that Galactic Star Fighers needs some work.

 

I've had some good fights and some bad fights, but its getting dull and the difference between the haves and have nots is massive. I've just taken to flying with a republic character I'm levelling so have a new ship needing upgrades. The two things I have noticed from this is that republic ships fly better don't know why maybe its the familiar shape but seem to be nicely responsive. And the second thing is that if you are new to GSF you are going to have a very hard time of it, gunships and bombers make it very hard. To the point that other than the dailies or the weekly are the only option for getting requisition.

 

But even if you take out the difference in ships from a new player to an experienced one, match making has some very odd ideas about fair sides. Once all that is said and done and you take it into consideration and accept some matches are just going to be impossible to win. Its becoming very repeatative, while there is little reward and will likely head in the same direction as the pve space content. It has perhaps faired better than expected but the quality of the experience is just a mini game and doesn't add enough. And really doesn't live up to what could be added to The Old Republic as space combat goes.

[Starbros]

My 3 main gripes with Galactic Starfighter as of 2.6.1:

 

(1) Railgun drones: Bad enough that gunships already mount a long-range, instant-hit cannon capable of biting huge chunks out of targets' shields and hull; now bombers spit out equally-punishing, auto-targeting railgun drones of miniscule size. This vast difference of scale but not damage between gunship railguns and drone railguns makes no sense, blowing away suspension of disbelief regarding this weaponry. Railguns would be more credible overall if their blasts took time to travel distance and didn't zap targets instantly.

 

(2) Powerups in Deathmatch: It seems these were meant to establish parity between Deathmatch teams by giving underperforming pilots a boost against more experienced opponents with upgraded starfighters. More and more often though, especially now that capital ships no longer fire on enemies (??), one or two of the savviest scout pilots buzz around the map snagging these boosts and proceed to dominate the match, resulting in the most lopsided numbers ever witnessed in both personal kills and team scores. A level playing field in GSF Team Deathmatch should ideally pit players in a pure contest of piloting prowess and starfighter performance, not a powerup-gobbling spree.

 

(3) Windows XP = No audio in GSF: This is an unresolved bug reported by testers numerous times starting with Galactic Starfighter beta. The complete lack of sound in GSF under Windows XP is nearly as frustrating as the utter lack of official word on when a patch will arrive to fix this issue. Until then, XP users like myself will keep struggling with missile-lock alarms and copilot warnings we simply cannot hear -- immersion-breaking, to say the least.

[DanNV]

The place I see this most is the TDM. IT started mostly strikes and scouts, now it's mostly bombers and gunships. The 8v8 I just did, my team had 6 gunships. I ended up flying my bomber because the other team was as many more or more gunships and my scout disintegrated before I could even see them.

 

Personally, I can live with that, but the spawn camping that I now see in every TDM is enough to make it no fun. They get a gunship close or a bomber right on the spawn point (or the combination of them) and rack up kills. If BW doesn't fix it, I'm done with GSF and I've played it and enjoyed it from BEAT to now. AS it stands right now, I can't recommend it to anyone. Mods are still way too powerful and spawn camping has gotten insane in 3 days.

[FridgeLM]

My 3 main gripes with Galactic Starfighter as of 2.6.1:

 

(1) Railgun drones: Bad enough that gunships already mount a long-range, instant-hit cannon capable of biting huge chunks out of targets' shields and hull; now bombers spit out equally-punishing, auto-targeting railgun drones of miniscule size. This vast difference of scale but not damage between gunship railguns and drone railguns makes no sense, blowing away suspension of disbelief regarding this weaponry. Railguns would be more credible overall if their blasts took time to travel distance and didn't zap targets instantly.

 

Bomber railgun drones do tickle-worthy damage compared to real railguns fired by actual ships. You are very mistaken in thinking they even approach parity with player-fired weapons.

[Armonddd]

Bomber railgun drones do tickle-worthy damage compared to real railguns fired by actual ships. You are very mistaken in thinking they even approach parity with player-fired weapons.

 

That's completely true. On the other hand... I've never gotten blown out of the air mid-barrel roll by a human gunship. Drones have done this to me multiple times (once even when I had dfield up in the barrel roll). It's frustrating.

Edited March 1, 2014 by Armonddd

[Starbros]

Bomber railgun drones do tickle-worthy damage compared to real railguns fired by actual ships. You are very mistaken in thinking they even approach parity with player-fired weapons.

 

Good point on parity. Unlike gunship pilots, railgun drones never seem to miss "tickling" any evading target in line of sight within their range. Firing rate aside, do railgun drones expire after delivering a certain number of shots or is their power supply inexhaustible?

[Armonddd]

Firing rate aside, do railgun drones expire after delivering a certain number of shots or is their power supply inexhaustible?

 

The latter, afaik.

 

Practically speaking, railgun drones tend to get blown up before their lifespan expires, anyway.

[NathanielStarr]

It is all gunships and bombers now. At least you could out fly the scout and still succeed. Now it's a completely no talent match. It's just about how many of your friends you can get to play gunship or bomber instead of the fun ships.