I now have a new perspective on Recruit gear

[Astarica]

Let me first say that of course Recruit gear makes you perform better. This isn't about whether they're inadequate.

 

I recently rerolled an alt again and took him through 10-49 again and plan to lose my way to BM. So I took the Recruit token, sold it for 300K and used it to buy speeder training level 3 and got my WH offhand and proceeded to start losing in the 50 bracket.

 

And of course you get the 'omg you need recruit gear' which is no surprise.

 

What's surprising is then you see the guys who tell you that you need recruit gear generally are much worse than you. For example in one game I did 80K damage, while the guy telling me I need to buy recruit gear did 60K damage. We're both pure DPS so we have no secondary functions. As you can surmise from these numbers I got totally owned in that game, but there were 3 guys who did less than 80K damage who weren't DPS. It was a standard 'totally owned' game so there was nothing strategic to defend since we lost the game as soon as it started so it's not like you could be doing low number because you're doing something else useful.

 

There was another case I was defending a node with another guy, that guy got attacked and died and I called for help relatively late, and we lose the node. Obviously it was my fault because the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned. Incredibly, while I'm wearing literally random stuff I found on the ground on this character, and the other guy with me inspected me to repeatedly tell me my gear sucks, it never occurred to this guy that we're probably going to lose an obvious 2on2 so he should call for help.

 

So if I indeed bought the Recruit gear what I am doing is essentially carrying guys who are way better geared than me who are inexplicably bad. Sorry, this isn't happening. I'm used to carry people on my WH gear characters, but even if the world doesn't plan on returning the favor when I'm on alt, I certainly don't expect to be carrying the team in Recruit gear. After I lose my 100th game I may feel merciful and go back to carrying the team again. My WZ numbers says I am somehow doing around average amongst teammates in my similar classification (maybe because I picked a good FOTM to reroll) so I think I pulled more than my expected weight. Yes I can do better, but not for the guys who are incredibly doing worse than me. If everyone is doing better than me, which is what should happen, I'll think about buying more Recruit gear. Until that happens, I'm going to save my credits as long as I'm with the guy who is somehow worse than me in BM gear while I'm wearing level 40 blues.

[PowerReaper]

So let me get this straight, you took the 300k Token (bad enough your a PvPers and didn't get the gear), and spent it on speeder piloting. Sigh . . .

[Totaltrash]

Let me first say that of course Recruit gear makes you perform better. This isn't about whether they're inadequate.

 

I recently rerolled an alt again and took him through 10-49 again and plan to lose my way to BM. So I took the Recruit token, sold it for 300K and used it to buy speeder training level 3 and got my WH offhand and proceeded to start losing in the 50 bracket.

 

And of course you get the 'omg you need recruit gear' which is no surprise.

 

<snip> TLDR

 

Ahh, a new twist from the PVE'ers:

 

1) Spend the token money on anything but recruit gear

2) Check post-screen damage to find someone who did worse, then use that as "proof" that you don't need expertise.

3) Compare tactical errors to gear/expertise (which have nothing to do with each other) to further bolster your "proof"

4) Ruin more warzones for the real PVP'ers

 

Yes, there are people in expertise gear that play worse than you - but you still die in 10 seconds, over and over.

Trust me, you ain't "carrying" nothing and nobody, don't delude yourself.

 

So, unless you are on the other team, get the hell outta of my warzones!

[heechJunzi]

The guy with better gear in your story sounds like he's not very good at pvp.

 

You, on the other hand, sound like a d-bag.

[Evil_Santa]

OP Failed to realized that dude with 60k dmg in the warzone was either guarding a node, or playing hutt-ball

[Monterone]

Taking money from the token and then entering warzones with practically no expertise and sabotaging games for others who may not have time to play over and over all day is about the douche-baggiest thing I've heard on this forum.

 

You, sir, get a special d-bag commendation!

[Leiralei]

It's stupid to rag on someone in full Rakata to get recruit gear especially if they're a decently-mobile healer. I still recommend to at least fill the left half of slots with recruit, but keep your set bonus until you get enough BM!

[Synxos]

The fact that you think damage is the sole determiner of how well someone does in a WZ proves just how little you know about pvp....

that and that you didn't get recruit gear. That mostly proves your an a-hole tho.

[Synxos]

It's stupid to rag on someone in full Rakata to get recruit gear especially if they're a decently-mobile healer. I still recommend to at least fill the left half of slots with recruit, but keep your set bonus until you get enough BM!

This guy doesn't have rakata gear....

While I agree, that rakata gear is nothing to rag on someone about. I will call someone stupid if they say Rakata gear is better for pvp than recruit gear. And yes, it has happened quite a few times before. They actually didn't even say recruit. They went so far as to say Rakata was better than BM gear.

[criminalheretic]

Let me first say that of course Recruit gear makes you perform better. This isn't about whether they're inadequate.

 

I recently rerolled an alt again and took him through 10-49 again and plan to lose my way to BM. So I took the Recruit token, sold it for 300K and used it to buy speeder training level 3 and got my WH offhand and proceeded to start losing in the 50 bracket.

 

And of course you get the 'omg you need recruit gear' which is no surprise.

 

What's surprising is then you see the guys who tell you that you need recruit gear generally are much worse than you. For example in one game I did 80K damage, while the guy telling me I need to buy recruit gear did 60K damage. We're both pure DPS so we have no secondary functions. As you can surmise from these numbers I got totally owned in that game, but there were 3 guys who did less than 80K damage who weren't DPS. It was a standard 'totally owned' game so there was nothing strategic to defend since we lost the game as soon as it started so it's not like you could be doing low number because you're doing something else useful.

 

There was another case I was defending a node with another guy, that guy got attacked and died and I called for help relatively late, and we lose the node. Obviously it was my fault because the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned. Incredibly, while I'm wearing literally random stuff I found on the ground on this character, and the other guy with me inspected me to repeatedly tell me my gear sucks, it never occurred to this guy that we're probably going to lose an obvious 2on2 so he should call for help.

 

So if I indeed bought the Recruit gear what I am doing is essentially carrying guys who are way better geared than me who are inexplicably bad. Sorry, this isn't happening. I'm used to carry people on my WH gear characters, but even if the world doesn't plan on returning the favor when I'm on alt, I certainly don't expect to be carrying the team in Recruit gear. After I lose my 100th game I may feel merciful and go back to carrying the team again. My WZ numbers says I am somehow doing around average amongst teammates in my similar classification (maybe because I picked a good FOTM to reroll) so I think I pulled more than my expected weight. Yes I can do better, but not for the guys who are incredibly doing worse than me. If everyone is doing better than me, which is what should happen, I'll think about buying more Recruit gear. Until that happens, I'm going to save my credits as long as I'm with the guy who is somehow worse than me in BM gear while I'm wearing level 40 blues.

 

You lost me at "the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned". I mean I get that you are being sarcastic, but you're still saying it was more his responsibility than yours, to call for help.

Edited August 4, 2012 by criminalheretic

[Astarica]

You lost me at "the first guy who was attacked probably can't call for help while he was stunned". I mean I get that you are being sarcastic, but you're still saying it was more his responsibility than yours, to call for help.

 

Oh no I'm not saying he should be responsible for calling the help. I'm saying I called for help versus the guy who did not call for help at the same node and yet the guy who never called for help blamed on the guy who called for help late, no doubt because my gear was gimp. Based on my experience in WZ calling for help would not have mattered anyway but at least I tried to call for help versus the guy who did not.

 

Another case in oint. Just finished a WZ, 8 DPS in Huttball that we lost 2-0. Was 4th in DPS and 4th in objective points. Everyone besides me was obviously BM or better geared and I'm still wearing next to nothing, and even if I had full Recruit gear I don't see how I'm not pulling my weight by doing better than half of the people in objective + DPS.

 

There was no complaint about gear this time though there was a guy who told everyone how we all suck at Huttball. He came in last in DPS and last in objective points. Now obviously there are 3 guys who did way better than I did (my numbers were nothing special) and if they say "Your numbers are good for your gear but we might have won if you bought that recruit gear" I can take that as valid criticsm (though won't necessarily change my mind), but the guy doing the criticsm is often the guy who came in last in everything and I'm not going to waste credits bailing these guys out.

 

Look, of course I get that having Recruit gear is better than not having Recruit gear, but the reason for me to buy this gear isn't to cover guys who need to L2P first because they're somehow worse than me while I am wearing next to nothing.

[Wefi]

So let me get this straight, you took the 300k Token (bad enough your a PvPers and didn't get the gear), and spent it on speeder piloting. Sigh . . .

 

i took it on my fresh 50.

I had 2400 WH tokens, and max Wz.

 

I bout my BM armor, then converted my WH into Wz tokens which i got all of the BM pieces but the wrist, belt, and boots. the rest was Recruit.

[Evil_Santa]

Another case in oint. Just finished a WZ, 8 DPS in Huttball that we lost 2-0. Was 4th in DPS and 4th in objective points. Everyone besides me was obviously BM or better geared and I'm still wearing next to nothing, and even if I had full Recruit gear I don't see how I'm not pulling my weight by doing better than half of the people in objective + DPS.

 

You lost, case in point.

 

I play a DPS sorc in hutt-ball and often my Damage is > 100k, and while i play forward as a position for juggs to intercede to, as well as use my sorc pull often to move the ball carrier forward, i don't gain any objective points for those two actions.

 

So are you going to say that you're a bigger contributor to your team over me?

[Cymate]

The main problem was that the other guy couldn't call inc cuz he was stoned bad Edited August 4, 2012 by Cymate

[criminalheretic]

Oh no I'm not saying he should be responsible for calling the help. I'm saying I called for help versus the guy who did not call for help at the same node and yet the guy who never called for help blamed on the guy who called for help late, no doubt because my gear was gimp. Based on my experience in WZ calling for help would not have mattered anyway but at least I tried to call for help versus the guy who did not.

 

Another case in oint. Just finished a WZ, 8 DPS in Huttball that we lost 2-0. Was 4th in DPS and 4th in objective points. Everyone besides me was obviously BM or better geared and I'm still wearing next to nothing, and even if I had full Recruit gear I don't see how I'm not pulling my weight by doing better than half of the people in objective + DPS.

 

There was no complaint about gear this time though there was a guy who told everyone how we all suck at Huttball. He came in last in DPS and last in objective points. Now obviously there are 3 guys who did way better than I did (my numbers were nothing special) and if they say "Your numbers are good for your gear but we might have won if you bought that recruit gear" I can take that as valid criticsm (though won't necessarily change my mind), but the guy doing the criticsm is often the guy who came in last in everything and I'm not going to waste credits bailing these guys out.

 

Look, of course I get that having Recruit gear is better than not having Recruit gear, but the reason for me to buy this gear isn't to cover guys who need to L2P first because they're somehow worse than me while I am wearing next to nothing.

 

I can't really argue with that. I personally bought recruit gear with my last 50, cause it was free, and it seemed like the right thing to do. Although I admit before they gave the tokens with my previous 50's, I did not spend my money on it.

 

I suppose it comes down to whether you want to do the best you can, or just not be the worst.

[NoTomorrow]

Yes because tier 3 speeder piloting is what you need to be good at pvp

[Astarica]

I can't really argue with that. I personally bought recruit gear with my last 50, cause it was free, and it seemed like the right thing to do. Although I admit before they gave the tokens with my previous 50's, I did not spend my money on it.

 

I suppose it comes down to whether you want to do the best you can, or just not be the worst.

 

Sure, I respect that, but I don't want someone to tell me I can do better when they're playing inexplicably bad themselves. On my weaker alts I usually buy Recruit since otherwise my numbers would indeed be a total embarssment. In this particular character I felt being an overpowered FOTM was enough to get me through while I get my BM gear, and my numbers (generally middle of pack in DPS/objectives) seems to support that being a FOTM OP reroller lets you get away with a bit more than other less fortunate classes.

 

Did people miss the fact that I said I had my WH offhand when I hit level 50? This isn't a whine about their availability or whatever because if things like that bothered me I wouldn't have a WH offhand the moment I hit 50. Even if I have WH offhand + full recruit obviously you should expect to lose your way to BM at least (until that point you're still inferior to the average character so of course your team is at a significant disadvantage). It is not possible for a new character to start out on even ground even with full Recruit gear. You have to go through a losing phase before things turn better. I respect those who buy Recruit but even they go through a period of medicority. I'd bet you everything I ran into happens to the guy who has full Recruit + 3500 ranked WZ as well, though he only has to put up with it for a shorter time.

[-Holmes]

So, back to the time when you seemingly did a 2v2 on a node.

 

Let's say the guy who was better geared deals 30% of that guy's HP before he dies, then the enemy comes to smash on you. He's at 70% health. The other is at full.

 

In trash drops that you got from quests and mobs, you'd last about 10 seconds. Likely it was even less. Calling for backup late can be a silly mistake, and it's always implied that no matter who you are, you call that inc as soon as you see it. No excuses.

 

Now, if you were in recruit gear, you might have been able to use some medpacs, hit some defensive buffs and kite those mofos around the turret till you got someone to back you up. That in turn, would have kept the turret safe and at the end of the game, you might get an MVP or two.

 

For someone who claims he's got a full WH toon, you seem to forget defending 101.

[Skolops]

Sure, I respect that, but I don't want someone to tell me I can do better when they're playing inexplicably bad themselves. On my weaker alts I usually buy Recruit since otherwise my numbers would indeed be a total embarssment. In this particular character I felt being an overpowered FOTM was enough to get me through while I get my BM gear, and my numbers (generally middle of pack in DPS/objectives) seems to support that being a FOTM OP reroller lets you get away with a bit more than other less fortunate classes.

 

Did people miss the fact that I said I had my WH offhand when I hit level 50? This isn't a whine about their availability or whatever because if things like that bothered me I wouldn't have a WH offhand the moment I hit 50. Even if I have WH offhand + full recruit obviously you should expect to lose your way to BM at least (until that point you're still inferior to the average character so of course your team is at a significant disadvantage). It is not possible for a new character to start out on even ground even with full Recruit gear. You have to go through a losing phase before things turn better. I respect those who buy Recruit but even they go through a period of medicority. I'd bet you everything I ran into happens to the guy who has full Recruit + 3500 ranked WZ as well, though he only has to put up with it for a shorter time.

 

If you're any good, you can still make a contribution in Recruit gear. I still topped the charts in damage often enough when my Gunslinger was in Recruit. Sure, you are most likely going to lose 1 on 1s and not be able to be "the man," but you can ABSOLUTELY make a contribution which, without that 800 expertise, you really can't.

[Astarica]

So, back to the time when you seemingly did a 2v2 on a node.

 

Let's say the guy who was better geared deals 30% of that guy's HP before he dies, then the enemy comes to smash on you. He's at 70% health. The other is at full.

 

In trash drops that you got from quests and mobs, you'd last about 10 seconds. Likely it was even less. Calling for backup late can be a silly mistake, and it's always implied that no matter who you are, you call that inc as soon as you see it. No excuses.

 

Now, if you were in recruit gear, you might have been able to use some medpacs, hit some defensive buffs and kite those mofos around the turret till you got someone to back you up. That in turn, would have kept the turret safe and at the end of the game, you might get an MVP or two.

 

For someone who claims he's got a full WH toon, you seem to forget defending 101.

 

Way to play the hypothetical hero and be sure to talk about WZ consumables that nobody uses while gearing up.

 

Actually what happened was the guy complaining died without doing any damage to the attacker and the same thing happened to me. I'm not sure how many times I have to say this, but the entire team was incredibly bad. It has to be just the fact that while wearing almost nothing I still had higher leaderboard numbers than a few guys (who didn't quit). We also had stuff like Sentinels running to fight a Juggernaut 1on1 and lose while doing 0 damage to the Juggernaut.

 

It's really hilarious people are actually making statement in the form of "If you had Recruit gear..." I'm not going to say Recruit gear is useless against BM let alone WH augged characters, but if you think Recruit gear stops a BM let alone any stronger character for any period of time you must have some serious playing issues. After all the guy I was with had no problem of pulling I "can't type because I was stunned' deal while wearing at least BM gear.

[Astarica]

If you're any good, you can still make a contribution in Recruit gear. I still topped the charts in damage often enough when my Gunslinger was in Recruit. Sure, you are most likely going to lose 1 on 1s and not be able to be "the man," but you can ABSOLUTELY make a contribution which, without that 800 expertise, you really can't.

 

Gunslinger is a DPS classification above most DPS classes (i.e. equally geared Gunslinger will easily out damage most DPS) so that's not saying much. I actually had #2 in DPS in one of the games, not that this means anything significant but I'd like to think coming second in DPS means I did my fair share of work. I usually come in around middle in a standard 8 DPS game in DPS and objectives. Yeah I can actually do more than that, but I'm not trying to work a miracle in every game I play. It'd be like asking the best player on your team who has the best leaderboard numbers how come he didn't do so much to win the game by himself? Yeah he might actually be able to do it, or maybe everyone else can do their fair share of the work. I've had games on my main where I did twice the DPS of the next closest guy. It'd generally be far easier if all the other guy stepped up their games as opposed to me figuring out how to do triple the DPS of the closest guy.

 

Realistically even full Recruit geared guys have no business being in the middle of the pack amongst 8 DPS assuming all are at least BM geared. Sure I know I got there because the rest of my team sucked, so it's okay for some people to simply do less by sucking but it's not okay to do less by having lesser gear? I don't yell at people who do incredibly bad due to being bad in the game, which hurts just as much if not more than a lack of gear. I mean if you yell at everyone for sucking at least you're consistent, but if you don't then singling any particular thing is just hypocritical. You might as well yell at someone for being an Arsenal Merc. That's probably more likely to cost your team the game than almost any skill/gear based stuff because the class is just so weak right now. Actually I know people who will do exactly that, so I'll at least give them points for being a consistent hater.

[SapoDoode]

Wow you are really selfish OP. You're bringing down every team you join just to save yourself a few credits.

[Acorns_Malfurion]

WTB mod slots to recruit gear (pref. chest) :0

 

-Just like the look of it for Jedi Guardians. Battlemaster is an ugly brown color with the missing back-pack thing.

[Racter]

Wow you are really selfish OP. You're bringing down every team you join just to save yourself a few credits.

 

Not even save, waste on 10% extra speeder speed. OP is definitely an ******e. Also, sidenote, Rakata is worse then recruit gear for PVP. Pretty sure Rakata is worse than BM for PVE and utterly worthless comparatively in PVP. Use main stat/end augs, that's the only improvement over BM gear for PVE. Ta-da.

 

You sound like that Mara I two shotted all night in an ACW a while ago. That specific scenario you described went down pretty similarly, except my partner and I killed both of you in <3s. They were in junk PVE gear, too.

[Sinemetu]

I don't understand not getting recruit gear. Even if you don't plan to PvP, it's still better than leveling blues and greens by a long shot. And it really does hurt your team. I'm not in amazing gear (just under 1200 expertise and around 20k hp as a tankassin) but today I was able to cap 1v2 vs some shadows alderaan because neither had pvp gear at all. You just get shredded in PvE gear; skill hardly enters into it unless you count not getting targeted.