A Healer's 1.2 Grievances: The story of why healers are upset

[Lunez]

If I were able to post images, this is the image I would post for Republic healers....

 

http://www.politifake.org/image/political/1203/oh-cry-me-a-river-crybaby-rich-poor-politics-1330674304.jpg

 

And I would post this one for Imperial healers...

 

http://static3.beanscdn.co.uk/modules/SbPicture/picture/cry-me-a-river-1.jpg

 

Moral to the story is.....

 

http://www.nedhardy.com/wp-content/uploads/images/2012/february/star_wars_lol/funny_star_wars_pictures_17.jpg

 

But on a more serious note....

 

http://allweirdnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/omg-funny.jpg

[mSum]

"Everything's fine for me, so everyone should shut up."

 

Yeah okay buddy .

 

Sort of....but isn't that the point?

 

If you roll into a WZ now wearing full champion gear you will get owned by anyone in full recruit gear. I have a feeling a lot of these people don't realize that 600 expertise is nothing now.

[bamsmacked]

But that's the thing. It was a different play style. You needed two good dps to work together. That's a team effort. People tell the healers that, "Oh pvp is a team effort. You are supposed to need people to help you."

 

 

I agree with a lot with what you said but this statement. If the game is such a team effort why can healers survive 1v1 encounters against DPS and it will drift into stalemate post 1.2?

 

Healers should have TEAMS protecting and guarding them, when a single DPS with skill can't kill a single healer I think we have a problem on our hands.

 

Believe me I was using Awe, Interrupts, Stasis, Push, Leap as interrupts but still in 1v1 situations I could not bring a healer down to Dispatch range. Could NOT do it. Interrupts didn't lock out an entire tree, Stasis, Push are on 1 minute cool downs Awe is on 45 second cool down a single DPS that's skilled should be able to defeat 1 healer that just throws out heals mindlessly with no system of fake casting or negative-consequence to follow.

 

It's a double standard here than when 1 DPS can't kill a healer, healers scream and shiyt about team work. But now team work is even more essential to prolong the life of a healer healers scream and cry about them being nerfed into the ground.

 

The game needed some re-balancing, I don't agree with this huge *** nerf of the operative/smuggler, and healing classes meanwhile damage output has been increased and Mara/Sentinels have becoming invincible vanishing gods of destruction. I wanted a balance and I wanted all classes to be brought up to the same playing field as far as mechanics goes. That didn't happened. You got major nerfs where they weren't needed and buffs that weren't needed.

 

I unsubbed because of this. I'm not wasting my time on a damn game that from the gitgo to me, rewarded less skilled players and 1 button mashing champions. The game was fairly balanced before compared to this patch but now it's just ridiculous and now looking back at all the things I was complaining about they seem trivial compared to the changes now.

 

Most of my complaints centered around balancing CC with a system of diminishing returns or simply make Resolve more powerful by making you immune to ALL forms of CC - which include roots, pulls, snares and etc.

Edited April 13, 2012 by bamsmacked

[TzachNahRood]

I agree with a lot with what you said but this statement. If the game is such a team effort why can healers survive 1v1 encounters against DPS and it will drift into stalemate post 1.2?

 

Healers should have TEAMS protecting and guarding them, when a single DPS with skill can't kill a single healer I think we have a problem on our hands.

 

This is just bizarre logic. The fact that you cannot see the glaring contradiction in your statement shows how self-focused you are.

 

A healer should need a team to stay alive, but a dpser should be able to solo a healer?

 

Isn't true balance that 1 healer vs 1 dpser cancel each other out and either needs a team to defeat the other?

 

It should take two dpsers to kill a healer. And it should take a healer's teammate to come along and kill the dpser.

 

Any team that had a clue already had this under control and it was working fine.

Edited April 13, 2012 by TzachNahRood

[noladev]

Introduction

There are a lot of threads arguing for and against the changes to healing. The healers are obviously up in arms and upset, where as the dps is cheering as they are draped in the blood of said healers. None of what I've seen so far really explains why healers are upset in a way that makes non-healers understand. This thread hopefully will shed more constructive light on that by a telling of a long story from a healer's perspective.

 

I encourage more healers to write about their gameplay experience as I am about to in this long thread.

 

"The nature of how pvp healing works has been changed. It's ruined," is something I've told people. The responses from healers were sympathy and consensus that this statement was true. Some DPS respond unfavorably with "You are exaggerating and over generalizing", "Get over it, you were imbalanced and now have to get used to how it should be", and "Healers shouldn't be able to be that unbeatable." But, the statement is true and this long story will explain why.

 

Starting Out as a Healer in TOR

So some background. I play a Republic Commando, level 50 obviously, in full Battlemaster Gear, valor rank 75. I slacked off after completing my gear. I did not warzone much until I hit level 50 so I had a long and terrible valor rank grind around the time when the Ilum fiasco reported by Kotaku occurred.

 

I enjoy healing, played as a healer for most of my long World of Warcraft career. But, what captivated me with The Old Republic was how the PvP was vastly different for healers. I went with very little and dated gear and stepped fresh into warzones and found out to my surprise that tanks can tank in PvP. It was like what?! Someone can actually guard and defend me? That's crazy. That's amazing. Someone's job is to be there for me, and watch my back. That was so refreshing that I immediately loved doing warzones. Healers felt appreciated. Tanks would ask at the start of warzones who was a heal so they could guard you. Someone actually cared.

 

Gone were the days (well mostly gone) were people would complain that there aren't any healers cause they are dying when you were in fact there healing your butt off. If your main is a healer, you know how disheartening it is for someone to make those complaints and not be recognized. In TOR, people noticed.

 

As a commando healer, I soon also quickly found out that I was amazing even without gear. Sure, I was squishy but it felt like I could still do stuff. Right away, I had imperials recognizing that I was a great healer because I did a lot of things healers should do but neglect to. I would line of sight often, using hammer shot to heal when I moved, cc'd every cd on appropriate targets, help dps when I could, even knock back. Sweet baby jesus this is amazing. It's active and engaging with a lot of stuff to do and I excel at all of it.

 

Then my gear slowly, and I mean slowly improved. As I said, most MMO's don't show appreciation to their healers. So although the community was warm and welcoming to my heals, the game surely was not. Ilum and warzones did not originally give kill credit for healing. You had to stop and tag stuff for killing. On my server, there were a lot more imps than rep in Ilum the majority of the time so stopping to tag targets was an insane waste of time when so many people needed heals and they need it now. Stopping meant death against the Imp zerg.

 

Gearing from scratch, the medal and valor system was brutal on healers. I could earn very few medals. 2.5k heal that even a dps could earn. A killing blow if I was lucky. 75k healing sure. Anything past that not guaranteed. While other people earned 6 medals easy. But, the community appreciated healers. People would MVP vote healers and you'd feel the love.

 

The change in the medal system and giving healers kill credit through healing finally gave healers game recognition for their deeds. Game was now giving credit, and healer valor gain doubled, maybe even tripled, making it way easier for healers to gear when they used to gear half as fast with the old system. I was past that already, but I was happy for new healers who wouldn't have to go through the horrible grind I did.

 

Then Came 1.2

Then came 1.2. I heard rumors that it was going to suck. Brushed it off as over exaggeration and was excited about a lot of the other features. The commando nerfs looked harsh, but I was like I'm going to get through this. I didn't put points in med zone reactive shield and was unkillable as is so I'll be fine. Or so I thought.

 

The damage buffs on dps and the med pack nerf came as a tidal wave against us. Compounded from the fact that Imperial 4 man groups have a lot better gear on average versus my servers Rep groups. I'm not exaggerating on the gear difference. I recognize the same Imps and guilds and groups on my server. It's kind of nice having that tight community. But that's digressing. Another strange anomaly of our server is our side doesn't have a lot of great dpsers. Empire had the DPS, we had tons of tanks and heals. It is not abnormal on our server to have 4 healers in a warzone. I've seen a game with 6. This lead to disaster in 1.2 as heavy organized 4 man Imp groups decimated a weird dynamic that used to play out on our server of having long games where Rep side couldn't kill, but wouldn't die. Now it was Rep side just dies.

 

Weird composition of my server warzones aside. The amount of dps that geared marauders and powertechs were doing was crazy. People were falling over left and right, and heals meant nothing. It went from, "Yeah, I can save you" to give everything you got to delay death slightly. Against two geared dps going down on one person, person is just dead. Nothing you can do about it.

 

As a commando I didn't need a tank pre 1.2. I could tank it myself. Throw me a good, geared tank and we were a two man god team. Me and my tank against the world. Couldn't necessarily kill anything, but we wouldn't die. That was the thing though, we couldn't necessarily kill anything. People lived for a long time. To kill a healer required a lot of coordination and focus fire. 1v1 as a healer was easily a stalemate. A good dps could lock you down so outbound healing to other people was hard to do, but couldn't necessarily kill you. Your health might spike and stuff, but if you managed your CDs you knew you could make it out if you were good enough. Two dps should be able to kill me but a lot of dps don't interrupt. That was their biggest problem. They never interrupted the right thing or at all. Medical probe should've been their target, not advanced. That goes on cooldown anyways after using it unless I have supercharge up. Wait for reactive shield to pass, lock out medical probe after the adv probe I used to make it cheaper, then burst with your adrenals and relic. How do you think I'm keeping up with tanking a bunch of you, managing my wz expertise adrenal and relics carefully. Never had to juke heals much cause people just don't interrupt in the first place and there's so many stuns, kb etc, juking isn't always worth it.

 

But, then we were told it wasn't ever supposed to be that way. We weren't meant to be able to last that long. Granted some of commando nerfs I'm okay with. We didn't need to manage ammo, but since I played with a lot of movement and hammer shot to begin with, the ammo management change didn't phase me much at all. I'm glad that was added.

 

Survivability was killed though. Went from super hard to kill to yeah, they can kill me. Consequently, can't save other people because I have to worry a lot more about myself. It took myself and my sage friend to heal her to keep her alive from one marauder. That's two healers healing to stop one dps. My heart goes out to those sages. They can't take care of themselves as easily as before, and before there was a lot of "keep running, they gonna kill you!" Her deaths I would say doubled each warzone. She comes out of the spawn and gets sent quickly back.

 

Output wise, I can get the same numbers. I can still push past 300k healing in a warzone. Think I did 500k one warzone tonight. But, a lot more people die cause the damage is insane. My tanks die. I can't save them if they guard me like I used to because taking care of myself takes so much more, can't heal other people as well. Sometimes I'm left to free heal and still can't save people. It didn't make things harder. It just made things more depressing. Pre 1.2, it was hard to keep everyone up alive. But, by jolly, it could be done!

 

Pre 1.2 healers felt like they had a huge impact. They did. They could do so much. People would rage about focus firing healers. People made a fit about marking healers. Healers would point out in their ops that they must be marked cause they are being focus fired hard and dying now as a badge of honor and frustration at the same time. Some void stars never got passed the first door both rounds. A healer was important. Vastly important. You want to kill someone, you can't ignore that healer. Someone has to lock it down or you all have to go and kill it.

 

Post 1.2 dealing with the healer is optional. Can just bypass the healer, kill the guy directly. Or just outright dispatch the healer like it was nothing.

 

That's why healing has fundamentally changed. That's why healers are all upset. Feels like a bait and switch. From a game where we were super important, then changed to a minor nuisance that is optional to deal with. We lost our independence, our time in the lime light. Back to other MMO styles where we require other people to hold our hands, peel things off of us constantly.

 

Sure, might make DPS a lot happier. Sure, it might be in line with intended balance. But, it doesn't feel good to be reliant and dependent again. Doesn't feel good to not be the center of attention in warzone dynamics. Doesn't feel good to be treated same way other MMO's have treated us.

 

The proof of the change is a new trend I've noticed in mvp votes. Gone is the emphasis to give healers votes instead of the person with the most medals. Votes are now given to the person with that crazy damage doing 600k a warzone. DPS is the one that is important. People don't remember you helping them as much cause they are dying which was a huge change from holy heals batman, I didn't die that whole warzone. That's amazing, Mr. Healer. No more Healer is immortal. That was an amazing day when I got immortal as a commando healer. I was so happy. Now I'll be happy to get unbeatable.

 

Like every other MMO

 

I was losing a lot of games. Then I found a 600k damage person to carry me. I could heal again while he did his thing and killed people. People would focus fire on him to kill that crazy Vanguard dpsing hard. I wouldn't be able to save him even though I could free heal, and spent the time reminiscing about the days I used to be that guy that people focus fired, I used to matter.

 

Healers hoped that it wasn't a flavor of a month sort of deal. We'll all get used to the change back to mainstream style of DPS being king, but a long time ago, in a patch far far away, there was an MMO were healers were appreciated, a promise land of you being a key piece that others were dependent on and not the other way around. The Old Republic wanted to make players feel more heroic. You made healers feel heroic till you changed your minds about it. What other MMO let a healer heal himself and take care of 7 other people like a baus. It didn't have to be unintentional. It could have been a game design decision, and it's depressing that it was never intended. BW could have stood by that stance. Healers were OP. Now DPS is OP. Why do healers have to work for it now, and certain DPS classes don't have to work for it? Nothing's ever completely balanced.

 

I put those points into med zone to give me that extra 20% healing to myself I didn't have before. Tanked two dps at once as I watched people die around me and noticed that these bad dps didn't interrupt as usual. Yeah, I'm living again, but it's not me. They are just bad. It's not me being awesome. They are just bad. Awesome was the low death rate of warzones of old. *sigh*

 

My healing numbers are the same as they always were. The problem? It is all self-healing. I can barely spare any heals for the team.

Now you see the problem with basing balance changes on end of war zone stats/metrics??

[bamsmacked]

This is just bizarre logic. The fact that you cannot see the glaring contradiction in your statement shows how self-focused you are.

 

A healer should need a team to stay alive, but a dpser should be able to solo a healer?

 

Isn't true balance that 1 healer vs 1 dpser cancel each other out and either needs a team to defeat the other?

 

It should take two dpsers to kill a healer. And it should take a healer's teammate to come along and kill the dpser.

 

Any team that had a clue already had this under control and it was working fine.

 

The difference between a Healer and a DPS is that a DPS can die....

 

If a DPS doesn't have pocket heals it's dead. Even in 1v1 situations, DPS dies. Healers prevail.

 

Before DPS needed healers to do, you know DPS. They could be killed, 1v1 healers could not.

 

Healers should not be invincible and with the interrupt system being **** you cannot DPS through the heals.

 

Interrupt should lock out an entire tree like traditional interrupts do, that would have significantly balanced the system and no nerfs would be needed.

 

I'm calling for a balance and compromise. When I'm sitting here beating the piss water out of a Healer, blowing all my CDs just to interrupt it's heals and still can't kill it something is wrong. Interrupt a big heal. Force Push another heal. Stasis another Heal. Awe another heal. Interrupt another. If it's not dead by this point, it's a stalemate. I will beat this thing for 30-40k damage until a friend or foe comes along so that we can proceed to finish the healer off or finish what's left of me off.

[Doxxs]

It's like a Lifetime movie

 

"The Story of Why Healers are Upset: A Healer's Struggle Against 1.2."

[TzachNahRood]

The difference between a Healer and a DPS is that a DPS can die....

 

If a DPS doesn't have pocket heals it's dead. Even in 1v1 situations, DPS dies. Healers prevail.

 

Before DPS needed healers to do, you know DPS. They could be killed, 1v1 healers could not.

 

Healers should not be invincible and with the interrupt system being **** you cannot DPS through the heals.

 

Interrupt should lock out an entire tree like traditional interrupts do, that would have significantly balanced the system and no nerfs would be needed.

 

I'm calling for a balance and compromise. When I'm sitting here beating the piss water out of a Healer, blowing all my CDs just to interrupt it's heals and still can't kill it something is wrong. Interrupt a big heal. Force Push another heal. Stasis another Heal. Awe another heal. Interrupt another. If it's not dead by this point, it's a stalemate. I will beat this thing for 30-40k damage until a friend or foe comes along so that we can proceed to finish the healer off or finish what's left of me off.

 

Again your entire statement proves the point and just continues your gross contradiction. You are saying that you are mad that you cannot solo a healer and that you need a teammate to help you kill him.

[SKNugget]

It's like a Lifetime movie

 

Watch that channel a lot?

 

lol jk no-wtfbbq-takebacks

Edited April 13, 2012 by SKNugget

[bamsmacked]

Again your entire statement proves the point and just continues your gross contradiction. You are saying that you are mad that you cannot solo a healer and that you need a teammate to help you kill him.

 

I'm not mad about that.

 

The contradiction I'm trying to point out is this.

 

Healers would claim that this is a team based game, yet they can run solo and survive in 1v1 situations and that team work is needed to beat them. Could DPSes ever run solo? No. And they still can't run solo. Teamwork is required for all other classes to prevail post 1.2 patch WITH THE EXCEPTION OF HEALERS.

 

But now that teamwork is required for healers to I dunno, stay alive and their ability to heal themselves and others at the same time has been nerfed they are upset??

 

If working in a proper team heals can still be very strong, I was in a warzone the day the patch was released and healers still managed to heal through our DPS because they had multiple healers.

 

The real issue at hand is that Healers expect to be invincible in solo encounters, and when people bring this up they scream and shout about how team work is required to take one down. But now with this patch, despite all the bad **** more teamwork is actually more required than it was before, I think this is the real issue. Healers can't survive 1v1 situations against DPSes and you know what I say?

 

TEAMWORK. Get your Guard to guard you. DPS can't plow through both players you know. DPSers and Tankers rely on healers to stay alive and now Healers get to rely on us to stay alive as well.

Edited April 13, 2012 by bamsmacked

[TzachNahRood]

I'm not mad about that.

 

The contradiction I'm trying to point out is this.

 

Healers would claim that this is a team based game, yet they can run solo and survive in 1v1 situations and that team work is needed to beat them. Could DPSes ever run solo? No. And they still can't run solo. Teamwork is required for all other classes to prevail post 1.2 patch WITH THE EXCEPTION OF HEALERS.

 

But now that teamwork is required for healers to I dunno, stay alive and their ability to heal themselves and others at the same time has been nerfed they are upset??

 

If working in a proper team heals can still be very strong, I was in a warzone the day the patch was released and healers still managed to heal through our DPS because they had multiple healers.

 

The real issue at hand is that Healers expect to be invincible in solo encounters, and when people bring this up they scream and shout about how team work is required to take one down. But now with this patch, despite all the bad **** more teamwork is actually more required than it was before, I think this is the real issue. Healers can't survive 1v1 situations against DPSes and you know what I say?

 

TEAMWORK. Get your Guard to guard you. DPS can't plow through both players you know.

 

Wow. There is obviously no use trying to teach you the meaning of logic.

 

"Others should need teamwork to survive. I should be able to solo anyone." Yeah. Great logical argument there.

 

Could you be more self-centered? lol

Edited April 13, 2012 by TzachNahRood

[CompassRose]

I'm going to have to disagree with you on the mobility issue. Combat Medics are very immobile relative to the other two healing AC's and to the mechanics of the dps classes.

 

We don't have any reliable separation. If there is a z-axis (huttball) then we can create distance with the kb, otherwise it's not particularly good. Except for Scoundrel/Operatives all of the melee classes have either pulls or leaps to keep us engaged, as well as stuns and slows to keep us from escaping. We have one stun and a cast-time mez.

 

Our instant heals (the core of your argument that we are mobile) are very weak or on cooldowns. Hammer Shot is okay at topping someone off and is better than nothing if you're having ammo problems, but it won't effectively heal someone under pressure from a dps. Kolto bomb has always been more useful for the buff than for the actual healing it does. Bacta infusion is a pretty weak heal and the 17 second cd (with set bonus) means that you can't really heal while on the run. You're not going to be able to extend anyone's life with hammer shot, kolto bomb, and a medium heal every 17 seconds. And, yes, Tech Override makes one cast-time ability instant, but it's on a 2min cd.

 

Both scoundrels and sages have heals (or bubbles) that they can cast on the move that are a core part of their rotation. In addition they have far more cc abilities as well as escapes. Commandos are easy to catch and keep pinned in one place because we have to stand still at some point and heal either ourselves or others.

 

You're right that with all of our cd's available we only have to stop for 3 seconds, but what if you're under pressure? How will you escape? What if your cd's aren't up? We have small windows of mobility, but most of the time we're going to have to sit and cast something.

 

I think the class changes to combat medic were probably fine. What's so damaging to the ac is the change to expertise. We had to be a little bit tanky because we couldn't really escape once we were engaged. Pre-1.2 we were probably a little too tanky, but post 1.2 we melt too fast. Now a good marauder or powertech will stomp a combat medic's face in with ease. And you have no chance of getting away.

 

On top of all that, the changes to expertise means that burst dps exceeds burst healing by a significant margin. Given equal gear and a similar skill level, I don't believe it's possible to keep a target (or yourself) alive through burst damage. My experience yesterday certainly bore that analysis out. And before the l2p people get in, neither my nor the people I play with are bad players.

 

Good questions, good arguments. I'll take them a paragraph at a time:

 

-- We don't have any reliable seperation

 

NOBODY has any reliable seperation in this game. Not with the amount of roots/snares/stuns that can come from any combination of EIGHT enemy players in a warzone. If they want you to stay put, you will stay put.

 

Kolto bomb has always been more useful for the buff than for the actual healing it does. Bacta infusion is a pretty weak heal and the 17 second cd (with set bonus)

 

I've got my Bacta Infusion down to 9 seconds. Where are you getting 17 seconds from?

Kolto is a group heal you can do on the run, and that enhances the heals for any player that got it with it. It might not heal for a lot, but name another group heal that buffs subsequent heals you can make on the run for 2 ammo or the force power equivalent.

 

You're right that with all of our cd's available we only have to stop for 3 seconds, but what if you're under pressure? How will you escape? What if your cd's aren't up? We have small windows of mobility, but most of the time we're going to have to sit and cast something.

 

You're ALWAYS under pressure. You're a healer. It wouldn't be a warzone without a marauder draped on your back and your team doing nothing about it. When you move in to heal a player, you move to an area that on the fringe as much as possible, with some form of cover in case you start taking ranged damage.

 

If you get jumped by melee, you pull as much aggro as you can as far away from the objectives as possible while dragging out your death as much as possible.

 

You're going down. Because 95% of the population just can't take a healer getting away on low health. They MUST finish the job, even if it takes 3-4 of them to do it. Even if it takes 45 seconds to a minute to do it. Even if.....wait how did they just score 2 goals in Huttball so quickly? How did they plant that bomb on the door? Where did half the team go?

 

If they want you dead, you're dead. No matter the class, no matter the spec. The key is to make them pay for it.

 

It's not just about healing your teammtes. It's about getting the other team to surrender a strategic advantage for a +1 on their kill count. And the commando is perfectly positioned to do that with the Heavy Armor / mobile heals combo.

[SpaceJ]

Either they balance around the healer having guard or they balance around the healer not having guard. It's damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

With guard, especially if they have gear, they are unkillable. They are better tanks than the tank that put the guard on them. This is obviously not a good situation. Without guard, they can die easily.

 

Even ignoring this obvious issue, which DPS class do you balance the healers ability to 'tank' through the damage around? The highest or the lowest? If it's the highest, the lower DPS classes have zero chance. If it's the lowest, healers will complain that any DPS trumps them.

 

Give the changes some actual time to settle in, give yourself the chance to relearn your class, and you might discover some goodness there.

 

For the record I play a Bounty Hunter Mercenary healer, as my signature indicates, and I will tell you that BH Merc needed the nerf stick badly. I never went above even 10% heat on my healer going full-out on heals. This is obviously only one of the three healing classes opinion, but it's what I think.

 

If you don't see a problem with a tank/healer combination being 'god like', using your own words, than I can't do much for your opinion.

[bamsmacked]

Wow. There is obviously no use trying to teach you the meaning of logic.

 

Others should need teamwork to survive. I should be able to solo anyone. Yeah. Great logical argument there.

 

Could you be more self-centered? lol

 

Jesus Christ. You must not be comprehending what I just said????????????

 

A DPS CAN DIE. I die all the time! I DIE!!! I DIE CONSTANTLY! I COULD BE KILLED IN 1 V 1 SITUATIONS!! Healers could not!!

 

How is that teamwork? HOW IS THAT TEAMWORK?

 

I rely on heals and tanks to stay alive, healers rely on nothing to stay alive? How IS THAT TEAMWORK the supposed choir of HEALERS have been PREACHING?

 

If TEAMWORK is their THING then they should LOVE this PATCH SINCE TEAMWORK IS EVEN MORE REQUIRED FOR THEM TO STAY ALIVE!

 

Post 1.2 patch what did I need to STAY ALIVE AND EFFECTIVELY DPS? Tanks and Heals. Teamwork.

 

What did a Sage healer need? NOTHING. You get close to it KNOCK BACK, force speed fights over. Or if you get lucky enough to get on it the best thing you can do is to keep it from healing others while keeping up the pressure blowing every single CD imaginable just to limit it's heals and still isn't enough to even get a dent in the healer for Dispatch.

 

Healers IN MY MIND are the most valuable asset to the TEAM and SHOULD BE high value targets and SHOULD require a team effort to maximize there life span - and effectiveness.

Edited April 13, 2012 by bamsmacked

[iceperson]

 

A DPS CAN DIE. I die all the time! I DIE!!! I DIE CONSTANTLY! I COULD BE KILLED IN 1 V 1 SITUATIONS!! Healers could not!!

 

If you were dying to healers that much then there's something wrong...

[TzachNahRood]

Jesus Christ. You must not be comprehending what I just said????????????

 

A DPS CAN DIE. I die all the time! I DIE!!! I DIE CONSTANTLY! I COULD BE KILLED IN 1 V 1 SITUATIONS!! Healers could not!!

 

How is that teamwork? HOW IS THAT TEAMWORK?

 

I rely on heals and tanks to stay alive, healers rely on nothing to stay alive? How IS THAT TEAMWORK the supposed choir of HEALERS have been PREACHING?

 

If TEAMWORK is their THING then they should LOVE this PATCH SINCE TEAMWORK IS EVEN MORE REQUIRED FOR THEM TO STAY ALIVE!

 

Post 1.2 patch what did I need to STAY ALIVE AND EFFECTIVELY DPS? Tanks and Heals. Teamwork.

 

What did a Sage healer need? NOTHING. You get close to it KNOCK BACK, force speed fights over. Or if you get lucky enough to get on it the best thing you can do is to keep it from healing others while keeping up the pressure blowing every single CD imaginable just to limit it's heals and still isn't enough to even get a dent in the healer for Dispatch.

 

And what could that healer do back to you in return? Nothing. As you already clearely stated in a previous post: 1 on 1 with you and a healer was a stalemate. You could not kill the healer and the healer could not kill you because all they could do was heal themselves.

 

It required a third person from either team to come along and finish the fight. This is good balance.

 

It is your continual self-centered, flawed logic that got us to this point in 1.2 PvP. Enjoy it. Because they listened to the mess of illogical, self-centered complainers like yourself and destroyed a good thing.

Edited April 13, 2012 by TzachNahRood

[bamsmacked]

If you were dying to healers that much then there's something wrong...

 

I'm not saying I'm dying to healers. I'm saying I'm dying to other DPS. Everyone is susceptible to DPS except healers in post 1.2.

 

If Interrupts worked as traditional interrupts like in other MMOs, that would have balanced the system enough and nerfs wouldn't be necessary.

 

I could Interrupt a big heal, lock out the tree briefly giving me a few seconds to do some damage and then I will have Awe, Stasis, and Push as additional interrupts waiting for my next CD to cool down. Lone healers would be forced to think more strategically, and use CC more effectively.

[SliggXx]

Reality: Healers are a detriment to a group.

 

I know, that is strange, right? Well, the reality is that because people have figured out that even one quality dps can faceroll even a great healer rather easily now, there is no reason to bring even one healer to a group when you can put in a high dps class or a shadow/assassin tank that all have much more effective damage mitigation cooldowns and can be effective even while being attacked. A group of all dps/tanks can kill other players so quickly that they don't even nee heals.

 

Don't believe me? Just watch how things play out once rated comes out if nothing is done about this.

 

Sentinal (Guarded),, Sentinal (Guarded),, Sentinal (Guarded),, DPS Vanguard (Guarded), Jugg, Jugg, Shadow, Shadow. Taunts coordinated on rotation. Two groups assisting = two players dying every 2 GCDs. GG. Game Over. Thanks for playing.

[TzachNahRood]

I'm not saying I'm dying to healers. I'm saying I'm dying to other DPS. Everyone is susceptible to DPS except healers in post 1.2.

 

If Interrupts worked as traditional interrupts like in other MMOs, that would have balanced the system enough and nerfs wouldn't be necessary.

 

I could Interrupt a big heal, lock out the tree briefly giving me a few seconds to do some damage and then I will have Awe, Stasis, and Push as additional interrupts waiting for my next CD to cool down. Lone healers would be forced to think more strategically, and use CC more effectively.

 

Yes a single dpser could not kill a healer and a single healer could not kill a dpser.

 

Why was this a problem? This was good balance.

 

It is only a problem in your self-centered, gank, glibfest drenched brain that helped destroy the joy that was SWTOR PvP.

 

OMG?! I can't solo kill this healer?! He can't solo kill me either, but I should definitely be able to solo kill him!! Because I need killz!!! Nerf whine nerf whaw cry whine.

 

/sigh

Edited April 13, 2012 by TzachNahRood

[bamsmacked]

And what could that healer do back to you in return? Nothing. As you already clearely stated in a previous post: 1 on 1 with you and a healer was a stalemate. You could not kill the healer and the healer could not kill you because all they could do was heal themselves.

 

It required a third person from either team to come along and finish the fight. This is good balance.

 

It is your continual self-centered, flawed logic that got us to this point in 1.2 PvP. Enjoy it. Because they listened to the mess of illogical, self-centered complainers like yourself and destroyed a good thing.

 

I said I unsubbed. I'm not playing this garbage anymore, just because I didn't agree with the mechanics of how heals worked doesn't mean I like this new patch.

 

It's in my mind that healers are the most self-centered group of players. Preach team work but can run around solo and not die, meanwhile if anyone else does it they die easily. I didn't call for a nerf, I just wanted Interrupts to work like real Interrupts that way healers are just as vulnerable to DPS as everyone else is? How is that self-centered?

 

I had a feeling from the gitgo that this game would end up this way. Flooded with 1 button mashing champions and classes that are so easy to play and win with that a monkey on crack could win with.

 

Meanwhile I've been playing one of the most underwhelming classes/specs in the game (Deep Vigilance) and working my *** off just to come off on top while other classes don't even have to try.

 

Even with the new patch, my class got a considerable buff and I was initially excited about it I just can't play in a environment with a dull competitive environment.

 

I didn't call for a nerf to healers, I called for a better system of Interrupts. So get your **** straight. No system of fake casting, no negative-consequences of healing post 1.2 patch and you come and put my skill level into question?

Edited April 13, 2012 by bamsmacked

[TzachNahRood]

Reality: Healers are a detriment to a group.

 

I know, that is strange, right? Well, the reality is that because people have figured out that even one quality dps can faceroll even a great healer rather easily now, there is no reason to bring even one healer to a group when you can put in a high dps class or a shadow/assassin tank that all have much more effective damage mitigation cooldowns and can be effective even while being attacked. A group of all dps/tanks can kill other players so quickly that they don't even nee heals.

 

Don't believe me? Just watch how things play out once rated comes out if nothing is done about this.

 

Sentinal (Guarded),, Sentinal (Guarded),, Sentinal (Guarded),, DPS Vanguard (Guarded), Jugg, Jugg, Shadow, Shadow. Taunts coordinated on rotation. Two groups assisting = two players dying every 2 GCDs. GG. Game Over. Thanks for playing.

 

As someone putting together a ranked team, I had to recommend to my own teammates that I had put together to find someone else to replace me. As I was now only a liability.

 

Anything would be better on an 8-man team than a healer right now if that team wants to strive to be the very best.

[SKNugget]

Reality: Healers are a detriment to a group. .

 

Unfortunately this is what has happened. I went from Mako to Tallos Drelik.

 

I guess I'm glad RWZs were delayed.

[Dietra]

The difference between a Healer and a DPS is that a DPS can die....

 

If a DPS doesn't have pocket heals it's dead. Even in 1v1 situations, DPS dies. Healers prevail.

 

Before DPS needed healers to do, you know DPS. They could be killed, 1v1 healers could not.

 

Healers should not be invincible and with the interrupt system being **** you cannot DPS through the heals.

 

Interrupt should lock out an entire tree like traditional interrupts do, that would have significantly balanced the system and no nerfs would be needed.

 

I'm calling for a balance and compromise. When I'm sitting here beating the piss water out of a Healer, blowing all my CDs just to interrupt it's heals and still can't kill it something is wrong. Interrupt a big heal. Force Push another heal. Stasis another Heal. Awe another heal. Interrupt another. If it's not dead by this point, it's a stalemate. I will beat this thing for 30-40k damage until a friend or foe comes along so that we can proceed to finish the healer off or finish what's left of me off.

 

Ok had to lol at this post... yes dps can die... and the healer can heal... but while the healer is healing against the dps... he's not exactly doing any damage himself is he? And if he healer is doing dps... to kill the dps... he is not healing himself... and can also die... Don't hear you saying that the healer is killing you in this story....

[bamsmacked]

Ok had to lol at this post... yes dps can die... and the healer can heal... but while the healer is healing against the dps... he's not exactly doing any damage himself is he? And if he healer is doing dps... to kill the dps... he is not healing himself... and can also die... Don't hear you saying that the healer is killing you in this story....

 

Healer doesn't kill me, right. The only advantage of this sort of situation is that it forces the healer to focus it's heals on itself rather than allies.

 

The biggest problem I have with post-healing was that skill didn't matter. I would eventually blow my CDs and Interrupt before I could get it down to 20% health. Believe me I always come close. But after I blow my first wave of CDs and after about the second Interrupt I'm down to hardly any resource and still the Healer is sitting on 400 force still throwing out heals.

 

I consider myself a skilled player, I rolled Vigilance from the gitgo and was consistent in my Warzones. I'm playing a Piano fest on my keyboard with all these damn keybinds, between interrupting throwing out taunts, snares, and rolling out my damage rotations my fingers are all over the damn keyboard. I liked this system. I liked not having macros and I liked the feeling of knowing I worked my *** off to beat someone, it lets me know that skill is playing a part.

 

But again.. When I'm having a piano fest on my keyboard working my *** off trying to break through heals and I can't even put a dent into a healer while they are just standing STILL not moving maybe pressing 3-5 buttons that's FRUSTRATING.

 

And that's the real reason why I quit. No skill is required to win in this game. You want to win now? Roll a Sent or Mara. You'll be an invincible god of destruction and no healer required to take people down.

 

All I wanted was a fixed system of interrupts like in OTHER MMOS that way healers would be on the same playing field as everyone else.

[Moondragon]

i as a lvl 50 healer have some complaints but it's not about the typical healing nerfs or dps buffs etc etc..instead my complaint is this..why is it that i can heal the crap out of my entire team, sheild them keep them alive to get the 40+ kills and sometimes get only 1 vote?

 

i was in a huttball game yesterday where i had 264k healing done, scored 3 goals, had several medals and objective points yet i recieved 1 vote..instead the majority of the team voted for the guy who had 42 kills, 0 goals scored, and 0 objectives..

 

my biggest complaint i guess is that sure getting kill credits for healing people is nice but teammates should remember to thanks those of us keeping you alive to do your tons of dmg and get lots of kills..

 

it makes no sense that a player like me who actually plays the warzones as intended and not as a personal team death match should be lacking in mvp votes. i personally vote for other likeminded players who do the game objectives and i wish others did the same.

 

Believe it or not...I NEVER played huttball on the new patch yet. (>_>)

So I'm curious...do Goals still count for diddly? Passes have no value? etc etc. i.e. Does playing as a team to get the objective done still not count for squat (read: no objective points)? If the answer is yes...then my answer would be that. I hope. Personally....I don't think 80% of the pop knows how to really mvp huttball...but that could be just my server. If it's actually counting for something...buh...i don't know. Lame people?