Andryah Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) And the 350k number was proposed by some community members, following the sub losses from peak backward all the way before the staff Armageddon and the launch of F2P/Market. It is an assumed number knowing the prior loss rate announced by EA...which of course were usually not concrete numbers to begin with. True.. but that was the usual negative smoke an mirrors forum stuff more then anything else. Not even analysts were pushing that number around. We will never know the details of the rebound numbers on the game.. only quarterly brush strokes like what is coming out in the call. Edited May 7, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRoamer Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 500k is half a million all day you know And the 350k number was proposed by some community members, following the sub losses from peak backward all the way before the staff Armageddon and the launch of F2P/Market. It is an assumed number knowing the prior loss rate announced by EA...which of course were usually not concrete numbers to begin with. Oops, sorry, I read your post wrong, I missed the word "were". I thought you were saying we were actually at 350k. Apologies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) 500k subs after one year is not the best ''growth'' ever. I'm very happy that Bioware is making a SW game for the new trilogy, this said. Edited May 7, 2013 by Angedechu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRoamer Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Oh my... Indeed... I'm listening to this live (it's still going) so I'll have to check the transcript but from memory they were talking about Bioware working on a new single player game. As far as I remember they said it as if the game has already been in development before this new deal was announced. 500k subs after one year is not the best ''growth'' ever. Who said that? Edited May 7, 2013 by DaRoamer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) 500k subs after one year is not the best ''growth'' ever. All that counts anymore is average revenue per active account. This is the standard of measure for non-sub only MMOs Angedechu. Revenue DOUBLED, if I understood earlier comment here correctly. Sub numbers became secondary as soon as the game went F2P. It's still an important internal measure for them as it is used to keep track of conversion rates and movement rates in and out of the game, but that's about it. And some players still fixate on sub numbers or course. Edited May 7, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Imagine a game like Mass Effect, but set in the Thrawn campaign ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pietrastor Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) They also stated that Bioware is already working on a new Star Wars game. Urhm what?? How?! Both Edmonton teams are busy with big projects, the 1st one (old Mass Effect team) works on a new IP while the second team works on Dragon Age 3. Montreal only just grew into a full team and they're busy with Mass Effect 4. Austin works on TOR and didn't have any massive hirings. So who's working on that? Or did EA canned the new IP in favor of Star Wars game... 500k subs after one year is not the best ''growth'' ever..Well duh. But they actually managed to stop the subs number from plummeting to sub-100k numbers in less than a year unlike tons of other MMOs never managed to. This 500k seems quite stable now, it's similar to what was said in mid 2012. And then there's all the new F2P players who bring revenue as well Edited May 7, 2013 by Pietrastor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuixupu Posted May 7, 2013 Author Share Posted May 7, 2013 Imagine a game like Mass Effect, but set in the Thrawn campaign ! That would be just too awesome to ever be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Urhm what?? How?! Both Edmonton teams are busy with big projects, the 1st one (old Mass Effect team) works on a new IP while the second team works on Dragon Age 3. Montreal only just grew into a full team and they're busy with Mass Effect 4. Austin works on TOR and didn't have any massive hirings. So who's working on that? Or did EA canned the new IP in favor of Star Wars game... Early work does not require a large studio effort you know. In fact, the reverse is often true.. small team working quietly to architect the framework and review it ahead of even an IP license being signed. It would be a precusor in fact to getting a license, often performed under a Letter of Intent between parties. Edited May 7, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Well, considering that Disney made a very credible Black Widow in the Avengers, you can hope for a decent Mara Jade game one day. (I still think that a Mara Jade game would blow out of the water any Boba Fettesque escapade. Mysteries of the Sith FTW) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRoamer Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Urhm what?? How?! Both Edmonton teams are busy with big projects, the 1st one (old Mass Effect team) works on a new IP while the second team works on Dragon Age 3. Montreal only just grew into a full team and they're busy with Mass Effect 4. Austin works on TOR and didn't have any massive hirings. So who's working on that? Or did EA canned the new IP in favor of Star Wars game... No idea, that's just what I heard. I don't think I misheard him but I guess wait for the transcript? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levity Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Well, this should silence the majority of the "SWTOR IS FAILING! SKY IS FALLIN!" crowd. And for those of you who are thinking, "BUT F2PERS DONT SPEND MONEY!", two words: Cartel Coins. Three more? They buy them. No ones saying they don't, but I guarantee % wise, subscribers spending on CCs is bringing in more revenue then the F2P guys. I know 3 people in my guild a lone that spned 200 + dollars a month on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 I don't doubt they said the revenues doubled.... doubled compared to what ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Yes, the 350k is pure speculation, though higher than doomsayers (some suggested 50k lol) and much lower than fanbois from the period (saying we have somewhere close to 2 million players, ridiculous) and I tend to think the logic behind it is reasonable...but remind myself it is complete speculation. Yes, subs are lower than they were just after launch but on the rebound if you consider the 350k number viable. At any rate, as others have said, total subs are no longer relevant under this new model...revenue is king. As long as revenue remains positive and continues to grow the game should be in good shape. If they keep doing what they are doing and avoid any serious missteps I think that is likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 No ones saying they don't, but I guarantee % wise, subscribers spending on CCs is bringing in more revenue then the F2P guys. I know 3 people in my guild a lone that spned 200 + dollars a month on it. And while this is a crowd....it's not the best crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 No ones saying they don't, but I guarantee % wise, subscribers spending on CCs is bringing in more revenue then the F2P guys. I know 3 people in my guild a lone that spned 200 + dollars a month on it. Heh.. so far all you can guarantee is that you have 3 "whales" in your guild... that account for 600 dollars per month in SWTOR revenue. I'm not disputing how you feel about the game revenue stream... only pointing out that you have a limited datapoint for your "guarantee" statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) No ones saying they don't, but I guarantee % wise, subscribers spending on CCs is bringing in more revenue then the F2P guys. I know 3 people in my guild a lone that spned 200 + dollars a month on it. Though that could be possible for this game, historically that is unlikely under this model. Prior to this game and in the market as a whole the level of revenue from F2P players is substantially higher than from subscribed players, based on industry analysis, reports from MMOs with similar models and folks that write and report on this particular revenue model in the industry. Sub players tend to be a bit more resistant, at least at first, to spending extra cash. Again, I want to stress that that doesn't mean that is how it is here. It could be very different here. Edited May 7, 2013 by LordArtemis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Yes, the 350k is pure speculation, though higher than doomsayers (some suggested 50k lol) and much lower than fanbois from the period (saying we have somewhere close to 2 million players, ridiculous) and I tend to think the logic behind it is reasonable...but remind myself it is complete speculation. Yes, subs are lower than they were just after launch but on the rebound if you consider the 350k number viable. At any rate, as others have said, total subs are no longer relevant under this new model...revenue is king. As long as revenue remains positive and continues to grow the game should be in good shape. If they keep doing what they are doing and avoid any serious missteps I think that is likely. A subber bring 15 x 12 = 180 dollars per year. That means 45 packs. To replace 500 000 subbers, you need to sell 22 millions packs. I'm a big video game player with a 3DS, a PS3, a X360, dozens of steam games and two MMO subs. (Unfortunately, the large income that fund those pruchase means that I have around 8-10 hours per week to play to the said games. Oh well). I still don't find any value to the packs, and I really don't see why anyone would buy them-I can't even use my free ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philastra Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) They also stated that Bioware is already working on a new Star Wars game. I would be very happy if BW picked the Star Wars 1313 title and are finishing it. If you haven't seen this game http://www.lucasarts.com/games/1313/ Edited May 7, 2013 by Philastra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eillack Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Prepare for more Cartel Coin requirements this means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pietrastor Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) No ones saying they don't, but I guarantee % wise, subscribers spending on CCs is bringing in more revenue then the F2P guys. I know 3 people in my guild a lone that spned 200 + dollars a month on it.Because 3 people in your guild prove anything. With 500/600+ CCs a month given to subscribers, I VERY much doubt they bring more revenue from CC purchases (not exchanging the stepid for items) than the actual F2P/Preferred players who don't get any coins except for few from Achievements. Also, 200$ per months on CCs? What are they buying, 20 Czerka speeders every month? Edited May 7, 2013 by Pietrastor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levity Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 Heh.. so far all you can guarantee is that you have 3 "whales" in your guild... that account for 600 dollars per month in SWTOR revenue. I'm not disputing how you feel about the game revenue stream... only pointing out that you have a limited datapoint for your "guarantee" statement. Well here's some more assumptions that are fairly good to make. Anyone who spends a reasonable amount of money on this game I would consider an actual fan of the game and the company and will probably have a subscription. Of course since there's more F2Ps then Subscriptions, you can't make a fair comparison. But on a one to one basis, I guarantee a subscriber has spent more then a f2p guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levity Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Because 3 people in your guild prove anything. With 500/600+ CCs a month given to subscribers, I VERY much doubt they bring more revenue from CC purchases (not exchanging the stepid for items) than the actual F2P/Preferred players who don't get any coins except for few from Achievements. Also, 200$ per months on CCs? What are they buying, 20 Czerka speeders every month? Buddy, 3 people out of a 20 person guild that spends 200 a month, so I was bringing it up as a generalization. I wish there was some hard numbers to just shush you guys. (or to shush me, just so we are clear) And no they like to gamble. edit: No problem here, it's a good compromise. Think of it like this, subscribers spend on their subscription, and then some for extra CCs, so they are getting the subscription and then some so they are banking off of that. Then you also have the F2Pers that make up a majority that are making smaller purchases, but since it's a larger scale there's profit. It's good both ways for the company. Edited May 7, 2013 by Levity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angedechu Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 But at least, if you win at the real life lottery, you can buy real stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted May 7, 2013 Share Posted May 7, 2013 (edited) Well here's some more assumptions that are fairly good to make. Anyone who spends a reasonable amount of money on this game I would consider an actual fan of the game and the company and will probably have a subscription. Of course since there's more F2Ps then Subscriptions, you can't make a fair comparison. But on a one to one basis, I guarantee a subscriber has spent more then a f2p guy. Here's a datapoint for you. I am a fan of SWs and a big fan of the game. I have spent $0 on cartel coins, and ability to pay is not a factor for me whatsoever. I'm sure I'm not the only one either. They do however get $15 per month from me, each and ever month. Edited May 7, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts