If your thinking of rolling a PT for DPS, don't!

[jillun]

I'm not bragging or trolling. To say that PT is worthless for PvP (which includes both ranked and unranked, in case you didn't know that), is a flat out lie and blowing the situation way out of proportion. it just so happens that I play AP and prefer it...for no other reason but the fact I enjoy it more. So, my experience with AP greatly outpaces my experience with Pyro. I've never quite cared for a "one trick" pony, which in my opinion Pyro has been since launch. But that's neither here nor there, my point is...there's plenty of viability in all three specs, Pyro just isn't OP anymore. Look at my sig, do I really have to explain to you why i'd use AP as an example when debating the viability of Powertech as an advanced class???

 

 

AP is ok in wz, but what matters is rwz, because that is HIGH END CONTENT.

And again stop trolling :

 

1 The fact that you prefer one build and think it is viable (but you obviously only do PUGs) doesn't make it a reality.

2 Just tell me what does a powertech (any spec) do better than any other AC? Well nothing...

 

It doesn't mean that you won't kill baddies with your pt, I do all the time, it just means that you are not as efficient as.... anything else.

And please report me all you want, it doesn't change the facts.

 

PS : I don't care about your signature, it doesn't make you any better.

Edited June 20, 2013 by jillun

[Ottoattack]

I didn't say Pyro was a faceroll spec...my assertion is that in its previous incarnation many players were using it as a crutch. It's far from faceroll at this point in time. I suppose it just boils down to playing what you enjoy, I for one enjoy AP playstyle...and have played it since very shortly after launch. I suspect that players who truly enjoy the playstyle/concept of BH, specifically Powertech, will continue to put effort into making it work. There's alot more to AP than sustained damage...i'd argue that its damage dealing capability takes a backseat to it's excellent utility.

 

No offense, nothing ever in PvP is face-roll, unless you know very well what you are doing. You are right in terms of playing down what you enjoy. I enjoyed pyro, because it was highly mobile and has burst damage. I personally do not like AP play style, especially that my least favorite skill for PT is flame thrower. But, when you are in progression raid or competitive PvP, what you like is not really important. The question is can it perform if played efficiently?

 

AP can potentially do good damage in PvE, but is not the best and has no utility. Pyro can't. Both pyro and AP are under performing PvP wise. And I do not care that you own PUG games where 90% of the population can't use their toons to 25% efficiency. Bottom line is PT is mediocre in all dps aspects. Its viable, but an equally skilled and geared dps from a couple of other classes can significantly outperform PT.

[Sardonyyx]

Most definitely Otto, they need to adress the nerfs, and fix AP so it's not so scatterbrained. I really feel like that's the last tree they made before they were trying to rush the game out and they messed it up a lot. Is not smooth, you have a GCD of awkwardness waiting for all of your 15 second CDs to come up, so...more FB spamming? No thanks. I'll just play my sniper and have better survivability and damage.

[crewthiefthor]

AP is ok in wz, but what matters is rwz, because that is HIGH END CONTENT.

And again stop trolling :

 

1 The fact that you prefer one build and think it is viable (but you obviously only do PUGs) doesn't make it a reality.

2 Just tell me what does a powertech (any spec) do better than any other AC? Well nothing...

 

It doesn't mean that you won't kill baddies with your pt, I do all the time, it just means that you are not as efficient as.... anything else.

And please report me all you want, it doesn't change the facts.

 

PS : I don't care about your signature, it doesn't make you any better.

 

You completely missed the point. Reading comprehension FTL. Kids these days...

 

P.S. You're making alot of assumptions about me...simply because you and I disagree. Grow up.

Edited June 20, 2013 by crewthiefthor

[jillun]

You completely missed the point. Reading comprehension FTL. Kids these days...

 

P.S. You're making alot of assumptions about me...simply because you and I disagree. Grow up.

 

On the contrary, I'm right on the point, you missed it.

You make absolutely no sense at all... no arguments whatsoever : kid kid kid grow up ===>GG you're too strong for me.

 

Read what Ottoattack wrote.

Edited June 20, 2013 by jillun

[crewthiefthor]

On the contrary, I'm right on the point, you missed it.

You make absolutely no sense at all... no arguments whatsoever : kid kid kid grow up ===>GG you're too strong for me.

 

Read what Ottoattack wrote.

 

Actually, it's not worth it to bother arguing with you. Continue on crying about how impotent you are on your PT.

[Aetrus]

I tried full Pyro again last night after not using it in a month. I previously held the opinion that full Pyro is a terrible solo queue spec because the damage isn't significantly better than the hybrids or AP, and it has much less defense. However, I was able to get the assassin medal against a Vigilance Guardian on one of the best ranked teams on my server (we killed each other, I killed him first but his Dispatch was already in the air and killed me just after.) I also played it badly, was getting used to a new acquire target's target hotkey and like I said, adjusting to using full Pyro again. I'm going to need to do a lot more PvP as full Pyro before I say anything else negative about them. I'm definitely much weaker than in 1.7, as well as more fragile...and I miss TD's burst a lot. But IDK. I seem to be able to outplay a lot of people still. Hopefully 2.4 will give us some love, and tone down Snipers and Smashers a bit.

[Bourk]

Full pyro is pretty viable too. It tends to get less dps than ap because it lacks the aoe but can still do some decent numbers.

 

Here's a screenshot from a fairly recent game :

http://i1076.photobucket.com/albums/w446/bourk11/Screenshot_2013-06-09_14_25_48_172549_zpsb12f0520.jpg

 

Could have been better but enemy was dying fast

[Macroeconomics]

Full pyro is pretty viable too. It tends to get less dps than ap because it lacks the aoe but can still do some decent numbers.

 

Here's a screenshot from a fairly recent game :

 

Meh. I've scored 800k plenty of times with a PT Pyro post 2.0. It would have been 1+ million on my Smash Monkey. Thing is, Smash Monkeys aren't OP. They are the only dps class in the game that can output anywhere near a healer. It's that every other dps class in the game is underpowered.

[TheRampage]

Im still having fun with my vanguard, but lets face it - broken class. Nerfed damage and no defensive abilies at all (shield at 2 min cd isnt def, it is ****). When I healer with me then I'm good beacuse he is healing me (and ignoring others so I'm actually bringing my team down ). In that case, yes, you can do some decent damage, overall, you wont beat smasher or sage, that is for sure.

 

Every other class kills me without problem. Every single one. Scoundrels or shadows usualy stunkill me, before i can even move I'm at 20%, at that point I just stand still and await for ress button

Every other class can do 7k hits without trying. I log my terribad shadow and I hit people for 7k (dont even know rotation, i spam randomly what is on cd), on smasher it is even easyer.

 

So, play it if you like it, I do, thats why it is my main since launch, but it is terrible.

[UncleOst]

I've put off developing my lil pt for long enough. When I get back to my comp next week I'm going to start acquiring partisan. Once I get a decent suit I'll be entering the galactic dueling league. I can't wait to unleash the earth crushing power that my powertech posesses.

[Brunner_Venda]

To pull decent numbers with Pyro PT, you need a healer, and you need to be really good. Otherwise you're a serious waste of a slot and drain on the team. Not kidding. You need to know what an interrupt is and use it constantly on casters. You need to mark and focus healers, and how to shut one down with interrupts, DOTS, DPS, constant stuns, and grapple. There's no excuse for running around dueling like an idiot while the other team heals up. You need to learn "target of target" and keep focusing people down with your burst. You need to use grenades, and toss seismic charges at snipers every time they get into position to peel them off of your healer. You need to never catch yourself off-sides (and in the middle of five enemies) all because you wanted to chase a kill, because you will never survive it with pyro. You need to be BETTER than your average bouncing DPS derp. Even if you are that good, I guarantee you would do better as a sin or mara.

 

You'll usually pull more damage and kills with pyro than AP if you play it right. But AP will always be the better spec to survive an attack, defend a node, run a ball, cap an objective, or get where you're supposed to be quickly with it's better mobility. AP can kill a sin, mara, or a sniper in a duel as well, because of the energy shield, redoubt proc, and re-braced armor. The problem is, I just can't get over the 15 second immolate/rail CD, and the fact that the spec can't break 5K in any attack. That's broken. I don't give a flying **** if you say otherwise, when other classes can chain stun or cycle force sweep and dispatch back to back. B-R-O-K-E-N. The AP spec is a DPS spec without the DPS, the main two attacks need a shorter CD, and rail needs to pack more armor penetration.

[Brunner_Venda]

Meh. I've scored 800k plenty of times with a PT Pyro post 2.0. It would have been 1+ million on my Smash Monkey. Thing is, Smash Monkeys aren't OP. They are the only dps class in the game that can output anywhere near a healer. It's that every other dps class in the game is underpowered.

 

If I had to fix pyro, I would start with the top tier skills. None of them are close to as good as AP, thus most of you out there are running hybrids, because you HAVE to..

 

1. Give a little more of our armor pen back for rail shot with the top-tier bracer skill. Pyro doesn't get auto-crit like AP. Make the bracer skill worth having.

2. Fix thermal det into something worth having, it should do as much damage up-front as immolate. It's on the same CD, so why should ours do less up front, and then run a stupid 12 second DOT that everyone just cleanses in three?

3. Buff automated defenses. "Kolto Overload" is the worst "press this and die anyways" button, because if only works when your health is already in "please everyone execute me now!" territory.

 

* AP's Energy rebounder gets a small chance to fire a redoubt proc while you're getting shot that absorbs a little damage, and it works for what, six out of every ten seconds?. It also reduces the CD on the energy shield, making it awesome.

 

* Why not let automated defenses give us a small chance to HEAL a little bit if you get shot in addition to reducing the CD on kolto overload? Would a 389 tick every second for three seconds with a ten second internal CD be too much? Take whatever the redoubt proc can ABSORB, and give it to us back in HEALTH.

 

There, that's three skills worth having at the top of the pyro tree. Hybrid specs filling up with bottom skills in other trees should never out-DPS the full &%@#ing DPS tree. Sorry Bioware. Fix this garbage.

[Aetrus]

Meh. I've scored 800k plenty of times with a PT Pyro post 2.0. It would have been 1+ million on my Smash Monkey. Thing is, Smash Monkeys aren't OP. They are the only dps class in the game that can output anywhere near a healer. It's that every other dps class in the game is underpowered.

 

Rage/Focus is mostly definitely broken. Maybe not individually, but because of the way Smash works, it is. That's why every good ranked team runs 2 Smashers. Because Double Smash is simply too much pressure to heal up. If Smash did full damage to the main target, and lets say 60% to surrounding targets, it wouldn't be a problem. As it is now, it's impossible to deal with. The attack hits even when you strafe around directly behind them, with no LoS. What other attack in the game does that?? There's zero counterplay to Smash other than "don't group up n00b," which isn't possible on maps like Novare, playing the old meta on Hypergate, and frequently on Voidstar.

 

And healers need to output far more healing than a DPS needs to output damage. There are usually 2 healers and 4 DPSers. :\

 

I agree with what Brunner says though. You can still make Pyro work, but you have to be a very good player to do so. And even then, whatever you're able to do with a PT, you could do better on another class. DPS Sorc does the same job as a Pyrotech. They both have a pull for utility, they're both primarily a dot-based consistent pressure class with a longer TTK than some other classes...but sorcs have many more defensive abilities, the safety of doing their damage from 30-35m away, and off-healing utility.

Edited June 21, 2013 by Aetrus

[Kaos_KidSWTOR]

Ok, i have a 53 Vanguard Tank and a 21 Powertech DPS (AP DPS) and i dont see ANY issues with PT DPS... i think its all a matter of Learn to play and learn to gear properly and your fine.

[TheronFett]

Been awhile since I've posted in the PT forums. I've been playing this class since beta, and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone with more experience playing all 3 trees.

 

Shieldtech is fine. It's gimped compared to Jugg tank, but then again, Jugg is OP in all its forms. 'Sin tanks took a serious nosedive in PvP, so we're smack dab in the middle as far as I'm concerned.

 

AP is still crap. The rotation is wonky, the DPS is mediocre, and too reliant on PFT. If you're topping DPS charts as AP, it's because you're playing against idiots.

 

Pyro is still where it's at. But I agree with the above posters, sissies need not apply. You have to know this class inside and out to make it work now, but the potential is still there. Still squishy, but now minus 85% of the previous burst and 1v1 potential. If you're a FOTM re-roller, pack your bags and head home now if you haven't already.

[crewthiefthor]

Been awhile since I've posted in the PT forums. I've been playing this class since beta, and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone with more experience playing all 3 trees.

 

Shieldtech is fine. It's gimped compared to Jugg tank, but then again, Jugg is OP in all its forms. 'Sin tanks took a serious nosedive in PvP, so we're smack dab in the middle as far as I'm concerned.

 

AP is still crap. The rotation is wonky, the DPS is mediocre, and too reliant on PFT. If you're topping DPS charts as AP, it's because you're playing against idiots.

 

Pyro is still where it's at. But I agree with the above posters, sissies need not apply. You have to know this class inside and out to make it work now, but the potential is still there. Still squishy, but now minus 85% of the previous burst and 1v1 potential. If you're a FOTM re-roller, pack your bags and head home now if you haven't already.

 

To each his own. I enjoy AP play style and do fine with it, and definitely DO NOT think it's crap.

[Hizoka]

Been awhile since I've posted in the PT forums. I've been playing this class since beta, and you'd be hard pressed to find anyone with more experience playing all 3 trees.

 

Shieldtech is fine. It's gimped compared to Jugg tank, but then again, Jugg is OP in all its forms. 'Sin tanks took a serious nosedive in PvP, so we're smack dab in the middle as far as I'm concerned.

 

AP is still crap. The rotation is wonky, the DPS is mediocre, and too reliant on PFT. If you're topping DPS charts as AP, it's because you're playing against idiots.

 

Pyro is still where it's at. But I agree with the above posters, sissies need not apply. You have to know this class inside and out to make it work now, but the potential is still there. Still squishy, but now minus 85% of the previous burst and 1v1 potential. If you're a FOTM re-roller, pack your bags and head home now if you haven't already.

 

One of the best powertech DPS in the world is AP and none of the top powertech DPS play pyro.

 

SOrry but if you think AP DPS is "mediocre" then you are doing it wrong plain and simple. Just because you cannot make it work doesn't mean all the players out there far beyond your skill level can't make it work.

 

But thanks for posting that you have no clue what going on.

[TheronFett]

But thanks for posting that you have no clue what going on.

 

Don't give me your internet hero ********. Days like this make me yearn for cross-server queues. I can make AP "work" just fine. My personal opinion is that it's still an incomplete spec. As Pyro, there's not a single AP who will beat me. Not once, not ever. Not in 1v1, not in top damage...never happened. But you forum warriors go right on ahead and keep on truckin' with AP if it makes you happy.

 

Oh, and for the record, that top DPS in the world on paper stuff means exactly zero. Any moron can gear up and smack a training dummy around after optimizing his rotation. You wanna play in a real scenario? Come find me. We'll dance.

Edited June 21, 2013 by TheronFett

[Brunner_Venda]

Ok, i have a 53 Vanguard Tank and a 21 Powertech DPS (AP DPS) and i dont see ANY issues with PT DPS... i think its all a matter of Learn to play and learn to gear properly and your fine.

 

I just cut myself off from a long flame post, and decided to be nice.

 

You're welcome.

 

I'll just say this: pre-55 PVP is irrelevant. You're playing with many inexperienced people playing classes that don't yet have their top level 51+ abilities. When they get them, it's an entitely different game, and in 55+ PVP, premade groups of experienced ranked players will tear you apart.

[Brunner_Venda]

One of the best powertech DPS in the world is AP and none of the top powertech DPS play pyro.

 

SOrry but if you think AP DPS is "mediocre" then you are doing it wrong plain and simple. Just because you cannot make it work doesn't mean all the players out there far beyond your skill level can't make it work.

 

But thanks for posting that you have no clue what going on.

 

Show me your 6K damage medals - earned without picking up the battlefield damage power-up. It's possible but it's hard. Pyro gets them every single round without fail. Hell, I get 6K crits every other rotation.

 

Ouch. Sorry. Had to go there. That's my ONLY problem with the spec. Believe me when I say that I love it, there's nothing more fun than punching people in the face with retractable blade.

 

My issue: The two big damage moves are on 15 second cooldowns (too long!) and the damage of these abilities usually hit for 4.5K (not enough!). If you're lucky, have stacked surge, and grab a powerup, you'll get a 5K shot in PVP.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Brunner_Venda

[Ottoattack]

Show me your 6K damage medals - earned without picking up the battlefield damage power-up. It's possible but it's hard. Pyro gets them every single round without fail. Hell, I get 6K crits every other rotation.

 

Ouch. Sorry. Had to go there. That's my ONLY problem with the spec. Believe me when I say that I love it, there's nothing more fun than punching people in the face with retractable blade.

 

My issue: The two big damage moves are on 15 second cooldowns (too long!) and the damage of these abilities usually hit for 4.5K (not enough!). If you're lucky, have stacked surge, and grab a powerup, you'll get a 5K shot in PVP.

 

As a starter Hizoka is PvE player so whatever he says for PvP is not of high value. He maybe be the best AP PT ever PvE wise, but that is not relevant, because PvP dps does not revolve around rotation, which PvE dps is all about. No ranked team in their right mind would take PT. Pyro still has some burst, but its not enough and the survivability is way to low. Shield tech is fun and all, but Immortal Jugg is much better group tank. AP in PvP wise is actually still the worst PvP spec. It has better survivability than pyro, but has no burst, so you can go all game and spam 2-3K atks, but that won't matter in securing objectives.

[Marb]

I can't comment on PvP, but for anyone comparing PT's to maras and snipers that's not even a fair comparison, they do dps that is in a tier of its own, well above most AC's. Comparing the top end performance of PT to say juggernaut and assassins, it doesn't look as bad (this is real fight performance, not hand picked dummy parses).

 

For example vengeance can parse 2.9k on a dummy but doesn't get anywhere near that on styrak. I mean a full pt pyro can parse 2500 on that fight so its not even a question of spec. For pve damage, PT's are better then assassins, who are currently the lowest dps AC in the game. PT's are viable, but are straying away from the top tier performers by well over 500dps, which is far too much. If bioware are intent on sticking with NiM dreadguards in their current form, yes PT's and assassins wont be viable for that fight without skipping them and getting gear.

Edited June 22, 2013 by Marb

[TheronFett]

This is an AoE and DoT class. It has its place in any group, PvE or PvP, with a proper team composition. Pyro or AP make an excellent compliment to a Lethality or Engineering Sniper for example. PT has always excelled at clearing groups, be it DPS or tanking. That's just our niche in the group.

 

PvE content isn't that difficult to clear in this game, so as far as I'm concerned, any class in any spec is viable to complete it...with perhaps the exception of DPS Operative, which has been nerfed hard for a long time. In Operations, I will almost always run AP because the sustained damage is higher. Some bosses I will switch to Pyro just because the uptime is better w/ all the DoTs when you have to run around a lot.

 

Personally, I don't put much stock in dummy parses. Those are under the most ideal and controlled conditions possible, and not an accurate measure of DPS potential. Not in my book. Very few instances allow you to have 100% uptime and max efficiency on your rotation.

Edited June 22, 2013 by TheronFett

[Aetrus]

AP in PvP wise is actually still the worst PvP spec. It has better survivability than pyro, but has no burst, so you can go all game and spam 2-3K atks, but that won't matter in securing objectives.

 

Yeah AP is fine in regs. I like it and ran it for a while. I usually pulled slightly less damage than when running Pyro, but I died less and usually ended up with more solo kills. AP is great 1v1. I like dueling, and I don't like dying. So there's the allure. But I've only seen 1 AP PT in ranked on my server. Rated is all about burst, and AP has none. I like chaining back-to-back-to-back 5k hits, followed a few GCDs later with 3 stack Flamethrower. Nice, consistent pressure. But completely irrelevant against a competent ranked team. Definitely not the same 'oh ****' pressure as full Pyro. Even though Pyro's burst is also total **** and TTK in both specs is far too long.