Why did Jeff Hickman lie to subscribers about the future of the game?

[Fuse_AQM]

Well I have a different view of PS2. The only area I am disappointed in is the releasing of weapons that are op.

 

If you look at the progress that has come directly from player input over the 6 months of release the rapid development is unprecedented.

 

I have over 100 days playtime in PS2 and have played all 3 factions the unbalance just isn't there,.

 

Over-all they are balanced, but in individual areas they each have issues that need to be addressed. There still is no meta game at all, and that's what sets PS2 apart. BF3 and Arma can simulate large scale combat. Planetside is supposed to do more.

[KrayVinDark]

like i said they can spin it any way they want in my eyes it is not a expansion.

 

doesn't matter what they want to call it. they can put a picture of a dog up on the site and call it a parakeet. doesn't change the fact that it's a dog.

 

True, but if they named the dog A Parakeet, guess what, it's a parakeet. Just because your perception differs from theirs doesn't mean that they're wrong.

[Tekeda]

Over-all they are balanced, but in individual areas they each have issues that need to be addressed. There still is no meta game at all, and that's what sets PS2 apart. BF3 and Arma can simulate large scale combat. Planetside is supposed to do more.

I agree about the meta and the fact that it is repetitive is why I play much less then I used to.

 

But when I made PS2 an example I was talking about the communication and changes made directly tied to player input.

Now you may say that that Reddit is bad or that they use 3rd party sites to communicate but what you will have a problem finding is a dev team that communicates better or even attempts it.

 

You see updates and screen shots of future items UI changes and gameplay updates LITERALLY every single day from the PS2 team. Name any other game that does this.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Tekeda

[Fuse_AQM]

True, but if they named the dog A Parakeet, guess what, it's a parakeet. Just because your perception differs from theirs doesn't mean that they're wrong.

 

No, a dog named "A Parakeet" is still a dog. Just like a store page that says I get full access to character creation is still full of crap.

[Shingara]

We got our answer to your signature. They're going with their action over their words. However, they also alluded to something changing based on feedback so I guess we'll have to wait to see what that is.

 

Communication has occurred, they've stated their intent, reset our expectations, and now it's probably time to react and move on from this topic.

 

Nah bud, this is warhammer all over again, they say stuff just to hold you back, make you think ow ye must have been a mistake, no mistake this is history repeating itself.

[Quraswren]

SNIP...

 

Separately....

.....props to Eric for posting in this nasty themed thread. Unfortunately, all it did was make the complainers complain louder.

 

It's good he posted as I think many didn't think they would. (or anyone for that matter)

 

On a positive note for gamers though, BW deserved all the complaints.

 

It's a win/win.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Quraswren

[Shingara]

Separately....

.....props to Eric for posting in this nasty themed thread. Unfortunately, all it did was make the complainers complain louder.

 

Eric drops into the thread say ow no we didnt say that, i mean no no no of course we didnt mean that, what got put onto the website never got checked, double checked and then checked again so it was correct. hell its only the person in charge of the game. Why should he know what he is on about.

 

If you beleive a word of what eric said then pfft. I mean in a few months they can come back and say ow no we didnt mean that either, and they they will announce something but ow no we didnt mean what you thought, i know we wrote it specificlay about one specific thing but nah we mean something completly different now.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Shingara

[PariahMessiah]

If the OP Truly wanted to make this point this would have been brought up the instant Makeb was mentioned as a separate purchase.

 

 

But at least theres an EA response that boils down to "**** you, LOL"

[WookieIsshe]

We can buy two random dye packs each month! In a year, maybe we can buy enough packs to get the dye we actually want. In just a short 7 years, you can have your entire armor set recolored from your monthly stipend!

 

You DO realize that you can buy the ONE dye pack, put it in your chest piece and then match color to chest piece for the rest of your armor. Your argument is dead on arrival.

[Arkerus]

That's not what the dye packs, or cartel packs are there for. Eric was referring to the various customization unlocks released in 2.1

 

All those dyes and all those pack contents will be up on the GTN, courtesty of players who like buying and opening kits/packs and who are not averse to spending for coins. Some people like buying and spending coins, some do not. I personally do not, but I understand others do. In any event, in a very large player base It's a symbiotic relationship, courtesy of Bioware making all the stuff tradeable (unlike some other MMOs that make it all bind on aquire).

 

TL;DR save your coins for actual unlocks of things for your account. If you want to buy dye kits or cartel packs.. that your choice too.. but don't complain about the random nature of them, when the contents will be up on the GTN in volume.

 

Separately....

.....props to Eric for posting in this nasty themed thread. Unfortunately, all it did was make the complainers complain louder.

 

People conveniently forget that next to EVERYTHING can be purchased with in game credits (as long as there are sellers).

 

Almost every single silly argument can be countered with "I see it on the galactic market right now". Some things are absurdly priced but it also drives rarity and some kind of prestige. Shoot, people always whine and complain how there is no rarity. So they make some things rare and hard to get...and people complain.

[DarthDymond]

So because everyone is getting so riled up over 2.1, the next time they've got a few Cartel Market-based features ready to go that people have been asking for, and are really excited to see implemented, they will hold them back until they can be released at the same time as some non-CM stuff.

 

How things went this time:

Major Content patch --> 4 weeks later: release a Cartel Market patch --> 4 weeks more (still at the 8 week cycle): release a Content patch

 

How it'll go next time:

Content patch --> 4 weeks later: Don't dare release the CM stuff, people will bite our heads off for it --> wait 4 weeks more: release the Content patch along with the CM stuff we could have released 4 weeks ago.

[DarthTHC]

I didn't forget that at all. I'm saying they could have held it back and released the two together. Would it have been possible to combine the two? Only they can answer it but I don't see why not. They could have updated the back end stuff like adding the dye slots to gear, changes to the tooltips (that look awful), and the placeholder for the kiosk etc. in advance of the patch if it would have helped. But I think it was a poor decision on their part to release such a huge CM update by itself regardless of where in the cycle it fell.

 

Yeah, sometimes it's really tough to release two different things produced largely by two different teams on two different schedules, together.

[DarthTHC]

Nah bud, this is warhammer all over again, they say stuff just to hold you back, make you think ow ye must have been a mistake, no mistake this is history repeating itself.

 

That's all well and good. When I'm unhappy with the value I'm getting for my $15/month, they'll stop getting it. This month, they get it.

[Arkose_Sands]

No a poor choice of wording is, well it might rain then it doesnt, telling people to keep subscribing and they will get the same service as pre f2p and then doing the opposite is lying. its bait and switch. Its fraud.

 

You crossed the line and possibly broken the law, asa have been informed so we shall see.

 

If you are truly sorry give out refunds for subs not yet used and cartel coins in account not given via subs loyalty scheme.

 

But, subscribers do get the same service as before free-to-play went into effect. The Cartel Market did not exist before the free-to-play patch. Stop pestering the American Society of Anesthesiologists or the ASA as you call them! They have better things to do than listen to patch 2.1.0 rabble.

[Tekeda]

Yeah, sometimes it's really tough to release two different things produced largely by two different teams on two different schedules, together.

 

So name the last 2 content updates that subscribers got that they didn't have to pay for.

 

I have asked this question twice and no one has given an answer.

 

Also tell me how we are a year and a half into release and basic things like an ability activating when you push the button are still bugged.

 

This game is not improving they are just finding ways to more efficiently extract your money from pocket.

 

If the Starwars ip was not attached to this game how many of you would still play?

[decoyofham]

Its no different than any of the other MMO's out there that try to balance out the f2p (micropayment) option of gameplay.

Usually by that time, the in game store takes a precedence because that is where a number of the revenue seems to come from. At least Bioware have not started selling stat boosters or datacrons, or such yet via the Cartel Store, like I have seen some MMOs do.

 

Here's a radical thought. Instead of ************ about it repetitively like a broken record, protest where it counts... Stop spending cartel coins. Convince your friends who play to stop spending cartel coins if you like. Or at least to stop spending cartel coins on that thing you have an issue with. I suspect the many people who no doubt have availed themselves with the cosmetic vendor have validated EA's decision to charge for it many times over by now.

[Hizoka]

Hey folks,

 

I will just be as honest as I can here, it was a poor choice in wording on our part. I know that players have made decisions around whether to remain a subscriber based on those words which makes it all that much more sensitive. I apologize if you feel that you were misled by what we said in that blog. Since this blog I feel we have been more consistent in our messaging that you can expect things like cosmetic and convenience features (like Appearance Designer) are the types of things we usually place on the Cartel Market.

 

It has always been our plan that as new content is released,(such as Flashpoints, Operations, in-game events, daily hubs, etc.) that subscribers will get access to these pieces of content. This is unlike a free-2-play player who will need to purchase access to that content. This is why we stated subscribers gained "unlimited" access to that content, because you get that as a part of your subscription.

 

For Cartel Market items, you have access to purchase all of them, as do F2P players. What sets you folks apart is your monthly stipend which will allow you to purchase those features at no additional cost should you choose. I realize with your stipend, and with all the features we have, you may not be able to get it all at once but you can get it in time as a subscriber.

 

With that being said we have definitely heard your frustrations around Game Updates and the value you feel as a subscriber. I don't have details today but we are continuing to look at options moving forward to make sure that you don't feel that way.

 

-eric

all i got to say about that last part is its going to be a bold face lie. MANY suggestions have been put out there for you to actually show you give a damn about the subscribers, yet you do NOTHING for them. You falsely advertize how the collections system would work and now you say it was a wording error... that is a load of crap. The words were "You can give a revan mask to all your alts on any server though the collections if you already own one" no where did you say only iuf you have all the other preices to an ultimatly bugged and ugly looking set.

 

Subscribers should not only get at least double what we get for a monthly amount of coins EVERYTHING on the market should be at great discount for subbers.

[spectreclees]

Hey folks,

 

I will just be as honest as I can here, it was a poor choice in wording on our part. I know that players have made decisions around whether to remain a subscriber based on those words which makes it all that much more sensitive. I apologize if you feel that you were misled by what we said in that blog. Since this blog I feel we have been more consistent in our messaging that you can expect things like cosmetic and convenience features (like Appearance Designer) are the types of things we usually place on the Cartel Market.

 

It has always been our plan that as new content is released,(such as Flashpoints, Operations, in-game events, daily hubs, etc.) that subscribers will get access to these pieces of content. This is unlike a free-2-play player who will need to purchase access to that content. This is why we stated subscribers gained "unlimited" access to that content, because you get that as a part of your subscription.

 

For Cartel Market items, you have access to purchase all of them, as do F2P players. What sets you folks apart is your monthly stipend which will allow you to purchase those features at no additional cost should you choose. I realize with your stipend, and with all the features we have, you may not be able to get it all at once but you can get it in time as a subscriber.

 

With that being said we have definitely heard your frustrations around Game Updates and the value you feel as a subscriber. I don't have details today but we are continuing to look at options moving forward to make sure that you don't feel that way.

 

-eric

 

This took some guts to post. Much respect, Eric.

[LordArtemis]

Howdy, folks. Cory Butler here to follow-up on some of your concerns that have been surfacing in the forums and on social media sites around Game Update 2.1: Customization. First, it's important to know that 2.1 will not affect the cadence of our game update schedule. 2.1 was the second half of our Cartel Market implementation plan. So, do not expect to see this type of Market-driven update on a regular basis. This release was comprised almost entirely of cosmetic options that have no impact on combat balance or gameplay. Vanity modifications are the kinds of things, in general, that we’ve always planned to offer in the Cartel Market for purchase by all players and in some cases, like with Appearance Designer changes, discounted for subscribers -- having said that, we’ve heard some frustration from subscribers that, even with these kinds of offerings, we ought to do more to recognize subscriber status. We hear you loud and clear. Please stay tuned.

 

To continue on the point of content cadence, I know in a separate post Eric discussed a bit about our cadence and that our plan is for all of you to see content within an 8-week window from Rise of the Hutt Cartel’s launch, I would recommend reading his post for more details, here. What I do want to do is assure you that we have many more things in the works here at BioWare that aren’t Cartel Market features, and are the exact types of content you folks have been asking about. I cannot go into specifics yet but we are definitely working on things like new Flashpoints, Operations, daily hubs, events, PvP, and even the super-secret space project! Game Update 2.1 is just one of the many Updates you will get from us this year and I am really excited about what is still to come and I think you will be too.

 

Until next time -- see you in-game!

 

Hey folks,

 

I will just be as honest as I can here, it was a poor choice in wording on our part. I know that players have made decisions around whether to remain a subscriber based on those words which makes it all that much more sensitive. I apologize if you feel that you were misled by what we said in that blog. Since this blog I feel we have been more consistent in our messaging that you can expect things like cosmetic and convenience features (like Appearance Designer) are the types of things we usually place on the Cartel Market.

 

It has always been our plan that as new content is released,(such as Flashpoints, Operations, in-game events, daily hubs, etc.) that subscribers will get access to these pieces of content. This is unlike a free-2-play player who will need to purchase access to that content. This is why we stated subscribers gained "unlimited" access to that content, because you get that as a part of your subscription.

 

For Cartel Market items, you have access to purchase all of them, as do F2P players. What sets you folks apart is your monthly stipend which will allow you to purchase those features at no additional cost should you choose. I realize with your stipend, and with all the features we have, you may not be able to get it all at once but you can get it in time as a subscriber.

 

With that being said we have definitely heard your frustrations around Game Updates and the value you feel as a subscriber. I don't have details today but we are continuing to look at options moving forward to make sure that you don't feel that way.

 

-eric

 

It's good to see you guys talk about this. I personally appreciate the dialog. Despite some of the rhetoric, it is my hope that you recognize that the appeal of a sub has been diminished a bit without a sub gate...the discounts help, but not enough IMO.

 

Either better discounts, a way to purchase the features with EC or, IMO the best option, allow subscribers (only subscribers) to earn a small capped amount of CC by participating in in-game activities, especially those that are under utilized and need promotion.

 

I pointed out that I felt it was perhaps that he misspoke, and that you guys should probably form official statement guidelines with talking points that you can stick to. Any changes can update the list, but you stick to the official list.

 

I look forward to seeing what you come up with.

Edited May 17, 2013 by LordArtemis

[xorcist]

Did you have to pay to download patch 2.1? No? OK then.

 

ITS ONE FREAKING PATCH! You seriously need to relax. If you are this upset, you should vote with your wallet. Quit and move on.

 

They said all along that cosmetic fluff items will be Cartel Market. This patch has mostly cosmetic fluff items, and guess what? Some of them involve the Cartel Market. I really don't see what the problem is here.

 

Icebergy,

In addition to the other replies you got to the quoted post above. I will also quote the following person in response to your argument. It also applies to you, and is more than fitting to explain what the problem is here.

Enjoy.

 

My thoughts as posted in another thread:

 

I like this game and want it to succeed. Customers are voicing their concerns in droves. I know most will die off after the initial frustration wears off.. however change after change after change on a whim in order to "nickle and dime" people is a bad business model.

 

Most will simply leave without voicing a concern on the forums. That is what scares me. The few on these forums that defend everything the company does to the point it seems like they are looking through rose colored glasses are doing a disservice to the game and they don't even realize it.

 

There will come a time when enough people have reached whatever line in the sand they have set for themselves and they will simply leave. Then all of these people defending every move BW makes will be left with no game at all.

 

That is also why anyone who uses the argument " if you don't like then leave" is truly a moron.... These people would not be on these forums complaining if they did not like the game ( at least the vast majority of them) They want to see the game get better and yet there are a few people on here who drop this line on anyone who has anything negative to say regarding anything. To them I say be careful what you wish for....

[Tekeda]

Hey folks,

 

I will just be as honest as I can here, it was a poor choice in wording on our part. I know that players have made decisions around whether to remain a subscriber based on those words which makes it all that much more sensitive. I apologize if you feel that you were misled by what we said in that blog. Since this blog I feel we have been more consistent in our messaging that you can expect things like cosmetic and convenience features (like Appearance Designer) are the types of things we usually place on the Cartel Market.

 

It has always been our plan that as new content is released,(such as Flashpoints, Operations, in-game events, daily hubs, etc.) that subscribers will get access to these pieces of content. This is unlike a free-2-play player who will need to purchase access to that content. This is why we stated subscribers gained "unlimited" access to that content, because you get that as a part of your subscription.

 

For Cartel Market items, you have access to purchase all of them, as do F2P players. What sets you folks apart is your monthly stipend which will allow you to purchase those features at no additional cost should you choose. I realize with your stipend, and with all the features we have, you may not be able to get it all at once but you can get it in time as a subscriber.

 

With that being said we have definitely heard your frustrations around Game Updates and the value you feel as a subscriber. I don't have details today but we are continuing to look at options moving forward to make sure that you don't feel that way.

 

-eric

 

So when do you plan on fixing issues with abilities stuttering incurring the global cooldown without activating and animations activating with out the accompanying ability firing???? I left a year ago came back and the SAME issues are still here. These are basic combat mechanics if you can't fix these I have little faith in anything you have to say.

 

Not to mention that the last true content update an expansion( and I use the term loosely when talking about ROTHC) was also something that required subscribers to purchase.

 

What were the last 2 content updates of any significance that did not require additional payment out of a subscribers pocket?

Edited May 17, 2013 by Tekeda

[Shingara]

But, subscribers do get the same service as before free-to-play went into effect. The Cartel Market did not exist before the free-to-play patch. Stop pestering the American Society of Anesthesiologists or the ASA as you call them! They have better things to do than listen to patch 2.1.0 rabble.

 

do we hell, you know what we get over preffered players, operations runs, thats it. they can do everything else, get runs even though limited, can by pass with ingame credits and if they spend the same ammount of money on cartel coins as subscribers pay in subs a year they get 22000 coins a year, far outstripping us and thus more of this so called content we have an unlimted access too. We get 7200 coins a year which is nearly the same as one hypercrate or 12 mounts in the collections, have to keep paying through content draughts and tiny discount on cc stuff.

 

You do the math. cos when we pay for a patch they get it free.

 

And asa are for false advertising, this is exactly what hickman did.

Edited May 17, 2013 by Shingara

[DarthTHC]

So name the last 2 content updates that subscribers got that they didn't have to pay for.

 

I have asked this question twice and no one has given an answer.

 

Also tell me how we are a year and a half into release and basic things like an ability activating when you push the button are still bugged.

 

This game is not improving they are just finding ways to more efficiently extract your money from pocket.

 

If the Starwars ip was not attached to this game how many of you would still play?

 

Probably because it's sporadic and client machine specific. Never happens to some. Hard to find & fix issues like that.

 

I would still play if it wasn't "Star Wars" but I don't know if I'd play if it was fantasy.

[desertwolph]

I really hoped EA would change their ways towards their customers, but i guess the "worst company" label is spot on.

 

Well, it's not like they were voted worst company more than once by accident. They earned it.

[Tekeda]

Probably because it's sporadic and client machine specific. Never happens to some. Hard to find & fix issues like that.

 

I would still play if it wasn't "Star Wars" but I don't know if I'd play if it was fantasy.

Thats funny I played on a AMD machine at launch I have upgraded to I7 3600 and still have the same issues with a new PC.

 

And yes it is their fault that they haven't fixed them. This is the only MMO I have ever played that can't get the push button ability works thing right.

 

But keep on keepin on bro nothing to see here move along game is fine.