I Want To Like TOR, But It Just Feels Old

[Roofner]

let's just all save some time and effort and just agree that there will be no "Perfect" MMO until they take Skyrim and just make it an MMO. Agreed?

[Shadysketchy]

Don't blame Bioware for out leveling the majority of the player base.

 

But why not?

 

With WoW's LFD, it wouldn't be as big of an issue; why should BioWare get a free pass?

[Corlantis]

There's nothing about my thread that instigates "bickering"

 

A volatile, unfriendly community that frequently blows up, and argues with one another does this, and in many threads — not just mine

 

Well, you could do a better of job of presenting your idea if you aren't trying to instigate bickering.

Your title and tl;dr is not going to get you a balanced argument. If it matched your first and last paragraphs, which seemed more sincere, you might have gotten a less divisive response.

 

Also, when you list your points, the language is at times flippant and harsh. Words such as absurd, lackluster, insulting (and sentences with the same flavor) aren't going to get you a balanced response.

 

I'll concede that your language isn't particularly offensive, I've definitely seen worse. However, a post of this nature on the second day after the release of a game is likely not to be well received without one being very careful about it's language and presentation. People want to enjoy the game and probably don't want others raining on their parade.

[Megaberna]

The amount of 10 -16 year old people whining is just ridiculous!

 

Some just have to take a lighsaber on the knee...

[cronpants]

He doesn't want WoW. He wants the features normally found in a modern MMORPG.

 

It took wow 7 years to get where it is. This is not a wow clone. He wants wow. So do you.

[DLSilence]

Think you're overlooking the fact that the LFG killed ~all~ social aspects of wow, as well as killed the "world" in that acronym. Everyone just sits in one area waiting for an all powerful box to pop up. On top of that, anyone who actually plays an mmo to be immersed gave up on wow and blizzard after the nonsense that you call cataclysm. Wow could practically be played on a console in it's current form with the way people go about it. Sitting in a pvp or lfg queue waiting to get into a map. Wow is old, and dying.. enjoy your pandas.

[valsheres]

let's just all save some time and effort and just agree that there will be no "Perfect" MMO until they take Skyrim and just make it an MMO. Agreed?

 

still wouldnt be perfect, youd get everyone complaining about blacksmiths oneshotting people in full combat skills, artisans are overpowered

 

back ontopic, while you can fault the op for "power leveling" i highly doubt he power leveled rather than spent his entire free time from the first day of headstart playing the same character, which he cannot be faulted for

 

it doesnt take that long to level, 3 hours and your at level 12 with all of the starter area finished, 20 minutes for the first instance and level 13 coming on 14, 5 more hours and your leaving the next planet at 18, and hey you havent even spent a full day of gaming yet, sure it slows down, but take 5 hours to clear a planet, theres about 12 of them 60 hours is doable in 5 - 10 days depending on how much time you have

[Asamitai]

But why not?

 

With WoW's LFD, it wouldn't be as big of an issue; why should BioWare get a free pass?

 

I'm not sure why I'm feeding the obvious troll, but I really have nothing better to do with my time right now.

 

To expect Bioware to include every single thing on your list, LFD included, is overkill. The amount of development time with the sheer amount of voice acting, content and everything else that went into this game is infinitely larger than what Blizzard put into the original WoW.

 

You can argue that Rift had a lot of these features in at launch, but it also didn't have anywhere near the depth TOR has in dialogue or voice acting. You're going to sacrifice certain things to include others, unless you want the game to be endlessly stuck in development.

 

They put time and money into developing other aspects of the game to match the type of game they wanted at release. If you don't like it, and this is an overused phrase, go back to WoW. It has everything you want already, and you can actually play instead of complaining on the forums in every single thread.

[Grammarye]

the moment the critics of this topic start constructively breaking down each point the op has made, and giving proper reasoning as to why its not neccesary, THEN well be able to have a decent discussion

It would have been nice if the OP could have started that; I read that post as entirely 'I want TOR to be WoW and I expect a bunch of features' which isn't constructive at all.

 

Very few of the actual features in that list are necessary. I should know; I've played enough MMOs without them. Useful? Sure. Some are just opinions.

 

LFG for example; been debated to death in other threads. Nothing to add here of value & not worth bringing up again. The current tool could be better, no doubt.

 

Calling companions pets for example - were we going out of our way to annoy? Don't know what AI issues he's had; beyond Khem getting in my screen too often, I have seen no issues.

 

2007 graphics - I don't know what 2007 he's referring to; TOR's graphics could easily match Skyrim's for level of detail, they just happen to be a different art style. Or has he not looked very hard at current modern games' textures? Art style is something that a lot of so-called developers entirely forget about.

 

No day/night cycle - Who cares? This is pure opinion, and not even a useful feature. It has no merit in WoW either; that it's lacking in TOR is entirely irrelevant.

 

Same goes for water. Not noticing the problem here. This smacks of 'I am going out of my way to find fault'.

 

Not going to argue on queues, I was disappointed by them too.

 

Char creation - Purely opinion. It could be more detailed, but I'm not noticing a significant problem with identical characters turning up.

 

Levelling curve - This is purely subjective, and places the emphasis on levelling, which the game isn't focused on. The game is about story content. Nobody cares if you get to level 50 in a day a week or a month, and why should they?

 

Macros, mouseover casting, addons, dual spec - None of these are standard. They happen to be in WoW. That's it. A smattering of them turn up in some other MMOs. Arguing that they ought to be there is like saying that Burger King do something that KFC doesn't.

 

Lack of variety in quests - This just demonstrates further that the OP is looking for a fight and not engaging in debate. The story itself, as real game commentators have mentioned, makes each quest different.

 

Voice actors on too many characters - Clearly this player hasn't gone near any Bethesda game ever. Same goes for the repetition he mentions. Either the player has never done any voiced games ever or he's deliberately ignoring them.

 

I could go on but frankly it's not worth the effort. I don't object to people voicing their opinions, but this is such biased opinion that there is clearly no point in discussion. He wants WoW, in space. Well, sorry, TOR isn't that.

 

I want the game improved; this isn't how to go about it.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Grammarye

[CaptainHagbard]

As with most of the complaints I read about the gameplay or the game in general, this one complains mostly about stuff WoW, but TOR has not. Let's see:

 

LFG-tool, UI-customization, night-and-day-cycle, swimming, more warzones, macros, dual-spec, early mounts, transmorgification, barbershop... This sowhat annoys me, because people switch games, but in the end want all the stuff they are used to in their old games.

 

So either it's "WoW with Lightsabers" or it's "Not enough like WoW, because I miss feature X". Don't get me wrong: The game is far from finished or perfect, but it's not WoW and that's fine by me. There will be some things implemented that OP wants, some won't but in the end it's important that the game develops it's own style and does not really become "WoW with Lightsabers".

[XRenegade]

Okey, so you want to like the OLD republic, but it just feels OLD?

 

I suppose it's a win, then.

[saminaobx]

Every single point you made is valid and needs to be adressed by Bioware.

[TotalProBear]

@OP

 

I can tell by the majority of you're Original Post that you havent really got very far in SWTOR.

 

This game is EPIC!!!

 

No LFG Tool - Make some REAL friends!

 

Awful UI - The UI is ok, I cant move stuff, which is a bit of an issue, but I can bind hidden hotkeys, so BIG DEAL!

 

Pet AI is horrible - I can select the skills I want my dude to use, and they are cast automatically. I havent had an issue with my pet pulling mob groups or anything, which happens ALOT in WOW.

 

2007 graphics - huh? The graphics are AMAZING!

 

No Day/Night Cylce - SO WHAT?

 

No accessable body of water deeper than 6 inches - THANKGOD! Water sucks, Swimming Sucks!

 

Server queues - Not my fault you rolled in a Heavy Population server.

 

Lackluster Character Creation - Im guessing this was to make cinematic movie coding easier. And tbh it has alot greater character customisation than wow does.

 

Absurd Leveling curve; the overall process of getting from 1-50 is pretty fast, but the curve for time per level increases at a rate that makes me feel like I'm playing Aion again - LoL, Leveling is easy in this game. The curve is fine.

 

Three Warzones, No Arenas (also consider Huttball cannot be taken seriously as Rated PvP). Again; TOR is competing with 2011 WoW (8 Battlegrounds, 4 of which can be done Rated + Arena Content) - Dunno why you even need battlegrounds, when their is world pvp.

 

No Macros - And?

 

No mouseover casting - Oh no! i HAVE TO TARGET SOMEONE TO USE AN ABILITY ON THEM. THE WORLD IS GOING TO END.

 

No addon support - No newbie addons, Good! Last thing we want it some stupid addon telling you when to ease up on your DPS. Or how to fight a boss. Addons just lower skill level.

 

No Dual Spec - Dual Spec is stupid. pPick your role and play it.

 

Taris memory leaks - err. get some more RAM.

 

Lack of variety in quests; everything is kill X amount of Y - There are tons of quests where you have to activate consoles, deactivate stuff, pick stuff up, interact with the environment, epic duals with jedi/sith etc...

 

Voice Actors voicing too many different people - Lol enjoy the game a little better.

 

"Choices" are still just the Blue good guy option - well.. what more do you want?

 

No Mount until level 25 - you get a sprint before this... in wow you didnt used to get a mount till level 40.

 

Awkward gold - Credits is the lore lol.

 

A vast array of technical errors that BioWare, - its a new 20gb game ofcourse its gonna have a few bugs.

 

No Appearance/Gear Customization - errr, modification system is not customisable? *** U TALKING ABOUT!!!

 

No Barbershop for minor character recustomization - yEAH! STUPID FEATURE.

 

More.. - yEAH KEEP COMPLAINING.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Sireene
insulting

[Shadysketchy]

I'm not sure why I'm feeding the obvious troll, but I really have nothing better to do with my time right now.

 

To expect Bioware to include every single thing on your list, LFD included, is overkill. The amount of development time with the sheer amount of voice acting, content and everything else that went into this game is infinitely larger than what Blizzard put into the original WoW.

 

You can argue that Rift had a lot of these features in at launch, but it also didn't have anywhere near the depth TOR has in dialogue or voice acting. You're going to sacrifice certain things to include others, unless you want the game to be endlessly stuck in development.

 

They put time and money into developing other aspects of the game to match the type of game they wanted at release. If you don't like it, and this is an overused phrase, go back to WoW. It has everything you want already, and you can actually play instead of complaining on the forums in every single thread.

 

Why are you arguing that the UI is acceptable, because the game has voice acting? UI, and VO are two entirely separate, and unrelated features

[Shadysketchy]

@OP

 

I can tell by the majority of you're Original Post that you havent really got very far in SWTOR.

 

 

I'm level 50

Edited December 23, 2011 by Sireene
reply to edited post

[Asamitai]

Why are you arguing that the UI is acceptable, because the game has voice acting? UI, and VO are two entirely separate, and unrelated features

 

No I'm saying that they only have a certain budget for development. They chose to spend it in other areas. They don't have an endless supply of cash, time or manpower, which is why features you want so dearly aren't in the game.

Edited December 23, 2011 by Asamitai

[WallaceHS]

/sign

 

Especially regarding the "No LFG Tool". I miss that!

[mutharex]

It would have been nice if the OP could have started that; I read that post as entirely 'I want TOR to be WoW and I expect a bunch of features' which isn't constructive at all.

 

 

of course it isn't, it isn't the OP objective. How many people do you know that say they love a game and they want it to succeed then proceed to insult the game and basically say it's not as good as wow?? it's blatantly trolling, I tell ya

[Shadysketchy]

of course it isn't, it isn't the OP objective. How many people do you know that say they love a game and they want it to succeed then proceed to insult the game and basically say it's not as good as wow?? it's blatantly trolling, I tell ya

 

Why does every post you make have the word "troll", or "trolling" in it?

 

Do you even know what trolling means?

 

At any rate, you're not being constructive

[mutharex]

Why are you arguing that the UI is acceptable, because the game has voice acting? UI, and VO are two entirely separate, and unrelated features

 

The UI IS acceptable. Is the best? No. Is unusable? No

 

Would it be good to be able to customize it? yes. The devs haven't said anything about this, so I assume it's possible they open up the API. But to be honest I haven't had any issue (aside from the Open a CS Ticket button.....)

 

Now the question is:

 

1) do you like the game and want it to succeed and get better?

 

OR

 

2) you just angry you over hyped this game in your head and so you want to vent your anger?

[Twicepolar]

 

- Three Warzones, No Arenas (also consider Huttball cannot be taken seriously as Rated PvP). Again; TOR is competing with 2011 WoW (8 Battlegrounds, 4 of which can be done Rated + Arena Content)

 

 

indeed

[valsheres]

woohoo constructive feedback! yay go go go go!

 

It would have been nice if the OP could have started that; I read that post as entirely 'I want TOR to be WoW and I expect a bunch of features' which isn't constructive at all.

 

Very few of the actual features in that list are necessary. I should know; I've played enough MMOs without them. Useful? Sure. Some are just opinions.

 

LFG for example; been debated to death in other threads. Nothing to add here of value & not worth bringing up again. The current tool could be better, no doubt.

 

the current tool, is not really much of a tool, its just the character search option with an icon with 15 characters worth of text you can add before it goes off the window and vanishes due to the window not being resizable.

 

i personally wouldnt mind the LFD tool from wow, queue up for instances, wait till it finds a group and bam ports you into it, however given the fact that all instance portals are in roughly the same area, being the station, might aswell at the requirement that the player is currently on the station to use it, as opposed to doing dailies on god knows where.

 

 

Calling companions pets for example - were we going out of our way to annoy? Don't know what AI issues he's had; beyond Khem getting in my screen too often, I have seen no issues.

 

some issues with companions: attacking the wrong targets, id rather they focus fire with me on an elite at 10% health rather than shoot the boss i just stunned because cc broke.

 

you cant shut them up

 

they say the wrong messages when coming back from missions (it went better than expect on a fail, sorry i failed on a critical success etc etc)

 

pathing issues, interrupting harvesting (i turned this off in the end because i got sick of having to tell mako to salvage 8 times)

 

 

2007 graphics - I don't know what 2007 he's referring to; TOR's graphics could easily match Skyrim's for level of detail, they just happen to be a different art style. Or has he not looked very hard at current modern games' textures? Art style is something that a lot of so-called developers entirely forget about.

 

many textures in swtor are pretty low res, im still uncertain if hi res textures are simply not included, or disabled at the time, im guessing disabled, why else would the game be 20 gigs and look like half the armor was spray painted on the models

 

No day/night cycle - Who cares? This is pure opinion, and not even a useful feature. It has no merit in WoW either; that it's lacking in TOR is entirely irrelevant.

 

Same goes for water. Not noticing the problem here. This smacks of 'I am going out of my way to find fault'.

 

Not going to argue on queues, I was disappointed by them too.

 

its aesthetic, some planets should have fast cycles some slow, it gives a sense of time passing,

 

as for the water thing, it makes exploration more fun, finding a pool with an underwater cave is far more satisfying than walking down a path into a wide open cave obscured by a 1 ft high bush

 

 

Char creation - Purely opinion. It could be more detailed, but I'm not noticing a significant problem with identical characters turning up.

 

now this i disagree with, while individual customisation is decent, the extremely limited ammount of possible body shapes irks me immensely, the male models especially are icky, as i pointed out somewhere on page 31 or 32,

youve got the anorexic bobblehead, the wide shouldered stick, the steroid guzzling giant, and the hutts big brother.

females are in a slightly better position with the anorexic bean, the super model, the steroid junkie, and the well rounded human look

 

however also dont forget that 8+ different alien species all share the same body shape is disconcerting to say the least, and seems quite lazy

 

 

Levelling curve - This is purely subjective, and places the emphasis on levelling, which the game isn't focused on. The game is about story content. Nobody cares if you get to level 50 in a day a week or a month, and why should they?

 

the curve is fine, i agree with that

 

 

 

Macros, mouseover casting, addons, dual spec - None of these are standard. They happen to be in WoW. That's it. A smattering of them turn up in some other MMOs. Arguing that they ought to be there is like saying that Burger King do something that KFC doesn't.

 

all of these have become useful features to simplify the strain on the mind in mmo's rather than note every single number of damage you see popping by, you have a meter that keeps track of everything for you.

 

rather than having 6 different keys for your heals, you have them bound into one, with modifiers, shift is the fast heal, ctrl the hot, alt the shield, etc, freeing up room on action bars.

 

mousover casting helps with keeping the ui clean, and speeds reaction time saving you from losing your current target.

 

dual spec in the long run saves enormous ammounts of money, even if the initial buy cost was 100k credits, some people have reported respec fees already over 35k due to switching between a dps and healing tree based on solo / group play

 

 

 

Lack of variety in quests - This just demonstrates further that the OP is looking for a fight and not engaging in debate. The story itself, as real game commentators have mentioned, makes each quest different.

 

story can only carry a quest once (twice given good / evil choices) (or more often for the exceedingly forgetful) the actual quest itself though based on its enjoyment determines whether its worth doing after that, story comes last when your running your 3rd inquisitor through balmorra because you need a pure healer because your sick of respec costs

 

 

Voice actors on too many characters - Clearly this player hasn't gone near any Bethesda game ever. Same goes for the repetition he mentions. Either the player has never done any voiced games ever or he's deliberately ignoring them.

 

I could go on but frankly it's not worth the effort. I don't object to people voicing their opinions, but this is such biased opinion that there is clearly no point in discussion. He wants WoW, in space. Well, sorry, TOR isn't that.

 

I want the game improved; this isn't how to go about it.

 

the voice acting does get annoying after a while, i have turned it off several times while traveling through areas ive already been, and having 5 / 12 vendors with the same voice in a row (go talk to your pvp vendors) feels appalling.

 

there ive given you my opinion on your opinions, hoping to highlight what i see wrong with the points, this is what this topic should be like /cheers

[mutharex]

Why does every post you make have the word "troll", or "trolling" in it?

 

Do you even know what trolling means?

 

At any rate, you're not being constructive

 

I am being as constructive as you. I agree that doesn't amount to much, but you should look into your posts before criticizing

 

And I don't mean just this, I mean all of your other posts through the forum, you seem to pop up in every discussion basically saying that this game sux, it's old, BW threw away money etc etc

 

VERY constructive

 

Now, if you don't like the game, why are you here posting? I mean after the first 100 posts we got your message really, now you can find something else to do with your spare time

 

dunno, sit in orgrimmar?

[Elkard]

Day four and the whinners are taking over. Everything the OP says is in direct relation to what WoW has because of whinners. WoW, player base aside, is not the best nor has it ever been anything except a carebear slobber fest for console players who do nothing but log in to play a multiplayer version of some closed-end linear game. Every post on these boards complaining about this game repeat the same issues and are extremely distracting. I do have some beefs with other players: people who "assume" they are the only ones who "know" how to run everyone's class (news--you don't. So stop trying to tell people how to use their abilities); all the OOC questions constantly in chat--yes, I sometimes turn it off because of the questions that are answered by actually reading the Stickys and FAQs (where do I go, what do I do, how come I have so far to travel...put a sock in it and play the game(s) for once); Posturing; elitism in groups. Although most games today look the same, one constant remains--elitist players who God Mode through with stacked groups instead of actually using tactics and, lord forbid, real team work instead of--Bob, take the aggro, Jed heal the dps, I'll just sit here and type making judgments about how yawl aren't doing your parts. Yeah, put a sock in those attitudes as well. People worry too much about "special gear" and reaching top level as soon as possible. I am playing through the story, side quests afterwards, and gearing in a variety of ways that keep my critters strong (best chest armor--and the coolest looking--was found in a chest from treasure hunting). While I agree about character customization--didn't I just see that guy with a beard?--the rest of the crying needs to stop. I prefer sandbox games, but find SW:TOR a good replacement. I find the stories--yup, test ran all the classes except Republic Soldier--intersting. Bounty Hunter is super great; SW story, getting...interesting (those of you on Balmorra and know that Darth woman know [winkwink]). Play the game; give it a real shot; leave the console-player attitude at the door.

[Shadysketchy]

Everything the OP says is in direct relation to what WoW has because of whinners

 

Right

 

WoW has a Day/Night Cycle, because of "whinners"

 

It all makes sense now