PlayLoud Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 TOR is useing the alpha hero engine client, No im not fracking kidding, wish was. Its not even the beta version, let alone the regular version or the hero engine 2. You don't think they modified the engine themselves? Yes, they bought a older version of the engine (was the newest at the time), but then they developed it further themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CritasStorm Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 You don't think they modified the engine themselves? Yes, they bought a older version of the engine (was the newest at the time), but then they developed it further themselves. Sir If I buy a Yugo for car, no matter what I do to it, its still a Yugo 1 the worst cars in the world. If im developers and CEO and I am making 250-300 million dollar mmo over 7 years, and launch 6 monthes to early with beta features like legacy, lfg tool and on on not in yet, that was Promised. Then im dam sure not going to buy game engine that came out of cracker jack box! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phill-fry Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 I wouldn't expect it either, converting from DX9 to DX11 is a massive undertaking, even for a relatively small project. Let stand for a major project such as this. Additionally, as quite a lot has changed, not all your developers may be familiar enough with DX11, this would require extra resources to be spent on the time they take on getting up to date. Furthermore you will be challenged with the difficult choice on whether to keep supporting both DX9 and DX11, risking to run into DX specific bugs which then quickly get the notion of simply to play with e.g. DX9 (as most commonly its DX11 running into issues, due to many developers being inexperienced with it). Prime example to this is TSW, of which the DX11 client has been perhaps one of the most buggy DX11 applications till date, for many people simply not even launching. The other option is to fully switch over to DX11, but then you face the issue of minimum requirements for the game skyrocketing, as you'll need at least Windows 7. Or Windows 8 in terms of DX11.1, not to mention the requirement of a DX11 capable GPU. Which makes it a hard decision to make: 1. Losing further development time by needing to code for 2 APIs simultaneously, and risking an increment of API specific bugs. Which may even further increase if OpenGL support is ever considered to allow for Mac support. 2. Cutting off a major part of your player population by ditching DX 9 support as EA is doing with certain other franchises which make use of the Frostbite 2 engine (this engine only support DX10 and DX11, these two versions of DX are much more similar to each other and hence easier for programmers to support simultaneously); e.g. Dragon Age III for the BioWare fans. I see what your saying but by the time they actually do implement this is they even do most people should have Win 7 or above but yes for now it probs is best to stay with DX9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CritasStorm Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 (edited) I see what your saying but by the time they actually do implement this is they even do most people should have Win 7 or above but yes for now it probs is best to stay with DX9 Other much much Older MMO's have dx10 and dx11 support, features , that way players that cant aford dx11 systems like some of us have had for few years, as we upgrade every 12-24 monthes can still game in dx9 while the rest of us can crank up the graphics in dx11,dx10 and game runs much more smooth and with more dx11 api's etc and higher framerate for those us with 2-4 Video cards per Rig in SLI etc. Wow is 1 example, LOTR,DDO Aoc etc. Hell LOTR if have cpu and gpu's for such old game looks stunning in dx11 compared to dx9 and tons more fps, Godrays, new shaders etc. Edited January 7, 2013 by CritasStorm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 TOR is useing the alpha hero engine client, No im not fracking kidding, wish was. Its not even the beta version, let alone the regular version or the hero engine 2. Old news is SO exciting! They are using the alpha code with THEIR OWN CODE to finish it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
symke Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Sir If I buy a Yugo for car, no matter what I do to it, its still a Yugo 1 the worst cars in the world. If im developers and CEO and I am making 250-300 million dollar mmo over 7 years, and launch 6 monthes to early with beta features like legacy, lfg tool and on on not in yet, that was Promised. Then im dam sure not going to buy game engine that came out of cracker jack box! Yugo is not one of the worst cars in the world. Unless you take Jeremy Clarkson too seriously . Yugo is (or was since there are almost none left) one of the best cars to learn driving in and of the best "first cars" in the world. And considering it sold in USA for 50$ it's one of the best values for money you could get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idavies Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I'm running TOR on a one year old Alienware M18X. It ran perfectly well on max settings until about 6/7 weeks ago. Then the horror story began! I have given up with WZ's altogether as the performance is dismal. The fleet is also absolute hell! The lag/low fps is just appalling. I have turned everything down to very low and still have issues. I began to think it may have been my laptop. So last night I loaded Crysis 2 and F1 2011. I set them both to ultra and prepared for the worst. What I got was far from bad, both played with no noticeable issues. All three fans blew enough hot air to heat a small room lol. But when TOR is running only the left hand fan (GPU 1) runs constantly and occasionally the middle fan (CPU) starts up. There is no heat/activity coming from the right side fan (GPU2) at all. I'm a little worried that if this continues I may damage my system. I saved for two years to buy it and I really cant afford to replace it if it grenades itself! It is set to maximum performance and crossfire is enabled. I have reinstalled the OS and tried various Dell/Alienware and AMD graphics drivers. I flashed the BIOS to the newest version and have disabled all but essential background tasks. So back to head scratching for me! Anybody have an M18X with the following spec who may be able to advise on a course of action for me? i7 2960XM 2.7Ghz 2x AMD 6990's in crossfire 2x 256Gb SSD's in Raid '0' 8Gb 1600Mhz Ram This game has long ceased to be a hobby and has now become an addiction. I really can't imagine what I would do if I couldn't get my daily fix of this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonFire Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 SWTOR doesn't support Crossfire. Pop one of your cards out, you won't see any performance differences. Tested this several times in different ways. Not that this has anything to do with your issues, just mentioning it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProphetScourge Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 Hmm, interesting. I have had to make concessions on my graphic settings in this game to improve performance (a first), I shall give this a bash, thank you. Just wondering, did it help you out at all poosticks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idavies Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I'm running TOR on a one year old Alienware M18X. It ran perfectly well on max settings until about 6/7 weeks ago. Then the horror story began! I have given up with WZ's altogether as the performance is dismal. The fleet is also absolute hell! The lag/low fps is just appalling. I have turned everything down to very low and still have issues. I began to think it may have been my laptop. So last night I loaded Crysis 2 and F1 2011. I set them both to ultra and prepared for the worst. What I got was far from bad, both played with no noticeable issues. All three fans blew enough hot air to heat a small room lol. But when TOR is running only the left hand fan (GPU 1) runs constantly and occasionally the middle fan (CPU) starts up. There is no heat/activity coming from the right side fan (GPU2) at all. I'm a little worried that if this continues I may damage my system. I saved for two years to buy it and I really cant afford to replace it if it grenades itself! It is set to maximum performance and crossfire is enabled. I have reinstalled the OS and tried various Dell/Alienware and AMD graphics drivers. I flashed the BIOS to the newest version and have disabled all but essential background tasks. So back to head scratching for me! Anybody have an M18X with the following spec who may be able to advise on a course of action for me? i7 2960XM 2.7Ghz 2x AMD 6990's in crossfire 2x 256Gb SSD's in Raid '0' 8Gb 1600Mhz Ram This game has long ceased to be a hobby and has now become an addiction. I really can't imagine what I would do if I couldn't get my daily fix of this! Okay, time to eat humble pie. I'm posting this to a) hi-light my stupidity and b) to help others who may have encountered a drop in performance. I have religiously cleaned and hoovered my vents ever since owning my machine thinking it was the right thing to do. From outside there appeared to be no dust/fluff etc. anywhere. Last week I decided to remove the bottom cover and the three fans as I was getting concerned about this much to the point I was losing sleep! It cost a fortune to buy and I expect to keep this for at least another 2/3 years. The bottom cover came off and there was no visible issues. Then I removed the fans...... OMG!!! All the hoovering I had been doing over the last year had done nothing to clear the radiators, it had in fact dragged every bit of dust and fluff and compacted it up against the heat-sink radiator into three solid blocks of crap! They were so compacted they more or less came out in three separate pieces! I was gob smacked by what I had seen. I also gave it a blast of compressed air while it was all open for good measure. I re-assembled everything and re-started TOR. Hey presto! It now runs again on very high settings with no stutter, no drop in fps and it's now back to being the laptop it was when new I still can't get my head around Crysis 2 and F1 2011 running on ultra with no problem and TOR struggling like hell to play on very low. Looks like that will have to remain one of life's mysteries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Karsk Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 The bottlenecks are massive performance drops in high population areas, which have no explanation, other than a server issue or poor coding. This game and TF2 are the only games where lots of players = strange performance issues. Both are notorious for being poorly written. This, i have no problem what so ever with other game MMOs. Only with SWTOR like so many. Coding and engine must be utter garbage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacito Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 Not sure if it helps anyone, but I've gained about 20 fps by migrating to windows 8. Now runs with anti-aliasing and shadows enabled as well as it did before without those things. Even better, in most situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fornix Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 Not sure if it helps anyone, but I've gained about 20 fps by migrating to windows 8. Now runs with anti-aliasing and shadows enabled as well as it did before without those things. Even better, in most situations. The real question is though, is it truly Windows 8 giving the performance boost, or is it the mere fact of it being a fresh installation? Chances are high if you reinstalled windows 7 (assuming that's what you used) you may have noticed a similar performance boost. Computers tend to gather a lot of junk overtime as people install new things, but hardly ever bother to remove the old. Windows partitions logging itself full also doesn't help, some people fail to realize that if the windows partition has only 1 GB or less left, windows often doesn't become too happy as it's a default pagefile drive as well. Last but not least, the migration to windows 8 was without a hardware upgrade I take it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tacito Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 (edited) The real question is though, is it truly Windows 8 giving the performance boost, or is it the mere fact of it being a fresh installation? Chances are high if you reinstalled windows 7 (assuming that's what you used) you may have noticed a similar performance boost. Computers tend to gather a lot of junk overtime as people install new things, but hardly ever bother to remove the old. Windows partitions logging itself full also doesn't help, some people fail to realize that if the windows partition has only 1 GB or less left, windows often doesn't become too happy as it's a default pagefile drive as well. Last but not least, the migration to windows 8 was without a hardware upgrade I take it? Yes, no hardware upgrade. In fact, there's a slight downgrade, since my windows 8 partition is on a larger but substantially slower hard disk, still getting a better overall experience (while all partitions have at least 20 GiB free space). And since I use my desktop at home only for games, there was nothing installed on windows 7 either, save for 2 other games. Which are also installed on windows 8. The changed operating system really is the only distinguishing factor. Edited January 13, 2013 by tacito Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applicator Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 Okay, time to eat humble pie. I'm posting this to a) hi-light my stupidity and b) to help others who may have encountered a drop in performance. I have religiously cleaned and hoovered my vents ever since owning my machine thinking it was the right thing to do. From outside there appeared to be no dust/fluff etc. anywhere. Last week I decided to remove the bottom cover and the three fans as I was getting concerned about this much to the point I was losing sleep! It cost a fortune to buy and I expect to keep this for at least another 2/3 years. The bottom cover came off and there was no visible issues. Then I removed the fans...... OMG!!! All the hoovering I had been doing over the last year had done nothing to clear the radiators, it had in fact dragged every bit of dust and fluff and compacted it up against the heat-sink radiator into three solid blocks of crap! They were so compacted they more or less came out in three separate pieces! I was gob smacked by what I had seen. I also gave it a blast of compressed air while it was all open for good measure. I re-assembled everything and re-started TOR. Hey presto! It now runs again on very high settings with no stutter, no drop in fps and it's now back to being the laptop it was when new I still can't get my head around Crysis 2 and F1 2011 running on ultra with no problem and TOR struggling like hell to play on very low. Looks like that will have to remain one of life's mysteries! Glad to hear it's working better, now if everyone who is having issues was as thorough and stopped whinging about poor code, they'd find a lot of their issues disappear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlbo_Nabbins Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 (edited) Many PC gamers have beastly towers (like mine), while the only thing bottlenecking them is the programming of the game itself. No bottlenecking for me on an average gaming system, everything maxed except shadows and 80-110FPS with no stuttering. GTX650 card. Edited January 13, 2013 by Arlbo_Nabbins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nosmos Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I have a gtx 580, i5 2500k unlocked and oc'd to 4.4ghz (on water) with 8 gigs of ram. On EC, i get such bad frame stutter or skips, and of course on your regular places (fleet and some planets). Definitely should not be like this, considering i can run every single other game and ultra without a hitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hambunctious Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I have a 2GB 550ti, and I have zero problems with frame rates. It's the CTDs since 1.4 that are killing me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMKSED Posted January 13, 2013 Share Posted January 13, 2013 I have a gtx 580, i5 2500k unlocked and oc'd to 4.4ghz (on water) with 8 gigs of ram. On EC, i get such bad frame stutter or skips, and of course on your regular places (fleet and some planets). Definitely should not be like this, considering i can run every single other game and ultra without a hitch This. I can play any other MMO at max settings and get frame rates in them compared to SWTOR. Biowares coding is crap any other coders who have used the Hero Engine have called Bioware out in it too. Something needs changed but we most likely won't ever see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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