A new level cap just might be the gamebreaker for me

[Suromir]

bottom line then...MMO's are not for you. This is how they work. how they NEED to work.

 

if they were gonna lock us in at 50 for the life of the game then why bother adding levels at all? just make tiered gear treadmills.

 

8 years playing MMO's where 99% of them do this..and you still call it a gamebreaker??? lol

 

took you a long time but maybe you're realizing that MMO's aren't your thing. it's how they work. how they NEED to work.

 

see carrot. run after carrot. catch carrot. add more carrot's.

 

and as someone else pointed out..not increasing the level cap leads to it being stagnant. If you're going after iLvl 6x gear now....but they don't raise level cap and add iLvl 7x gear...it's basically the same thing.

 

make some sense man.

[Alavastre]

Its more or less that generally speaking, raising your level cap so early is bad because it invalidates all of the previous content.

 

Ergo, most developers only do it when they have a ton of fresh new content.

 

So, Coruscant invalidates Tython? I don't really get this argument. You're supposed to progress, you're supposed to do new things with new stories. It doesn't invalidate the older stuff just because it's there.

[Frostvein]

So, Coruscant invalidates Tython? I don't really get this argument. You're supposed to progress, you're supposed to do new things with new stories. It doesn't invalidate the older stuff just because it's there.

 

It invalidates the level 50 ops and flashpoints as a source of repeatable content.

 

You wont be chain running any of them because the new level cap, area and gear makes the rewards obsolete. Problem is, there won't be nearly as much new content to run.

 

Ergo, you just created a situation where you effectively cut down the amount of end game content instead of expanding it.

Edited June 6, 2012 by Frostvein

[MasterKayote]

No. Just more levels. Which is what I wrote. Please spare me the automated fanbot defense.

I'm perfectly fine with more skills and items. Adding more levels though means everything you can do in the endgame now is essentialy a waste of time (as much as that can be said in a game anyway). The inner collector in me doesn't get hooked by the though of working hard to finish sets that I know will not be usable anymore within a short span of time. The new stuff might be absolutely awesome but it does kill my motviation to play in the endgame right now. And I think that will be true for a lot of raiders. This won't help with the already low activity at all.

 

Then I suppose you just stopped caring about rakatta gear when campaign/black hole came out? FYI your gear will ALWAYS become obsolete sooner or later. Yeah, curremt end game will be skipped, but you get a whole new set of ... well ... everything to make up for it! Such is mmo's. Id try playing them for fun, youll be a lot happier.

[Wraiven]

Then I suppose you just stopped caring about rakatta gear when campaign/black hole came out? FYI your gear will ALWAYS become obsolete sooner or later. Yeah, curremt end game will be skipped, but you get a whole new set of ... well ... everything to make up for it! Such is mmo's. Id try playing them for fun, youll be a lot happier.

 

 

Such is MMOs after only six months...

 

This is *not* such is MMOs. This is "such is Bioware"

[Goretzu]

Then I suppose you just stopped caring about rakatta gear when campaign/black hole came out? FYI your gear will ALWAYS become obsolete sooner or later. Yeah, curremt end game will be skipped, but you get a whole new set of ... well ... everything to make up for it! Such is mmo's. Id try playing them for fun, youll be a lot happier.

 

 

 

This is the big question.

 

L55 gear needs to out perform L50 gear to seperate the levels (and to make the levels worthwhile).

 

However this then resets all gear, meaning nothing is worth grinding as it will be worthless at L55.

 

 

 

Now this works ok with the big expansion every 18 months model.

 

However with a mini-expansion every 9-12 months its less clear how well it will work.

 

Many people will give up if the literally have no chance to at least catch up with the carrot for a while.

[Blackardin]

I've been playing this game without getting involved in the doomsaying or complaints for a long time now even while I watche activity on the server slowly melt away. But I got to say the anouncment of a raised level cap absolutely stunned me. Unless I'm missing something here it seems the worst possible move. Right now the servers suffer from players waiting till things get fixed. In my experience the anouncement of raised level caps usualy slowed down current raiding to a crawl since everyone knows their equip will be outdated within two levels anyway.

In my case my current motivation was working on all my crafting profesions, reverse engineering so I could outfit all my companions with purple gear (this is already inferior to just raiding and using leftover Columni but I just PVP..) but what's the point now? It's a ton of work to reverse engineer just the right purples and now I know they won't be good for long. I'm not even sure it is worth grinding PVP for War Hero gear now as I asume there will be new sets at the new cap.

I will say that I'm looking forward to more story but essentialy these news tell me "sit back, wait for the expansion to hit."

This is always the case with such anouncement but in a game already lacking player activity this just doesn't feel like a good idea.

 

Don't jump of a bridge. Its going to be a while. My guild has taken their time leveling and raiding. We are currently clearing HM KP. We expect to have all content cleared by the time the level cap is raised, but we also understand (or I do) that we are well behind the curve. Most raiders, I would expect, should have cleared everything through nightmare by the time it comes out (if not already), including us.

[VegaPhone]

It invalidates the level 50 ops and flashpoints as a source of repeatable content.

 

You wont be chain running any of them because the new level cap, area and gear makes the rewards obsolete. Problem is, there won't be nearly as much new content to run.

 

Ergo, you just created a situation where you effectively cut down the amount of end game content instead of expanding it.

 

Thats a good point.

 

The long term goals of a themepark MMO gets hurt when it is replaced with a new lvl brackect and there are not other long term goals.

 

This game needs a better approach to rewards, missions be it pvp/ops, and more features to create different long term goals.

 

Swtor's design as a themepark here is seen as too shallow with only a gear grind or money sink to repair, or get vanity items.

 

We need player housing, guild castles, open world pvp, seiging, complex crafting, rare resources in dangerous areas which are tied in with the areas objectrives possibly being a timed event as well. These become better long term goals, and great money sinks which also stimulate the economy.

 

We need long term goals from multi player mini games as well.

 

We need ops all to scale to have the right gear for end game. Ops should still be end game at this point, and we need different gear rewards from ops for the new lvl bracket.

 

The long grind of pvp gear should not be invalidated nor the long grind of PVE gear as well. Therefore the gear should be exchanged at a better rate for the new tier than attaining them without the possiblity of the exchange. This way the grind still exists for those that invested into the game, but also rewards them for the time they put in.

 

Overall, only having a gear grind as a long term goal in swtor is not fun, and feels to much like playing in a themepark that feels void of life.

[KimbeFett]

It's gonna be a long time before you see that level cap raise. I wouldn't worry about it.

 

^

 

This is all "within the year" I mean, and likely to get pushed out by delays. You know expansions will hit, you know level caps will hit. Its like saying "I am not going to play Burning Crusade because I heard there may be an expansion afterwards"

 

When the new level cap hits PTR then I will agree with you; you know your a few weeks/months off, may as well wait. But as a 'teaser', which is what that was, meh, don't worry, it is a long way off

[Cerdo_hormiguero]

Future content fails to excite me when we are still awaiting fundamental content: healthy server populations, World PvP content, and Rated WZs.

 

Moreover, I believe that the new content will be sold for $$. That's the industry model, and EA/BW have been following the MMO herd, not innovating. And I can't pay justify paying for new content when I've been waiting six months for basic content.

[ScarletBlaze]

They seem to be adding a new chapter to your class story and this is why they are raising the level cap. If all they were going to do was to add flashpoints, heroics, operations they would not raise the level cap. They have proven this before when they add new flashpoints, operations, no level cap was raised.

 

As far as the old operations, flashpoints, heroics they were still just as viable as before. Just because they add new content does not mean the old operations, etc. are obsolete.

 

As far as the skill trees it could be very simple as to giving you more points to use on your skill tree. That's what happened to one game I played before, they just gave us more points.

 

It is a possible they would change the skill trees completely but I wouldn't think they would do so as that would take more time in doing that. It makes more sense in just adding points for us to use in the skilll trees. If that is the way they do it then it would be better for the player. How many people would like one or two more points so they can add something they would like to use in their skill trees.

 

As they said this will happen sometime this year so I imagine the closer they get to releasing this is when more information will become available.

 

Some people I know think adding new story content is great. That is something they have been wanting.

Edited June 6, 2012 by ScarletBlaze

[Frostvein]

context (n)

The parts of a written or spoken statement that precede or follow a specific word or passage, usually influencing its meaning or effect: You have misinterpreted my remark because you took it out of context.

 

So let me get this straight again.

According to people here, there is an MMO rulebook that EVERY single MMO developer MUST NOT increase the level before 12-18 months?

 

So what if Game X does not increase the level within the first year. This is not Game x.

 

Those of you that grind all day for gear, well I am sorry for you that you have even more stuff to do.

 

Its more or less that generally speaking, raising your level cap so early is bad because it invalidates all of the previous content.

 

Ergo, most developers only do it when they have a ton of fresh new content.

 

How do you know they wont have enough content when this releases? As far as we know, it wont be released until December. That is plenty of time to have lots of new content.

 

Given past content patches and announced new ones, plus the current rate of development it would be a major surprise if the new patch has enough content to compete with whats in game.

 

Is it going to have the same or a comparable amount of level 50 OP's and FP's? Same amount of level 50 daily areas? Probably not. Your trading in 3 or 4 level 50 daily questing areas for what, 1 level 55 area? And how many new FPs for level 55 compared to level 50? They are making their own content obsolete much faster then is probably prudent.

 

So, Coruscant invalidates Tython? I don't really get this argument. You're supposed to progress, you're supposed to do new things with new stories. It doesn't invalidate the older stuff just because it's there.

 

It invalidates the level 50 ops and flashpoints as a source of repeatable content.

 

You wont be chain running any of them because the new level cap, area and gear makes the rewards obsolete. Problem is, there won't be nearly as much new content to run.

 

Ergo, you just created a situation where you effectively cut down the amount of end game content instead of expanding it.

 

No, I have no idea when the level cap will be raised, nor the nature of any of those pointless questions you asked, because that wasn't what we were discussing. Someone asked why raising the level cap was bad. I gave several reasons.

 

Is it possible that they come out with more new content then is currently in game? Sure. Is it probable? Given the amount of content we've seen in the time frame we've had thus far, it seems doubtful. Why you insist on being combative for no reason is beyond me.

Edited June 6, 2012 by Qishari
quoted rude commetns

[JeramieCrowe]

It's not a question of whether or not it's normal, but rather or not this is too soon to be upping the cap.

 

Define "this"? Because, by all indications, this level cap won't even be here until the end of the year. One year from launch is too soon?

[Shingara]

context (n)

The parts of a written or spoken statement that precede or follow a specific word or passage, usually influencing its meaning or effect: You have misinterpreted my remark because you took it out of context.

 

No, I have no idea when the level cap will be raised, nor the nature of any of those pointless questions you asked, because that wasn't what we were discussing. Someone asked why raising the level cap was bad. I gave several reasons.

 

Is it possible that they come out with more new content then is currently in game? Sure. Is it probable? Given the amount of content we've seen in the time frame we've had thus far, it seems doubtful. Why you insist on being combative for no reason is beyond me.

 

No what you do as you normaly do is state your opinion as fact, you have no idea what is going to be relevant or not, you assume it shall, stating what they will or wont do is your opnion not fact. you have no idea what there going todo nor what content they are going to introduce from now until the level cap is changed and what content is going to be implimented or addapted at that time.

 

Infact you are well know for being anti bioware which is easily seen by looking at sig. And i do not have any idea what they are going todo which is why im not standing around going the end is nigh. But unlike you im not daft enough to think for one second that a game they have spent 300 mil on that they are going to make all there endgame content irrelivent when they increase the level cap by 5 levels unlike some people.

 

You have no fact, you have no proof, you are simply fear mongering as you normally do.

Edited June 6, 2012 by Shingara

[JeramieCrowe]

QFT!!!

 

The game is only six months old. This level cap raise is getting here way too soon. it is a desperate attempt from Bioware to draw back in players who are no longer paying them for their game. Six months and already a level cap raise. Most casual players are just now hitting 50. They won't even have a chance to get the gear that is out there now, more less the gear that will be introduced with a new level cap.

 

This was a bad move by Bioware that will not have the affect that they are hoping that it will.

 

Again, the video and E3 said "Coming This Year" not "Coming This Summer". This strawman of level caps coming to a 6 month old game has GOT to stop. It's coming to a one-year-old game, as it's far more likely we're not seeing any of this stuff until close to December.

[JeramieCrowe]

I actually agree with the OP. BioWare can always add new content without raising level cap. They just copy WoW blindly.

 

Pretty sure you meant EQ, as WoW was definitely not the first to do this.

[Frostvein]

No what you do as you normaly do is state your opinion as fact, you have no idea what is going to be relevant or not, you assume it shall, stating what they will or wont do is your opnion not fact. you have no idea what there going todo nor what content they are going to introduce from now until the level cap is changed and what content is going to be implimented or addapted at that time.

 

Infact you are well know for being anti bioware which is easily seen by looking at sig. And i do not have any idea what they are going todo which is why im not standing around going the end is nigh. But unlike you im not daft enough to think for one second that a game they have spent 300 mil on that they are going to make all there endgame content irrelivent when they increase the level cap by 5 levels unlike some people.

 

You have no fact, you have no proof, you are simply fear mongering as you normally do.

 

I feel bad for you.

[Shingara]

I feel bad for you.

 

And why is that exactly ? because i like the game.

Edited June 6, 2012 by Shingara

[JeramieCrowe]

You have no fact, you have no proof, you are simply fear mongering as you normally do.

 

I would argue that the "facts" and "proof" are in the plethora of other MMOs that raise level caps, including (but not limited to) WoW, EQ, EQ2, etc. Not ONCE did raising the level caps render the content moot or worthless. NOT ONCE.

 

As in EVER.

 

NEVER.

 

To think it will here is just as you said: fear-mongering.

[Qishari]

Hi all,

 

As a reminder, please make sure that your posts are constructive and respectful toward one another.

 

If you find that you cannot get along with someone, we encourage you to place them on your ignore list.

[Sasheria]

raising level cap is a bad idea.

 

The short version - skipping Content

 

The long version - Have you noticed that people are having hard time running FP? because people out level them quickly and go do better things without having to run FPs.

 

Currently our Ops are cap at 50. The skill system works (when it is working properly) once you go beyond 50, then we will have balance issue in the future. Currently it is not possible to get 2 top tier skills in your skill tree (out of 3) but when you start going from 50 to 55 to 60 to 70 to 80, it will be possible. Then the skill system will need to be revamp and redo for balance (similar to WoW look what happen now. Totally different than what we use to have)

 

gears from level 50 to 51 will probably be like WoW, becoming VERY useless. I notice time and time again when a skill cap is raised, the gear jumped. You could have the top gear at "max" level before the cap but the GREEN gear is BETTER than your top raiding gear. This is a bad thing.

 

people are willing to skip "lower level content to hit max level" once the cap eventually reach 55 or 60, then what about the old ops? will SWTOR revamp the old ops for higher level like they did with WoW? Will people even bother to run it?

 

What I suggest is put in more content but harder content and keep the level cap. You can have bigger and better gear so NEW players will HAVE to do old ops in order to do new Ops (to keep a constant supply of players) because if you raise the level cap, I am pretty sure that new players (or even alts) won't do the level 50 ops and HM FP and go straight to the new stuff and thus "reducing content" cause people CAN skip it.

[JeramieCrowe]

Raising the level cap is a GREAT idea! It moves the current endgame content (which people are calling boring now, anyway, due to doing it so much) to leveling content (which means it WON'T be skipped), and introduces brand new endgame content! Edited June 6, 2012 by JeramieCrowe

[Muskaan]

Raising the level cap is a GREAT idea! It moves the current endgame content (which people are calling boring now, anyway, due to doing it so much) to leveling content (which means it WON'T be skipped), and introduces brand new endgame content!

 

You realize that it will make all the current end game content obsolete. So, they will have to come up with a whole set of new end-game content -- new OPs, new FPs, new dailies. That's a LOT of work for a content patch.

[Alavastre]

It invalidates the level 50 ops and flashpoints as a source of repeatable content.

 

You wont be chain running any of them because the new level cap, area and gear makes the rewards obsolete. Problem is, there won't be nearly as much new content to run.

 

Ergo, you just created a situation where you effectively cut down the amount of end game content instead of expanding it.

 

Simple fix, make all the flash points and ops at the end at the level cap. Probably be like a 5 level cap adjustment, not a huge difference. I doubt they would put out level 55 content, and leave the end game at 50.

[Muskaan]

Simple fix, make all the flash points and ops at the end at the level cap. Probably be like a 5 level cap adjustment, not a huge difference. I doubt they would put out level 55 content, and leave the end game at 50.

 

It's not as simple as you think.

 

1. They have to adjust the encounters for the level 55 cap

2. They have adjust the loot drops to account for a stat increase that comes with the level 55 cap.

 

And that doesn't solve the problem for the people who already have gear from the Ops and FPs.