Powertechs need an urget nerf

[DarthOvertone]

For those having their doubts or haven't really faced a decent Pyro/Assault yet, here's your proof:

 

http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCpCE2qKnYI

 

A lot of what I saw in that video was L2P stuff. Pyro grapple and the person doesn't knockback right away when they land? Almost no CC used...ever. And each person, aside from one, tries to take the dude down toe-to-toe. Come on now.

 

The rest of the kills were him just focus-fire ganking dudes with his teammates. No surprise there.

 

However, the back to back to back 5K/3K/5K crits is an eye-opener to be sure. That is a problem. But before we nerf the class I wonder how much Expertise is factoring into that scenario, as a result of the 1.2 change and his opponent's gear or lack thereof. There are variables missing from the equation that need to be evaluated before crying nerf.

 

Everyone knows the TTK is presently too fast across the board. BW certainly needs to address Expertise 1.2. Once those adjustments are made, then take a look at individual class performances and see if they are off track.

Edited May 14, 2012 by DarthOvertone

[_Makers_]

Yea we have a high amount of burst damage, but ask us to beat on an operations dummy for 6min 20sec, and you will stop your qqing, immediatly if not sooner. Edited May 14, 2012 by _Makers_

[DrDoobious]

"they are either full dps killing war hero geared players in 3 to 6 seconds depending how geared they are."

 

Ever think it might have something to do with the fact they're in battlemaster/war hero armor? Do not under estimate the value of Expertise.

 

"tank specced in dps gear which is basicly someone with the defense of a tank and the damage of a pure dps class."

 

If they're in dps gear with tank spec then they aint got the full defense of a pure tank and the full damage of a pure dps, they've got half of each at best.

 

ps... I hope many deaths at my powertech's hand was part of your reason for this post

Edited May 14, 2012 by DrDoobious
omission

[Hethroin]

A Pyro is harder to take down than a Sorc/Sage. A Pyro is harder to take down than a Sniper/Gunslinger. Of course it all depends on overall skill but both of the classes I compared a Pyro to are, generally, far more squishy than a Pyro himself.

 

And as you said before you need atleast 2 players to take down a Pyro. There is no, if the Pyro knows what he's doing, other way to kill him or neutralize his role. In a balanced PvP System, any dps could win from any dps, all depending on the situation and skill of course. This rarely is the case with a Pyro/Assault.

 

I can assure you the guy suggesting you put 2 DPS on the pyro assumed that you are in a group setting, where you had jobs and priorities. If you have 2 DPS set the Pyro as their #1 priority that pyro will have been nullified for the duration of the encounter.

 

If I see sniper DoTs and a marauder punching me in the face I have to back out of the sniper's LOS, and pop my one cooldown to stay alive. If I fail to see the sniper's dots and just see the marauder I might keep on trucking, expecting to get healed through it, but that incoming Cull is going to end my damage output on the second tic (+/- Vicious Throw).

 

Coincidentally that same marauder with all its cooldowns ready will win 1v1 against me every time, the same cannot always be said about the sniper it's more of a who can play LOS better.

[Varicite]

I can assure you the guy suggesting you put 2 DPS on the pyro assumed that you are in a group setting, where you had jobs and priorities. If you have 2 DPS set the Pyro as their #1 priority that pyro will have been nullified for the duration of the encounter.

 

I was going to reply to him, but it seems you've put down a lot of what I was going to say here.

 

In addition, it does not actually take 2 DPS classes to kill a Pyro PT (but I would be genuinely happy if it did, lol) as there are a few classes who have more than what it takes to down a Pyro in a 1v1 situation if necessary. Well-played Marauders, Tankasins, and Snipers in good position come to mind.

 

Pretty much anyone who can outlast the initial burst phase of a Pyro PT can win the fight 1v1.

 

Still, even if you CAN kill a Pyro w/ a Marauder 1v1, there's no NEED to do so in a group setting, as Heth has mentioned. If you can dedicate 2 DPS to focus fire opposition, it is almost always going to be better than if you had sent your Marauder to fight the Pyro alone, due to a lower TTK and more time to focus on objectives / heal up after the threat has been dealt w/.

 

My suggestion to put 2 DPS on the Pyro was not out of necessity, but efficiency. It's always best to get the job done quickly. : )

Edited May 14, 2012 by Varicite

[lisaaa]

Hell nerf ever class,someone is also crying nerf on a class..once they nerf power then they cry on a another and another and soon it be like swg nge period....

[SneiK]

you know those numbers at the end of the warzone dont realy mean jack right ? other than pointing out what needs nerfing and balancing out.

 

on my sin i usualy get around 75k damage done with 30 kills and 0 deaths so the damage numbers mean didly squat

 

Nice troll...or whatever. If you're doing 75k m8 no wonder you're getting stompped. That's bad even for a tank.

Edited May 14, 2012 by SneiK

[Astarica]

PT, along with Snipers and possibly Juggs fall into the 'overpowered because there are Tankasins/Marauders". These 3 specs are pretty strong but not so strong that you need to focus your whole game on shutting them down, unlike Tankasins/Marauders. But if you give them a little breathing room they can certainly do a lot of damage, but you don't really have a choice here because you'll have a hard time dealing with the two more powerful classes even if you pressured them the whole time.

 

In particular all 3 classes are quite easily defeated by the two premier 1on1 classes, but those two classes are usually busy killing themselves for exactly that reason. To further complicate things, these 3 classe can be better than the top 2 1on1 class in some special niches (Sniper versus Marauder, PT versus heavy armor, Jugg versus group of closely clustered guys) so if you give them too much breathing room, it could come back to haunt you, but you can't treat them as kill on sight either. Knowing who/when to use against these classes is what make WZ interesting, at least until everyone rerolled as Marauder/Tankasin for DPS.

[Mormoz]

I can assure you the guy suggesting you put 2 DPS on the pyro assumed that you are in a group setting, where you had jobs and priorities. If you have 2 DPS set the Pyro as their #1 priority that pyro will have been nullified for the duration of the encounter.

 

If I see sniper DoTs and a marauder punching me in the face I have to back out of the sniper's LOS, and pop my one cooldown to stay alive. If I fail to see the sniper's dots and just see the marauder I might keep on trucking, expecting to get healed through it, but that incoming Cull is going to end my damage output on the second tic (+/- Vicious Throw).

 

Coincidentally that same marauder with all its cooldowns ready will win 1v1 against me every time, the same cannot always be said about the sniper it's more of a who can play LOS better.

 

Marauders have their CDs, Snipers have to deal with LoS,... All classes seem to have their weak points that you can exploit. But I honestly fail to recognize those of a Pyro/Assault spec. Just go all in and get him down asap? If the other team has capable healers they'll manage to keep him up. So... go for the healers, right?

 

Well, lets say each team has capable healers. One team has a Pyro however, where the other does not. The enemy team will get your healer down faster, because, well, as a healer one of the worst things that can happen to you (or any player really) is burst damage, which, Pyro/Assault, excels most at of all classes. They have the largest burst potential, overall, of all classes. But, such a massive advantage should come with a large disadvantage as well, right? Balance is balance. And then we're back at my primary point and where I fail to see your rhetoric. What is that great disadvantage, that Pyro/Assault has over other classes, that we can exploit? Just focus fire him? Well, that's the general counter, that works for any class.

 

There is no specific weakness a Pyro/Assault has. And in my opinion he definetely, of all classes, should have it, looking at that insane burst potential.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Mormoz

[Pistols]

There is no specific weakness a Pyro/Assault has. And in my opinion he definetely, of all classes, should have it, looking at that insane burst potential.

 

May I ask a question; do you play on a PvP or RP server?

[Metalmac]

No they can't. They are very strong dps, but lets not go overboard here. The aren't going to kill you in 3-4 globals, sorry. Are you pvping without your gear on?

 

I have 1125 Expertise and get hit for 3k to 5k every time by a Power Tech. This is just OP.

 

I have been hit for 7k and 9k twice in one game and wearing this much War Hero gear that is OP.

 

The Power Tech needs a nerf on Burst as that is just crazy when I have seen a team mate with only 500 expertise get hit for 18K as a 20K tank.

[Astarica]

Pyrotech die much faster than a Marauder or a Tankasin while having comparable thoroughput. That is a rather signficant weakness.

[Varicite]

Marauders have their CDs, Snipers have to deal with LoS,... All classes seem to have their weak points that you can exploit. But I honestly fail to recognize those of a Pyro/Assault spec. Just go all in and get him down asap? If the other team has capable healers they'll manage to keep him up. So... go for the healers, right?

 

Well, lets say each team has capable healers. One team has a Pyro however, where the other does not. The enemy team will get your healer down faster, because, well, as a healer one of the worst things that can happen to you (or any player really) is burst damage, which, Pyro/Assault, excels most at of all classes. They have the largest burst potential, overall, of all classes. But, such a massive advantage should come with a large disadvantage as well, right? Balance is balance. And then we're back at my primary point and where I fail to see your rhetoric. What is that great disadvantage, that Pyro/Assault has over other classes, that we can exploit? Just focus fire him? Well, that's the general counter, that works for any class.

 

There is no specific weakness a Pyro/Assault has. And in my opinion he definetely, of all classes, should have it, looking at that insane burst potential.

 

There is a specific weakness. You are just ignoring it entirely.

 

That's called ignorance, not imbalance.

 

In fact, I more than spelled out for you exactly what that weakness is, so now the ball's in your court. You can either learn to exploit it, or continue to whine about how you "just can't see" what people have explained to you.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Varicite

[Twor]

I have 1125 Expertise and get hit for 3k to 5k every time by a Power Tech. This is just OP.

 

I have been hit for 7k and 9k twice in one game and wearing this much War Hero gear that is OP.

 

The Power Tech needs a nerf on Burst as that is just crazy when I have seen a team mate with only 500 expertise get hit for 18K as a 20K tank.

 

18k in a single hit is not possible, no matter how many CDs the opponent blows.

 

The 9k is only possible when rs and td hit at once. And even than only barely. Those are two skills though. 9k single hit on someone with WH gear and the rest BM is not possible for Pyros.

[Keypek]

Wow, some of you couldn't exaggerate more if you tried. Dps spec vanguards are decent at dps if in dps gear and buffed properly. But like all dps (except for sent/marad) drop fairly easy when focused. And can be taunted. This isn't rocket science people.

[ComeAndSee]

I'm Tank Spec.

 

My Stockstrike and High Impact Bolt crits for like 2-2.5k average (3k TOPS if they really undergeared + cooldowns).

 

DPS spec. Vanguards High Impact Bolt can crit for 4k+

[Metalmac]

It's one thing to not know what you're talking about (as many in this thread have illustrated), it's totally another when you make up fabrications to justify your lack of gaming intelligence.

 

First off here is video of me killing a PT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoL6ZZLwQh0&list=UUULwPKqrRFCtNv5_xMuOqQw&index=2&feature=plcp

 

And as you can see it is they are not anywhere as squishy as a Sage or Scoundrel or Sent.

 

I lose 65% of all PVP War Zones but those would make pretty boring movies.

 

Something needs to be done as they have more damage then a Sage before they nerfed the Sages.

The PT has better survival then a Sage and higher burst so this is a issue that needs to be fixed.

[SawKrates]

powertechs/vanguards have got to be nerfed urgently

 

 

they are either full dps killing war hero geared players in 3 to 6 seconds depending how geared they are.

 

or

 

tank specced in dps gear which is basicly someone with the defense of a tank and the damage of a pure dps class.

 

 

something has got to be done because they cant stay how they are right now they are just far to powerfull to be kept like this.

ive noticed alot of people rerrolling to either vanguard/powertech because of it and its just rediculous.

 

You should practice pvp a bit more, our class is not OP. You just dont know how to play against that class yet

[Varicite]

First off here is video of me killing a PT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoL6ZZLwQh0&list=UUULwPKqrRFCtNv5_xMuOqQw&index=2&feature=plcp

 

And as you can see it is they are not anywhere as squishy as a Sage or Scoundrel or Sent.

 

I lose 65% of all PVP War Zones but those would make pretty boring movies.

 

Something needs to be done as they have more damage then a Sage before they nerfed the Sages.

The PT has better survival then a Sage and higher burst so this is a issue that needs to be fixed.

 

Man, if only Sages had some other niches that they could fill better than a Powertech, like healing, CC'ing, AoE'ing, and helping to dominate Huttball.

 

They are definitely more squishy than a Sentinel. As for Sage and Scoundrel, well, it's a great thing that both of those classes have methods to escape combat or defend themselves, or even pull other allies to them for help.

 

I don't need to watch your silly video, as I play a BM Sorc and Powertech (as well as Tankasin, and working on Sniper). From both sides of the fence, PTs are fine. They hit hard and go down fast.

 

PS) What I did learn from your video, however, is that you're a keyboard-turning backpeddler who makes a lot of mistakes. Suddenly, your posts are starting to make a lot more sense.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Varicite

[ComeAndSee]

Vanguards have great survivability, but they can be blown up just as fast as any other class if you focus fire them. I've been basically globalled by two Guardian's double smashing on top of me next to my guarded target.

[Metalmac]

Pyrotech die much faster than a Marauder or a Tankasin while having comparable thoroughput. That is a rather signficant weakness.

 

This is untrue when Expertise is the same the PT is harder to kill then the Marauder.

I do agree that the Tankasin is OP also has to much damage to survival in DSP gear.

 

But PT has way to much burst and should be toned down to a resonable amount.

[exphryl]

This is untrue when Expertise is the same the PT is harder to kill then the Marauder.

I do agree that the Tankasin is OP also has to much damage to survival in DSP gear.

 

But PT has way to much burst and should be toned down to a resonable amount.

 

How is expertise the same again making the PT harder to take down? the 3% Damage reduction difference in Heavy to medium armor clearly makes them light years tougher to take down.....

 

You are quite the scholar my good man.

[Metalmac]

Man, if only Sages had some other niches that they could fill better than a Powertech, like healing, CC'ing, AoE'ing, and helping to dominate Huttball.

 

They are definitely more squishy than a Sentinel. As for Sage and Scoundrel, well, it's a great thing that both of those classes have methods to escape combat or defend themselves, or even pull other allies to them for help.

 

I don't need to watch your silly video, as I play a BM Sorc and Powertech (as well as Tankasin, and working on Sniper). From both sides of the fence, PTs are fine. They hit hard and go down fast.

 

PS) What I did learn from your video, however, is that you're a keyboard-turning backpeddler who makes a lot of mistakes. Suddenly, your posts are starting to make a lot more sense.

 

LOL you pick only the class that everyone agrees is just flat you OP.

At least your total bias is not unfounded or clouded by self intrest.

 

(P.S. I put all my mistakes in the game as I am human and do not have a huge ego to drag around)

Edited May 14, 2012 by Metalmac

[Metalmac]

And here is my video rebuttal...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiSmCJcSbsQ

 

Argument lost as you have no arugumet counter point.

Like the wiseguy in class that has no clue what the answer is so just make a joke to cover your lack of thought.

[Metalmac]

How is expertise the same again making the PT harder to take down? the 3% Damage reduction difference in Heavy to medium armor clearly makes them light years tougher to take down.....

 

You are quite the scholar my good man.

 

Well you ignored the shield or number of CC abilites did you not?