Why do you play a MMO if you don't have enough time?

[Guildenstern]

Good MMOs can attract and keep casual players just as easily as "hardcore".

[FranJ]

Good MMOs can attract and keep casual players just as easily as "hardcore".

 

Tell that to EQ, FFXI, Vanguard, etc...

[Wydow]

I use to be that hard core gamer; we would get a pizza and a case. The only time we would break was to pay the pizza guy and make a beer run. Weekends and hours and hours of nothing but hard core gaming. That was then (Aoc, WoW, warhammer, daoc, lotro and even aion) but like many we grew up and I don't have the endless hours to play now. With that said I still enjoy the time I do get on, a few hours here and there.

 

To me it is not about the end game rush anymore it is about pure enjoyment and stress relief after duty. I use to make these games a job and that was fun for me then, not now. If I have 2 hours to play I don’t want to waste it looking for a group the whole time on a low pop server. I get on run my little quests and missions and then go out into the real world. A lfg tool would be useful ,not a "need" for me to enjoy the game, but I would most def put it to use in time saving.

[Saberglow]

tldr: Suck it up kids or go to back to WoW.

 

I agree with the OP and Hippiechick. Those of us who played mmo's before Warcraft came along have an entirely different standard for MMO's. We played when things were a grind, because they were a grind. It gave us a feeling of accomplishment when after months of pushing and striving we achieved some awesome personal goal. There was no achievement tab telling you how special you were. It was personal and unique feeling of self worth and awesomeness. WoW opened up a very dangerous door with its easy access to the casual gamer. Casual's I'm sorry but you are a minority. You come and go from game to game on a whim. Take it as an insult idc its fact.

 

Hardcore old pre 1995 Gamers had very strict loyalties to company's and titles. A lot of this was due to a large variance between games. Games were not merely clones of one another with minor tweaks. There was vast differences between each MMO. WoW took the some of everything apporach and brought a lot of different titles and put them into one mold. Then tuned down the difficulty and skill level to make it more accessible to the casual impatient lazy demanding gamers. If you disagree with that you are a Casual gamer. You dont need to be angry about it, but you do need to accept it.

 

Those of us who enjoyed MMO's pre Warcraft do not like you. It isnt your fault. Because you are used to being catered to from blizzard you now expect every game on the internet to be the same way to keep your attention. I respect what you want out of a game, but stop trying to force every game to be like WoW. This is what will lead to the end of MMO's. Ask anyone that used to go to Arcades. There's a reason very few of them are left. Enjoy the challenges each game presents and strive to overcome them (not counting bugs).

 

Instead of ************ about nerf this and make my friends for me finders do some work. Make a guild of people who think like you. Be a proactive player and not just a forum troll trying to ruin everyone else's experience.

[wadetho]

similar to the qestion...

 

"why do people get on airplanes if they dont want to fly?"

 

to which someone answers... "allow me to ask this question, why do airplanes have to fly? they have wheels, why cant they just drive down the road?"

 

sigh...

[MMornard]

I do have "enough" time. I have as much time as I want to spend.

 

I do NOT have enough time to "suit" you. The fact is, this is irrelevant.

 

There are many, many, many more casual players than ... ahem... "hardcore." This trend, I predict, will only continue. Expect games to cater more and more to casual players. If there are 100,000 "hardcore" players and 1,000,000 casual players, you'd be a dope to cater to the hardcore players.

 

Resistance is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.

[Excorsion]

MMO's are MEANT to waste time. It's their primary function. That's why they exist: to waste your time.

 

If you are playing an MMO when you have something important to do, you're doing it wrong.

 

umm if you truely think that then you are doing it wrong... MMO's are meant for you to have fun while playing perferably with friends.... if you play on a realm that suddenly has a drop in playerbase so you can not excactly get a group togather to have fun then you are wasting your time which is something i don't think any dev wants thier game to be about...

 

you might want to stick to your real job... because it's bad biz to put out a game that is nothing more than a waste of time.Time sinks are there to milk the subscription... not because they are what is intended for the game. ask any dev.. and the number one priority for them is that the fans think thier game is fun.

[Spezamaho]

tldr: Suck it up kids or go to back to WoW.

 

I agree with the OP and Hippiechick. Those of us who played mmo's before Warcraft came along have an entirely different standard for MMO's. We played when things were a grind, because they were a grind. It gave us a feeling of accomplishment when after months of pushing and striving we achieved some awesome personal goal. There was no achievement tab telling you how special you were. It was personal and unique feeling of self worth and awesomeness. WoW opened up a very dangerous door with its easy access to the casual gamer. Casual's I'm sorry but you are a minority. You come and go from game to game on a whim. Take it as an insult idc its fact.

 

Hardcore old pre 1995 Gamers had very strict loyalties to company's and titles. A lot of this was due to a large variance between games. Games were not merely clones of one another with minor tweaks. There was vast differences between each MMO. WoW took the some of everything apporach and brought a lot of different titles and put them into one mold. Then tuned down the difficulty and skill level to make it more accessible to the casual impatient lazy demanding gamers. If you disagree with that you are a Casual gamer. You dont need to be angry about it, but you do need to accept it.

 

Those of us who enjoyed MMO's pre Warcraft do not like you. It isnt your fault. Because you are used to being catered to from blizzard you now expect every game on the internet to be the same way to keep your attention. I respect what you want out of a game, but stop trying to force every game to be like WoW. This is what will lead to the end of MMO's. Ask anyone that used to go to Arcades. There's a reason very few of them are left. Enjoy the challenges each game presents and strive to overcome them (not counting bugs).

 

Instead of ************ about nerf this and make my friends for me finders do some work. Make a guild of people who think like you. Be a proactive player and not just a forum troll trying to ruin everyone else's experience.

 

this guy.

 

btw i dont have fun mindlessly killing mobs to gain lvls. nor do i enjoy gathering materials for schematics and crafting nonsense. if the craftables were half as useless i could justify it. I play mmo's because i enjoy the challenge of the end game content. blame bioware for your 2 hours of fleet loitering due to a dozen servers with low pop. there is no need for that. iron citadel, one of the larger servers was heavy when i rolled there over 150 repub on the fleet now we are down to 40-60 given time of day. imp's have over 100 all times. server merge will help the game if they even care about saving it. casuals and hardcores should unite to the common problem, bioware.

 

tldr Bioware is the reason why you spend 2 hours looking for a group so you can finish your dailies on belsavis. let casuals be casual and let hardcores be hardcore. dont let bioware rob you of your money while they refuse to post anything on what they are doing to fix it.

[evilmonkitar]

I am almost 40- years old. I have 2 dogs, 2 kids, a husband, a house to look after, food to cook, errands to run, hobbies outside of swtor and rl friends. I don't have the time to devote to MMOs like I used to. We all have to grow up at some point but that doesn't mean we have to give up one of our favorite things.

 

Yes, sometimes you do have to give up your favorite things, that is what 'growing up' is; not having more things to do in a day...

 

 

If you know your time is going to be "wasted" looking for a group, why don't you make a guild, use the guild forum, and create a post or event on the calendar for a flashpoint or operation within the time frame you have to play? Take some initiative and be proactive like a previous poster stated.. or don't play; find something else to "waste" your time if you are concerned with the possibility of not 'getting stuff done' when you log in. Video games are a massive waste of time depending on which point of view you want to use.. I'm sure there are more things than just a video game that can provide enjoyment.

 

Opinions differ, this is mine.

[Lunazen]

tldr: Suck it up kids or go to back to WoW.

 

I agree with the OP and Hippiechick. Those of us who played mmo's before Warcraft came along have an entirely different standard for MMO's. We played when things were a grind, because they were a grind.

 

 

I think it depends on what your definition of grind is.

 

I played WoW for perhaps a month collectively. Wasn't my thing.

 

I played EQ2 when it was new and for several years afterward. I never felt like it was a grind in the beginning. It was pure fun, every bit of it. I watched it change over the years to become "more like WoW" and at that point, it felt like one huge grind.

 

For example, in the beginning, a certain mob for a heritage quest, the **** Captain my guild called him, was on a timer that could have you camping for days for him. Now... he's always up. Sure it's easier now, but the first scenario created memories. It was great! We don't talk about, "hey remember that time we did that Heritage Quest and all the mobs were right there for us to kill?" So, the waiting, the camping, the socializing during, that was not a grind to me.

 

Oddly enough, the mob being right there is a grind to me.

 

Another example: faction. If faction is gained naturally through the process of the game, it's not a grind, even if it takes a good amount of time. It can be fun because you are just playing the game. This Legacy thing reminds me of a faction grind in EQ2 towards one of the later expansions. It was a grind for more crafting recipes I believe. I don't know for sure because I stopped doing it. It was excessive. It was repetitive. It was an obvious time sink for no good purpose. There was no socialization involved. And more than likely, as soon as one would take a reasonable amount of time to finish that particular faction grind, another expansion comes out. Old goals and rewards fall to the wayside while "new" grinds await. Ugh. Just lots of the same over and over and over again.

 

 

 

TLDR So, I don't mind earning things. Not at all. And I don't mind things taking time as long as it feels like there is a good reason for it to take time, if it fits within the game, it if creates memories. If it's just a grind for a grind's sake, I generally avoid it now. I don't whine. I just go without. The most recent example: the plague. Loved it. Very glad BW put it in. I'm a sucker for live and world events. But after I did each quest once, that's enough for me. I won't do the same quest every day when I only have an hour or two to play, not even for a reward.

 

So I repeat, OP, I play an MMO within my own time constraints, and I do it because it's fun.

[Sycopat]

There are people who enjoy games like this, who enjoy playing with other people but don't have huge amounts of time to sink into them. This number is growing for two reasons: Increasingly MMO's and video games are becoming a mainstream hobby (aka: casuals) also gamers are getting older which leads to a) more people with less free time playing and b) more people who are getting tired of the idea of 'difficulty' as content.

 

These people don't see a reason for it to take an hour to get a group of random people together to run a flashpoint. Indeed, there really isn't one.

 

Most people don't really care who they're running a flashpoint with, they just want the people they are playing with to be able to do their jobs (Which is why Tanking and healing in other games often comes with certain amounts of grief from other players: These players jobs are, to more of an extent than DPS, dependent on them knowing the fight, whether or not they've ever seen the fight before.) and crossserver group finders remove the hassle of getting a group together.

 

They also make it easier for people to learn the ropes by providing an environment where it's a lot less likely that a newbies reputation can be ruined by the high expectations of other players. If someone gives tanking an honest go in a more highly anonymized environment, the social repercussions of their inevitable mistakes are lessened.

 

Also,standing at a hub spamming chat channels is a lot more boring then hitting a queue and going about your business until the group pops.

[Angel_of_Cain]

So people with lives and responsibilities should not be allowed to play this game???

[iRouven]

I have a somewhat reverse question.

 

Why do you play only one MMO if you have so much time?

 

Instead of complaining there is not enough to do in one game because you are able to be online 24/7 take pride in your abilities and max out 10 games. Lot's of f2p ones out there too! Go beat them all.

 

Hey, try Eve as well, it will take you years because of the way the learning is set up in real time!

 

(Not knocking Eve, good game.)

 

Resistance is irrelevant. You will be assimilated.

 

Futile mate, futile!

Edited April 23, 2012 by iRouven

[masterarohk]

Eve is dumb in my opinion. what is the point of a game where your only option practically to skill up/level up whatever you want to call it, is to basically sit around and wait. Someone logging for 8 hours a day against someone who logs on once every 2 weeks basically cannot gain any advantage other then monetary. the skill ups are 95% time based. if you ask me that makes it more casual then any other mmo out there. you cant even get into it without having a sub for at least 6 months to gain a few skills, and even then you can still never catch up to anyone who has been playing for even a year-2 years more then you, and the game has been out much longer then that. It practically doesn't even allow new players to get into the game. the system is actually kind of counter-intuitive to itself in that matter. Skill ups = casual style, but at the same time you can't be casual to catch up to any degree to anyone? what ?

 

And a lfg tool and cross server (at least for this game) is pretty necessary. i don't want to have to sit in general chat spamming a message every 90 seconds for 30 minutes to get a healer or tank, or if you happen to be on a low population server, waiting 30 minutes for a warzone. its an mmo standard for convenience to allow more fun time and less wait around and spam time. That doesn't make it any less casual or hardcore, it makes it more fun with less bull**** time.

 

But yes, there are many more casuals playing nowadays then in years past, not that i am one, so that's who developers will cater too. there is probably twice as many casuals as hardcore players out there so what do you expect. I would like to say i should be rewarded for playing twice as much as joe shmoe, but it wouldn't be very fun for joe shmoe to not only probably not be as skilled or knowledgeable as i am, and on top of that never be able to have gear as good as i would have. Or maybe they are as skilled or more then i am, but don't have the time to invest to get geared and play at the top level, also not fun for them and they wouldn't stay playing this game knowing they don't have the time to invest.

Edited April 23, 2012 by masterarohk

[EVGoon]

Yes the grand old days of MMO's... not just an adventure but a job as well.

There's nothing quite like that sinking feeling you get as you run back to grab your gear before the still smoking corpse is looted.

If the characters would have had dental work, the fillings would have been looted as well.

Well... as for me I kinda like the fact, if I pull some bonehead move I haven't wasted the last two weeks of grinding.

Real life provides enough potential grief, playing is a form of relaxation for me. Sorry if my casual presence in the game offends you.... I'm sure as the game matures you will find a group of like minded individuals.

I'll play my way and you play your way, I'm having way too much fun to quit.

 

Regards

[MMornard]

Yes the grand old days of MMO's... not just an adventure but a job as well.

There's nothing quite like that sinking feeling you get as you run back to grab your gear before the still smoking corpse is looted.

If the characters would have had dental work, the fillings would have been looted as well.

Well... as for me I kinda like the fact, if I pull some bonehead move I haven't wasted the last two weeks of grinding.

Real life provides enough potential grief, playing is a form of relaxation for me. Sorry if my casual presence in the game offends you.... I'm sure as the game matures you will find a group of like minded individuals.

I'll play my way and you play your way, I'm having way too much fun to quit.

 

Regards

 

Times a bazillion.

[Mamasmonkey]

tldr: Suck it up kids or go to back to WoW.

 

I agree with the OP and Hippiechick. Those of us who played mmo's before Warcraft came along have an entirely different standard for MMO's. We played when things were a grind, because they were a grind. It gave us a feeling of accomplishment when after months of pushing and striving we achieved some awesome personal goal. There was no achievement tab telling you how special you were. It was personal and unique feeling of self worth and awesomeness. WoW opened up a very dangerous door with its easy access to the casual gamer. Casual's I'm sorry but you are a minority. You come and go from game to game on a whim. Take it as an insult idc its fact.

 

Hardcore old pre 1995 Gamers had very strict loyalties to company's and titles. A lot of this was due to a large variance between games. Games were not merely clones of one another with minor tweaks. There was vast differences between each MMO. WoW took the some of everything apporach and brought a lot of different titles and put them into one mold. Then tuned down the difficulty and skill level to make it more accessible to the casual impatient lazy demanding gamers. If you disagree with that you are a Casual gamer. You dont need to be angry about it, but you do need to accept it.

 

Those of us who enjoyed MMO's pre Warcraft do not like you. It isnt your fault. Because you are used to being catered to from blizzard you now expect every game on the internet to be the same way to keep your attention. I respect what you want out of a game, but stop trying to force every game to be like WoW. This is what will lead to the end of MMO's. Ask anyone that used to go to Arcades. There's a reason very few of them are left. Enjoy the challenges each game presents and strive to overcome them (not counting bugs).

 

Instead of ************ about nerf this and make my friends for me finders do some work. Make a guild of people who think like you. Be a proactive player and not just a forum troll trying to ruin everyone else's experience.

 

I am one of those lazy gamers. I've played EQ, EQ2, and WoW. I've also put two kids through school, own a home, have spent most of my life working 10 to 12 hours days. I pretty much am a poster boy for delayed gratification except for when it comes to games, I play them for fun and yes I would like to enjoy playing them when I actually have some time off. When I feel something needs to be improved in the game I feel comfortable about posting my view of the game. What I don't do is go on condescending rants about how views other than my own are invalid because of some defect in character exhibited by the person holding the opposite view. I agree it does have the effect of getting casuals players who normally don't comment to just stop posting. How did that work out for you in EQ? I think the game will be stronger if all points of view are encouraged and Bioware finds a way to make us all enjoy our time in the game. If you have a point about the game please argue your point about the game, I just don't see how your view of other posters is useful or helpful. By the way my youngest kid is 31 and I do still play WoW occasionally but it's been a pretty long time since someone called me a kid. :-)

[evilxpoptart]

Women think my epics are sexy.

[Elkirin]

Lets just play the epeen, gamer a second, I played UO, EQ, DAOC, and many other games, through all content, both PvE and PvP, playing 20-30+ hrs a week every week, for years since 1997. and it matters, not one single iota.

I still only have one opinion like everyone else, regardless of playstyle.

 

Please do not pretend to speak on my behalf when you use words like;

" Those of us who enjoyed MMO's pre Warcraft do not like you"

 

or use your own twisted definition of casual to imply you represent my opinion.., you do not..

 

 

To the OP, games with choices tend to be more populated than Niche interest games. Heavily populated games often feel more alive than Niche games.

 

Populated towns do not detract from what is happening in dungeons and battlezones, let people play how they wish and let companies make enough money to develop content I can enjoy, Thank you.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Elkirin

[RobNightfall]

Loads of people are complaining in forums about no LFG tool, cross servers, credit sinks and such. Why do people play this genre of games if they don't have enough time? every MMO in history needed a good amount of time to accomplish the best equipment, the best ranks, etc... if you couldn't afford that, because u had priorities, no one would whine about that "there are people that has time, and they used to be the best top players". For instance: It's like you like playing football but u wanna become a professional football player, u should leave all your RL priorities to invest time playing football trying to become the best or at least a professional level. You can't expect to obtain the best equipment or top ranks if you play 1/3 than other player, it's as simple as that.

 

So before whining reconsider what type of game are u playing, and enjoy ur achievements. This game can be fun in multiple ways. I've friends that don't have time for raiding or hardcore pvp, and they just enjoy leveling different classes and doing all the storylines, exploring the world, finding the best look for their chars, etc...

 

MMOs are not like shooters, console rpgs or casual gaming in general (xbox/playstation), this is a different genre with different requirements.

 

LOL pay me a professional football player's wage and your argument will then a) motivate me and b) actually be meaningful. Until then, neither condition applies. And this isn't a profession, it's a game. Move out of your parents basement and obtain a profession. You'll find suddenly you don't have time to waste either.

[Cassidan]

I also played MMO's back when they were first getting started (though unlike some people, I do not feel like a Grandpa telling his Grandson about charging the beaches of Normandy because I played MMO's back in the day) and there have been many changes made in order to suit more casual players because game companies want a larger audience to make more money. Therefore it should not come as a surprise to other MMO players that casual players would enjoy tools designed with them in mind (such as the LFG tool). This does not mean you are forced to use it, but others might enjoy those tools if they are limited on time.

 

The reason many of us who are limited in time continue to play is because we enjoy the game just as much as you do (surprise!) and want the chance to experience the different parts of the game without having to spend hours spamming a chat channel. There should be somethings outside of a casual players grasp that can only be acquired by really investing time into the game such as for PvP gear in order to draw in the hardcore crowd as well, but casual players and companies reaching out to them is not going to go away. With the hectic times we live in these days, more and more people have less time to spend in a virtual world than we had in years past it feels like.

[Pathlight-]

I play because I loved Kotor and I love SW and this allows me to get my SW fix. However, I would never complain about what people with a lot more time get out of the game. They put more in, they get more out, makes sense.

[sakidnasty]

Elitist Dribble.

 

Who are you to tell me what to do with my $15?

[Saberglow]

I don't recall calling anyone a kid. If your life has changed to become extremely busy kids, long work days busy social life and you are limited to 10 hours or less a week you are CASUAL. That's not really debatable. I work 40 hours go to school 15 hours a week, have a social life and still put in ~20 hours a week in gaming. It's my hobby and will be my profession after school is done.

 

The main point of contention is that players who feel entitled to everything in the game regardless of how minimal time they put into it. I am not against a LFG tool. I am however against making all the best gear easily obtainable with minimal investment. There needs to be a balance between hours played and the level and quality of gear / rewards you receive. The problem is too many casual players don't agree and want something for little to nothing. There is a reason so many people are cancelling and flooding away from the game. Skilled players that have time to put in arent feeling that challenge a good balanced mmo presents. And people constantly complaining to make it even easier is pushing too far in the wrong direction. 25 min Hard modes are not enjoyable to me.

 

The main reason you can't find a group isnt because of a LFG tool its the dispersed server populations. A lot of "Hardcore" people like myself got around this by forming guilds and having active recruiting.

Edited April 24, 2012 by Saberglow

[DeutschGamer]

Its not about time, its about convenience.

 

If there is an option to streamline/speed up a boring process then it should be implemented, because this is a game and games are for entertainment. You don't get entertainment from sitting around waiting for people to come and typing in General asking for a group, you get it from playing the Flashpoint with other people.