HuaRya Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 To the Devs, If you really want GSF to take off you need to create a solo queue only option. This single and double premade nonsense only turns anyone new away to the game. Nobody wants to show up with their two-three non-enhanced ships vs. these 24/7 playtime kids with their max geared gunships. There is nothing encouraging or fun about seeing all three bases taken over in the first 20 seconds of play and then camped gunships one shotting anyone who ventures near. The rare games that are all random players are extremely fun and unpredictable, the ones described above are ones you simply have to leave the battlefield. This argument has been made in ground pvp but what makes GSF different is that it's new and has the potential to be hugely popular as it expands. Therefore why not offer the options for these two entirely different game styles to flourish instead of one snuffing out the other. Thank you, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XavinNydek Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 (edited) You don't need to actually group queue to see the same people in match after match, it just happens because the good people are the ones that are queuing all the time. The matchmaking actually seems to build groups of four from similarly geared characters, so you probably aren't even seeing coordinated groups most of the time. You typically only need 2-3 people who know what they are doing to win a map, they don't even need to coordinate, they just need to actually focus on the objectives instead of dogfighting and being useless. In short, play more, get better. Edited January 16, 2014 by XavinNydek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainamoinen Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 OP, you were crying about Premades in ground PvP, now you bring it here. Big, bad, evil premades are not a problem in GS - at least on the two servers I play on - and I strongly suspect they aren't why you have a problem in PvP be it ground or space based. And no, I don't play in one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renegadeimp Posted January 16, 2014 Share Posted January 16, 2014 People premade in GSF purely for the faster queues. They RARELY ever work together. Those that do, and dont organise queues with the opposing faction are normally bad players who want to dominate unskilled and undergeared pugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianDavion Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 premades aren't making that big a differance. beyond it means one side or another has x number of pilots who "proably know what they're doing" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elly_Dawn Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Premade is just a misnomer anyway... trying to demonize Team Play... those that don't play as a team feel it's right to call for action against those that do... if they weren't trying to demonize it they'd use the appropriate term of Team Play vs. Solo Play... to be clear Team Play does not require a VoIP of any kind, all it needs is a few good players communicate the plan at the start and everyone try to stick to it... hell, with my wingman the voice convo usually goes no further than "incoming", "already see 'em"... it's the Cowboys that cause a loss usually, by not playing Objectives like a team should... all you Cowboys need to hold your horses, Death-Match is coming soon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEATHICIDE Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Text macros in PvP will get you banned. Put this beside your "team" arguments. Headsets should be everyone or nobody in a PUG. You all are like "My pro squad with headsets VS your random team with a keyboard is totally fair, just suck it up" Please. MMO = Massive Multiplayer Online, not Massively Mumbled Or whatever... Right now it's a mixed queue, so you have every right to headset and rape pugs, we get that, but don't come in here guns blazing because people want a single player only queue to avoid your mumble squad, i mean really... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applejacxs Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I would agree op there really should be a ACE que. I don't see how in the long run people winning 1000 to 50 (i been the loser and winner in that scenario) is fun or entertaining to be a part of for anyone. I really think Bio ware failed to take into account there causal players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 The funny thing with GSF is there are premades all over the place, the other funny thing is that 95% are indistinguishable from the rest of the pugs. Oh and please stop deluding yourself into thinking every team you lose to is using a Voip, that's rediculus. premades are the same thing as gear gap - just another excuse to prevent people from realizing there are people out there that are better than them, and they just might be on the other team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEATHICIDE Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Oh and please stop deluding yourself into thinking every team you lose to is using a Voip, that's rediculus. I said nothing of the sort, also, I rarely lose. If you had read my thread on this subject, you would be aware that I am constantly invited to voice groups, they are also very easy to spot if you watch the minimap. Since straight up "premades" aren't the real issue here, let us not delude ourselves. You after all, have no clue how us vets fair VS premades, headset or not, and that is not the point. A true premade is indistinguishable from pug players 90% of the time, but when the second you start tailing one known Voip'er and 6 people all dart at you from across the map, without that player taking any sort of pause to possibly call for help, well, this is really self explanatory. If that is not an unfair advantage then I'm the freaking pope. Let us ***** for a single player queue, we aren't hurting you, unless of course you are scared of other guilds in their own premades taking you down vs you shamelessly farming pugs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sangrar Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Here is the problem, what if I just want to group with my friend just to play together? what if I am just hanging out with someone and am not even on a headset? that's the problem, as well as group and solo together make a faster que pop, a separate group que will only cause a slower que time in solo and a very very slow group que, also, every 3 or 4 matches I lose I hear someone either call out "it was a premade!" or "fu hacks" so yeah, I am a bit skeptical (if the other team was premade, how come I was able to one shot some of them so easily with slug+bypass? I am usually only able to do that with only unupgraded ships and even then sometimes there is a little health left). Seriously I bet many of the times someone shouts "premade" is because they do not believe that another team can beat them without a voice advantage or something, bad beatings happen eventually, that's life. And before I am accused, I have NEVER run a premade myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I said nothing of the sort, also, I rarely lose. If you had read my thread on this subject, you would be aware that I am constantly invited to voice groups, they are also very easy to spot if you watch the minimap. And according to the PTS battle records I have a 91% win rate....Also if you're watching the mini-map your doing it wrong which explains a lot. Since straight up "premades" aren't the real issue here, let us not delude ourselves. You after all, have no clue how us vets fair VS premades, headset or not, and that is not the point. I'm sorry this just cracked me up. "Us vets" LOL. Do you know I am? Do you know how good I am? Do you know how good you are compared to me? Oh wait you don't, in fact you can't even tell me what my main is, or which of the two ships in my sig I fly the most. A true premade is indistinguishable from pug players 90% of the time, but when the second you start tailing one known Voip'er and 6 people all dart at you from across the map, without that player taking any sort of pause to possibly call for help, well, this is really self explanatory. You realize that once you close with a person, you become a red dot on that persons sensors, and when that happens this miracle of communication occurs where your red dot is grapevined to everyone else's sensors and now they can see from all the way yonder. Please When I'm not fighting over a node I'm cruising around waiting for a red square like yours to appear somewhere and bam I'm zero'ing in. It's called awareness. Besides if you attacking one guy causes 6 other players to quit what they are doing to go chase one person then I would declare that a victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Premade is just a misnomer anyway... trying to demonize Team Play... those that don't play as a team feel it's right to call for action against those that do... if they weren't trying to demonize it they'd use the appropriate term of Team Play vs. Solo Play... to be clear Team Play does not require a VoIP of any kind, all it needs is a few good players communicate the plan at the start and everyone try to stick to it... hell, with my wingman the voice convo usually goes no further than "incoming", "already see 'em"... it's the Cowboys that cause a loss usually, by not playing Objectives like a team should... all you Cowboys need to hold your horses, Death-Match is coming soon... Ya that's basically what voice chat with my wingman that I occasionally play with sounds like. The only other thing we say is when we have some one on our tails if we know the other is close enough by to help, but more then half my games I pug only play with the wingman when he is feeling it which isn't all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IceGanon Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I'm part of a pre-made pretty much every time I fly... it's really not as sinister as some of you make it out to be. It's mostly my guild and a few extra people who like to play with us. We do use voice chat. However, we pretty much only coordinate in the beginning of the match and if the other team is a pre-made. Otherwise, we just talk about random topics and do our thing. A lot of us are just taking it easy. If I see the other team looks newish, I often fly a ship I've hardly put any req into and try to stick to one sat. I still often end up with top kills because people like to fly in a straight line blasting away at a turret. I prefer to fly with my friends and no matter what ships you put us in, mastered or fresh ships, we are going to win because of our skill and experience. It's not like we're doing it to be elitist or make people rage or something like that... they need to learn to fly better, and sometimes that's a tough lesson. I would support a ranked system of sorts for GSF, but until/if that happens, I really just suggest that one makes some friends and fly with them. It's honestly more fun that way (Winning or losing) and it's going to help one become a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tunewalker Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I'm part of a pre-made pretty much every time I fly... it's really not as sinister as some of you make it out to be. It's mostly my guild and a few extra people who like to play with us. We do use voice chat. However, we pretty much only coordinate in the beginning of the match and if the other team is a pre-made. Otherwise, we just talk about random topics and do our thing. A lot of us are just taking it easy. If I see the other team looks newish, I often fly a ship I've hardly put any req into and try to stick to one sat. I still often end up with top kills because people like to fly in a straight line blasting away at a turret. I prefer to fly with my friends and no matter what ships you put us in, mastered or fresh ships, we are going to win because of our skill and experience. It's not like we're doing it to be elitist or make people rage or something like that... they need to learn to fly better, and sometimes that's a tough lesson. I would support a ranked system of sorts for GSF, but until/if that happens, I really just suggest that one makes some friends and fly with them. It's honestly more fun that way (Winning or losing) and it's going to help one become a better player. It definitely helps on the better player and enjoyable side of things. Had a friend that never wanted to do space PVP because he didn't get it at all (he is a keyboard turner and never did any of the space PVE stuff so he couldn't even turn his ship lol) but we got him to play with me and my usual wingman taught him little by little while also giving him some enjoyable people to play with and a couple good pilots to cover him so he didn't feel like he was getting trounced over and now he will play and do alright at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEATHICIDE Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 And according to the PTS battle records I have a 91% win rate....Also if you're watching the mini-map your doing it wrong which explains a lot. I'm sorry this just cracked me up. "Us vets" LOL. Do you know I am? Do you know how good I am? Do you know how good you are compared to me? Oh wait you don't, in fact you can't even tell me what my main is, or which of the two ships in my sig I fly the most. You realize that once you close with a person, you become a red dot on that persons sensors, and when that happens this miracle of communication occurs where your red dot is grapevined to everyone else's sensors and now they can see from all the way yonder. Please When I'm not fighting over a node I'm cruising around waiting for a red square like yours to appear somewhere and bam I'm zero'ing in. It's called awareness. Besides if you attacking one guy causes 6 other players to quit what they are doing to go chase one person then I would declare that a victory. Whaaaaaat buddy? I don't even think we are on the same server. Plus you are talking down to a player who is almost always No.1 or 2 on the board so yeah. Please do tell who you are and what server you are on for the class then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Whaaaaaat buddy? I don't even think we are on the same server. Plus you are talking down to a player who is almost always No.1 or 2 on the board so yeah. Please do tell who you are and what server you are on for the class then. And I am a player that is always 1 or 2 on the boards, and you are a fool for making assumptions about someone you have never encountered. The best players are those who realize they have more to improve and the worst players are those who think they are the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XavinNydek Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Text macros in PvP will get you banned. Put this beside your "team" arguments. Headsets should be everyone or nobody in a PUG. You all are like "My pro squad with headsets VS your random team with a keyboard is totally fair, just suck it up" Please. MMO = Massive Multiplayer Online, not Massively Mumbled Or whatever... Right now it's a mixed queue, so you have every right to headset and rape pugs, we get that, but don't come in here guns blazing because people want a single player only queue to avoid your mumble squad, i mean really... Voice chat is not that useful, because it's completely unnecessary. The correct thing for everyone to do, always, is to kill turrets, cap nodes, and fly in circles around them to defend/deny. If there are no enemies around your capped node and there is another node the enemy hold, go over there, kill the turrets, cap the node. If 2-3 people do that on a team and the others are at least flying around, there's a 90% chance your team wins, zero communication required. People are awful about ignoring objectives. Even if you are on a terrible team, you can still get 1500+ req by yourself. Guess how? Kill turrets, cap nodes. If you know you will lose and your team is useless, get in a blackbolt/novadive and head over to the lmost lightly defended node and kill the turrets. Cap if nobody is around, but if they are then just move on to the next node and kill the turrets there, repeat. The rest of your team can be doing whatever and you still get your req. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEATHICIDE Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 And I am a player that is always 1 or 2 on the boards, and you are a fool for making assumptions about someone you have never encountered. The best players are those who realize they have more to improve and the worst players are those who think they are the best. Again, please tell for the class what server you are on and who you are. I didn't talk at you, you talked at me. You don't want to put up, that is cool, but don't act like I was the one riding you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastorvar Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 To the Devs, If you really want GSF to take off you need to create a solo queue only option. This single and double premade nonsense only turns anyone new away to the game. Nobody wants to show up with their two-three non-enhanced ships vs. these 24/7 playtime kids with their max geared gunships. There is nothing encouraging or fun about seeing all three bases taken over in the first 20 seconds of play and then camped gunships one shotting anyone who ventures near. The rare games that are all random players are extremely fun and unpredictable, the ones described above are ones you simply have to leave the battlefield. This argument has been made in ground pvp but what makes GSF different is that it's new and has the potential to be hugely popular as it expands. Therefore why not offer the options for these two entirely different game styles to flourish instead of one snuffing out the other. Thank you, I actually agree with this 100%, and I say this as someone who plays in one of those premades virtually all the time. My reasons are not that I get pwned, but the exact opposite: It made GSF boring I loved it at first! I loved zipping around the battlefield in my scout, obliterating all opposition! My ship was specially decked out to beat out all comers and the dogfights where intense and fun. But those days are gone. These days, there is almost never an ounce of challenge in the matches. Its all just mopop and a case of who gets to score the kill first, not who is the best pilot but just who gets the poor scrub first to up their score. Good for points, but there is no challenge nor fun in this for me. I was drawn to GSF because of the chaotic challenge and skill element. But the disparity in skill between our team and most of our enemies has completely sucked the fun out of the game for me. Chasing after free kills is boring, I dont play for that. So I find my playtime being less and less but if there was some way to fix this, I would love for it. Bring back the challenge! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elly_Dawn Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 oh i love these people that always claim to be number one or two on their boards... one or two of what?, cause i can be at the bottom on the default score screen and with 2 clicks of the Objectives Tab be the one on the top with the higher number... so claiming you're the top scorer makes zero point if you don't indicate what you were top score in... otherwise you're just blowing smoke... and for my claim; yes, i usually am in the top 5 for Objective Points... usually... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptwonline Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 I actually agree with this 100%, and I say this as someone who plays in one of those premades virtually all the time. My reasons are not that I get pwned, but the exact opposite: It made GSF boring I loved it at first! I loved zipping around the battlefield in my scout, obliterating all opposition! My ship was specially decked out to beat out all comers and the dogfights where intense and fun. But those days are gone. These days, there is almost never an ounce of challenge in the matches. Its all just mopop and a case of who gets to score the kill first, not who is the best pilot but just who gets the poor scrub first to up their score. Good for points, but there is no challenge nor fun in this for me. I was drawn to GSF because of the chaotic challenge and skill element. But the disparity in skill between our team and most of our enemies has completely sucked the fun out of the game for me. Chasing after free kills is boring, I dont play for that. So I find my playtime being less and less but if there was some way to fix this, I would love for it. Bring back the challenge! Yeah. These days I find my win% dropping because I get so bored playing on the side that gets premades more often. Seriously, it's boring winning 1000 to 5. So now I play the usually-outmatched side more often to try to help them out. it's still sad when we get outkilled 40 to 5 and I get 4 of those kills and really it's not much fun, but at least it's not as boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DEATHICIDE Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) oh i love these people that always claim to be number one or two on their boards... one or two of what?, cause i can be at the bottom on the default score screen and with 2 clicks of the Objectives Tab be the one on the top with the higher number... so claiming you're the top scorer makes zero point if you don't indicate what you were top score in... otherwise you're just blowing smoke... and for my claim; yes, i usually am in the top 5 for Objective Points... usually... Right when a match is finished, the default order on the scoreboard is your overall combined if you don't click on any modifier buttons. Does this score REALLY mean anything? That is entirely debatable, but if you are on the top, you at least know how to score points as far as the system is concerned. - To the other posters who are sick of premades: Thanks for the civility, and that is all I was ever getting at. I'm certainly not ************ about losing a match or two, im ************ on behalf of new players' frustrations, and my own boredom in said matches. (I'm a Republic player so losing is rare to begin with as on my server the Imps usually are straight up pugs, the Pubs tend to be the powerhouse teams which include the premades most often) We all get our requisition just fine, but the whole point is to have fun, and premades vs premades of top skill is much more FUN than premade vs pug. Looking at any team vs team, it is only FUN when it is a challenge on both sides and the score is close. Blowing stuff up and farming can be fun if you are new to it because everyone likes shooting stuff and being victorious, sure, but it gets old real fast. Edited January 17, 2014 by DEATHICIDE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zharik Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 Right when a match is finished, the default order on the scoreboard is your overall combined if you don't click on any modifier buttons. Ummm it defaults to kills... nothing else (though I admit I do not know what takes precedence over a tie in kills) I've been 2nd in kills by a few and first in everything else and yeah... it is not some weird combining thing like you "know" it to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elly_Dawn Posted January 17, 2014 Share Posted January 17, 2014 (edited) Ummm it defaults to kills... nothing else (though I admit I do not know what takes precedence over a tie in kills) I've been 2nd in kills by a few and first in everything else and yeah... it is not some weird combining thing like you "know" it to be. right, the default page is the Kills Tab... those Tabs are not modifiers, they're to organize your scores based on the priority you choose, like; Kills, Assists, Deaths, Objectives, Hit%, ect... which was the whole point of the post he quoted... I have to take your word for now, but I could swear I see players with less kills higher than others when their other scores are much beefier, so I thought it must be an overall combination. I could be mistaken, as I don't pay THAT much attention to it other than the usual quick glance. i pay a lot of attention to it after every match, to see who's working objectives and who's just Cowboys... Edited January 17, 2014 by Elly_Dawn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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