Tendering My Resignation

[MillionsKNives]

Well, that just proves how unfit he was to be class rep. He was obviously focussed on one area - tank spikiness - to the exclusion of all others. Last thing we needed in a rep. The way I see it is we're at the start of a long process here and what we need is someone who's going to stick to that ... Not flounce off when the one issue they care about goes unheeded.

 

Do we even have questions, or did Kitru take them with when he rode off on his drama-lama?

 

Well yes, he focused on tank spikiness because he was a tank first and foremost. That does not mean he did so to the exclusion of all others, in fact he often communicated with the rest of the shadow community and also with the Assassin rep on what to bring up. He had his own "what are we going to ask" thread to bring in others opinions. Exactly what you'd want in a rep.

 

He flounced because of how often the devs have proved themselves to be incompetent, not even with just the Shadow tanks, but that I'm sure is what annoyed him the most. He also states that he left because he found something else to be more engaging than he is currently finding SWTOR. For something that is meant to be entertainment you can't come up with a better reason to leave than that.

[manchusabre]

So sad. It has been one rough summer for my progression group as well. We lost so many people and it has taken a while to rebuild. It seems like this game is something to do until ESO comes out. I think EAs focus is on the cartel market first and foremost. There have been so many good suggestions on stuff to do since release. Outfits end up being done but only for the CM. The new content is ok, but wow CZ198 can't handle 63 pub players and lags like crazy. The rereleasing of TFB to level 55 hurt more than help. The crazy learning curve for the nim dreadguard put off so many people. Yes, in a guild that downed them prenerf. I would like to know what game you switching too also. I been trying out other things now more regularly. Almost to the point of playing minecraft.

[Vaerah]

Think this thread's getting a little bit out of hand. Kitru's done a lot for the community, even though some may not have agreed on the manner or methods. He's leaving and this is a farewell. Now, to focus on the even greater issue than Kitru, myself or anyone else - How are we going to present the batch of questions for the next Rep?

 

I am stuffed being called "OP" left and right (playing infiltration) while I myself would never invite an inf shadow neither for competitive PvE nor any form of serious PVP.

Only question I have is:

 

"Is this experience worth paying my sub?".

 

The reply is: "No, I'll eventually come back once my spec is as useful for any length of time like every other and once my sustained DPS is anywhere comparable to the others".

 

Yeah, that's a long, long time of staying unsubbed.

[Dragonexadon]

I am stuffed being called "OP" left and right (playing infiltration) while I myself would never invite an inf shadow neither for competitive PvE

Then you need a new guild and/or new friends to play with. And I mean that with no disrespect to you. I just hate guilds that shun Shadows. While I think Kitur's work for the community is amazing I detest when people come to the conclusion that they would be left out due to their classes status. If that is the case then you really need to consider a new guild.

The reply is: "No, I'll eventually come back once my spec is as useful for any length of time like every other and once my sustained DPS is anywhere comparable to the others".

I think Kitru's experience was a bit different. He is a master at theroy crafting. To that aspect I believe he was doing it for the community and only for the community. His personal raiding experience in current content is only Story mode S&V and Story mode level 55 TFB.

 

While this does not take away from his skill as a player in the least, it does throw out the idea that he was waiting for his class to become useful. SHadow tanks are more than capable for HM content. It appears he was losing interest for sometime.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Dragonexadon

[KeyboardNinja]

Then you need a new guild and/or new friends to play with. While I think Kitur's work for the community is amazing I detest when people come to the conclusion that they would be left out due to their classes status. If that is the case then you really need to consider a new guild.

 

My guild has a shadow DPS who really is fantastic. He parses about as well for his gear level as any shadow that I've seen (with the exception of wild-berry). He works very hard, and I like him as both a player and a person.

 

But he is a DPS shadow. The fact of the matter is that there are bosses in Nightmare mode which have tight DPS checks, either in the form of soft or hard enrages. For this reason, we can't take him in our main progression group. He is now doing Nightmare content with a different (in-guild) group, but we need to plan every strategy with the awareness that this group's DPS is lower that is desirable, and perhaps viable.

 

We want very much to take the player and not the class. Unfortunately, we cannot. This is precisely the reason that shadows are not balanced. When a guild as open-minded and as meritocratic as the one I'm in has to turn-down someone who has put in so much effort and diligence and improved so significantly, something is terribly wrong.

[Riivan]

My guild has a shadow DPS who really is fantastic. He parses about as well for his gear level as any shadow that I've seen (with the exception of wild-berry). He works very hard, and I like him as both a player and a person.

 

But he is a DPS shadow. The fact of the matter is that there are bosses in Nightmare mode which have tight DPS checks, either in the form of soft or hard enrages. For this reason, we can't take him in our main progression group. He is now doing Nightmare content with a different (in-guild) group, but we need to plan every strategy with the awareness that this group's DPS is lower that is desirable, and perhaps viable.

 

We want very much to take the player and not the class. Unfortunately, we cannot. This is precisely the reason that shadows are not balanced. When a guild as open-minded and as meritocratic as the one I'm in has to turn-down someone who has put in so much effort and diligence and improved so significantly, something is terribly wrong.

 

Vigi guards everywhere understand this all too well. We can do the min for 8s and thus substantially more than the min for 16s but the stars need to align. Someday they'll balance us out, until then hello Sent/Sage.

[Dragonexadon]

My guild has a shadow DPS who really is fantastic.

 

That was my error. While at work I was skimreading the response. Shadow DPS is horrid right now no doubt. I thought the post was about kinect combat, not infiltration. The poster clearly stated DPS but my mind went to Tank.

[leto_cleon]

My guild has a shadow DPS who really is fantastic. He parses about as well for his gear level as any shadow that I've seen (with the exception of wild-berry). He works very hard, and I like him as both a player and a person.

 

But he is a DPS shadow. The fact of the matter is that there are bosses in Nightmare mode which have tight DPS checks, either in the form of soft or hard enrages. For this reason, we can't take him in our main progression group. He is now doing Nightmare content with a different (in-guild) group, but we need to plan every strategy with the awareness that this group's DPS is lower that is desirable, and perhaps viable.

 

We want very much to take the player and not the class. Unfortunately, we cannot. This is precisely the reason that shadows are not balanced. When a guild as open-minded and as meritocratic as the one I'm in has to turn-down someone who has put in so much effort and diligence and improved so significantly, something is terribly wrong.

/thread to http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=668485 really.

 

Vigi guards everywhere understand this all too well. We can do the min for 8s and thus substantially more than the min for 16s but the stars need to align. Someday they'll balance us out, until then hello Sent/Sage.

With much less gear and stats, my Vigilance Guardian was parsing very much higher than my Balance Shadow. It was pretty frustrating.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I guess that's what happens when you win a popularity contest, but already made up your mind about leaving.

[Telanis]

You shouldn't have applied to be a rep. Thanks for nothing and good riddance.

[Vaerah]

We want very much to take the player and not the class. Unfortunately, we cannot. This is precisely the reason that shadows are not balanced. When a guild as open-minded and as meritocratic as the one I'm in has to turn-down someone who has put in so much effort and diligence and improved so significantly, something is terribly wrong.

 

Exactly. I had to quit other MMOs befor SWTOR (including WoW) because I always ended up rolling some class that was just underperforming no matter what you did.

This really grinds my patience, to pay an AAA sub and then long time friends have to tell you "sorry, we'd REALLY want to take you but we can't do this content with your class. Maybe if you had another alt...."

[-DG-]

I was a class representive for about 4-5 years in the MMORPG Dark Age of Camelot(shortname: DAoC). The class might have been the worst so called underdog class. And I had to wait several months, yeah at times a year or so, before things went "my" way.

 

Sometimes a struggle, sometimes a really fun co-operative spirit between developer and class representatives such as myself and other ones. Ups and downs, etc.

 

As a class representive, it could be wise to see and understand the importance of "long term" as well as "the overall picture". I hope that next time Kitru embark on the adventure as a representative - this information might be something Kitru keep close at hand.

 

(English ain't my 1th language - Thus spelling and grammar might be... less good)

[Dragonexadon]

But, on the other hand, as far Infiltration Shadow. DPS, a guild just got server nightmare first on Jedi Covenant with an Infil.

 

 

Another raider commented:

 

[–]Proud_of_myselfSephir | Shadow Tank | Jedi Covenant 1 point 1 hour ago

Our Shadow is absolutely excellent. When Torparse was working he was consistently #1/#2 on most fights...

 

I don't know much about Infiltration. Perhaps just a fluke but thought I post it. Asking for his logs now. I find it hard to believe that they are parsing that high.

 

Edit, the GMs reply

comment replyAscension - NM Styrak - Jedi Covenant Server First

from Proud_of_myself via /r/swtor/ sent 2 minutes ago

show parent

Yep - you can see the breakdown on Torparse if you search for ascension.

Sage: 2257 Slinger: 2307 Shadow: 2580 Sent: ????

Edited August 27, 2013 by Dragonexadon

[Berjiz]

But, on the other hand, as far Infiltration Shadow. DPS, a guild just got server nightmare first on Jedi Covenant with an Infil.

 

 

Another raider commented:

 

 

 

I don't know much about Infiltration. Perhaps just a fluke but thought I post it. Asking for his logs now. I find it hard to believe that they are parsing that high.

 

 

Styrak is probably the best fight for infiltration shadow. He cleanses dots all the time and got lots of burst windows. Infiltration has no dots and high burst that is controlable. Impressive dps from the shadow. But in a fight with more sustainable dmg like warlords the shadow would look a lot worse.

 

Whats the spec of the sage and sniper? If they were dot speced they would lose a lot of dps that way.

[DaftVaduhhh]

Terrible work from the Slinger & Sage. Sent & Shadow carried the **** out of them.

[Dragonexadon]

Styrak is probably the best fight for infiltration shadow. He cleanses dots all the time and got lots of burst windows. Infiltration has no dots and high burst that is controlable. Impressive dps from the shadow. But in a fight with more sustainable dmg like warlords the shadow would look a lot worse.

 

Whats the spec of the sage and sniper? If they were dot speced they would lose a lot of dps that way.

 

I have no clue. Not my group, Saw the post on reddit, thought it was impressive DPS for a shadow and thought I share.

[Vaerah]

I have no clue. Not my group, Saw the post on reddit, thought it was impressive DPS for a shadow and thought I share.

 

Gimnicks and fringe cases: that's where inf shadow is competitive. Needs to guard a node. Or needs to get the opener on a bad geared opponent. Or needs to get the one encounter that penalizes everyone else.

 

Wish I'd have only to pay a sub outside of those exceptions, I'd play a year for $30!

[Dragonexadon]

Gimnicks and fringe cases: that's where inf shadow is competitive. Needs to guard a node. Or needs to get the opener on a bad geared opponent. Or needs to get the one encounter that penalizes everyone else.

 

Wish I'd have only to pay a sub outside of those exceptions, I'd play a year for $30!

 

No gimich, they ran with the shadow all the way through and they said he is constantly pulling the best, or near best , numbers in the group. They are not best in slot DPS clearly. Torparse averages show they are at the bottom. But, for PVE , they can complete all the content both as Tank and DPS.

 

They need love for sure though. And I know nothing about them for PVP

[MillionsKNives]

No gimich, they ran with the shadow all the way through and they said he is constantly pulling the best, or near best , numbers in the group. They are not best in slot DPS clearly. Torparse averages show they are at the bottom. But, for PVE , they can complete all the content both as Tank and DPS.

 

They need love for sure though. And I know nothing about them for PVP

 

"Can complete" doesn't stop the jokes! All the jokes!

 

*weeps in the corner*

[thejollygreenone]

No gimich, they ran with the shadow all the way through and they said he is constantly pulling the best, or near best , numbers in the group. They are not best in slot DPS clearly. Torparse averages show they are at the bottom. But, for PVE , they can complete all the content both as Tank and DPS.

 

They need love for sure though. And I know nothing about them for PVP

 

whoever this shadow is that was constantly pulling the best or near best numbers in the group, i can almost promise you he wasn't using infiltration for more than 20% of the fights, which is the spec the person you quoted was referring to. infiltration. balance is very manageable in pve, but is extremely hard to pull satisfactory numbers, which are still sometime's sub-par. infiltration on the other hand has a few straight up broken and useless mechanics in pve.

 

it seems to me that those who are able to switch builds as a shadow and do well, will use balance for the majority of the fights, and will switch to infiltration when the fight is bad for balance. thats just a guess though, i'm a player who tends to stick with one spec, that spec is infiltration and it's not doing nearly as well as it could be. i'll refrain from explaining why because i've already done so countless times in other threads.

[manchusabre]

The shadow that did Nim TFB was Wild-berry. You can see some of his numbers on the torparse site. He is in Republic Gentlemen. Edited August 30, 2013 by manchusabre

[Xinika]

The shadow that did Nim TFB was Wild-berry. You can see some of his numbers on the torparse site. He is in Republic Gentlemen.

Impressive that one is, no doubt. It's always good to see such players push regardless of the state of the class.

[KeyboardNinja]

Impressive that one is, no doubt. It's always good to see such players push regardless of the state of the class.

 

Yeah, wild-berry is a beast. What I think is particularly noteworthy is that his group cleared NiM Dread Guard before the first nerf (when the enrage timer was 30 seconds shorter than it is now, and they had more health than at present). There was absolutely no room in that fight to carry anyone, and there is no doubt in my mind that his DPS is competitive with the top tier slingers and sentinels.

[mmerry]

I'd like to point out that M-knightrider of Ascension is an excellent Shadow DPS also. He and his group is 5/5 and 7/7 in the current NiM ops. This is something that I haven't accomplished yet and full credit should go to him and his group. While the general consensus on the forums is that Shadow DPS is sub par, the class is certainly very capable of pushing competitive numbers and clearing content (in either dps tree). I don't want to speak for him, but I just want credit to go where credit is due.

[Avicii]

I'd like to point out that M-knightrider of Ascension is an excellent Shadow DPS also. He and his group is 5/5 and 7/7 in the current NiM ops. This is something that I haven't accomplished yet and full credit should go to him and his group. While the general consensus on the forums is that Shadow DPS is sub par, the class is certainly very capable of pushing competitive numbers and clearing content (in either dps tree). I don't want to speak for him, but I just want credit to go where credit is due.

 

Good post and very gentlemanly of you. Nice to see someone giving credit to someone else instead of trying to belittle them do to their own self perceived skill or scream and rant at BW. +1 Internets to you