Legacy has been a failure

[GnatB]

/An egregious example of how bioware just doesn't understand simple math and economics is the example of the lowering of the cool down for emergency fleet pass unlock. It is clearly cheaper in the long run to just buy for 2k a shot the passes from the security vendor.

 

You fail at math. It is clearly cheaper in the SHORT run to just buy a pass for 2k a shot. Buy enough of those passes that could have been replaced by a shorter cooldown, and the shorter cooldown will be cheaper in the LONG run. infinite fleetpasses @2k per will always be more expensive than a 1 time purchase.

 

That being said... that assumes the decreased cooldown actually saves having to buy fleet passes. Most people are playing what, at most 4 hours a day, usually at the same time every day? 18 hours, 12 hours, or 5 hours doesn't matter. Unless the cooldown drops to below how long they play per day, (i.e. below 4 hours) they're only gonna be able to use it once per session. The decreased cooldown doesn't even do anything for the vast majority of players. They should entirely rewrite the unlock. Make it unlock additional fleet pass charges or skills, or something. So you can use it 2 times per play session. or 3 times with a second unlock, or whatever. Each "charge" could still only be used once per day though.

[Urael]

You fail at math. It is clearly cheaper in the SHORT run to just buy a pass for 2k a shot. Buy enough of those passes that could have been replaced by a shorter cooldown, and the shorter cooldown will be cheaper in the LONG run. infinite fleetpasses @2k per will always be more expensive than a 1 time purchase.

 

That being said... that assumes the decreased cooldown actually saves having to buy fleet passes. Most people are playing what, at most 4 hours a day, usually at the same time every day? 18 hours, 12 hours, or 5 hours doesn't matter. Unless the cooldown drops to below how long they play per day, (i.e. below 4 hours) they're only gonna be able to use it once per session. The decreased cooldown doesn't even do anything for the vast majority of players. They should entirely rewrite the unlock. Make it unlock additional fleet pass charges or skills, or something. So you can use it 2 times per play session. or 3 times with a second unlock, or whatever. Each "charge" could still only be used once per day though.

 

Your right I chose my words poorly. I will restate:

 

Currently Legacy gives the following for EFP:

 

Legacy Fleet Pass: Has three ranks and reduces the cooldown of the Emergency Fleet Pass by 1h/2h/3h.

Cost 100,000/200,000/300,000 credits and requires Legacy Level 5/10/15.

 

So for 600,000 credtits you drop from 16 hrs to 13hrs.

 

Security vendor:

 

Note: Cheeper than I remembered its 1k not 2k.

 

Fleet Passes can be purchased from the Security Key Vendor for 1,000 credits each and they stack in your inventory. They are bound to your character so they are exclusive to those using a security key to log in. They have only a one hour cooldown as opposed to the Emergency Fleet Pass ability which takes 16 hours.

 

So for 600,000 credits I can by 600 1hr cool down passes.

 

While I said long term ... its neither long or short terms.

 

Its for the most part always.

 

I will probably never use 600 1hr cool down passes I would say I would prolly use at most 50 over a 5 year period if that.

 

So its cheeper to pay 5 irl dollars to access the security vendor ( if you didn't purchase a CE) and pay 1k a pop for 1hr cool down.

 

This makes the marginal utility of the Legacy Unlock ZERO.

 

It is an example of over inflated cost for products services with little or no value.

 

Clearer?

[flyersfan]

It was supposed to help balance out factions and encourage people to play alts which would increase playing time and content.

 

I don't believe that faction balance was ever a goal with the legacy system as it was developed well before launch and the player-created problem of faction imbalance. The legacy system seems to be more of a personal thing that is fun for the player to look at and have new goals to achieve over the life of the game. Many of the things will take a long time to unlock, but I know that some day it'll feel good to have it all completed. Until then, I dread pressing Y.

 

I'm sure some people like legacy, but can anyone really say its been worth the time and effort, much less the hype, BW had put into the system?

 

Yes, I think it was worth the time and effort. As with most things in this game, typical MMOers were looking for the magical "fix all" button to arrive with the legacy for some reason. It seems that MMOers look into things far too much and throw all their hopes on one thing. The legacy system promotes a good deal of fun for people that like to play different characters and enjoy the different experiences with the other classes in this story-driven MMO. In all actuality, it provides no multi-player benefits other than maybe the neutral GTN and it's purely for the player to enjoy by him- or herself. I think it's a very good addition and I'm glad to have it. I just wish the family tree part wasn't crap and that I could have more than one surname for my obviously unrelated characters.

[Tifadore]

Legacy has been a great success! Anyone who says othervice I won't even listen to, I don't even bother reading this text!

[UnmarkedFaith]

Legacy has been a great success! Anyone who says othervice I won't even listen to, I don't even bother reading this text!

 

you just made me bust out my Lawler skates.......clearly you don't play the same game as us.

[Valethar]

To be fair, legacy has not yet been fully implemented.

 

If you substitute 'the game' for 'legacy' in that statement, you will find that it explains everything wrong with SWTOR at present.

[Primal]

Your right I chose my words poorly. I will restate:

 

Currently Legacy gives the following for EFP:

 

Legacy Fleet Pass: Has three ranks and reduces the cooldown of the Emergency Fleet Pass by 1h/2h/3h.

Cost 100,000/200,000/300,000 credits and requires Legacy Level 5/10/15.

 

So for 600,000 credtits you drop from 16 hrs to 13hrs.

 

Incorrect, the cooldown goes from 16 to 10 in your example as the purchased tiers are cumulative (total reduction time of 6 hours), but the real effect is from 18 hours to 12 hours (you have the wrong initial cooldown time).

 

Beyond that, the Legacy costs are way too high for most of the unlocks. This is my opinion.

[Snakeyees]

Legacy...

 

I really dig 2 features:

• Fully self-buffed when I hit chapter 2 on 4 classes.
  
• Cross-faction mail between my characters.
  

 

The rest of it I really don't give a flying banana about, especially the insanely high prices for all of the credit-only unlocks.

 

Failure? I don't know about that, but it's probably not compelling enough for the effort that went into creating it. Hopefully BioWare has more interesting stuff on the way or they'll get more realistic on the prices.

 

 

do bananas really fly? i like to see that someday.

 

Legacy is NOTHING more than a CREDIT sink its not rewarding players for making alts, its not benefiting people who play their game, and pay to play their game. they don't care if your legacy level 15 or 47.

 

what they should have done to reward people was the higher your legacy level the lower the money cost to unlock stuff. i have over 8 mil credits and I refuse to buy any thing legacy, at this time. why you may ask. cause BIoware Lied in fact George Zeller lied and I'm not going to put up with it. i will keep earning credits.

 

3 days before the patch when live they added the 5 mil credit cost to the purchase of the GTN. and not only is it neutral its not even linked. don't get me started on the repair droid either. even after he posted and said at the guild summit it was Either OR I'm not going to let this die. i don't like being lied to.

[Mallorik]

Incorrect, the cooldown goes from 16 to 10 in your example as the purchased tiers are cumulative (total reduction time of 6 hours), but the real effect is from 18 hours to 12 hours (you have the wrong initial cooldown time).

 

Beyond that, the Legacy costs are way too high for most of the unlocks. This is my opinion.

 

I dont think its a fail, i think its a great start for a great idea, but i do think the prices are a little out of whack, things should be expensive but where they are now is a little overboard.

 

I thought they would be a little more dependant on legacy levels and less dependant on credits and that the high credit cost would come into play if you wanted to buy something without the legacy levels.

[Saurakk]

Bottom line. Legacy is a GREAT idea but is too god %^$& expensive. I don't have 2 million credits sitting around.

 

I think some of their numbers are still based off thinking everyone got rich off the early slicing pay backs.

[Nemmar]

The only problem with legacy is that the rewards are way overpriced and are not worth the effort.

 

With a bit of budget tinckering they would be more interesting to get.

[Mallorik]

do bananas really fly? i like to see that someday.

 

Legacy is NOTHING more than a CREDIT sink its not rewarding players for making alts, its not benefiting people who play their game, and pay to play their game. they don't care if your legacy level 15 or 47.

 

what they should have done to reward people was the higher your legacy level the lower the money cost to unlock stuff. i have over 8 mil credits and I refuse to buy any thing legacy, at this time. why you may ask. cause BIoware Lied in fact George Zeller lied and I'm not going to put up with it. i will keep earning credits.

 

3 days before the patch when live they added the 5 mil credit cost to the purchase of the GTN. and not only is it neutral its not even linked. don't get me started on the repair droid either. even after he posted and said at the guild summit it was Either OR I'm not going to let this die. i don't like being lied to.

 

One thing about the neutral legacy gtn, i do think it is too expensive right now and it is totaly useless but pretty soon (not sure if its 1.3 or not) The hutts are going to buy out the gtns and they will all be neutral, opening up the economies between imps and reps.

[NDiggy]

no it wasnt

 

It actually was. BW mentioned at the guild summit that legacy was intended in part to help balance out the factions on servers by encouraging people to roll alts on the other faction.

[aarka]

Kind of agree. The self buffs and the tiny stat gains from finishing companion stories is the only thing I'm using. Level 31 legacy. I have no interest in leveling another alt at this point, I've done them all so many times.. So even the 1.3 coming soon features don't interest me.

 

That being said, it is better than nothing. But I think it was a bit over-hyped.

Edited May 4, 2012 by aarka

[Balrizangor]

Legacy...

 

I really dig 2 features:

• Fully self-buffed when I hit chapter 2 on 4 classes.
  
• Cross-faction mail between my characters.
  

 

The rest of it I really don't give a flying banana about, especially the insanely high prices for all of the credit-only unlocks.

 

Failure? I don't know about that, but it's probably not compelling enough for the effort that went into creating it. Hopefully BioWare has more interesting stuff on the way or they'll get more realistic on the prices.

 

They do have more stuff on the way for it, according to them, a lot of stuff. This (1.2) was just laying the coded groundwork to let them add more stuff later

 

I also like the stuff you posted about, a lot, and I do agree about those insane prices. I am not sure why BW thinks all our characters are running around with 10s of millions of credits (although I am sure some are) but I can't picture a huge amount of people with that many creds (incoming the posts of "I have 20mil!!!!111" ...)

Edited May 4, 2012 by Balrizangor

[Elenia]

It was quite depressing to realise when you pop lv 50 (yesterday) since launch (I got a life) you have to do it an other 8 times.. I just want to play 1 char, make that one stronger, enjoy being high level, do wars, flashpoint, etc... Not repeat the same "go there and kill..." quests for a million times...

[Vicen]

It's quite annoying that it is not ACCOUNT based...and simply server based...If it was account based it would be quite...quite awesome...But since it's not...It's only average imo...

 

[NDiggy]

It's quite annoying that it is not ACCOUNT based...and simply server based...If it was account based it would be quite...quite awesome...But since it's not...It's only average imo...

 

 

Having it be account based might have made implementing server transfers/mergers more of an easy process.

[Thuggy]

While it's far too soon to call legacy a "failure" I do agree the grindy aspects have really soured me on the system. I've spent the last few weeks doing dailies I otherwise would not have done...in lieu of leveling the alts I had originally planed to in order to unlock various convince features of the system.

 

I don't mind the existence of credit sinks...but having to generate credits in order to access the features I wanted, to experience timesink of choice (leveling alts) to it's fullest has ultimately sunk my desire to log-in and do any of it. The cost of unlocks, the cost of legacy equipment are so prohibitively expensive and short term...the features border on useless.

 

200+ daily coms for birthright kits that do not scale with level. 100k-300k credits for custom gear (without augment slots, or legacy specific perks)...who the hell priced this garbage?

Edited May 4, 2012 by Thuggy

[Ryvath]

Legacy :

 

The system is pretty nifty so far. I figure it's new, and for them to implement something like this sooo early in the game (it's been out only a few months) is pretty neat.

 

My one and only big gripe with legacy so far is the class restrictions on the legacy gear. If it's my family gear and bound to my legacy... why a class restriction? Also would be nice if legacy gear was a bit more similar to BoA gear in WoW ... exp bonus etc... as it is... class restriction and no actual leveling bonuses... legacy gear is pretty much same as another moddable gear you can find in game. Only big plus right now is it makes it a lot easier to get moddable wrist and belt.

[Mrpoodles]

cut the credit cost for legacy perks and gear and i am mega happy. i am ok with it right now. wish they cool it on the credit costs.

[kevlarto]

Legacy has been a failure....In my opinion

 

Thought I'd help you out a tad.

 

yep, where is the offical thread, LOL I really get tired of people who think thier opinion is the voice of everyone in the game, there are features I am not to fond of, but i know others who loves those features, just like life we all have likes and dis-likes of different things../shrug

[Blackardin]

Legacy was a heavily hyped feature going into launch, and then into 1.2. It was supposed to help balance out factions and encourage people to play alts which would increase playing time and content. Neither of those haar come to pass. Faction imbalance is stool add bad as ever (just with fewer players overall for each faction), and players are leaving the game out of boredom rather than roll another alt.

 

Many of the legacy unlocks cost a prohibitive amount of money even with the legacy level necessary to unlock them, while other legacy unlocks, such as races, are easily bought without the need for any legacy level. What should be a nice perk for players invested in the game simply becomes another money sink with no real benefit.

 

The real failure of legacy is that it is one of the primary reasons we don't have server transfers or mergers already, because BW has to deal with changing legacy names when those names are already taken.

 

I'm sure some people like legacy, but can anyone really say its been worth the time and effort, much less the hype, BW had put into the system?

 

Well, I guess when you invest millions of dollars, years of work and full dedication into a game, you will have the option to tune it to your exacting specification....but for 50 cents a day it is fun, entertaining and well within expectation.

Edited May 4, 2012 by Blackardin

[Thuggy]

Legacy :

My one and only big gripe with legacy so far is the class restrictions on the legacy gear. If it's my family gear and bound to my legacy... why a class restriction?

I believe the class restrictions are to prevent you from tossing the legacy items on your companions. Honestly I don't understand why it matters as it's not like there are alternative mod-able gear available for them, at much cheaper prices.

 

Also would be nice if legacy gear was a bit more similar to BoA gear in WoW ... exp bonus etc... as it is... class restriction and no actual leveling bonuses... legacy gear is pretty much same as another moddable gear you can find in game. Only big plus right now is it makes it a lot easier to get moddable wrist and belt.

 

Agreed

Edited May 4, 2012 by Thuggy

[Myschief]

Legacy was a heavily hyped feature going into launch, and then into 1.2. It was supposed to help balance out factions and encourage people to play alts which would increase playing time and content. Neither of those haar come to pass. Faction imbalance is stool add bad as ever (just with fewer players overall for each faction), and players are leaving the game out of boredom rather than roll another alt.

 

I do not remember any mention that Legacy would affect faction imbalance. It is unfortunate that the people that might dispute your claims about the Legacy system failing to encourage people to play more alts are probably playing. I know that I do not post on these boards while I am playing.

 

Many of the legacy unlocks cost a prohibitive amount of money even with the legacy level necessary to unlock them, while other legacy unlocks, such as races, are easily bought without the need for any legacy level. What should be a nice perk for players invested in the game simply becomes another money sink with no real benefit.

 

Bioware has shown a reasonable amount of knowledge concerning how many credits they expect characters to have as they level up. Between class and crew skills, character weath gain levelling up is very low. Once a character starts running dailies that changes. Everyday activities are going to get players the credits pay for perks, in game, that most MMOs would be selling through real world microtransactions. The fact that Bioware has managed to show restraint in not requiring cold hard cash for these perk is out of character for them.

 

I'm sure some people like legacy, but can anyone really say its been worth the time and effort, much less the hype, BW had put into the system?

 

Yes it has been worth while.

 

I like running ship mission, so having a mailbox on board has made sending materials off to my crafters has been a convience.

 

I have notice an improve perfomance from my alts because to the additional class buffs. I have also notice an improvement from the pets of those alts due to the 100+ point presence increase.

 

Having Legacy gear override bound mods so those mods can be recycled for use by alts has also proven useful.