Odyseus Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) While your classes with the most defensive cooldowns have the most burst dps? Edited December 2, 2012 by Odyseus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 While your classes with the most defensive cooldowns have the most burst dps? Depends on 'spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoliteAssasin Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Depends on 'spec. Not only that, but it is so easy to counter that burst. Thinly veiled marauder QQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iDraxter Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) so burst is the measurement of how good *insert class here* is now? Edited December 2, 2012 by iDraxter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siorac Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 so burst is the measurement of how good *insert class here* is now? The way PvP works now, it pretty much is. Sustained damage has very little use in warzones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easpeak Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Sorcs/sages would make a good counter class to some, but because getting to your target has been made so easy in this game, the class just doesn't work. Their deeps is fine, it's just the amount of leaps/pulls and the range of said abilities that make it useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 gap closers with the same range as ranged DPS is the root of all evil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surrena Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 class that has no defensive cooldowns and is squishest like sage should be highest hitting class not be stupid periodic crap but no instead they give 8k aoe smash to class that has best cooldowns and best utility in game roll black sage pre 1.2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoliteAssasin Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) class that has no defensive cooldowns and is squishest like sage should be highest hitting class not be stupid periodic crap but no instead they give 8k aoe smash to class that has best cooldowns and best utility in game roll black sage pre 1.2 Yep, those bubbles sure are crap. So are the stuns that everyone uses with them now. Oh and did I mention it can be used back to back? Talk about a crappy defensive. QQ more little sage. Edited December 2, 2012 by PoliteAssasin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danbuterx Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Maybe he didn't know he could do that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easpeak Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 roll black sage pre 1.2 Them black sages did not deserve to get nerfed, I call this game racist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amnie Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 bioware has already succeeded, I see. nobody even remembers scoundrels/operatives anymore. (ok ok, they do have some nice burst if you do it right, but you know what I mean.. back from a few months ago ;D) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Them black sages did not deserve to get nerfed, I call this game racist. Black Sages are Sorcerors. He was referring to the robe colors, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerJBD Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 I play both a Sorcerer and a Sage in PvP. We aren't nearly as squishy as you would like to believe. You get a free heal that crits for 5k-plus with decent gear on a fairly low cooldown, along with bubble. I personally don't use stun bubble as it is going to get nerfed anyway. I like my low-cooldown 2-second root out at the top of the madness/balance tree. You have lots of tools to counter other classes' burst. I do think sorcs/sages should get an execute, but DPS is solid all-in-all. The real issue is the derp-smash spec, which obviously needs a nerf. But our damage is fine. You just have to know how to play the class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramtar Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) class that has no defensive cooldowns and is squishest like sage should be highest hitting class not be stupid periodic crap but no instead they give 8k aoe smash to class that has best cooldowns and best utility in game roll black sage pre 1.2 Than remove your ability to self-heal. Other classes have to be speced to get self-heals. Edited December 2, 2012 by Ramtar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MidichIorian Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) I do believe that the correlation between sorc/sage output, the light armor and other classes is poor but I'd rather nerf other classes (or specs) than buff sage/sorc. By buffing sage/sorc we'd only add to the problem, the short ttk'es. Or nerf damage by 25 % across the board instead, that would give sorcs/sages enough time to use their tools, we wouldnt even have to tweak them. Edited December 2, 2012 by MidichIorian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielHex Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Than remove your ability to self-heal. Other classes have to be speced to get self-heals. F1. Heal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucianobck Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 so burst is the measurement of how good *insert class here* is now? In my opinion? Yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrias Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) I play both a Sorcerer and a Sage in PvP. We aren't nearly as squishy as you would like to believe. You get a free heal that crits for 5k-plus with decent gear on a fairly low cooldown, along with bubble. I personally don't use stun bubble as it is going to get nerfed anyway. I like my low-cooldown 2-second root out at the top of the madness/balance tree. You have lots of tools to counter other classes' burst. I do think sorcs/sages should get an execute, but DPS is solid all-in-all. The real issue is the derp-smash spec, which obviously needs a nerf. But our damage is fine. You just have to know how to play the class. I would say this is both correct and incorrect at the same time. In a one-on-one scenario, their DPS is acceptable, because the combat will last long enough for their utility to and ability to kite to make up for their lower burst against most classes. However, in group scenarios and Ranked, DPS Sage/Sorc are a poor choice. You need to be able to switch targets instantly (which you can't do with a DoT based damage dealer) to focus fire, and it is almost impossible to make up for your DPS shortfall with CC in the same way, because other ACs will also be putting up their own CC and you'll white bar people. That's why Sorc/Sage could do with a spec that has some reasonable front-loaded burst damage. Certainly something better than '20% alacrity for 10s every 120s', because it's really not that good on it's own, but it also requires you go quite high up a tree renowned for being a poor choice for PvP. Edited December 2, 2012 by Tyrias Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerJBD Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 I would say this is both correct and incorrect at the same time. In a one-on-one scenario, their DPS is acceptable, because the combat will last long enough for their utility to and ability to kite to make up for their lower burst against most classes. However, in group scenarios and Ranked, DPS Sage/Sorc are a poor choice. You need to be able to switch targets instantly (which you can't do with a DoT based damage dealer) to focus fire, and it is almost impossible to make up for your DPS shortfall with CC in the same way, because other ACs will also be putting up their own CC and you'll white bar people. That's why Sorc/Sage could do with a spec that has some reasonable front-loaded burst damage. Certainly something better than '20% alacrity for 10s every 120s', because it's really not that good on it's own, but it also requires you go quite high up a tree renowned for being a poor choice for PvP. I could get behind a slight boost to burst damage for Sorcs/Sages, but I don't think it is that far off. FiB crits for 4k on multiple targets. Mind Crush with a proc hits like a truck. Honestly, I think the solution here would be a bit of a buff to project for sorcs and sages. It's the only other instant hit we get, and it just doesn't hit that hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrias Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Yeah, I could go with that. Maybe even something akin to what Shadows have, where they build up a stack of procs from some other skill, and that adds to the damage of the next Project. Just something to let smart Sages/Sorcs bring in the burst without having to wait a couple of minutes for a cooldown. It's always niggled at me that Shadows have a more powerful Project that the AC that is supposed to be most about pofwerful force abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramtar Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 F1. Heal. I stand corrected: any Heal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abhaxus Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 A hybrid 21/20 madness/lightning or 23/16 has plenty of burst, it is just harder to play than something like PT that needs 3 buttons for rotation. I will be happy if smash gets a little nerf, or whatever it takes to get people to play another class. Tired of premades chain smashing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariak- Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 (edited) Yeah, I could go with that. Maybe even something akin to what Shadows have, where they build up a stack of procs from some other skill, and that adds to the damage of the next Project. Just something to let smart Sages/Sorcs bring in the burst without having to wait a couple of minutes for a cooldown. It's always niggled at me that Shadows have a more powerful Project that the AC that is supposed to be most about pofwerful force abilities. I would be down for a fairly generous buff to shock and force lightning. I agree with OP that we are very squishy with no cannon to match. Edited December 2, 2012 by Ariak- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrdert Posted December 3, 2012 Share Posted December 3, 2012 Learn to kite. Learn to bubble stun. PROFIT! / thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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