DarthMaulUK Posted September 15, 2013 Share Posted September 15, 2013 With Bioware trying and failing to add any kind of balance to PvP because of the constraints and impact making certain changes have to PvE by doing so, is the time now to focus on having 2 Skill Trees. One for PvE and the other for PvP? This way, Bioware can be a bit more creative (lol) with PvP without having to impact on PvE. We wont need new abilities, just increase the % in the PvP to add some balance there - again, this wont impact PvE. It's time to act Bioware because bringing out a 'major' PvP update without any class balance is kinda stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatile Posted September 15, 2013 Share Posted September 15, 2013 How would that work for non-pure-DPS classes? Would you make all Juggernauts tanks, so there's a PvE-Tank tree and a PvP-Tank tree but no DPS trees? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMaulUK Posted September 15, 2013 Author Share Posted September 15, 2013 The trees wouldnt need to change. It would just be a case of looking at the % spread across their abilities. Sins were nerfed because of how they performed in PvE, now, they are useless at both PvE and PvP when it comes to DPS, removing hybrids and really only leaving one viable option to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarmaForce Posted September 15, 2013 Share Posted September 15, 2013 NGE, here we come. They need to get their act together and just fix it. They should never take something from us to make something easier for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eitetsu Posted September 15, 2013 Share Posted September 15, 2013 Like I said in the other thread, all they need to do is create 2 different rule sets. One for PvE zones and another for PvP zones. When in a PvE instance, an ability functions one way, and in a PvP zone, or if your flag is active, the ability functions another way. Most abilities would be the same in either zone, but some might have reduced damage, increased cooldown or cast, whatever. I know they can do this, because relics in 2.0 have clauses like "Will not trigger inside PvP\PvE areas." Meaning they function differently based in the type of environment you are in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hessen Posted September 15, 2013 Share Posted September 15, 2013 In my humble opnion, classes are pretty well balanced compared to other PvP MMOs. And I think that completely changing skill trees or making noticeab le PvE vs PvP differences would be harmful and confusing for the majority of the playerbase and still wouldn't result in top end PvPers being happy and less vocal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jorill Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 I like the pvp skill tree idea but when you do that then you are at square 1 again with balance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fixiooo Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 With Bioware trying and failing to add any kind of balance to PvP They're not even trying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nempo Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 The trees wouldnt need to change. It would just be a case of looking at the % spread across their abilities. Sins were nerfed because of how they performed in PvE, now, they are useless at both PvE and PvP when it comes to DPS, removing hybrids and really only leaving one viable option to play. If you find them useless, it is because you fail at using all of your other skills that aren't pure damage. UTIITY is king in PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feztonio Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 I have respec on several toons .. i would settle for being able to 'save' specs so i didn't have to take the time to look up a spec, then manually toggle all the boxes, save and then reorder my action bars. heck they could even charge cartel coins for it. so it's a win for me and a win for them with their total focus on cash shop and the Cartel Market Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMaulUK Posted September 16, 2013 Author Share Posted September 16, 2013 If you find them useless, it is because you fail at using all of your other skills that aren't pure damage. UTIITY is king in PvP. You ask anyone who is a Sin. They have been relegated to node guards in PvP and most groups remove them from PvE. Nothing to do with being a fail. Typical response from a person who simply hasnt a clue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nempo Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 You ask anyone who is a Sin. They have been relegated to node guards in PvP and most groups remove them from PvE. Nothing to do with being a fail. Typical response from a person who simply hasnt a clue. Which those who remove them do so for fail reasoning. People base it off of parsing damage on a target dummy whose HP doesn't lower to the execute level. A good sin/shad player will wreck most anyone if they play their utility right. I love your last sentence, said by someone who TRULY has no clue how to use that class properly. As your last line actually proves how little you know, it is the line we point out in psychology as a "blind bluff". You know nothing about me and are blinded by your own ignorance. The knowledgable individual actually listens, theorizes, and tests... yet so many people though fail at this and only theorize. Dummy parsing is theorizing, do the parsing in an actual live fight some time on an ops boss. What's that? Too much trouble and would likely take all day? That's the point, hard concrete factual representation in the field is all that is worth doing, the theory crafting from dummy parsing is a waste of time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmjarec Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 With Bioware trying and failing to add any kind of balance to PvP because of the constraints and impact making certain changes have to PvE by doing so, is the time now to focus on having 2 Skill Trees. One for PvE and the other for PvP? This way, Bioware can be a bit more creative (lol) with PvP without having to impact on PvE. We wont need new abilities, just increase the % in the PvP to add some balance there - again, this wont impact PvE. It's time to act Bioware because bringing out a 'major' PvP update without any class balance is kinda stupid. It seems to make sense and thats the reason bioware will never impliment it. I suggested it in beta but they only impliment the worst ideas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thylbanus Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 NGE, here we come. They need to get their act together and just fix it. They should never take something from us to make something easier for them. GHAAaaaa!!! :rak_06:RUN FOR YOU LIVES!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 I think they should completely change how PVP works. They should use a simplified GUI, like the SSSP GUI, poly reduced models and reduced particle effects and change how the stats work...only endurance would be of importance, and would effect everything...health, secondary bar, performance, etc. Ranking would boost endurance, gear would boost it. Deaths would reduce the gained Endurance pool from rank. This way balance would be easy to achieve, it would not effect PVE and more folks could PVP in larger groups without lag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMaulUK Posted September 16, 2013 Author Share Posted September 16, 2013 Which those who remove them do so for fail reasoning. People base it off of parsing damage on a target dummy whose HP doesn't lower to the execute level. A good sin/shad player will wreck most anyone if they play their utility right. I love your last sentence, said by someone who TRULY has no clue how to use that class properly. As your last line actually proves how little you know, it is the line we point out in psychology as a "blind bluff". You know nothing about me and are blinded by your own ignorance. The knowledgable individual actually listens, theorizes, and tests... yet so many people though fail at this and only theorize. Dummy parsing is theorizing, do the parsing in an actual live fight some time on an ops boss. What's that? Too much trouble and would likely take all day? That's the point, hard concrete factual representation in the field is all that is worth doing, the theory crafting from dummy parsing is a waste of time. Classes are nerfed mostly down to PvP. Lets take LOL-Smash for example. It's there because of PvE and its over powered because of PvE, yet those in PvP need to suffer 247. I actually died from a 'Scream' yesterday, which made a nice change than seeing 'Death by Player XXX Smash 5467 for the 100,000,000,000 time. Bioware simply can't balance both types of play with its current set up, and the arrival of 2.0 only made things worse for certain classes - Agents now, are just healers, Sins are toothless if people survive their short burst DPS. I believe the time is now to change and have skill points for both PvE and PvP so those that play one or the other can enjoy the difference it would make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaceen Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 even if there were pvp skill trees and pve skill trees, people would still complain about class imbalance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmjarec Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 even if there were pvp skill trees and pve skill trees, people would still complain about class imbalance. Ya cuz not doing anything will fix it. Oh noes ppl might complain might as well not even try! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 16, 2013 Share Posted September 16, 2013 (edited) even if there were pvp skill trees and pve skill trees, people would still complain about class imbalance. Indeed they would. This is the one constant in a gaming forum that everyone can count on. Maybe take the Ops idea and redux it even further. When you enter PvP. you are stripped of class, stripped nekkid and handed a nerf saber and shield AND so is your opponent.. thus reduxing to skill and skill alone. This too would however garner complaints about imbalance though. Edited September 16, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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