Weak dmg

[BobaFurz]

Ok, I did try Lacaretion and the dmg is much better now than before. Before I tried the Kolto Probe but the healing in pvp wasnt that good in BG´s, due to the high amount of dmg ppl do in comparison to the healing ticks.

 

What I notice is that this class seems to be highly depandant on crit, if you dont crit you are in trouble... . Not sure if this is an issue at higher lvls aswell.

 

So far i pick my targets with lower health and just finish em off....dmg isnt high enough to take them down fast so far, but this will change like some said and I cant await it

 

Highest crit so far 2400, around my lvl (23) with light armor.....vs 4-5 higher lvls the dmg is 1000+ around per attack and most of the time doesnt crit, thats a problem again.

 

 

Recent expiriences with my lvl 23 operative:

 

lvl 23 operative vs lvl 23 scoundrel

 

very fair fight and one of the rare moments were I felt good, did win and loose. Who hits first and has the better crits wins. Didnt feel like I was trying to kill a wall.

 

 

lvl 23 operative vs lvl 11 Sage.

 

Melee dmg alone is enough to kill a lvl 11 cloth wearer in - really long ~ten seconds - ....did take 3 melee combo rounds (BS, Shiv, Laceration) with additonal white rifle dmg and dots from the dart. Of course this player had no bubble up due the missing skill.

 

Not impressed, but better than before - still very weak when it comes to melee.

 

 

 

 

Ah yes, after reading the post under me:

 

Iam concealment spec with 3 points into Emperial Education...Iam not interesting in AOE dmg, just single target pvp.

Edited December 25, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Bwuce]

I agree with OP and others in many ways, i'ved tried all subclasses except the warrior/guardians in beta and early start, now i'm an operative because the friends i was playing with that originally decided on playing other classes than assassin which i wanted, are now all sorcs/assassins after seeing/testing them in beta/early game start...

 

 

I'm an operative because they were quite rare and late bloomers, also they are by far the most complex of all subclasses to play imo.

i'm now lvl 28 and sure it's getting better but i still find myself very weak compared to the other subclasses.

I also have to work a LOT harder and use ALL my tools at my disposal to kill people.

Currently i respecced from using laceration (pretty good) to kolto probe and the rest in concealment, just for more survivability.

 

melee attack chain: this wasn't complety for quite some levels, assassin has it early, sure it has less ranged attacks, though their stun is 30m range, ours 4m, that's a strange little disadvantage there.

 

Assassins can go in tank stance "dark charge" still do more dmg than us (talking around lvl 26), their backstab has no cooldown and does about 30% more dmg than ours.

I know we don't have our openers yet.

 

I see many people here that are saying they feel very powerful, are Lethality spec, i have not tested that yet but having AOE dots does help in going top dmg of course. Maybe i should give it a try because our melee attacks have slow animations imo.

 

one big tip is use cover (bind it in keybinds) and explosive probe, it's practically an instant and deals about as much dmg as our backstab, it's nice for getting a killing blow at range.

 

i don't have eviscerate yet and i'm looking forward to it for having a better melee chain but it seems situational (incapacitated targets) AND i read on the forums that it doesn't work in pvp so there goes that idea.

 

I'd also love to have a knockback or knockdown or pull of some kind, all other classes have some sort of placement CC, wether it's single target or pbaoe, it would simply make huttball a little more fun, facing dozens of inquisitors/consulars with 20s cooldown PBAOE Knockbacks is quite irritating

 

Our stun could have increased range imo, 4m is a bit silly, though i understand for scoundrels it's a kick, so this might be hard to do.

 

Shield probe, i was a bit disappointed, was hoping it was a shield somewhat like the sorc's, which is amazing imo.

[Morbidheresy]

Excuse me I laugh at the nade and dart dmg in comparison to the dmg ouput of the other classes in the same lvl I played so far....my normal rifle burst attack is almost as high like a stealth melee attack, whats the point here. If you get out of stealth you have only seconds to dish out dmg and to get out of the area, otherwise you die.

 

Iam doing the following:

 

sneak to the target>main backstab attack>stun and/or 2nd melee attacks>dart>after that my target has often 80%+ hp left and I hop around doing rifle dmg or use my other CC to get out of the trouble, otherwise i die.

 

 

 

Is this a joke ? If you are out of stealth you get steamrolled by Shadows, marauders and sourcerers with their bubble who suck up the whole "backstab" attack....how is this in higher lvls ?

 

Isnt this a melee class after all......just wonder

 

regarding pve, youre right, damage is low. thats what happens when you roll a healing class (and if the other healers are better then we just got bad luck) but we are far from being brokenly weak. I find I am a pretty effective fighter if I use Kaliyo even if I can't steamroll stuff.

Regarding pvp, sounds like you might just be bad because there is nothing wrong with the class even at below lvl 20 before you have any good moves

[BobaFurz]

Thx Bwuce for your post, Iam concealment right now up to Laceration and 3 points into Medicine for Imperial Education. My Battleground rank is lvl 18 so far...Iam picking my targets and doing 1v1 if possible in melee range, avoiding the groups and just talk about single target effectiveness and AOE or spreading dmg is not interesting for me to top dmg charts. I think you know what Iam talking about.

 

@Bwuce try the concealment tree if you like and report back how you do in close combat ....I have the full lvl 20 pvp set + blue weapon.

Btw the 1v1 against the scoundrel was my best fight so far.....

Assassins ? They have crazy burst at lvl 28 already, shock + maul ....

Never did try Lethality tree and dont see if this is an advantage in pvp or just a mass effect dmg....

 

For how much does this corrosive grenade tick on other players around the same lvl, on average ?

 

 

 

I dont have any problems in pve, dmg is enough.

Edited December 25, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Bwuce]

Thx Bwuce for your post, Iam concealment right now up to Laceration and 3 points into Medicine for Imperial Education. My Battleground rank is lvl 18 so far...Iam picking my targets and doing 1v1 if possible in melee range, avoiding the groups and just talk about single target effectiveness and AOE or spreading dmg is not interesting for me to top dmg charts. I think you know what Iam talking about.

 

@Bwuce try the concealment tree if you like and report back how you do in close combat ....I have the full lvl 20 pvp set + blue weapon.

Btw the 1v1 against the scoundrel was my best fight so far.....

Assassins ? They have crazy burst at lvl 28 already, shock + maul ....

Never did try Lethality tree and dont see if this is an advantage in pvp or just a mass effect dmg....

 

For how much does this corrosive grenade tick on other players around the same lvl, on average ?

 

 

 

I dont have any problems in pve, dmg is enough.

 

 

I am concealment, or was at least, i had 2 points in healing just for the .5s faster casting time, which has saved me many times.

lvl 28 now, life gets better when u get the interrupt btw, some classes, when u interrupt them, are clueless, merc spamming tracer dart, interrupt and he won't be doing anything for like 5seconds because he keeps spamming it.

now i'm medic and i kind of fight the same, just am more survivable, thing i want to try is that improved sleep dart, 50% less dmg for 10s after breaking sleep dart seems like a 1v1 win... I know i can't have acid blade AND kolto probe so i'm not sure about my end spec yet, atm i just respec now and then to give things a chance.

 

I can't really win a fight 1v1 without healing myself behind a corner now and then tbh, that's without stuns/blind up though. I hardly ever die in pvp, i do win a lot of 1v1 now but it takes a long time, usually people join in on the fight but i would've won it eventually. I really use everything at my disposal.

 

My friend is a 28 assassin we always team up and we compare the dmg etc, at this lvl assassin outdmgs us by far, backstab being a lot higher too and they can focus on dps only because they are actually quite tanky (in pvp assassins "should" use dark charge anyway)

Also i find the resources a lot harder to use on operative.

 

atm in my opinion, bountyhunter is the easiest to play, most straightforard, then comes the inquisitor classes which seem more powerful with all the cc, sorcs gets to spam lightning too but it's not as spammy as tracert dar for example. they're all just pretty simple and straightforward. Operative by far the hardest, to master it you must use your cooldowns at the right time, keep an eye on your energy because once you go below 60% it regains really slow, keep an eye on tactical advantage, know how to use cover now and then (vs snipers u can win at range if you use kolto probes and cover even).

I haven't used this many hotkeys on any other char.

 

Though there lies the strength of the operative imo, we are the most versatile by far.

 

going to test eviscerate soon, we'll see what gives.

 

Another idea for slightly better range imo, is to upgrade our distraction (interrupt) to 30m, i think that would be doable too

 

Again, we are somewhat low level, supposedly after lvl 36 people will cry about us. I only hope nothing above 36 gets nerfed before i get to use it because atm i sure think i have to work way harder than others to get results.

[BobaFurz]

Some expiriences with lvl 28 operative - concealment (lvl 24 battleground)

 

Its going better so far and Iam effective vs light and medium armor, except they have a bubble or shield. Due to that, it takes often too long to kill someone and other members of the team target me.

 

lvl 28 operative vs lvl 22 Gunner/commando...

 

This is one of my hardest opponents currently, doesnt matter if he is some lvls lower....

First has high armor, you think you hit against a wall...I have the feeling the higher the armor values the lower you get crits, its very often that I dont crit at high armor. The gunner did not even recognize me, doing 900-1000 dmg hits, doing the second round of attack rotation.

 

The worst is his auto rotation it acts like a damn AIMBOT, harder getting a backstab into him. He has a backkick skill and in this time his dmg output is that high that almost half my HP is gone. This is really a dangerous and very powerfull class so far at my lvl 28, annoying like people with shields on.

If they have a shield all my attacks get absorbed.....so you waste a stealth and attack rotation for nothing....i hope this will be different in higher levels.

 

 

All in all its getting a lot better now and for light and medium aromor this class is really a threat already around my lvl....

 

Lots of fun in the Battlegrounds and I love the possibilities of really fast pacing fights with this class...

Edited December 26, 2011 by BobaFurz

[BawssMcgee]

I get almost 3000 burst dmg just from a low lvl BH range attack after I pop up from stealth, looking at my tiny 1200 in close combat....common . Going rifle in close combat vs melee characters after the stealth attack...

 

Numbers not high, I thought this is the class with the highest direct dmg in the game ? Some kind of glass cannon....

 

Is bioware kidding us.....my lvl 16 sorcerer does 900dmg channeling per tick with slow effect !

 

Hope some higher lvl players can write something about their pvp expiriences "as the class with the highest direct dmg ouput"...

 

You are not doing 900 dmg per tick at level 16.

[Obsivus]

I did test several classes up to lvl 16, sorcerer, warrior, BH and Operative. I did with all classes aswell pvp for at least 2 lvls.

 

Anyway, so far operative is for me the weakest class in pve and pvp and Iam not sure how it will change in the next levels.

 

When doing pvp with my lvl 15 operative, going melee with the two main melee attacks I feel quiete weak. My main attack to the back of the opponent does often only 1200 dmg around, this so low in comparison what i can do with the other classes. If you are out of stealth and both melee attacks on cd, i dont know what to do...except using my blaster and dying quiete often. There are classes around where I do maybe 10-15% overall dmg - just with the two melee attacks. Wheras ranged classes or warrior classes are redicoulos strong.

 

Whats going on here, feel a little gimped.... ? How do you play the operative in low lvl pvp ? Is this class broken ?

 

Arent you a healer? You cant expect to main heal and do heavy dmg.. None of the classes are gimped in SWTOR, People yelling and whining " My class suck", " I do weak dmg " etc.. Those people do not know how to play their class..

[BobaFurz]

yeah...whatever, you read only the first post anyway. Edited December 27, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Avia]

You are not doing 900 dmg per tick at level 16.

 

in pvp I have seen 700-1000 per tick with a slow, it's nothing special (for that class), and annoying as all hell.

[FredGe]

I'm level 16, and it feels like I'm already doing more then Ok.

 

I agree, I die quite fast especially in some zerg fests. But don't forget that we can heal, even as conceal/lethality!

 

I totally love this class, and looking forward to playing it in higher levels

[Nessirin]

I agree. I played every class in WoW up to level 10, and rogues (equivalent of lethality op on here) only had an auto attack and two other abilities. It took me forever to kill mobs! It must be like that later on in the game as well, since low level performance shows how the class will act throughout its lifetime.

 

Especially classes that don't get any of their worthwhile skills until 20.

 

 

 

My op is 41, I can burst down most people to under 50% health before they get up from my hidden strike into defib combo. If you're looking for absurd (I mean, since you say ours is low) burst damage, you should have rolled a sniper.

Edited December 27, 2011 by Nessirin

[BobaFurz]

Why lethality, thought its concealment with the melee attack. I never played lethality and all I see is this AOE poison attack, how are you doing with that in indidividual fights ? Iam thinking to change my talent tree, Iam lvl 30 almost and have bigger issues again, getting almost no crits and thats around a 1000 per hit again. Iam missing lvl 30 pvp gear ...damn.

 

I know the feeling aswell if you take down someone in only some hits, if I dont I have lousy dmg...only having 16% or 18% crit at the moment, base.

Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz

[BobaFurz]

Alright, I tried lethality and its nice about AOE so far and poison arrows, did top the charts with almost 200k dmg..as far i was not focus fired, man the playeres were annoyed of me and were running after..fun for a while and will use that for leveling and pvp until my melee dmg gets better with more crit and change to the more prefered playstyle with direct melee attacks.

 

By the way I get as good as never Tactical Advantage...I have one skill for that and its almost useless sind I cant use it without TA. Maybe Iam doing something wrong with the rotation ?

Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz

[CorruptedFlesh]

Yesterday I've made ~3k (2948) crit on some random guy (actually it was a gunslinger that was pulled out of cover) in warzone. I'm level 36.

Indeed low damage. My BH friend managed only 2.5k crit in that fight.

 

 

 

About crit chance. I can't understand how the hell you have only 16%. I have 34% crit and concealed attacks skill that increases crit chance for backstab and hidden strike. Totally 50% crit for BS and HS - that's sick!

 

Also found out, that there is no point to invest more into crit chance, better to boost surge or power.

 

I'm using Athis orange gear plus level 33 upgrades in it.

 

PS: And I forgot, we will get Meticulously Kept Blades. For even more crazy damage

Edited December 28, 2011 by CorruptedFlesh

[BobaFurz]

I had 16,5% crit chance at this lvl with pure concealment talents (I did not take the lethality 6% talent), with buff it was around 21%.....

 

With the pure lethality build (Talent gives 6%) at lvl 31 I have 20.59% and 25,59% with the buff

I use green + some blue items....

 

 

I would love to know my Tech melee base dmg, but I have no clue why they dont give the infos in the character scree, just only the bonus dmg....but the info for ranged the base dmg and the bonus dmg is available.

Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz

[CorruptedFlesh]

I had 16,5% crit chance at this lvl with pure concealment talents (I did not take the lethality 6% talent), with buff it was around 21%.....

 

With the pure lethality build (Talent gives 6%) at lvl 31 I have 20.59% and 25,59% with the buff

I use green + some blue items....

 

Of course I meant 34% with coordination and lethality skill. I'm concealment specced but that lethality skill - must have, even if you are a medic. IMHO "pure" builds - thats stupid. Also I've taken Razor Edge for +10% damage dealt by shiv and Incisive Action for free TA and faster healing.

Yes, in future I'll respec a bit to take Acid Blade as early as I can, but lethality will remain in any case. 6% crit it is a lot.

 

BTW, I hope you are looking at "Tech" tab in character sheet, coz ALL melee abilities are tech.

Edited December 28, 2011 by CorruptedFlesh

[BobaFurz]

Yes TECH tab, but there is no information about the Damage only Bonus Damage.

 

These are my stats currently for TECH:

 

Bonus Damage: 190,3

(List 489+97,8)

(Techpower 374+86)

(Attack Power 28+64)

 

But there is no info about overall damage like you see in the ranged tab, only bonus dmg.

 

And yes the 6% is important and I will take this talent when i reach higher lvl to get concealment again. You have almost 10% more crit, thats a lot for only 5lvl difference but you have also better gear. Respeccing is very expensive, more than 10000 already for me...sucks. Whats coordination ? I dont have so many talent points, only lvl 31 so far.

Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz

[Torn]

Although I do not think we are weak - I think we are weaker than we should be - Assassins (I dont have a high lvl one but im going off bolstering) can do way more damage and survive way longer, it does no good to be able to vanish when you just die anyways most of the time.

 

I heard this class got nerfed pretty hard in beta and I think it was a bit to hard, we have to get in and get it done fast and get out, I guess what I am saying is we do enough damage but it takes to long to do it. Maybe lower our GCD to 1.0 instead of 1.5? I dont know....just seems like we are good at klilling weak players or those that are almost dead....whohoo......

[BobaFurz]

Well at lower levels in pvp this class did suck, in comparison to other classes and Iam still not that satisfied, I was pvping with my Juggernaut at lvl 10 and he did more dmg in melee than my lvl 22 operative. At lvl 10 already with 2k crits and heavy armor. This class seems to be a big late bloomer. Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz

[CorruptedFlesh]

FFS, stop whining. Our class has a great damage potential.

 

Yes, before level 20 it was hard to me to get more than 100k damage in warzone, I realized my mistake and concentrated more on healing. Later I've got lacerate and warzones became MUCH more interesting. Next thing I've got Hidden Strike and it is awesome now.

Edited December 28, 2011 by CorruptedFlesh

[BobaFurz]

Yepp, Iam waiting for this :D

[Sabbathius]

I totally get what people are saying with weak damage. Operative IS pretty weak, comparatively speaking.

 

I'm currently leveling multiple chars at the same time, in a rotation. A Powertech, Merc and Operative, they're all roughly the same level. I also have Sorcerer and Assassin, but they're 5-7 levels lower.

 

And I gotta say, both Bounty Hunters do SIGNIFICANTLY more damage than my Operative, at least in high 20s. Like, there's not even any comparison. For one, they have way more AoE, including the all-powerful Death From Above. Essentially every 60 seconds I can wipe out an entire group with a single ability. Flamethrower is also very handy, as are various explosives (missile and explosive dart, both AoE). In other words, my Bounty Hunters just DANCE their way through quests where with the Operative it takes a considerable amount of time.

 

Yeah, people are saying it gets better. Not sure how, exactly? OK, at 36 you get a hard-hitting opener from stealth? Fine, so you drop one mob in a pull before it knows it. In the meantime, a Bounty Hunter will have all three down to 50% with AoE. Guess who wins? Yeah, later we get Acid Blade, -50% armor, yippee! Still doesn't help leveling much.

 

The class is just piss-weak, when it comes to leveling at least. Half of our CC (Sleep Dart and Slice Droid) are target-specific (Humanoid and droid only), where Inquisitor and Bounty Hunter equivalents (Whirlwind and Concussive Missile) will work on any target. Finally, I firmly believe Khem is a better tank than Kalyo, and Mako works fantastically with the Bounty Hunter as healer/DPS.

 

I'm only comparing Operative to Inquisitor and BH, not Warrior, just because I haven't played the warrior.

 

Maybe the class is just a REALLY late bloomer, I can believe that. Jarring Strike sounds interesting, but again it's just an opener, if it is denied to you for whatever reason, you're SOL. At least in the leveling department, this class' damage is pretty damn weak, considering most pulls are multiple mobs and work best with AoE.

[Taliknor]

Really stop whining and L2P.

 

The lvl 10-20 cycle is entirely different then the lvl 20-30 cycle. Since lvl 25 I have yet to get below 100k damage in pvp. Second last round topped at 238k. (then we were basically rick-rolled. The opponents had a fine group going.)

 

Read the actual play-style and insert youself as a pairing. If you can't do that, toss a flashy nade at them and run away.

 

Squishy is a bit of a problem sometimes, so you may need to buy armors that places endurance over cunning.

[BobaFurz]

Mmmh in pve i do not that bad, but actually my lvl is always higher than the questing area...but you are right that other classes have advantages.

 

The thing is I never saw a higher lvl operative in pvp so far...on my server maybe a handfull exist. I see more and more lower lvls but they go the sniper route.

Edited December 28, 2011 by BobaFurz