(keep it civil) What let you down most about TOR?

[Majirayan]

I was fine up until 1.2 released. They implemented the Ranked Warzone Commendations without Ranked PVP games. That to me killed the game. When 1.3 released and people could finnaly do Ranked PVP, you had people already maxed out in War Hero gear, augmented, all that was left was them getting a rating for the Rated gear. They left the Casual Player out in the dust and rewarded the no lifers with set armor. New guilds and new people starting out in a Rated PVP game will just get demolished simply because of out geared. I don't even want to pvp simply because of the outclass of Expertise everyone has vs the ones who are trying to gear up but cant due to 1500 expertise guilds running in normal PVP queues. A MMO should not be who has the best gear ever, it should involve skill 80% - Gear/Stats 20%

 

I'm gonna give this game a few more months with the F2P and 1.4 releases and see where it goes. If they don't do something about the PVP area, I will probably shelf this along with my other failed MMO series. All I ask, is EA to look at Ratings of groups queuing up before you throw them in Provisional vs 2100 Rated.

Edited August 9, 2012 by Majirayan

[Diktat]

Because 800-900k isn't "well above 800k" as you say. But it is "well above" 500k and just under 1 million as they said in the earnings call.

1st... you don't know what "well above" is for an EA lawyer or PR, It could be a number as low as 10K.

2nd... hide the real number under a vague sentence that put said number between X and 2 times X only means that that number is closer to X than to 2 times X.

3rd... they can't publicly admit that are near X because that's really bad so they try fool people with such wiiiiide range to minimize the damage to the shares value.

4th... we had a concrete number in previous quarter: 1.3M subs. The only reason to not give a concrete number this time is that that number is so bad that they can't plublish it.

5th... with 800K-900K subs the game wouldn't go f2p ever.

6th... cows doesn't have wings and can't fly, however you are free to believe they can fly.

Edited August 10, 2012 by Diktat

[WrecklessMEDIC]

1st... you don't know what "well above" is for an EA lawyer or PR, It could be a number as low as 10K.

2nd... hide the real number under a vague sentence that put said number between X and 2 times X only means that that number is closer to X than to 2 times X.

3rd... they can't publicly admit that are near X because that's really bad so they try fool people with such wiiiiide range to minimize the damage to the shares value.

4th... we had a concrete number in previous quarter: 1.3M subs. The only reason to not give a concrete number this time is that that number is so bad that they can't plublish it.

5th... with 800K-900K subs the game wouldn't go f2p ever.

6th... cows doesn't have wings and can't fly, however you are free to believe they can fly.

 

It's all a matter of perspective. Some people interpret "well above 500k" and "just slipped below 1 million" to mean it's closer to 500k. Others interpret that to mean it's closer to the million mark.

 

All depends on whether you're an optimist or pessimist really. But they never said they were barely over 500k which is the way some people choose to look at it.

[bannsider]

HK47 not being a jedi comp broke my heart, though HK51 seems to be a clone which is a very good thing

[Blattan]

Lazy Coding (To be clear, I was not looking for lazy coding, and didn't get enough. )

 

This goes beyond the usual "they reused <number> of assets" gripe, although you have to admit the amount of reused assets in a game that took this long to develop is kind of staggering.

Of course, the usual "counter" to a statement like this is "where is your AAA MMO, huh?" Well, I don't need one. I am not an expert, nor am I claiming to be one. I do code. I have not earned any money from my coding (yet), so I would classify myself as a hobbyist. As far as experience, I would say my experience falls below "expert," but well above "amateur." If you can believe a statement such as that.

 

And I look at things in game and it completely breaks any immersion in the game. I have to stop and wonder "people actually got paid to ship that crap!??"

 

Some examples:

 

• Glitchy cut scene animation: Now, I allow a whole lot of slack when I spacebar through a scene, or escape out to reenter it. That could simply be the engine trying hard to catch up to my actions. I am talking more about two models not even having their mouths touch during a kiss scene. All items being handed off "off camera" because they either couldn't, or didn't, care enough to get item handling to look right. The weapon in the hand of my character as they point and gesture at an NPC that they are trying to be friendly with. That kind of stuff.
  
• Clipping: Holy hell is there a lot of clipping. It seems to be common knowledge that there is a separate art team from all other teams. If this isn't the case, this point is reduced greatly. But look at all the clipping. The clipping is bad enough that they disable some visuals just to avoid players from seeing how bad things clip. If they don't disable visuals, sometimes they alter them (in less than flattering ways) in order to "slap a band-aid" over the problem. "Force users butt" is one example.
  Sidearm/weapons clip with any robe or jacket. It wouldn't be so bad, but every class has a weapon they holster on their hip.
  Robe style tops that have tails (front, or back) clip with robe style bottoms. Especially while moving.
  Miraluka eye coverings clip with nearly everything.
  The Cathar companion Aric Jordan is so ****** his trooper helmet goggles are inside his head. Let us see Chuck Norris do that!
  Now I don't expect every item to come out perfect. But this level of clipping should pretty much be embarrassing for the art department.
  
• Color variance for item diversity: Really? A separate color scheme warrants a whole new set of items? Is this used as a way to pad resumes? "Responsible for thousands of gear items in SW:TOR." To bad that it is just a couple of hundred pieces with half a dozen color schems.
  
• The same tired old "character name must be unique:" That is so 2006.
  
• Immobile while casting: This is likely to be a thing of the past rather soon.

 

There is more, but I don't really feel like typing it all out.

 

I'll close with the rhetorical questions: "If this game didn't have the Star Wars theme and IP, would you still be playing the game? If you say yes, are you playing other MMOs or online games? If you say no to that, then why not?"

My point being, once you peel away the story and theme/IP, all you are really left with is a mediocre MMO. A mediocre MMO that feels like some one was trying to pass it off under the "sauce" of Star Wars, thinking no one would notice.

 

Bah! Lazy Coding is certainly what let me down the most about TOR...

Edited August 10, 2012 by Blattan

[Diora]

The same thing that lets me down in every new game to hit the market these days:

 

The media, community, and gamers who overhype and place expectations on the game that can never ever be met, then scream "FAILURE" when the game isn't perfect. No game is perfect at launch. None. Never. But Gamers nowadays have lost all perspective and want perfection NOW. So They cry on the forums and in their little blogs and on the fansites. So Developers start changing things trying to please the customers, ALL the customers, when in reality, everyone knows you just CAN'T please everyone.

 

It's called "requirements creep" in defense acquisition, and it's the same thing here. And it kills every new game.

 

I maintain there will never be another "successful" MMO launch, not because the games are bad, but because the gamERS won't allow them to be.

[JunkyardWolf]

too many generic missions for planets. you know like when you get sent to Taris and think to yourself," Self ! do i really want to do those again?"

[BeenThere]

People are saying there are 800k to 500k in subscriptions , if there are where are they ......I think there are about 50k active players if that on any given day spread across 12 standard to heavy servers...all the rest of the servers are locked with one to none on them ...I have 52 characters on 12 locked servers that are ghost towns dead so how is this game even begining to come out of this sink hole...the end started when they offered free to play up to level 15 , and they still couldn't get players to come back , or start to play. now they are going for F2P up to level 50 in hopes they can stop the bleeding , and EA is in charge of pulling the plug , lay offs of developers , the doctors have not been heard from at all.......It's that dead quiet just before the storm. To little to, late.......Been There before ....

[SamuraBob_Fl]

Probably crafting/customization.

 

Crafting simply isn't a viable source of endgame gear, as you can get better drops, and I wish I could have taken the mods out of Tionese/Columi to put in orange gear without losing my set bonuses.

[BlueCorsair]

The PvE at end-game, or lack thereof.

 

This game has always been largely marketed as a PvE game; quality questing, story, engaging tough foes with friends, etc. etc.

 

I think we all remember the 'beating on one large enemy in a raid is not heroic' speech, given by a developer in a video. What did we get? Tonnes of fights that are exactly that.

 

I think we also remember how we were promised story and interactivity in raids/flash-points. After Black Talon & Esseles, though, this more or less stops. There is no more branching (i.e. being able to choose a different path), and there is very little story.

 

What this leaves for a seasoned raider like me is a 'less than' version of World of Warcraft. Why play ToR PvE end-game when WoW does it better? This game was supposed to enhance and improve on WoW's PvE, and it failed miserably.

[Nellsterzzz]

The fact that I can solo, as I did lastnight, for 1.5 hours at level 22 and gain 2 levels. That I did so while being under-equipped and only had my companion die twice and me once for a total death penalty of a 10 second wait for the rez timer and 387credits to repair.

 

In other words... what let me down the most is that TOR is the simplest, fastest, and least challenging MMO I have ever played.

 

You think its simple? Your level 22, quests aren't meant to be difficult? Since when were MMO's supposed to have a difficulty progression that is equivalent to Inferno Mode on Diablo? Just as an example, when you get to upper 30's and 40's you won't be solo'ing anything. If you are able to get through it without help, then you're not that under geared....

[Blattan]

For a less serious point:

 

The lack of Sexism complaints.

 

Seriously. Sexism is all the rage lately. Especially in games and gaming cultures. I am surprised there isn't any movement to claim SW:TOR is sexist.

 

Take the cutscenes. How many of them do not have a shot of a tight *** or crotch in them? My favorite is when the character of focus is in the background of the shot, but the "camera" is behind and slightly below the character not in focus. Then the tight *** takes up nearly half the screen!

[CosmicKat]

You think its simple? Your level 22, quests aren't meant to be difficult? Since when were MMO's supposed to have a difficulty progression that is equivalent to Inferno Mode on Diablo? Just as an example, when you get to upper 30's and 40's you won't be solo'ing anything. If you are able to get through it without help, then you're not that under geared....

 

I haven't seen anything other than bosses up to 30th that I can't solo, usually easily. I can solo bosses but my companion usually drops, and I can too if I'm not paying attention. I haven't seen any difficulty progression at all from 1-30. Fighting mob's of my level feels exactly the same at 30 as it did at 5. I've never played any other MMO that didn't ramp up the challenge as you levelled, or the pace for that matter. The PvE combat is easy. The levelling is supersonic.

 

Heroic quests are sometimes tough when you are the same level. However, if you can get a group that knows what they are doing (rare), they are just as easy.

 

I'm not saying "I'm awesome". I think anyone with a pulse could breeze through this game based on my experiences from 1-30. I'm not saying you are wrong, but if TOR does get significantly harder post-30, it would shock me because that would be the complete opposite of the 1-30 game design.

 

P.S. I haven't seen above 30 cause I have a jillion alts, I like to take my time, and I generally prefer lower levels in MMO's to higher ones.

[HammersteinSW]

Apart from the failures in game design and the disappointment that was Ilum it was probably the lack of Star Wars atmosphere - or rather the lack of any atmosphere or character at all. The game is like the prequels, a squeaky clean, generic product without soul.

 

Here's an example:

 

When I came to Dromund Kaas and entered the Sith hq there was no feeling of threat or of manipulative Sith Lords watching your every step. Instead you had your feared Sith sitting in their small offices, doing what exactly ? It did not feel like the heart of evil but more like walking into the headquarters of a huge ministry or some global corporation - maybe walking into the EA headquarters feels like that. Instead of scheming Sith you had a lot of pencil pushers sitting in their cubicles doing nothing scary or evil at all. A rather cool or detached government ministry will probably have the same air to it. There is no evil there, just red tape and boredom.

 

Its actually what I would have expected from the light side, since the Lucas prequels really stress that. The prequel jedi are a stoic bunch of guys who live in their ivory tower without understanding what is going on around them. And this detachment ultimately leads to their downfall. A certain bureaucratic coolness, with lives centered around traditions and regulations without passion.

 

For the Sith I expected a much more vivid and passionate style, Instead you get towers of cold metal filled with little offices where Sith Lords slave away at their computers. The game is really missing all the little things that create an immersive world.

Edited August 10, 2012 by HammersteinSW

[xorcist]

1. First and foremost the game Engine, and it's short comings/limitations. This contributes to the graphical limitations, light and shadows, the sounds, the bugs, certain details and features that could add life to a lifeless world.

 

2. Character creation. The limited species, the ugly design, the ugly + undesirable selections for hair (no long hair options), face, body, tattoo's, etc... The limitations to customization for individuality. This may all be associated to number 1. I'm not an expert.

 

3. For the most part, incredibly ugly, and poorly designed gear. Either did not look or felt like it belonged in the Star Wars universe. And if it did, should not have been an option. Those designs should not have been approved.

 

4.Choices in story. All roads lead to Rome, and there is very little consequence for any decision made. Certainly nothing life altering to your character. Light/Dark side points inconsequential to how your story unfolds. Does not open new opportunities or send you down a different path.

 

5. Black lightsabers. The look is undesirable. Nuff said.

 

Overall I'm enjoying the game despite these gripes. Think of how much better and more enjoyable the game would be if the points I've outlined were not an issue and done right the first time. The game Engine is the foundation that an MMO sits on. If its poor then everything else suffers sitting on it.

Edited August 12, 2012 by xorcist

[cornearian]

i think the thing that bugs me the most about this game, is the fact that they will fix one problem, and create ten more, by the time they get the ten problems fixed, some of the old problems will now be a problem again, and the last problem they fixed is still a problem.

[Catsmeat]

My one big issue is the still incomplete transfer scheme. I wish their time-line was for faster final resolution of this rather than the lingering unfinished "thing" that it is.

 

We had weeks of voluntary transfers. Origin servers are closed and those trapped on them (full destination server) still have no firm idea when they can play their characters again on a populated server.

 

Since about one week into the free transfers phase when my server became a ghost-town I've not enjoyed playing my characters at all. My destination server holds my 50's.

 

This transfer scheme split friends and guild-mates. That is the glue of MMOs.

 

Some day maybe they'll finish up this project of theirs to consolidate the servers (we still have no set dates). For those stuck until it is resolved the game is just one huge frustration. If I had designed this whole system myself it would have run its course in two weeks max and would have had a safety net for players whose characters could become trapped.

 

For crying out loud we are still trapped now at 2 months. Ridiculous way to treat customers you wish to keep. Even though I do love this game I'm at my wits end.

Edited August 10, 2012 by Catsmeat

[MCesca]

"What let you down most about TOR?"

 

The forum community and it's high percentage of active trolls.

[Thyferra]

There are many things about this game i like. I love that Questing feels like something worth doing. Voice adds so much to questing. I can't belive how much it adds.

Flashpoints, Operations, even Space Missions and the different Warzones are all well done. Some of the best instances i have played.

 

But what i miss most is fluff.

-Planets are too small to just wander around and explore. Only Alderaan, Hoth and Tattooine felt kind of open to me.

-Ther are no activities outside normal gameplay. Something like a Dejarek Table or Podracing would go a long way.

-No Housing. In EQ2 whenever i got nothing to do i was hanging out in my house and was decorating. It is just a relaxing feature that every MMO should have.

 

Beside the fluff i miss free spcae combat. This is a Star Wars game afterall. Space Combat belongs here.

 

While i am not a fan of tedious crafting i think this game needed something like it. Crafting in this game is the most boring crafting ever. A mix of the resource gathering of SWG and the actual crafting of Vanguard would have been awesome.

 

The engine is just horrible.

[KrazieFox]

(keep it civil) What let you down most about TOR?

 

 

Forced Server Transfers.

 

As a player who bought Pre Order in order to gain Early Access to get my character names & who played primarily a single character in order to unlock my 'Legacy' & gain my real surname as my Legacy Name I am horrified to then have EA/BioWare disregard the time & effort I put in

[Tessaril]

Patch 1.2

Let's face it, that is when this game started a massive decline. I am willing to accept all other problems as "the game is new and needs time to grow".

The simplistic healing mechanics, the underdeveloped raids, the unbalanced PvP, the massive bugs that still persist 6 months on, lack of cross server group finder, I can accept all of that but 1.2?

 

What patch 1.2 demonstrated to me is that there is something wrong with the design philosophy of this game, and that more time will only make it worse not better.

I'm a healer, I have played one in practically every MMO since Everquest, and I think patch 1.2 had a devastating effect on what little healing community this game had.

 

No one is arguing healing is too hard, or we lack raw HPS, the problem is the mechanics. The developers removed from this game the advanced mechanics that made healing as a sorc or mercenary feel somewhat fluid and dynamic, now we are on a "rotation", how fun.

 

To make it worse, PvP, the only end game aspect of this game that was somewhat entertaining is now horrid thanks to off the charts TTK and a "resilience will fix it" mentality.

I hope one day the developers will understand that healing is an important part of the game, and find better ways to balance classes without removing mechanics.

[TheNegotiator]

1. The ridiculous amount of hype created by the player base during development

2. The WoW culture...it's disgusting

3. Copying the combat format from another game

[VanguVegro]

3) Load times.

2) Maintenance.

1) The forum community. (The words "wretched hive of scum and villainy" come to mind.)

Edited August 11, 2012 by VanguVegro

[markyboy]

1. It's too Star Wars (Movies) when it should be Totally Old Republic.....ie YT 1300 wreckage etc....

 

2. The game engine is useless for a game of this scope.

 

3. Story content is over too soon and is very quick to get through.

 

4. Too easy to "Max-out" your characters (have 2 50's fully campaigned and more on the way)

 

5. Space is just an on the rails shooter..........Why didn't they just Copy SWG Jump to Lightspeed????

 

6. NO PC Wookies, Rodians, Trandoshans, etc...

 

7. WHERE'S THE NEW CONTENT!!!!!!

 

8. Ummmmm oh yeah, WHERE'S THE NEW CONTENT!!!!!!

 

9. Am getting very, very bored and starting to look for other games despite absolutely loving this game!

[cool-dude]

Many things let me down about SWTOR, which is why I canceled my subscription. Here is just a few things that let me down in SWTOR.

 

1. I cannot play as a Torguta, which is the race I want to play.

2. Nothing in legacy interests me.

3. Most of the available classes do not interest me, with the exception of the Assassin/Shadow that is a hybrid class. When I played games like Dragon Age, I liked to be an Arcane Warrior, which is like your darkness Assassin in SWTOR. In RPG games in general, I like to be hybrid classes.

 

There are other things too, but these three things are important to me as a SWTOR player. If I cannot play a race that I like, or a class that I want to be, and if there is nothing that I feel the need to work towards, I'll just stop playing.

 

Just has to do with me being able to really get into a game.

Edited August 11, 2012 by cool-dude