The penalties for losing are TOO severe

[Varicite]

Winning or losing --- I always played out the WZ. Well, I used to...

 

I could always keep doing my part, giving my best and getting an (okish) reward. Even seen a few matches that got turned around as others also kept trying. It was worth it to keep trying... in the end I got a reward for the time spend and at least part of that was linked to my own performance.

 

Also, these days I don't have as much time to play as I would like, so, my time in game is kinda precious (to me that is).

 

*shrug* Guess what I'm going to start doing now Bioware...

 

Sorry but I'm not gonna waste 10-20mins on this system that punishes people extra -- for bad match ups, even if they keep trying. So its time to start leaving matches...

 

My time is better spend on other things in game (or out of). Hope you people are working really hard on more PVE stuff, because you just shot casual pvp in the head for me.

 

Deserter debuff for normal WZs incoming...

[Kheldarr]

I'm writing this post while "Playing" and by playing I mean gettign swarmed by republic forces playing mostly troopers and jedi who are killing my team as soon as they jump off the spawn point in Voidstar. So, yeah, canceling my account. **** you bioware.

 

Perhaps concentrating on the match might be a better idea? Threads can be written afterwards...

[Ssfbistimg]

Deserter debuff for normal WZs incoming...

 

If bioware adds deserter buffs and keeps rewards as is you will just have even longer PVP queue times. Cause Most people will just stop queuing up. Not worth the Time and effort to get 40 or less comms per lose. Especially with the high cost of war hero gear & weapons

[mSum]

I 100% agree that the penalty for losing is way too high now. Not because I want a cookie for failing....because people are bailing as soon as things go south. A single score against us in Huttball and 4 players bail. And I'm left sitting there wondering why I haven't left yet. I guess I should in the future.

 

People leaving WZ was a problem before, now it's a nightmare. Thanks BW.

Edited April 13, 2012 by mSum

[Tetrablade]

Ok forum patrol.

What's your honest take on 1.2 pvp.

I'll bet you never even played one yet, simply because you say it's fine.

You like joining a team and receiving less rewards then before? At least If your team lost before 1.2, and you did well, You would be rewarded well for your performace.[ in case you failed to notice]

 

^^^ Who hired this sabredance comedian guy.

 

Actually i'm ok with getting less. In theory it means my team is more motivated to win. I guess I keep forgetting that mmo pvp in general is becoming more and more "on a silver platter" kind of gameplay. 40:100 ratio? Wow, so even losing thats 40% of what you would get for winning? Almost 50%? Yeah i'm ok with it, but then again I do more in these games then just the pvp warzones. How many games in rl or online give you stuff for LOSING?

 

Geez, its like you guys have never played an mmo where stuff changed. But i'm betting you have played other mmos that have given you more gind with less rewards before, so what makes this so different? I have played the new warzone, played the old ones with the changes (thank goodness an end to farming on voidstar, mostly) and yeah I like the changes.

 

If you are unhappy i'm sorry for you, but please examine exactly WHY you are unhappy. Saying that its unbalanced to be getting 40% of the rewards that you would have gotten if you won is kinda...spoiled honestly. Not saying that 1.2 was without flaws, but personally I think what we got was better then what we lost.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Tetrablade

[Lord_Karsk]

Just did a wz on my low lvl alt. 6 medals got 33 wz commendations.

 

PvP is now a complete patetic joke in this game.

 

TY devs for destroying the only joy i had left in this singel player pve game.

[Varicite]

If bioware adds deserter buffs and keeps rewards as is you will just have even longer PVP queue times. Cause Most people will just stop queuing up. Not worth the Time and effort to get 40 or less comms per lose. Especially with the high cost of war hero gear & weapons

 

Altogether, it's a bad combination.

 

1) Games still start uneven or in progress; Abort removed.

2) Gear/expertise reworked; everyone at a lower level than they were previously.

3) No Rated WZs; Gear, etc, now costs 3x as much as originally intended, due to lack of Rated WZ comms.

4) Server populations still uneven; some servers experience a high # of losses due to #1.

5) Rewards lowered for losing side; rewards do not currently take into account new cost of consumables/gear.

 

This is why I don't think that the "penalties for losing are TOO severe". I think that 1-4 are the major culprits, causing people to feel the way that they do.

 

Granted, some people would complain just to complain about the changes, but if 1-4 were resolved (#2 will go away on its own, and #4 may never go away), I don't think too many people would feel this system is too unfair.

 

It's the starting off w/out a real shot at victory that's unfair.

 

Fix that part, and I think more people would be okay w/ losing and walking out w/ half the rewards of the winners.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Varicite

[pixieish]

Just try harder and maybe you'll get less commendations than that guy on the winning team that's just /dancing away at the node!

 

Or just don't put in any effort, start /dancing at your own node, and still get as many commendations than you would trying to win, maybe even more, and... oh... wait...

 

...of course, maybe people should get commendations for the -effort- they put into playing the game, with a bonus for winning, instead of handing out gold stars by the truckful to everyone on the winning team and a couple of scraps for the losing team, but, hell, people should only play warzones to win. If they're not winning, they should try winning instead.

[mSum]

Just did a wz on my low lvl alt. 6 medals got 33 wz commendations.

 

PvP is now a complete patetic joke in this game.

 

TY devs for destroying the only joy i had left in this singel player pve game.

 

Well 8 count now, so try harder.

 

Medals are pretty easy to get now too, six is like getting 2 pre-patch. I've been getting 10-16 pretty regularly.

Edited April 13, 2012 by mSum

[Varicite]

Just try harder and maybe you'll get less commendations than that guy on the winning team that's just /dancing away at the node!

 

Or just don't put in any effort, start /dancing at your own node, and still get as many commendations than you would trying to win, maybe even more, and... oh... wait...

 

...of course, maybe people should get commendations for the -effort- they put into playing the game, with a bonus for winning, instead of handing out gold stars by the truckful to everyone on the winning team and a couple of scraps for the losing team, but, hell, people should only play warzones to win. If they're not winning, they should try winning instead.

 

I'm sorry you didn't get your gold star for effort.

 

I'm all out of cookies too. Not your day.

[oMGitsree]

I have yet to see any of these 0 matches.

 

 

I have been in 10 of hose 0 matches with 12 medals and obscene healing...they do exist.

[JayPres]

A true loser's mindset can only change by discovering that winning is possible when team is willing to do what it takes.

 

 

The people that are complaining have already given in to the prospect of losing and it manifests itself in the "effort" in loss and victory alike.

 

 

If you lost, you deserve less than half of what the winners get. Its not punitive, it is incentive. Get organized, stop pug'ing ALL THE TIME and maybe make friend or two that you can run with regularly.

 

Losing should sting, just like victory should be sweet.

Edited April 13, 2012 by JayPres

[Fexhie]

I have been in 10 of hose 0 matches with 12 medals and obscene healing...they do exist.

 

Yah i am not saying they don't exist I just have not been in any. Thats why I think it is probably some kind of bug.

[Varicite]

Losing should sting, just like victory should be sweet.

 

People who believe this, like us, are a dying breed, I think.

 

:c

[Ssfbistimg]

A true loser's mindset can only change by discovering that winning is possible when team is willing to do what it takes.

 

 

The people that are complaining have already given in to the prospect of losing and it manifests itself in the "effort" in loss and victory alike.

 

 

If you lost, you deserve less than half of what the winners get. Its not punitive, it is incentive. Get organized, stop pug'ing ALL THE TIME and maybe make friend or two that you can run with regularly.

 

Losing should sting, just like victory should be sweet.

 

I won 6 of my 8 warzones yesterday and still think this is a garbage system. Im tired of smashing under geared teams and dislike it even more when I'm on the under geared team. This new system just makes the geared more geared and the under geared even more under geared. This is not competitive PVP. Anyone who defends this is insecure about there talent and needs the crutch of having better gear.

[pixieish]

stop pug'ing ALL THE TIME

 

Ah, I see... a try hard thinks that everyone should get organized, perhaps only playing when they have elite gears? Fun? Oh no, no, why would you play for fun? PvP isn't supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be serious business.

 

Eve Online is thataway, by the by.

Edited April 13, 2012 by pixieish

[Tchotchke]

People who believe this, like us, are a dying breed, I think.

 

:c

 

Would you go to a job and work with 15 other people, working in groups of 8, knowing only one group would get paid at the end of the day?

 

"GRRR just work harder... life sucks, nothing is for free! Work better as a team! Get organized! Learn to play!"

 

Whatever. Undergeared, outnumbered, teams are getting nothing for a great amount of effort.. This means they will stop playing. When they stop playing, you people won't have anything to do. Do you have any idea how long your queue times will be when a huge amount of players stop PvPing because they are having no fun whatsoever?

 

This is such a simple concept. You elitists should be more upset than anyone. Most of your commendations, valor, credits and gear have come from victories against the casual players. Once they are gone, you'll be facing equals, and will be winning a much smaller percentage of games that happen much less often.

 

Think about it.

[Rachiia]

Ah, I see... a try hard thinks that everyone should get organized, perhaps only playing when they have elite gears? Fun? Oh no, no, why would you play for fun? PvP isn't supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be serious business.

 

Eve Online is thataway, by the by.

 

People can whine all they want about how people should only run with pre-mades, blah, blah, blah, but the fact is casual PvPers are the vast majority of players in any MMO. If you don't cater to them to some extent, you won't have an MMO, because they'll all go back to WoW or leave for GW2 (Btw, no armor issues, there, so they say.) or The Secret World or whatever is the fotm.

 

If PvP is good and it's fun, people will stick with this game. So, yes, it should be about having fun. If you want to be all hardcore, because you're so super serious and so, so leet, wait for the ranked warzones.

 

I love this game. Fix this PvP mess, please.

[Varicite]

Would you go to a job and work with 15 other people, working in groups of 8, knowing only one group would get paid at the end of the day?

 

"GRRR just work harder... life sucks, nothing is for free! Work better as a team! Get organized! Learn to play!"

 

Whatever. Undergeared, outnumbered, teams are getting nothing for a great amount of effort.. This means they will stop playing. When they stop playing, you people won't have anything to do. Do you have any idea how long your queue times will be when a huge amount of players stop PvPing because they are having no fun whatsoever?

 

This is such a simple concept. You elitists should be more upset than anyone. Most of your commendations, valor, credits and gear have come from victories against the casual players. Once they are gone, you'll be facing equals, and will be winning a much smaller percentage of games that happen much less often.

 

Think about it.

 

lol, you are just so wrong about your assumptions about me that I can't help but be amused. Just look back a few pages and maybe you'd see that I'm not upset at all, and while I think there are some valid gripes, the "rewards" for losing isn't one of them, imo.

 

I'm an "elitist" because I think that victory should be sweet, and defeat should sting?

 

I mean, this is such a simple concept, and here you are getting all bent out of shape that anyone in the entirety of the world may not agree w/ you.

 

Sorry, but your entire post smacks of "Whatever, if I can't win, I'm taking my ball and going home!".

 

Okay, go home. I don't tend to play w/ people who feel that way irl either.

[Jeopardydd]

I'm sorry you didn't get your gold star for effort.

 

I'm all out of cookies too. Not your day.

 

god, people like you on here are insufferable.

 

nobody, and I mean nobody is asking for "cookies".

you are intentionally creating straw men, and you should stop it.

 

people are saying that under certain circumstances that some people are playing under, people get zero or very little rewards due to circumstances outside of their control.

 

instead of responding like a decent human being you are using that condescending BS about cookies.

 

but here's the thing - if ANYBODY is requesting cookies here it's the people who want to defend the advantages they have (gear, full teams, premades). YOU are the one who is trying to preserve easy mode for you and some other people. the condescending attitudes should be directed at you, not coming from you.

[Varicite]

god, people like you on here are insufferable.

 

nobody, and I mean nobody is asking for "cookies".

you are intentionally creating straw men, and you should stop it.

 

people are saying that under certain circumstances that some people are playing under, people get zero or very little rewards due to circumstances outside of their control.

 

instead of responding like a decent human being you are using that condescending BS about cookies.

 

but here's the thing - if ANYBODY is requesting cookies here it's the people who want to defend the advantages they have (gear, full teams, premades). YOU are the one who is trying to preserve easy mode for you and some other people. the condescending attitudes should be directed at you, not coming from you.

 

If you want to search through the thread, I have left a great number of insightful posts about this situation. I don't agree w/ the OP, and I've made my arguments, which no one really wants to acknowledge, probably because they are being drowned out by the sound of the sky falling around us all.

 

If people want to be condescending, then I have no problem responding in kind, just as you don't. Don't call the kettle black, Mr. Pot. And don't come in halfway through a conversation, pick one phrase, and act like you have any inkling what the context was when you most obviously do not.

 

The "straw man" is the argument the OP and most of the people in this thread are presenting, which is the fact that if you lose, you suddenly can NEVER WIN AGAIN.

 

There is actually a guy who likened it to getting 3% weaker every single time you queue, and that's just ridiculous. Just like people are pretending that winners never lose, losers never win, circumstances never change, or that they have a glaring INABILITY to ask "who wants to join a premade?" in general.

 

None of that is actually happening.

Edited April 13, 2012 by Varicite

[JayPres]

Ah, I see... a try hard thinks that everyone should get organized, perhaps only playing when they have elite gears? Fun? Oh no, no, why would you play for fun? PvP isn't supposed to be fun, it's supposed to be serious business.

 

Eve Online is thataway, by the by.

 

Success is not final, failure is not fatal - Winston Churchill

 

Words to live by my friend. Be courageous and try something different like......create a premade.

[Khevral]

The new system is pretty terrible, especially considering this is a video game and not a competitive sport or career that you benefit from outside of the computer.

 

There are so many short-sighted posts in here that talk about getting better and getting a dedicated guild, etc... but none of those posts reflect the reality of pvp being part of what most people do for entertainment on free time, time that isn't already occupied with a career, family, or other hobbies. The majority of people who contribute to society don't have the freedom (or desire) to be in competitive pvp guilds and/or take advantage of exploits such as Ilum farming to acquire gear to be on a reasonably even playing field.

 

You can't really expect people with jobs and families to play so intensely that they have to have all of the winning conditions met (premades and gear) to have a reasonably enjoyable time. The changes promote premades and avoiding losing at all costs, so that's what you go up against with a solo queue.

 

Greed is what runs the world, the obviously biased posts on these forums are no different. There should be an advantage to dedicating a disproportionately large amount of time to the game, but it shouldn't strip the progression away from others to the degree that it does with these changes. These games are for entertainment, much of which is gone if you remove incentive for casually playing.

[Vanash]

Just been in a losing WZ on an alt. Myself at 31 and a 49 were the highest levels. The WZ (voidstar) had 4 operatives (dps). The sum total usable rewards was 25 commendations. Zero credits. How does this encourage people to level or even partake in pvp pre level 50?

 

This is the level range that's supposedly been tested.

 

Basic fact is BW couldn't give a flying fornicate about PvP.

 

They've just given up and think the PvE will carry them through...

[Veeius]

You honestly want to be rewarded for failing!? How about we just cry until BW just gives us the endgame armour without having to do anything but walk into the operation and say boo to the bosses till they give up the shiney's.

 

Look, I personally like to pvp, and I'm the guy that will continue to fight until the scoreboard shows up and says I lost (or won).

 

BUT, I'm *1* guy in a team of 8. If 6 of them say "eff it, they've 2 capped us, and it's 590 to 580, I'm leaving" then it's going to SUCK for me, and the system they've designed will make people do EXACTLY that. You have to have rewards simply for playing otherwise, most people won't. And honestly, if it gets to the point where I see 5 people quit, then, well, there's bloodthirsty, then there's just stupid.

 

 

You are the 99%, don't want to work for rewards just get everything handed to you because you wanted to play.

 

Er, excuse me, I'm paying to play a game. I'm not saying "hand me tons of stuffs for not doing anything." I'm saying "make it reasonable for the average person to stay in a fight even once it's definitely lost. If you fail to do that, then again, when I see 4 or 5 people quit, I'm not going to just sit there and get farmed while people continuously cycle in, see a losing fight, and cycle out. You get how broken that is, right?

 

I mean, why in the world would you bother to sit in a wz, getting farmed while half or more of your team is quitting? You're doing nothing at all but wasting time with no hope of any kind of reward? There's no way in the world I'd pay money and time to do that.