Good guilds still accused of hacks

[tpryan]

"Again I don't know if you play on the Harbringer. But if you do you should know there is basically no hacking going on our server in 50s."

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=577932

 

we are on the largest populated server in the game...the game has hacks...of course there is hacking on our server. To clarify I have seen one of these guilds across the map with a prebuilt and they school us...I understand that...that is not hacking. being stunned 3-4 times in a row is NOT hacking...an "invincible" player is NOT hacking...A player moving fast once or twice is NOT hacking...I do understand what I am talking about.

[Mookind]

Yea its a F2P game with lowbie hacking in it

 

No one denies that, everyone knows speed hacking is out there. It is also very blatant. Bioware doesn't use vids to catch "hackers" lol. You report one of their CS reps goes and checks the timings of his actions and then bam hes done for using macros/speed hax or watever he was doing.

 

However in 50's there is literally no hacking. And certainly none that is giving some one a winning advantage. And if there was every player on the server would report his *** so quick he wouldn't get much of a chance to keep doing it. The account may of been free but the time spent leveling isn't

 

You don't know what you're talking about or simply never PVP (probably both). Either way you have no business calling hax when the only thing you can come up with is a couple links to lowbies.

 

Edit - And look at your own link, it is beyond terrible quality with a 12 min youtube video. As far as im concerned you still have yet to show any hax on the harbringer. Certainly not a 50

Edited January 20, 2013 by Mookind

[LogicalPremise]

Someone in this thread said that only about 10% of the players are good at PvP; this is a damnable lie. Barely 5% are any good at all, and half of those are rendered helpless by solo queing when they can't make a premade and having to try to coordinate pugs.

 

And this is why the accusations of hacking are so widespread. I hate to use the term, but for a long time before Gingers, bads were convinced that their multiple losses had nothing to do with them failing to bother to learn how to PvP or gear properly, or even because their wretched pugs that wouldn't even coordinate in chat were going up against premades, but because the other side was total hax. And lo and behold, some hackers were discovered.

 

Now that BW is aggressively going after these people, you'd think it would stop, but no, the bads continue to take this line. The irresponsibility of this sort of thinking is now it's the thing to accuse whole guilds of it.

 

Do you actually expect me or anyone else to believe that Full Resolve is a pack of hackers? REALLY? Do you actually expect us to believe that top guilds are just full of hax, openly admitting it in ops chat? That the reason they're good is not due to skill but to hacks and that BW is blind to this?

 

Saying "I have seen some anomalous behavior but I don't want to call specific guilds out" merely smears them all. I never did like Darth Hater, and now I have an excellent reason never to bother with it again.

[Archiah]

As I'd said in my previous post, my intent was not to call out any specific guild, which I did not. The post that I replied to did, indeed, call those guilds out, but my comment was simply meant to imply that I had experienced something similar; whether or not any of the named guilds were involved was intentionally left blank, because I cannot provide specific proof on any of the instances that I've personally found suspicious.

 

Having said that, my opinion on the matter remains unchanged. I've done my best to apologize for ruffling feathers, but it is the opinion of many others that these things do occur. I stand by the fact that I've seen strange things myself, and while I don't have specific evidence of the hacking, that doesn't mean that it isn't happening.

 

I'm sorry that my explanation doesn't sit well with some of you, but that's the truth of it.; take from it what you will. Finally, let me say that in the future steps will be taken to censor such comments and discussion from ever appearing below an article in this fashion. Whether or not the accusations are true is a matter worthy of debate, but it doesn't belong in the comments section of an article.

 

What you should have said was "I made a bone head comment, my bad, I'll try to do better." You may have actually earned some respect and empathy with that. As it is you went with the non-apology we see so commonly throughout society. I suggest we all relearn when acknowledging a mistake is appropriate and productive.

 

That being said, I consider the matter resolved, with regards to the article.

 

Perhaps there is something we can do in game to educate the hackusators?

[Fuzztastical]

I know of no one in Covenant who hacks. I have never seen any of us, or anyone in any of the "good" PvP guilds hack.

 

This game is a technical mess. So, if newer (or older) players cannot understand how players can apparently do funny looking things simply because the game is basically a piece of junk (from a technical standpoint), then they need help.

 

Just the other day we were playing a huttball where a player was apparently teleporting all over the place while laying down. We chalked it up to SWTOR being SWTOR because for a portion of the match he moved correctly. This is possibly what happened to Sorey. There is so much lag that anytime you are trying to pull, push, force speed, etc., you basically have to pray to the BW gods that you actually get where it says you are going on your screen.

 

It is truly remarkable where players will end up if they are trying to leap, get pulled, get pulled again. They can end up somewhere completely different than you expected them to.

 

The guy at DH needs to be removed as a mod for that kind of comment without ANY proof. And trying to skirt it now is a joke. Get over yourself. You are apparently no different than the fresh 50s who have no idea how the game works.

 

I have never seen instances of the "good" guilds hacking.

 

Hey there Altruistic, remember when you were lightly trolling the Sorey thread and I asked how you'd feel and react if it was Covenant that was being accused? I guess that I'm here to white knight for you.

 

Seriously though, this is one of the things I was most afraid of back then. It sucks to be randomly accused. It sucks that people say "oh, I heard a thing way back in the day, so you guys hack because you won a warzone!"

 

Let's make it clear - no one has seen a Covenant member hack and provided proof. Posting a random message on some website or making things up in general chat is not something that should be taken seriously. I don't believe I have seen or heard of a Covenant player being banned. Their guild streams their pvp matches on twitch.tv. On our side, we record and stream our matches, and post them on youtube. Feel free to look up Mega's youtube channel, or watch while he's streaming on twitch. Look at the matches against Covenant. They are good players - but not hackers.

 

Same thing different guild name - Cookies and Goof Troop aren't hacking. I've said it before, but if you get beaten by someone, or they do something you don't understand.. why not ask them what they did, or if you can join them for a while? Most of the players who know what's going on are very good guys. You'll learn something about the game, and possibly get to tag along with them while they're pvping.

[Nneji]

Most of the players who know what's going on are very good guys. You'll learn something about the game, and possibly get to tag along with them while they're pvping.

 

Really, you think so? I find that most good players are homicidal maniacs who are barely kept in check from being unleashed on society by the sadistic pleasure they get of slaughtering countless peons in this game and then lording over them with boastful glee.

 

I try to chat up and joke around with people in other PVP guilds all the time, and yes some people have been pleasant back. But I've never had someone share strategy with me. I've had them spit on me, call me names, tell me to quit the wz, call me stupid, and tell me to kill myself, though!

[knightow]

Slow clap for Mr Vox of Darth Hater I would like to present you with

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdJmpVoe27U

congratulations you've earned it.

[JoshusMoshus]

. I've had them spit on me, call me names, tell me to quit the wz, call me stupid, and tell me to kill myself, though!

 

g t f o <3

[AltruisticRage]

Hey there Altruistic, remember when you were lightly trolling the Sorey thread and I asked how you'd feel and react if it was Covenant that was being accused? I guess that I'm here to white knight for you.

 

I remember. I also never said Sorey hacked. I just thought it was cute that we had republic players going out of their way to defend it. It felt more like sucking up to the Imp side, hence my trolling of the thread.

 

I am a pretty poor troll because I freely admit to doing it most of the time.

 

But this guy over at DH is just a joke and should be removed as a moderator for a comment like that that can be so easily misunderstood. Regardless of his backtracking, he basically accused all of the better known PvP guilds of hacking.

 

My whole point of contention with the Sorey thing was, whether or not he was hacking, BW investigated him multiple times and apparently decided he was worth a ban. All it could have been was technical issues he was experiencing (which would totally be BW's fault). BW may ban people whose computers have a hard time running the game. Like I said, I just found it funny the republic players basically sucking up to the imps. I will give the opposite side respect, but I will never suck up.

[Archiah]

Really, you think so? I find that most good players are homicidal maniacs who are barely kept in check from being unleashed on society by the sadistic pleasure they get of slaughtering countless peons in this game and then lording over them with boastful glee.

 

I try to chat up and joke around with people in other PVP guilds all the time, and yes some people have been pleasant back. But I've never had someone share strategy with me. I've had them spit on me, call me names, tell me to quit the wz, call me stupid, and tell me to kill myself, though!

 

Sucks that you've had that experience. I know I take the Adversarial nature of war zones too far sometimes. I haven't ever been that vicious, though. When I get into it, it's usually because someone has come at me with a snide or rude comment. Usually telling me that I suck, despite the current score board. My favorite are the ones who have to log over to a pub alt immediately following the WZ and send me a tell. Ultimate proof of awesomeness.

 

I'm all for talking about class mechanics and gearing and even what I would do in a particular 1v1, however actual strategy I would consider to be something akin to IP. I wouldn't expect a group of good players to tell me what they are trying to do, just as I wouldn't be very likely to explain to any one what my group tries to do.

[Asunasan]

As I'd said in my previous post, my intent was not to call out any specific guild, which I did not. The post that I replied to did, indeed, call those guilds out, but my comment was simply meant to imply that I had experienced something similar; whether or not any of the named guilds were involved was intentionally left blank, because I cannot provide specific proof on any of the instances that I've personally found suspicious.

 

Having said that, my opinion on the matter remains unchanged. I've done my best to apologize for ruffling feathers, but it is the opinion of many others that these things do occur. I stand by the fact that I've seen strange things myself, and while I don't have specific evidence of the hacking, that doesn't mean that it isn't happening.

 

I'm sorry that my explanation doesn't sit well with some of you, but that's the truth of it.; take from it what you will. Finally, let me say that in the future steps will be taken to censor such comments and discussion from ever appearing below an article in this fashion. Whether or not the accusations are true is a matter worthy of debate, but it doesn't belong in the comments section of an article.

 

You did, by agreeing that you had "experienced issues with some of the same groups that you're reporting, so don't worry, you're not alone" when the first person had brought up three of the top guilds and leveled no evidence against them. Go recant your statement on DH, as in respond to the chain again saying that you didn't mean to call out Goof, Cookies, or Cov, you just didn't think before posting.

 

After doing that you should point your boss (or the closest thing you have to one) at DH to both your comments section and this thread.

[Abbrachmann]

Hey there Altruistic, remember when you were lightly trolling the Sorey thread and I asked how you'd feel and react if it was Covenant that was being accused? I guess that I'm here to white knight for you.

.

 

I think you missed what he was saying in his post on that particular thread. However it’s different from accusations from a player base then actual Bioware themselves. I want even talk how unprofessional the Moderator and poor journalism on being biest on the moderators from DarthHater.com was.

 

I'm guessing he plays on this server; however I would like to know his name and guild for starters. Secondly to post on a major informational website like darthhater.com and to not show any type of proof . As a moderator you should always read your post at least two times before posting. It just looks bad if your always having to retract your statements.

 

FYI to everyone: No one from C O V E N A N T has ever been banned for cheating or hacking. When I make a statement like that I just want you to know we have a player base of 112. You can keep crying in general chat about whatever hacks. Or you can write down people’s names and times of the warzones. You can make video evidence. Instead of crying in general chat because you cant organize a 4 person group, or your mad because you are not good at an easy game. If you dont like the class imbalances atm. Either wait till they buff or nerf a class or re-roll.

 

OR!!! You can just learn class mechanics and game mechanics and L2P......Mumble, Ventrillo, and TeamSpeak can also help you in warzones. Just sayin

Edited January 20, 2013 by Abbrachmann

[Mackeyla]

What you should have said was "I made a bone head comment, my bad, I'll try to do better." You may have actually earned some respect and empathy with that.

 

Agreed. Why don't you just come out and say that what you said was wrong instead of insulting our intelligence? In fact, if you had just said that you're a bonehead in your first post I bet this conversation would be winding down by now instead of gearing up.

 

"I thought I would step in here for a moment and clarify a few things."

 

Gee, thanks. I'm sure it's simply our lack of reading comprehension that has led us to believe that what you said was unjustifed.

 

"As I'd said in my previous post, my intent was not to call out any specific guild, which I did not. The post that I replied to did, indeed, call those guilds out, but my comment was simply meant to imply that I had experienced something similar; whether or not any of the named guilds were involved was intentionally left blank"

 

You didn't need to call out any guilds specifically because the rest of the post had already done that for you. And the fact that you left it "intentionally blank" implies, in my mind at least, that you wanted to accuse them directly but were hiding behind what others had said in order to protect your own arse which seems to have backfired on you.

 

"So, in closing, I would like to solidify the point that while I believe there are hackers in the game, I do not have any specific proof aside from the collective experience of several players besides myself"

 

I would think that as a mod you would be attempting to stop all of the baseless accusations instead of fanning the fire. Personal experiences are not proof. Eight players in a warzone have eight different experiences.

Edited January 20, 2013 by Mackeyla

[Fuzztastical]

Really, you think so? I find that most good players are homicidal maniacs who are barely kept in check from being unleashed on society by the sadistic pleasure they get of slaughtering countless peons in this game and then lording over them with boastful glee.

 

I try to chat up and joke around with people in other PVP guilds all the time, and yes some people have been pleasant back. But I've never had someone share strategy with me. I've had them spit on me, call me names, tell me to quit the wz, call me stupid, and tell me to kill myself, though!

 

I definitely do think so - the guys you're talking about aren't the good players. I would wager you've never had a bad interaction with a Full Resolve or Ascendancy player.

[Fuzztastical]

But this guy over at DH is just a joke and should be removed as a moderator for a comment like that that can be so easily misunderstood. Regardless of his backtracking, he basically accused all of the better known PvP guilds of hacking.

 

I agree 100% with this. By posting what he did on that site and this forum he's basically giving notice that the website isn't worth visiting.

[Asunasan]

I agree 100% with this. By posting what he did on that site and this forum he's basically giving notice that the website isn't worth visiting.

 

He didn't even backtrack publicly (if he backtracked at all, he is still trying to tell us our reading comprehension is wrong), he did it here on our server forums where he doesn't have as much on the line rather than on DH where he did the insult.

[Eadres]

I don't think people that have been around for a while are reporting people for hacking but there are a lot of new people that do not understand sentinels and marauders . Almost everytime I am in a pug facing one of the guilds mentioned in this thread someone will ask if they are hacking and someone will have to point out the abilities being used by the sentinels. It is unfortunate.

[LogicalPremise]

I don't think people that have been around for a while are reporting people for hacking but there are a lot of new people that do not understand sentinels and marauders . Almost everytime I am in a pug facing one of the guilds mentioned in this thread someone will ask if they are hacking and someone will have to point out the abilities being used by the sentinels. It is unfortunate.

 

Hence my point that the real reason we are seeing so many hacking accusations is due to the incompetant, refuse to listen or learn nature of most of the playerbase.

 

I've never had a bad reaction or seen hacking from any of the guilds on Harbinger. The two times I've seen someone that may have been hacking , they were unguilded.

[Totaltrash]

First of all, why does anyone worry about false accusations if they are clean?

So far, nobody has been banned unjustly.

 

I think there are guilds that honestly don't know that they harbor a cheater.

Unless you are a healer, most of your attention is directed towards the enemy and the objective. So if the cheater doesn't do something brazingly outrageous (i.e. Gingers), the guildies might not even notice. I'm sure I have been on teams with lag switchers without becoming aware of it.

 

I also believe there are guilds who know that they harbor a cheater, but tolerate it, because it wins them warzones.

From their point-of-you, they are not doing anything illegal by keeping quiet. Until the cheater is caught by EAware, it is not in their best interest to report that guildie.

 

Lastly, I noticed there a few guilds who actively participate in cheating. Those are NOT the top guilds, but the wannabes, the kind that gets in trouble when facing a good pug team. I have seen 2 on Imp-side and 1 on Pub-side who apparently cheat as a guild activity. The warzones against them will always have lag spikes, regardless which guild members are playing, and miraculous game-winning stuff happens way too often whenever they get in danger of losing. Sometimes, I cannot pinpoint the individual cheaters (i.e. a bomb just appears on a watched door during a lag spike), so I end up reporting their entire warzone roster - it's EAware's job to investigate, they got the tools for it.

 

As a rule, whenever something funky happens, report report report and EAware sort them out.

[Psirebral]

First of all, why does anyone worry about false accusations if they are clean?

So far, nobody has been banned unjustly.

 

I think there are guilds that honestly don't know that they harbor a cheater.

Unless you are a healer, most of your attention is directed towards the enemy and the objective. So if the cheater doesn't do something brazingly outrageous (i.e. Gingers), the guildies might not even notice. I'm sure I have been on teams with lag switchers without becoming aware of it.

 

I also believe there are guilds who know that they harbor a cheater, but tolerate it, because it wins them warzones.

From their point-of-you, they are not doing anything illegal by keeping quiet. Until the cheater is caught by EAware, it is not in their best interest to report that guildie.

 

Lastly, I noticed there a few guilds who actively participate in cheating. Those are NOT the top guilds, but the wannabes, the kind that gets in trouble when facing a good pug team. I have seen 2 on Imp-side and 1 on Pub-side who apparently cheat as a guild activity. The warzones against them will always have lag spikes, regardless which guild members are playing, and miraculous game-winning stuff happens way too often whenever they get in danger of losing. Sometimes, I cannot pinpoint the individual cheaters (i.e. a bomb just appears on a watched door during a lag spike), so I end up reporting their entire warzone roster - it's EAware's job to investigate, they got the tools for it.

 

As a rule, whenever something funky happens, report report report and EAware sort them out.

 

Congratulations, you are what is wrong with this game. Looking at the username, however, I guess I shouldn't be suprised.

 

PS: Sorey would like a word with you on the unjustly banned statement.

Edited January 20, 2013 by Psirebral

[DaTimba]

First of all, why does anyone worry about false accusations if they are clean?

So far, nobody has been banned unjustly.

 

I think there are guilds that honestly don't know that they harbor a cheater.

Unless you are a healer, most of your attention is directed towards the enemy and the objective. So if the cheater doesn't do something brazingly outrageous (i.e. Gingers), the guildies might not even notice. I'm sure I have been on teams with lag switchers without becoming aware of it.

 

I also believe there are guilds who know that they harbor a cheater, but tolerate it, because it wins them warzones.

From their point-of-you, they are not doing anything illegal by keeping quiet. Until the cheater is caught by EAware, it is not in their best interest to report that guildie.

 

Lastly, I noticed there a few guilds who actively participate in cheating. Those are NOT the top guilds, but the wannabes, the kind that gets in trouble when facing a good pug team. I have seen 2 on Imp-side and 1 on Pub-side who apparently cheat as a guild activity. The warzones against them will always have lag spikes, regardless which guild members are playing, and miraculous game-winning stuff happens way too often whenever they get in danger of losing. Sometimes, I cannot pinpoint the individual cheaters (i.e. a bomb just appears on a watched door during a lag spike), so I end up reporting their entire warzone roster - it's EAware's job to investigate, they got the tools for it.

 

As a rule, whenever something funky happens, report report report and EAware sort them out.

 

Your statement is wrong on so many levels.

 

First all, "So far, nobody has been banned unjustly"

Completely untrue since we had a player get banned from our guild with absolutely no evidence presented. During that time it was pointed out multiple occasions how people have been banned and after arguing the case were unbanned. I know it sounds like I'm just saying my friend didn't hack, yet I stand by what I said, absolutely no evidence was presented to prove otherwise.

 

"Unless you are a healer, most of your attention is directed towards the enemy and the objective."

Absolutely incorrect when it comes to high level PVP. The teams that don't have all 8 members aware of their surroundings are the ones that get beat consistently.

 

"I'm sure I have been on teams with lag switchers without becoming aware of it."

Pictures (or in this case video) or it didn't happen. Download fraps and catch it then and only then can you really make this claim with any substance behind it. Until then this gets chalked up to all the other weird things that happens in games due to a poor engine.

 

"I have seen 2 on Imp-side and 1 on Pub-side who apparently cheat as a guild activity."

You say this yet you put no names behind it, mostly because it's a baseless claim and you're scared to get called out on the fact you have no proof against these guilds when they inevitably defend it. You also don't post your character name on this post or your sig and could just be anyone trying to rustle feathers. Nothing about this post has any credibility to your cause and is relatively useless to this discussion.

 

I will continue to preach this to all the hackussers out there. If you think hacking is so rampant in this game, download fraps for free, record it, and post it. Hell a week ago someone said they caught me and I even made a forum post for that person to post the video in... yet nothing, because like every other claim you guys make, it's all baseless accusations because you can't understand how you're getting beat or how to get better.

Edited January 20, 2013 by DaTimba

[Totaltrash]

PS: Sorey would like a word with you on the unjustly banned statement.

 

Video or it didn't happen.

[DaTimba]

Video or it didn't happen.

 

That's interesting because there are videos of him not hacking all over the place... yet no videos of him hacking, no explanation of what he was doing, and any questioning of Bioware on the topic was deleted like it never occurred.

[Psirebral]

Video or it didn't happen.

 

Just stay out of it bud, grown-ups are talking.

[Totaltrash]

That's interesting because there are videos of him not hacking all over the place... yet no videos of him hacking, no explanation of what he was doing, and any questioning of Bioware on the topic was deleted like it never occurred

 

Make a video of him getting unjustly banned, post the entire correspondence between him and Bioware, including his appeal and the length of his punishment, then I believe you - otherwise just hot air.

But before you do, read what's below:

 

You say this yet you put no names behind it, mostly because it's a baseless claim and you're scared to get called out on the fact you have no proof against these guilds when they inevitably defend it. You also don't post your character name on this post or your sig and could just be anyone trying to rustle feathers. Nothing about this post has any credibility to your cause and is relatively useless to this discussion.

 

You know, or should know, that naming people on the forums is against the EULA/TOS. If not, I suggest you read it.

And that is also WHY you cannot or should not post videos here (or email correspondence for that matter).

One quick note, "your" guild is not one of them, so relax.

 

Absolutely incorrect when it comes to high level PVP. The teams that don't have all 8 members aware of their surroundings are the ones that get beat consistently.

 

Aha, so you are telling me that you are completely aware of every ability, every gcd and every movement of all of your teammates at all times, even the guy ninja'ing the far node? Sure, I believe that.

 

 

It's funny how all the "there are no cheaters" people have moved to the server forums now.

Edited January 20, 2013 by Totaltrash