BioWare: Change the final fight please (major spoilers)

[Jonlo]

I've done it by cheating, essentially, and using the "push him off the ledge" trick. As far as I'm concerned, the fight is utterly impossible to win for a defense-specced tank guardian with orange gear modded to Corellia level. Maybe with full T3 Rakata gear, but hell, you certainly should not need anything like that to complete your **SOLO** class quest.

 

I will be giving detailed feedback below, in case someone at Bioware is actually monitoring this thread.

 

 

 

Went into the final quest at level 50, defense-specced tank. This is the spec:

 

Defense tank

 

Gear was mostly orange moddable items with decent mods. Got a couple of screenshots with the resulting values:

 

stats 1

stats 2

 

I chose to save my companion.

 

 

First problem: forcing the people to use a companion which is NOT the most useful for the class by a long shot (the correct one is obviously the healer, Doc) and which many players will not have upgraded in 30 or more levels. This was my case, too, and as a result, T7 was utterly useless.

 

This means any pull of 2 strong mobs is an automatic death, as the dps of e.g. the 2 sith assassins guarding the entrance to the temple is quite enough to completely break through the defenses of the class (even if using all the cooldowns). This in turn makes even reaching the temple a major pain.

The fact that the temple contains green gear for T7 by way of solving the puzzle is useless because:

 

A) You need an upgraded T7 to help you reach the temple and clear it in the first place

B) There is absolutely ZERO indication of what happens if you solve the puzzle. This means most players will simply never bother, because to solve it you need to clear a good chunk of mobs which you can simply avoid if you beeline for the emperor. And why try to clear several more groups than necessary in what is already an incredibly painful experience if you don't have a clue it will do you any good?

And this is without even taking the bugs into account.

 

 

Second problem: the fight itself.

 

Let's start by noting that whoever is saying the adds only spawn at 75%, 50% and 25% is definitely WRONG. This maybe the case if you do not save the companion and get the weaker version of the fight as a result; I don't know what happens in that case.

In my case, once I chose to go for the "pull him to the stairs and Force push him off the ledge" route, the initial seconds of my several tries went always the exact same way:

 

- I approach him until I'm at the very edge of the saber throw range

- I chuck my lightsaber at him (he goes down to 97% health) and instantly start running for the stairs (T7 is in passive mode)

- One or two seconds after I've gone outside his room (we're a few seconds into the fight now), he stops a moment and summons the first wave of clones

 

So for me the first wave was time-based, not health based, as he called them at 97% and it happened quite quickly too since I just had the time to go outside his room before it happened.

 

Now for the "all you have to do is interrupt his casts" part.

 

First of all, Force Kick is on an 8 seconds cooldown and a huge number of mobs (including yours truly) just LOVE LOVE LOVE to immediately restart whatever spell you interrupted as soon as the 4-seconds denial period is over. This means it's impossible to *keep interrupting* them indefinitely because they effectively work on a 4 seconds "spellcasting" cycle. So you can e.g. follow a force kick with a force sweep (assuming a weak mob which gets stunned by it) , then another force kick for the third casting attempt followed by a master strike etc. but after the first 6-7 interrupts your force kick will be on cooldown again and you won't have any more alternative interrupts available as they will all be on their long cooldowns. So you're screwed.

If, like in this case, the mob is not weak and your stuns don't work, it means you have much less alternative interrupts available and you simply get screwed much faster.

 

Second point, specific to this fight: AoE attacks will not work to dissipate his clones. So the quickest way of getting rid of them is to:

 

- tab target a clone

- hit him with the fastest ability available (i.e. the normal strike)

- tab target to the next

- twiddle your thumbs while the age-long global cooldown expires while the emperor and the rest of his clones are happily pounding you

- hit the second clone with a strike

- rinse and repeat with the rest of the clones

 

Bottom line: thanks to the GCD, it takes an age to clear all the clones. In that period, you are not interrupting whatever the emperor is casting at you AND his clones are also pounding you, resulting in an utterly insane amount of incoming damage which will easily burn through whatever defense you might have.

I've read in some previous post that it's possible to keep targeting the emperor and use Cyclone Slash to still dissipate the clones one at a time. That' s nice, however:

 

A) why cyclone slash works this way (unlike force sweep) on the clones and how the hell am I supposed to know?

B) even assuming you can keep interrupting the emperor while you cyclone slash away the clones, the clones who are still alive are still putting a huge amount of hurt on you

 

Just to underline this, I'd like to point out that even while using the "force push him to his doom" technique, it took me several attempts, 60k in repairs, and ALL my cooldowns and 2 medpacks to kill him this way. I would:

 

- run immediately back to the stairs

- hide behind that pack of stuff near the medical droid to avoid los to him and the clones

- wait for him to come as close as possible before the first clone could get los at me

- activate a defensive CD

- run toward him and force leap to him as soon as possible

- manoeuver so as to push him off the ledge

- clear the clones

- wait for him to port back to his room and get back to me with a new wave of clones

 

And even using all these methods to minimize incoming damage, I would easily lose 30-45% of my health in those few seconds I needed to run closer to him, force leap, move around and push him off.

 

As a possible comparison point, keep in mind this same toon earlier in the same day successfully tanked the Directive 7 flashpoint, so I don' t think either my skills or the toon statistics are so completely useless.

 

 

 

Another thing: there's an extremely nasty bug which can block your toon for hours if you're unlucky. When you are inside the temple and approach the force field, the quest will automatically update to the next step (the one in which you need to interact with the console to disable the force field and T7 tells you that your companion is in danger). HOWEVER, the medical droid in the mezzanine section *behind* the force field will also be unlocked, so if you die fighting one of the groups there, and you choose to rez at the droid instead of waiting for being resurrected in place (as I did as I was by then on the 10 minutes timer), you get rezzed on the other side of the force field and are stuck in there, because you cannot interact with the console anymore as you're on the wrong side of the field itself. And fast travel doesn't work because there are no bind points in the whole area. So you better have your fleet emergency pass off CD or you have just won a 18-hours wait before you can use your toon again, as you can go neither back nor forward (can't kill the emperor because you're stuck at a previous step in the quest chain).

 

 

Honestly I'm amazed this crap could pass any sort of semi-decent QA process. Keep in mind the people who already reached this point are all invariably pretty hardcore since they all reached 50 before the one month period. Just imagine what happens in a few more weeks, when the mass of casuals start banging their heads against this wall.

 

 

 

Well, you're wrong, as I hit 50 well before Corellia, burned through it and the final part of the quest up to the Emperor. My gear was not even close to Corellia quality.

 

I still did it without LOS or ledges. So it's doable. People who say it isn't doable are doing it wrong, plain and simple.

[pHettiii]

I still have major problems,

 

(1: yes

2: Sentinel, Focus specced. I would like a aoe to work on the shadow clones, thats all)

 

[lljkGSG]

I'm sure the gaming gods here will just disagree, but this mission's design is plain stupid.

 

 

Tank companions are weak to begin with (Scourge is useless unless you're just looking to enjoy practicing your rez.) and as a defense speced Guardian I haven't used T7 since Kira has been available so he's undergeared. I know some people here soloed the fight, but that hasn't been a game mechanic since level 7, why throw it in now?

 

There may be a bugged chest with greens in it but you have to slog your way to the temple to get there in the 1st place and he's useless in helping you get to it unless you've been looking for spoilers first, not to mention no context on what the puzzle is so by the time you get to it you're sick of dealing with trash mobs non-stop so I'm guessing most people just pass it by. The Emperor and chain casting clones are a pain with your slow foot speed even with the pillar trick (YAY! You need a gimmick to pass, unlike any fight in the previous 49 levels!) and one minor slip up and you might as well just wait to rez/repair and try again.

 

 

The take away for me is, it's just not any fun. Doesn't feel heroic in the least and I guess I'll wait till I can field a team to help me finish my quest since the grief to profit ratio is not worth it. Yippee....

[Slaxon]

You can always leave and go gear up your little buddy and then come back.

[MagnusLL]

Well, you're wrong, as I hit 50 well before Corellia, burned through it and the final part of the quest up to the Emperor. My gear was not even close to Corellia quality.

 

I still did it without LOS or ledges. So it's doable. People who say it isn't doable are doing it wrong, plain and simple.

 

Sure mate.

I did it with a naked level 1 toon and I asked a GM to spawn a second copy of him to make the fight a bit harder.

True story.

[Xenofell]

Finished it on my second attempt using the pillar trick. Cheers for the advice.

 

Have a hilarious screenshot.

 

 

Scourge, we're supposed to be killing the emperor. This is no time for lounging around in your undies.

 

http://i.imgur.com/Qjq52.jpg

 

[Jonlo]

Sure mate.

I did it with a naked level 1 toon and I asked a GM to spawn a second copy of him to make the fight a bit harder.

True story.

 

Sorry, just cause you're not able to do it, doesn't mean no one is.

 

The fight is doable, just way harder than any other story fight in the game.

[MEHColeman]

The fight is doable, just way harder than any other story fight in the game.

Did you save your companion? What AC /spec are you?

[Hyperionthethird]

I was able to do it in 3 attempts, but I also knew what happens from beta (It took me a long time in beta to actually do it however). The biggest part of that was knowing I had to use T7 so I accummulated gear for him as I leveled. I'm specifically not spoilering that because it's absolutely obnoxious that we're required to use a specific companion that we may not have touched since maybe level 15. There's no indication whatsoever until you're halfway through with this quest that this is going to be the case (or if there is, it's so subtle it's very easy to miss).

 

this is highly disappointing i hate t7. it's not just that i'm defense so he's fairly useless, i've grown to hate my little astromech droid and his sinisterly friendly republic propaganda

[Kitran]

 

I attempted this fight last night. Not a single success. Tried the stairs/force push trick. He didn't budge when I pushed him (happens a ton for me in pvp as well). I tried the pillars trick. He casted through them.

 

I dunno what I'm gonna do, likely get my sage healing friend to come help when he has time.

 

[Olekalvo]

I hated t7 before this fight, now I just want to chop him up and sell him as parts. Can I bring another player thats in a group with me into the temple to help out with the quest? Edited January 6, 2012 by Olekalvo

[Magrador]

yeah.

 

i upgradet t7 quite a bit with lvl 40+ blues and greens...still it died way to fast. after that i had 1 emperor and 4 or 5 "clones" killing me within a few seconds.

 

suggestion: bring a friend with you and kill him easy...

 

still i think it's poor design. i dont know if i did something completly wrong, but final quest was not soloable for me.

[kiato]

This quest is a joke, I had two major bugs in it.

 

 

I rushed the empire door, to activate the control pannel I died just in front of it then I choose to revive to the outpost because of the long cooldown.

I spawned just behind the door I couldnt activate the pannel,I couldnt do anything I was stuck in the zone. I had to wait 8 hours to get out of here with the fleet warp.

 

The day after I tried again rushed to the boss, I finally could fight him and get owned as well.

The third try, I just hit him ONCE then he turned green and I could finish the quest.

 

And finally Scourge appeared naked in the cutscene for some reason (btw he had armor equiped in my inventory)

 

 

This was the most painful and bugged quest I have ever done in swtor.

 

I'm so disapointed.

[Naroga]

I couldn't complete it as a Jedi Sentinel with 3 pieces of Champion gear and a fully geared T7.

 

I had to bring a healer friend with me to beat it.

[Felaed]

I couldn't complete it as a Jedi Sentinel with 3 pieces of Champion gear and a fully geared T7.

 

I had to bring a healer friend with me to beat it.

 

And you sir, are the reason I LOVE it when PvP'ers call PvE content easy and mindless.

 

I do both, so this isn't judgement of either group, but still...come on now.

 

It wasn't THAT bad.

[savagecarrot]

"We may lose and we may win though we will never be here again..." was not my experience since I was there again and again and...again. After the initial omg where is doc, my only friend in the whole verse, I had to adjust to T7. Made some changes in playstyle and he wasn't dying half as often and finally he was kinda decent but I had to spend a whole lot of creds to get him there. The whole battle synergy thing goes out the window after such a long time not playing with him. Hate it when I'm forced to do that. I got the emp down to 20% I think and died horribly and that was my best attempt.

 

The same mobs which I had down pat before, suddenly take on new colours with the tin can, colours that I do not like. Make the boss however you want but don't take my doctor away, please.

 

2 things:

 

- Don't force us to use T7 and if you must, give us doc after we save the companion at least.

 

- Make the clones susceptible to force sweep, I know, I know cyclone...but whatever.

[Machtuck]

Played a lot of MMO's, decided to do this one cold turkey, no beta, no forums. Lets just see whats next.

I have enjoyed the storyline immensely on my sentinel, the questlines have been at times challenging, but huge fun.

"Doomsday" is however, a complete CF. Whoever wrote this, a pox on your clan.

T7 is a waste of metal at this point. ***. died six times trying to get to emperor. Fine, this is hard, good enough.

Pretty much insta death on first few pulls emperor. Broke down and checked forums...blah blah LOS, yadda yadda...interupts, ya tried that, etc...

So tried stratgies from forums, still getting 2 shotted by clones and i dont know what the hell else.

Any rate, all medpacks, stims gone, dont think i have the 67 credits to fly back there anyway. About 200,000K spent repairs and medpacks etc...

Quest journal is empty, the emperor wins. all is lost.

Uninstalling and unsubscribing.

[ionutzMiR]

did someone found a way to kill the emperor ?????

[Lewyn]

after a night when i died 6-7 times the day after i kill the emperor at the first try, just use LOS on the pillars on the side of the throne, it takes 8-10 minutes, i use 5 medpacks, just have patience.

[Jotan]

I completed this quest at 49...

 

Go spec combat, so your saber throw (crippling throw) snares the target.

 

I nuked him for the first phase of mobs, then when T7 dies, because he is absolutely useless I kited him.

 

I would crippling throw, and then run down the winding corridor, crippling throw again, rinse, repeat.

 

Took about 15 mintues and felt gimpy and non epic to do it that way, but there is no other option.

 

Reminds me of wow, kite to vaels room

[Bjerven]

I got past the first enemies, and got into the temple solved the puzzle, but the box with T7 equipment is buggd and i cant get the items. I just wonder how BioWare could let something as important as the final quest for a class have this big bugs. I went on to the boss there i got annihilated by it. the sad part is that the game dont give me aces to all the dailys on ilum or belsavis so i cant go and get beather gear and go back im stuck now i can go pvp but i dont whant to do 8h a day pvp do beat my last class quest. Biowar please fix this quest and it needs a bit off adjustment to bo 100% solo quest as you promest the class quest to be. i dont whant to ues bugs or chees it to kill the emperor. so make it a hard but fair fight.

[Joespivey]

So how do I prepare for this fight without the help from a buddy?

[Hanzigh]

I completed this quest when i was level 49, and also hadnt picked up ability improvements for levels 47 and 48.

Granted this quest is the hardest one of the bosses in our story, it is still doable, if you pay attention to what is going on and use your abilities correctly.

I died about 5 or 6 times at first on him as i was in complete shock at how hard he was hitting and was wondering how the hell it was possible.

I gathered that killing all the clones is basically pointless and couldnt see it working in the slightest, so i stood in the middle of the room, sent T7 ( whose gear was pretty poor) to attack. When this happened the emperor would spawn next to me and id use zealous then get all my burns on him etc. I would also pop awe as soon as the clones spawned so that it gave me the time to keep T7 alive as long as possible but also to get as much damage done to the emperor.

Also with having specced into having a reduced cd on kick, i could basically interupt every single one of his powerful spells, using kick and leap and force stasis.

 

So yes it is a hard fight, but you do not need to LoS to defeat him at all, it just takes some time to understand it and use your abilities at the right time.

[Atraiyu]

I died about 7 times on this before I tried the pillar method. I was shocked how well it worked. Basically all of his clones ignore you and go after t7, but with even half way decent gear he can handle them like a champ. The emperor comes after you around the pillar and it becomes easy to target only him and use your interrupts.

 

When all of your interrupts are on cooldown or his clones do come after you, you just switch pillars. Also switch when you see the targeting reticle on the ground for his AOE. Didn't even have to pop most of my cooldowns after getting owned the first several times I tried it.

[newport]

Hey folks!

 

If you are unable to solo this fight, please give us a bit more information as requested below:

 

 

 

1) Did you save your companion?

2) What is your advanced class and tree spec?

 

This fight is designed to be soloable by fully utilizing your interrupts. You should not need to use any LOS tricks, etc, but we will take a look at exactly which circumstances are making this fight undefeatable for some players.

 

 

 

Thanks for your help!

 

My comments below:

 

 

 

Yes-- i saved companion.

 

Guardian-vigilance spec.

 

Unable to do the fight with just interrupts b/c by the time you down the 1st wave adds you are left with like 1/2 life, and I'm in soresu with 14,000 hp. So repeating that for 3 rounds of adds is mathematically impossible. Also force sweep and cyclone slash are not aoe hitting the adds. Is this intended?

 

Without tricks this fight requires superhuman levels of switching targets and interrupting. I've been interrupting on fights ever since I got the skill so its not like I don't use it. I've gotten pretty quick at it but this is a whole new level.

 

Edited January 8, 2012 by newport