oaceen Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Yes, it was, but I think for only a day. I remember seeing both of them in the newly added section of the market. very interesting. i wonder if they are reconsidering the price or if it's just some bug. i guess we'll find out soon enough lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laendser Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 very interesting. i wonder if they are reconsidering the price or if it's just some bug. i guess we'll find out soon enough lol Knowing BioWare, probably both at the very same time LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 (edited) This is bothering more people, then not. Sales and availability in the GTN will dictate the answer as to how many are actually bothered-vs-pretending. Neither your opinion on the matter nor mine matters as the player base will sort it out like they do every other faux-indignation that ganks the general forum every week. As I have said elsewhere, I spend more or did, then any 100 people Im sure on the CM. So your quote of, I, We, or others agreed to pay such a price is invalid. I never agreed to pay for it at that amount, which is absurb. And I was one of those whales throwing money away at it. You are one CM customer (and alleged self-proclaimed whale) .. you don't speak for all the random dye pack buyers. All I said was that while still rare and expensive.. this new sales model reduces both rarity and cost to acquire. And not just a little.. but a lot. Are you trying to say the new sales model does not reflect a significant reduction in "cost_to_acquire? Really? Are you trying to say that people did not buy dye packs prior to direct sale of B/B or W/W? Really? Edited September 8, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathlight- Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 What about those who don't want the dye itself, only to QQ? True One should never underestimate the capacity of this forum to spark faux outrage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Here, I can provide the next thing that we can all complain about...the fact that Mako does not burst into flames every time I log in. This really makes me a sad panda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Here, I can provide the next thing that we can all complain about...the fact that Mako does not burst into flames every time I log in. Heh.. I've been wondering how something as trivial and cosmetic as two dyes could completely distract the forum from the "class balance" and "devs know nothing about class balance" agenda. This really makes me a sad panda. Now now.. don't bring Pandaria into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Heh.. I've been wondering how something as trivial and cosmetic as two dyes could completely distract the forum from the "class balance" and "devs know nothing about class balance" agenda. Now now.. don't bring Pandaria into this. Oh yea...class balance....the whole "arena" tirade. Boy, I'm not looking forward to the return of that amusement ride Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArostheJedi Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Personally, I could care less about the Black/Black dye. So, no I don't want it. But I do feel that the price is wrong. It's not entitlement, it's logic. When you offer items through the CM, or for purchase with CC, then they should reflect both the value of those items in game and compare to the prices of other items. When you have an expansion pack for the game priced at less than $20, which includes 5 additional levels, a new planet, and tons of new gear; and then you have a dye pack that can only be used once on one piece of gear priced at $20, it's irrational. So my desire to want that price lowered to a more appropriate level is not entitlement, it's logic. Or to go back to your Jetta analogy: you buy a Jetta for $10k. Then you go back to the dealership that sold you the Jetta to ask them for a paint job. They quote you $15K for the paint job. Are you entitled because you feel that's outrageous? Or are you just using your brain and realizing that makes no sense. Excellent response to that. good job, and I agree with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laendser Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 (edited) Free market: put an article on the market. Price it accordingly to what the market will bear. A definition of Free Market: A condition that allows sellers to sell, and buyers to buy without restriction. Pretty simple really. The problem with that though, is that lobbying, inside deals, monopolies and other perversions try to gain an unfair advantage by limiting or outright thwarting of other competition. Cartels are a form of monopoly. The "Free" in Free Market refers to a lack of restriction or corrupt regulation that would hinder seller's and buyer's FREE ability to partake in said transactions. Notice how that mostly relates to SELLING, nobody ever talks about a buying monopoly. The selling side is where there needs to be free opportunities for businesses to enter the marketplace and act as competition to existing vendors. If competition is essentially stifled, then the free market system is no longer in effect. In the case of the SW:TOR Cartel Market, there are no competitors at all, it is a total monopoly. Thus, it is not a free market, the exact opposite in fact. If people want to spend 2k CCs on a dye it is nobody's business but their own. Those whining need to get a better job or start saving some ingame credits if they want it. Cartel items are cosmetic only and thus don't create any imbalance between players. They also fund future development for the game. Tldr: stop whining. The Cartel Market funds this game. Oh yeah, that lame-duck argument again! I guess all the profits piling in from the Cartel Market are giving us such great in-game content as the new hideous Obroan armor, all nearly identical but all equally disgusting! Cookie-cutter copies and only slight variations to distinguish between factions. WONDERFUL "future development" LOL! Future really is the correct word though, because it's certainly not right now, and I suspect not any time soon neither. It will forever be out there as a vague (however unlikely) possibility of a "future" addition that is worthy of any merit. Edited September 8, 2013 by Laendser Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArostheJedi Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 (edited) Are you trying to say the new sales model does not reflect a significant reduction in "cost_to_acquire? Really? Are you trying to say that people did not buy dye packs prior to direct sale of B/B or W/W? Really? What I was saying is youre trying to speak for everyone in this thread, or what bioware is or isnt doing. Stop. You actually finally did something correct, you nor I will determine anything, however, maybe not. The dye is gone right now, they havent said why, never said up front its gonna be there and then not, etc. Which tells me, all of us who thought the price was a slap in the face, were finally heard. *crosses fingers*. I never said no one bought anything before. I did, so did others. I did WAY more then others. And I feel the price is absurb, so IF I, a person who wasted more money then I wish to comment on again, think its bad, and others support this line of thought, then its bad. Again others will take that as a opinion. For me, its fact. As for this reduction in cost to acquire, that could go either way, depending on when that dye gets put back up and at what price, and is it gonna finally stay up there. Guess we ll see. If anyone hasnt noticed....there has been nothing from bioware anywhere on this, or the multiple threads on this issue. Wonder why? Edited September 8, 2013 by ArostheJedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 What I was saying is youre trying to speak for everyone in this thread, or what bioware is or isnt doing. Stop. I NEVER pretend to speak for "everyone" in a gaming forum. What I do however do is to challenge extreme and hyperbolic views and distortions that are common by people who frankly dislike the game or what the devs do with it......by presenting contrast, logic, and reason.. often with supporting facts and conclusions. Nobody gets to come into the forum and dictate their personal view of reality unchallenged. Personally, I leave it to individual readers as to which opinion expressed they choose to accept, if they indeed choose to be influenced by or accept any opinion expressed. But they do deserve to hear more then just the anti-game anti-dev rhetoric that is common in the forum.. even in it's much improved state of being vs a year ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPCOT Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 I believe BW will realize that they have gone way too high for a one time use item. It would be more reasonable to purchase if it were able to be added to collections. Right now, they could cut the price by 80% and I still would not buy it as a one time use item. I would feel that it would be too wasteful to ever change the colors on my armor and thus it would take away from the fun of the game. It's not that I can't afford it. It would just be a foolish waste of money. Come on BW, make these purchasable dye module able to be added to collections, and include the account wide unlock in the original purchase price. Don't make your loyal subscriber base feel like they're being ripped off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianDavion Posted September 8, 2013 Author Share Posted September 8, 2013 for the record I enchourage everyone to NOT buy the dye when it hits the CM and be very vocal about why. if the dye doesn't sell the sane people at BW can approuch the money grubbers and say "... look we told you this was stupid" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthSabreth Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 $20.00 bucks really? I could buy some food to eat or buy some gas for my car to get to work. If they were extractable to use on multiple gear like mods and augments, I might consider it, or better yet legacy bound I would buy them with out a thought, but 20 bucks for a one time use only item is just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuruVII Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Acquiring b/b and w/w dyes has become easier and cheaper (in average one didn't get a w/w every 5 packs and 1 b/b every 10 packs). I expect the GTN prices to fall when the dyes hit the market. As such I really don't see where the problem is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thylbanus Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) I believe my signature says, "It's amazing how loud a dollar can be." Don't post about it, do something about it. Don't buy it. The bottom line is what matters. If people are buying it, all the ranting and raving will amount to nothing. EDIT: I happen to like Andryah, we may not end up on the same side, but at least she thinks before she posts. So the only way for others to compete is by character assassination. Edited September 9, 2013 by Thylbanus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hambunctious Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) At least Andryah acts civil. No, her posts are designed to elicit an aggressive response, and are often laced with subtle, and not so subtle insults. Primarily insinuating, to some degree, that the intelligence of an individual is highly lacking. Questioning cranial capacity is a favorite of hers. If someone falls for that flame bait, then they are reported, and they are the ones who receive infractions. Thus removing a voice from the forum. There are several more posters like her that do similar things. Either as overtly aggressive, or in passive/aggressive forms with liberal use of :p:rolleyes: icons. Edited September 9, 2013 by Hambunctious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manchusabre Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Wow. Nearly 500 responses and 20,000 views and still no Bioware response. Yet, they responded to post about dye only being out for a day. It's nice to know what Bioware thinks of the community. Guess it's all about the kwan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 No, her posts are designed to elicit an aggressive response, and are often laced with subtle, and not so subtle insults. Primarily insinuating, to some degree, that the intelligence of an individual is highly lacking. Questioning cranial capacity is a favorite of hers. If someone falls for that flame bait, then they are reported, and they are the ones who receive infractions. Thus removing a voice from the forum. There are several more posters like her that do similar things. Either as overtly aggressive, or in passive/aggressive forms with liberal use of :p:rolleyes: icons. Aren't you sweet. What is your point? That some people respond aggressively to facts, objective discussion, or opinion? You are stating the obvious.... in order to prosecute an ad hominem attack against me personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuruVII Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) Why would they respond? They made the w/w and b/b dyes cheaper and easier to acquire and you are complaining about it. We as players have only gained from this. They dyes were a limited time offer anyway... so you guys can go back to buying 20+ dye packs for w/w and b/b dyes. Edited September 9, 2013 by GuruVII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Why would they respond? They made the w/w and b/b dyes cheaper and easier to acquire and you are complaining about it. We as players have only gained from this. /agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primarch_PWnD Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) Aren't you sweet. What is your point? That some people respond aggressively to facts, objective discussion, or opinion? You are stating the obvious.... in order to prosecute an ad hominem attack against me personally. One of the most ironic posts I've ever seen. Claiming to be open-minded and non-"aggressive", in a post dripping with sarcasm and condescension...... Its almost poetic..... To say something on-topic: Saying that the price at $20 is reasonable because it equates to the 2-million credits on the GTN is backwards. You can't convert credits back to Cartel Coins, so you can't compare the two. Imagine you ask me for a sheet of paper, but I burn it to ashes before I hand it to you and tell you it equals the same thing as paper. That's what you're trying to say to us with that argument. Dyes are on the CM for $20. You can't compare it to anything but what else is on the CM. You can't compare it to the GTN or anything else using credits. It's $20 for a video game dye, pure and simple, and it's ludicrous. Edited September 9, 2013 by Primarch_PWnD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuruVII Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) Sure you can compare it to something, you can compare it to 10 dye packs... and what are the chances of you getting a w/w and b/b dye in those 10 dye packs? Edited September 9, 2013 by GuruVII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHboy Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 One of the most ironic posts I've ever seen. Claiming to be open-minded and non-"aggressive", in a post dripping with sarcasm and condescension...... Its almost poetic..... To say something on-topic: Saying that the price at $20 is reasonable because it equates to the 2-million credits on the GTN is backwards. You can't convert credits back to Cartel Coins, so you can't compare the two. Imagine you ask me for a sheet of paper, but I burn it to ashes before I hand it to you and tell you it equals the same thing as paper. That's what you're trying to say to us with that argument. Dyes are on the CM for $20. You can't compare it to anything but what else is on the CM. You can't compare it to the GTN or anything else using credits. It's $20 for a video game dye, pure and simple, and it's ludicrous. No, Its 200CC for a B/B dye, or 2million credits on the GTN, or 200CC for a dye kit. Given the fact that they are available on the GTN for 2mil or 2000CC would imply a ration of 1000:1 (by the community in general) simlar to packs selling for about 350k when they only cost about 320C CC per pack. IF you don't want to buy them for $20, feel free to purchase either of the other two ways available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadoken Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) Sure you can compare it to something, you can compare it to 10 dye packs... and what are the chances of you getting a w/w and b/b dye in those 10 dye packs? Yea it's cheaper than the alternative, but don't expect these guys to understand (or rather, admit) that. Edited September 9, 2013 by hadoken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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