smash/force sweep spec is faceroll in pvp

[xContex]

That is really...insane. No AC should have the ability to generate that type of damage in a single attack, no one. And people are complaining that my Static Barrier is OP?

 

Smash/Sweep has been nerfed from that point due to surge being nerfed and the removal of adrenals/relic usage in pvp. If smash hits you for more than 7k you really need to evaluate your gear to see where the issue lies. The only time I've hit more than 7k on a geared player is when I had the expertise power-up + inspiration.

[oredith]

Pretty much.

 

Grapple, cryo-nade, 5k railshots dead. Class is borked.

wait, what?

 

so you're dead from 5k total dmg? .. O_o

[Chemic_al]

Smash/Sweep has been nerfed from that point due to surge being nerfed and the removal of adrenals/relic usage in pvp. If smash hits you for more than 7k you really need to evaluate your gear to see where the issue lies. The only time I've hit more than 7k on a geared player is when I had the expertise power-up + inspiration.

 

They can hit full WH for 6k+ easy. It's a joke how easy this spec is. It's become a no effort, no skill, I win button.

 

How bioware let's this stuff continue is beyond me. And then how any knight or warrior dares to complain about bubble stun is just amazing.

[SharpG]

Dude you sound like a person who doesnt know what their talking about so welcome to the club. How can the commando, sage whatever the class is turn around and stun the operative/scoundrel before they die from the dps? clearly yoou go against some stationary ops/scounds cause the one i go against... turn around isnt fast enough. The good players I have to go against is WZs are mobile... very mobile. 50% movement speed increase mobile so with that being said simply turning around (the solution you submitted) doesn't work. You guys do need to learn to play your class better instead of crying about force sweep crits. I wish we were on the same server to show you that no matter the spec I am whether Focus or Vigilance I'd beat you. Practice dps'n from range buddy. It sounds like thats all you got.

 

Sure its too slow if you keyboard turn (which it clearly sounds like you do). If you are dying to operatives/scoundrels you are just plain awful and the more you talk the worse you sound, a keyboard turning smash spec player so far, anything else you'd like to tell me? If you are honestly complaining about not being able to turn around and stun operatives/scoundrels you are trash and have no room to talk balance

 

Protip buddy, hold right click and turn, you'll see that its far faster then using the A or D keys

Edited December 22, 2012 by SharpG

[ELECTRICJUDGMENT]

Sweep/Smash is not the problem; the problem is ALL Knights/Warriors having access to the +30% damage talent Swelling Winds/Decimate. It needs to be moved back to the bottom tier of the Vigilance/Vengeance tree to be accessed by Guardians/Juggs only, like it was before 1.2.

 

Sents/Maras simply do not need the damage buff and never have. Their survivability was fine without it.

Edited December 22, 2012 by ELECTRICJUDGMENT

[xContex]

They can hit full WH for 6k+ easy. It's a joke how easy this spec is. It's become a no effort, no skill, I win button.

 

How bioware let's this stuff continue is beyond me. And then how any knight or warrior dares to complain about bubble stun is just amazing.

 

Why are we running in circles here. The smash spec has always hit this hard. Damage isn't the problem, its the ease of use/stacking of smashers that is the problem. This video was made around 1.1

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHuwPm6aDhs

 

And proves my point that the damage has always been this way but it has never been an issue, until 1.4. Until 50% of players rerolled smashers and started stacking teams. Be sensible and understand the damage is not what needs to be nerfed but the ease of use/stacking.

[Ghost_Spectre]

Smash/Sweep has been nerfed from that point due to surge being nerfed and the removal of adrenals/relic usage in pvp. If smash hits you for more than 7k you really need to evaluate your gear to see where the issue lies. The only time I've hit more than 7k on a geared player is when I had the expertise power-up + inspiration.

 

Really? Need to relook at my fully augmented WH gear? Surely you must be joking. Yes, I've been hit by a 7k smash. Luckily, that didn't kill me because I have damn near 20k hit points. However, regardless of what you claim, 6k+ is too much damage by anyone. What other class can hit with that much damage excluding the Jedi/Sith Warrior spec'd using that build? And do it in an AOE too against 5 people? If the Jedi/Warriors have that type of damage output, then by Yoda, everyone else should have an AOE that can generate that kind of damage. I'm sure that would get the get in your face smashers whining about being OP. They already cry about a small 3 second stun from a bursting Static Barrier. Imagine if my Sorcerer’s Lightning Storm or a Sage’s Earthquake generated 6k+ damage to everyone in the affected area! Would that be cool with you?

[funkhouse]

Simple..now that there is no delay on the animation, it's far more effective and easier to stack 3+ jugs.

With the immobilize from force leap, multiple juggs can leap one target after blowing their instant 4xsingularity generator and put out 12k~ easily and instantly. And that's just from 3...

 

The only counter to juggs is to spread out. But bad players don't spread out.

So you put one or two competent healers with a bubble sorc shielding every jugg...now you have an unstoppable force that ccs you even when you manage to break the bubble.

 

It's not that its OP but everyone has jumped on the bandwagon and people would rather complain then adapt to adversity.

First person ive ever seen get it right. Must be hard to use your defensive skills or pop a stim or just run.

[SharpG]

First person ive ever seen get it right. Must be hard to use your defensive skills or pop a stim or just run.

 

Because a scoundrel can avoid being leapt to by a smasher

[Xienive]

I love how the two heavy armor wearers can do more burst than the two stealther's "burst" specs.

[Raansu]

Imagine if my Sorcerer’s Lightning Storm or a Sage’s Earthquake generated 6k+ damage to everyone in the affected area! Would that be cool with you?

 

what a terrible comparison...those aoe's are channeled and can do way more damage than a single smash...

[SenseX]

Why are we running in circles here. The smash spec has always hit this hard. Damage isn't the problem, its the ease of use/stacking of smashers that is the problem. This video was made around 1.1

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHuwPm6aDhs

 

And proves my point that the damage has always been this way but it has never been an issue, until 1.4. Until 50% of players rerolled smashers and started stacking teams. Be sensible and understand the damage is not what needs to be nerfed but the ease of use/stacking.

 

Well... great video! Especially like the editing and music on it.

 

Anyway, thing is, it was made when you could still use PvE Relics and PvE Adrenals in WZs... just watch the video and observe how she pops relic + adrenal right after the jump (or basically while jumping) and before the smash.

 

You see, there was a reason why they removed those things from WZs because you could do some ridiculous damage by stacking power through stim + relic + adrenal. - And now it's back to almost the level it was back then, without the relics and adrenals, which isn't all that good really...

Edited December 22, 2012 by SenseX

[Devilk]

The difference between then and now is the player base. They were far less common because there were far more players to get into a match with. Edited December 22, 2012 by Devilk

[Loki_]

Whats wrong with smash ? Is it not entirely fair that I can leap on a sorc healer with 15k HP for 1.5k then hit him with a sweep for 8.5k then follow that up with a 5.5k bladestorm oh damn hes dead I cant even follow up with a 5.5k dispatch ....

 

Theres no fun in that if I dont even get to use my finishing move coz hes already dead.

[WaywardOne]

Because a scoundrel can avoid being leapt to by a smasher

 

Uh... yes, they can. Go invis. Or when you see them mid-air hit them with flashbang. Also, l2p.

[xContex]

Well... great video! Especially like the editing and music on it.

 

Anyway, thing is, it was made when you could still use PvE Relics and PvE Adrenals in WZs... just watch the video and observe how she pops relic + adrenal right after the jump (or basically while jumping) and before the smash.

 

You see, there was a reason why they removed those things from WZs because you could do some ridiculous damage by stacking power through stim + relic + adrenal. - And now it's back to almost the level it was back then, without the relics and adrenals, which isn't all that good really...

 

I understand that. The point was the amount of damage possible way back in January. It has always been here. The complaints are coming in because the amount of smashers. Those who complain about the damage really don't have any basis to complain as the damage has always been this high. So why was it fine then and not fine now? Because of the amount of smashers.

[CJNJ]

Basically you could still get hit for 6-7k hits before, but it was only like 7 guys(exaggeration) per server that ever did it

 

Now you get 2-3 per game, doing the same damage as before, only slightly more often.

[Loki_]

Basically you could still get hit for 6-7k hits before, but it was only like 7 guys(exaggeration) per server that ever did it

 

Now you get 2-3 per game, doing the same damage as before, only slightly more often.

 

6-7 k was a one off rare hit before, averages were around 5k ..... now 6-7k is normal and rare hits are 8-9k it needs toning back to the way it was

Edited December 22, 2012 by Loki_

[CJNJ]

6-7 k was a one off rare hit before, averages were around 5k ..... now 6-7k is normal and rare hits are 8-9k it needs toning back to the way it was

 

Again, those 6-7k hits were rare because NOBODY played the spec to its fullest extent, except a handful of people. I do not believe I have ever seen an 8-9k crit since the patch changed as well, and the most that I(full WH sage) have been hit for was 7k. Maybe 8k on a guy in greens, but not a guy in recruit, let alone WH gear, which is as we all know dirt cheap.

 

Quoting Zombieland

it's not the taste, it's the consistency

[Loki_]

Again, those 6-7k hits were rare because NOBODY played the spec to its fullest extent, except a handful of people. I do not believe I have ever seen an 8-9k crit since the patch changed as well, and the most that I(full WH sage) have been hit for was 7k. Maybe 8k on a guy in greens, but not a guy in recruit, let alone WH gear, which is as we all know dirt cheap.

 

Quoting Zombieland

it's not the taste, it's the consistency

 

I hit a noob sorc in recruit last night for 8.6k then crit with bladestorm straight after for 5.5k it happens regular when u play with max'd power/str

Edited December 22, 2012 by Loki_

[xContex]

Again, those 6-7k hits were rare because NOBODY played the spec to its fullest extent, except a handful of people. I do not believe I have ever seen an 8-9k crit since the patch changed as well, and the most that I(full WH sage) have been hit for was 7k. Maybe 8k on a guy in greens, but not a guy in recruit, let alone WH gear, which is as we all know dirt cheap.

 

Quoting Zombieland

it's not the taste, it's the consistency

 

A geared smasher will NEVER hit 8-9k hits on geared targets. Ever. I have hit 9.6k on a severely under-geared sorc but you cannot balance a game because of their lack of gear. That is what 1.6 brought to the table. A much smaller gear gap meaning once people get WH gear the hits won't be nearly as hard.

[Thoop]

A geared smasher will NEVER hit 8-9k hits on geared targets. Ever. I have hit 9.6k on a severely under-geared sorc but you cannot balance a game because of their lack of gear. That is what 1.6 brought to the table. A much smaller gear gap meaning once people get WH gear the hits won't be nearly as hard.

 

so the gap between recruit and elite war hero is smaller now, good to know. nothing wrong with a 9.6k AOE.

 

nobody plays dps ops anymore so i guess since they are single target a 10k hit would be fine also, well they can only do it once a fight so lets say 12k, i bet nobody would complain about that

Edited December 22, 2012 by Thoop

[Tranduril]

I would like the smasher/force sweep to explain this to me:

 

An AE attack that do more damage on a single target then a DPS commando spec for single target and using the highest skill in the tree ( for exemple Demolition round)

 

The highest ever i did with it is 6.1k because the person i attack had around 100 expertise (was a rep versus rep) andi had already have inspected his gear many time before. I will often get 4-5k crit.

 

 

Cooldown :

 

Demolition round have a hard 15 sec cooldown. Cant be lower or reset.

The timer of Force sWeep/Smash is 15 sec as well, that timer can be lower by some other ability.

 

Buff:

 

To be effective you need to use Grav round to get Vortex debuff on your target up to 5. each one buff the damage of demo round by 5%. No increase chance of crit.

 

For force sweep/smash you need singularity. each one boost the damage/reduce the cost by 25% stack up to 4 time.

 

Crit:

 

Demo round. well get some crit by yourself otherwise you wont crit. need to have a balance crit surge power

 

Force leap/zealous leap and lol crit! All go in power and surge. Crit what that? I auto crit!

 

Armor penetration:

 

Commando : With 5 vortex charge that 20% armor debuff + Armor piercing cell 30%

 

Shii-Cho mastery 30% armor penetration.

 

 

So please tell me again why an AE attack can do more damage to multiple target then a single target spec commando. with a basic skill that get buff with some speccing an in AE tree(not all the way throught the tree is necesasary) versus a skill that you can get only speccing all the way up a DPS tree.

 

I have been hit by a Lolsmasher juggernaut on my commando for over 6k damage through heavy armor + my shield and over 1200 expertise ( WH stuff )

 

I guess i should go back and respec and play my sentinel to be lolsmash, but 3 button spec... no thanks.

[PoliteAssasin]

so the gap between recruit and elite war hero is smaller now, good to know. nothing wrong with a 9.6k AOE.

 

nobody plays dps ops anymore so i guess since they are single target a 10k hit would be fine also, well they can only do it once a fight so lets say 12k, i bet nobody would complain about that

 

There are two DPS ops on BC that do EXTREMELY well thank you very much. Some people took the time to learn the class rather than QQ.

[Chemic_al]

I understand that. The point was the amount of damage possible way back in January. It has always been here. The complaints are coming in because the amount of smashers. Those who complain about the damage really don't have any basis to complain as the damage has always been this high. So why was it fine then and not fine now? Because of the amount of smashers.

 

No, it wasn't fine then but it was easier to avoid the smash, and rage tree has since been buffed, so it does more damage and people are min-maxing power and don't need any crit in their gear. You cannot defend such a spec as remotely balanced.

 

But just look at the QQ over sorcs' chain lightning wrath proc back then, why can't they have that back if loltrardsmashers can do that much aoe damage for so little effort, you know in the interests of fairness? So if that sort of AOE damage is fine, why were they all crying nerf then?

 

And only people defending rage as it stands now, are skillless smashmonkeys who whined about sorcs then and whine about their stun bubble stopping their lolsmashtrain now. They are hypocrites, and bioware listened to those tards and ruined PvP.

 

And that's not even touching how stupidly good marauders Defensive CDs are in a PvP environment.