No MMO has come close to SWG's community-orientation

[Jak-Jak]

you wont find the game here. Although i can commit to saying that there are alot more Mature gamers on TOR than pretty much every other themepark MMO ive played. SWG and EVE community is unique in the fact they HAVE to work together.

 

I will agree in that SWG and EVE both were the most community oriented MMOs I ever played. I never got that same feeling from games like Conan, CoH, WoW, etc.

 

What made SWG and EVE special was that you had no choice but to be social in many respects. Most other MMOs allow players to be self-sufficient in a MULTIPLAYER game. If that's the sort of gameplay people want, there are two prequels they'd love!

[Naxon_Vosh]

Put it this way. SWG was in a sense the Skyrim of MMORPG's. I hate to say it but SWTOR is basically like WoW (don't get me wrong I love this game to death) SWG brought something no MMORPG will ever be able to replicate. that being said, there are better games out their now.

 

SWG is and will forever be my favorite game I've ever played.

[entropyji]

I doubt you will ever see a non-goal oriented, free form mmo in the post wow generation. I seriously doubt you will ever ever see a strong community game in the post wow generation.

 

In an ironic way the most popular mmo ever completely poisoned the community feeling that made mmo's popular to begin with. Or perhaps it's simply a different generation and the modern children and teens of the internet aren't what they were in the days where wow first started, gee that makes me sound old.

 

Either way be grateful that the community you find here isn't toxic. Pray that some of wow systems to make the game easier don't come here, because they damaged the community as well and were not the perfect solution. Finally, be nice. This isn't wow or swg and what our player base is like will be determined by the players and how they act both on the forums and in the game. Sorry, think I sidetracked a bit.

[Hidalgo]

that game made me an RP'er without me knowing it,/QUOTE]

 

i was talking with a friend the other day and i said the same exact thing.

[Rikalonius]

RIP SWG

 

It went out not with a bang, but with a whimper.

 

It went super nova in 2005, it's just been a dying star ever since that finally lost all luminosity about 10 days ago.

 

SWG was alright for its time. I do love player housing. I think it should be instanced though. Players are too random and cities ended up being aesthetics nightmares that would send city planners into convulsions.

 

Lag was horrible, and waiting 10 minutes (figuratively) for the items in a house to appear destroyed the immersion. Getting any decent trophies wasn't a challenge, unless by challenge you mean willing to waste hundreds of hours of mind-numbing grinding to get part of it. Cities would have been better if they weren't built on the ground. No streets like in the developer crafted cities. You just come out of your house and bam, you're on the normal terrain type.

 

Yeah, pre-NGE you could do all these different unique class combos, but if you planned on PVP'ing, well, then there were only about four viable combos.

 

Open worlds, yeah, they were open alright. huge swaths of randomly generated terrain for you unrealistically ride your speeder vertically over. I think Tatooine in SWTOR is bigger than Tatooine in SWG, and its exponentially more hand-crafted.

 

Crafting was good, but there were plenty of things I didn't like. Having wheat grow where a week earlier a petroleum deposit resided was just silly. Equipment required elements that never spawned on certain servers, and instead of raiders being the big elitists it was the crafters, so it's a half dozen one, six of the other prospect to me.

[Rikalonius]

Because the old SWG, as much as I enjoyed it, didn't sell that well. What did SWG cap out at, about 350K subscribers?

 

Before WoW unexpectedly, and by unexpectedly I mean completely unheard of and not predictable, hit 1,000,000 subs and beyond, 350,000 subs was pretty darn good. WoW changed the paradigm. Everyone wants to believe it was a bunch of children that joined, but it wasn't. Yes, it was huge influx of casuals, but it was casuals from many different age groups and demographics who would have never ventured into the MMO genre without WoW. It's a double edge sword. Without these casuals, the MMO market will still be a niche market, and no investors would be rushing to spend $100 million on a title. With them however, the whole genre changed. Hopefully, down the road, we can find a happy medium between the two types of players and the genre can settle into something that is a mix of sandbox and theme park.

[thraxxousai]

The one thing I think every new MMO lacks is the sense of community that I loved in pre-nge SWG.

 

It was just a game that rewarded socializing/being part of the community, which I feel an MMO should do.

 

What I mean:

Actually RELYing on Crafters for goods. They mostly made the best weapons/armor.

Relying on Doctors for buffs for both PvE & PvP generally and even a new player benefitted massively from them.

Relying on Entertainers for the exact same reason.

Again, relying on crafters - they made it all, mounts, buff food, medical supplies, clothes, buildings, creatures, etc.

PvP Being real world PvP

Real Guild PvP Wars <3 <3

 

The best part:

PLAYER CITIES/housing/guild halls/etc

 

The player housing/city system was simply astounding, and they had the ability to fully function with mission terminals, factional bases, cantinas, shuttleports, med center, etc.

 

I don't understand why no game to this day has implemented or even tried to implement another player housing/city system like this. It was such a huge success in SWG. It just meant so much to have your 'home' in SWG. I put so much time into customizing my home and making it my home, as well as my home in my Ship.

 

I'm not just complaining about SW:ToR - just MMO's in general these days that are way more focused on providing PvE & PvP content that gives to the players, rather than put some focus on Players giving to Players and a strong community benefitting the game.

 

I have to say, if you took the average MMO player today especially from a game like WoW and put them into old SWG I can't imagine how bad it would be.. so used to rarely socializing with other players outside their own guild.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm LOVING SW:ToR - basically because it's like a new WoW for me that I haven't seen decline.

Personally I feel that WoW is a great game, but it has also had 7 years of development in it now - I just feel that the content in WoW sucks and is wasting the good design WoW has. But this isn't about WoW.

 

Just saying I love SW: ToR - but still hope some day for another MMO to come out that rivals the community orientation SWG had.

 

 

 

Anyone else feel this way?

 

 

how about we get the game working 100% before we worry about useless fluff like player housing?

[Jak-Jak]

how about we get the game working 100% before we worry about useless fluff like player housing?

 

Oh now you done it

[Clinical]

how about we get the game working 100% before we worry about useless fluff like player housing?

 

Yep because I'm sitting here saying we need to implement it right now.

 

You're just another who didn't even read the post. I'm just bringing up the fact no MMO's have implemented stuff like this. If I was trying to tell them to put it in the game it'd be in the suggestion forum.

[Dandolar]

the one part of swg that I hated was ALL the player cities. You did not go out into the desert or into the woods to hunt, you went into city after city to hunt. Everywhere you looked was houses. If folks had 5 toons they had 5 houses, if a player had 15 toons then they had 15 houses. It was almost to the level of stupid.

 

I am all for player houses but in a controlable way.

[gregordunbar]

The one thing I think every new MMO lacks is the sense of community that I loved in pre-nge SWG.

 

Your post is based 100% on your own personal expierence and does not apply to the MMORPG genre outside it. Some will say UO had the best community because it was one that was not FORCED to become a community by playing a hollow game with nothing to do like SWG. Some would say the RvR aspects of DAoC created an amazing community. Some would say the massive guild in EvE was the best community in MMORPG history. Some would say the massive epeen contest between the largest guilds on every WoW server created the kind of community they like...

 

Hell. One day someone may say this game has the best community because there are a million players yet few are ever around them to ruin their game play.

[Saurrantion]

Star Wars Galaxy sucked beyond words. There was nothing Star Wars about SWG. When I think Star Wars I think fast paced action. Star Wars Galaxy was a massive skill grind and lot of open country that look bland and boring.

 

What makes SW:TOR so great is that it's not a massive grind. What makes it even better is that everything revolves around the story. As an added bonus is the voice acting for the quest. Even more of an added bonus is that the choices I make can effect me later on down the road. SW:TOR is also way more fast paced and feels more like Star Wars then SWG.

 

The Bottom line is that SWG was a cheap knock off of Star Wars. It is about time that game was put down like the cheap crap that it was.

[Aigik]

Star Wars Galaxy sucked beyond words. There was nothing Star Wars about SWG. When I think Star Wars I think fast paced action. Star Wars Galaxy was a massive skill grind and lot of open country that look bland and boring.

 

What makes SW:TOR so great is that it's not a massive grind. What makes it even better is that everything revolves around the story. As an added bonus is the voice acting for the quest. Even more of an added bonus is that the choices I make can effect me later on down the road. SW:TOR is also way more fast paced and feels more like Star Wars then SWG.

 

The Bottom line is that SWG was a cheap knock off of Star Wars. It is about time that game was put down like the cheap crap that it was.

 

First of all, it's called "Star Wars Galaxies". Second of all, nobody misses SWG for its combat or its leveling. What do we miss are the sandbox features the game had, things like:

 

-player housing

-player cities

-the extremely deep crafting system

-the multiplayer component to space (a pilot, a copilot, gunners, a maintenance guy, etc.)

-being able to set up your own player events (create your own swoop racing tracks, lotteries, etc.)

-the ability to create your own quests for your friends to do

-the meta GCW system

-the free-form space flight

 

SWTOR is a great game, there's no denying that, but right now it is missing the massive multiplayer component. If you make an MMO and don't take advantage of the MMO features, there's something wrong with you. SWTOR in its current state, could work with a lobby system. Level your character with a drop in and out feature similar to borderlands, and use a server browser to choose which warzone or flashpoint you want to play. That's bad. If you create an MMO, why not take advantage of the fact that it's an MMO and add features that you could only add with an MMO, like some of the things I listed above.

[Aigik]

how about we get the game working 100% before we worry about useless fluff like player housing?

 

 

You are underestimating how important something like that is. To call it "fluff" shows that.

[Ohnoto]

how about we get the game working 100% before we worry about useless fluff like player housing?

 

No MMO ever works fully at 100%. Some people also consider bugs to be the game's issues when the fault is their own computer.

[Clinical]

Star Wars Galaxy sucked beyond words. There was nothing Star Wars about SWG. When I think Star Wars I think fast paced action. Star Wars Galaxy was a massive skill grind and lot of open country that look bland and boring.

 

What makes SW:TOR so great is that it's not a massive grind. What makes it even better is that everything revolves around the story. As an added bonus is the voice acting for the quest. Even more of an added bonus is that the choices I make can effect me later on down the road. SW:TOR is also way more fast paced and feels more like Star Wars then SWG.

 

The Bottom line is that SWG was a cheap knock off of Star Wars. It is about time that game was put down like the cheap crap that it was.

 

Don't know if you're trolling... I'll indulge either way.

 

Anyway, yes getting exp was a bit of a grind in SWG, I've already stated that.

SWG however was a sandbox MMO and a great one at that. They actually created the game from scratch with many interesting ideas/features that we'd never seen before rather than following the norm. If you honestly can tell me the skill tree system of SWG was inferior to the plain leveling system we have in most MMO's like WoW/ToR today - then either you know nothing of it or it was just too complex for you.

 

SWG immersed you into the world itself, not the story. Which is good for some bad for others. If you bought it to play the main star wars Story itself then you'd be disappointed. It was great though in the way that it put you into the Star Wars world and allowed you to explore the story but you didn't really interfere with it. It was what made it a great Sandbox. I feel that if they had made this game without the Star Wars tag it would of had more players due to many people who aren't into Star Wars games not playing the game fearing too much 'star wars'. So yes if you're a pure star wars fanboy the game wouldn't be as fun as to others.

 

Yes the land may get boring sometimes especially on tatooine, lock, and rori due to being huge planets of sand/muck however that's honestly how those planets landscapes in reality would be.

 

I understand opinions are opinions, but I will say to call the game cheap crap and a complete knock off is just ignorance. It was a very innovative game with good sides and bad. Personally I feel the goods outweighed the bad but others don't feel the same. I'm just bringing up in this thread some of the main points that many people did love the game for and how some of the best features of SWG are features that most other MMO developers have yet to implement and always state things like it is too much development time/hard to implement despite a game from nearly 10 years ago had some of those great features.

 

Then you get the people who lecture you on expecting too much from launch. You bet I expect a lot at game launches - we've had MMO's now for around 15 years, so I expect to see a lot of progression/great content from new MMO's with all the history they can study now. It doesn't seem like we're getting anything new/fresh feeling in the last 5 years of MMO's really aside from WoW knockoffs. The only thing fresh I've seen is the voiced story of TOR which will be great for a couple play throughs and then be more of a burden after that.

[jarjarloves]

If it was so great then why are you not playing SWGEMU? It's SWG pre CU. It's free and its out there.

 

 

Instead you are here posting about how great SWG was on TOR forums.

[Hidalgo]

If it was so great then why are you not playing SWGEMU? It's SWG pre CU. It's free and its out there.

 

 

Instead you are here posting about how great SWG was on TOR forums.

 

because SWG was terrible before the CU and NGE. the game didn't get really good until like 3 months after Trial of Obi-Wan.

[Hidalgo]

When I think Star Wars I think fast paced action.

 

well when i think Star Wars i think of political power grabs and deception. SWG had plenty of player politics .

 

if you want action, everything about the game had to do with the GCW, you fought so you didn't go broke paying fines the other side had put into motion, so you could use the public transit and didn't have to drive everywhere, so you didn't have to pay out the rear when you died. and there was always good pvp somewhere.

[Clinical]

Okay seriously, what is the deal with people having such terrible comprehension and missing the point of this thread entirely?

 

Are you SW:ToR devote fanboys that tense over the subject that you think anything is a direct insult at TOR?

 

I don't know how many times I've re-stated in this thread, I NEVER said SW:ToR sucks, I love the game. This thread is not saying SWG was the greatest game ever, I was bringing up how much community-involvement there was in a game like SWG and how we never see than in new MMO's. I'm not just specifically talking about SW:ToR.

 

I'm having a lot of fun playing SW:ToR - no not as much as SWG, but that's not really the point of this thread. I swear the fanboys are so quick to defend against insults that never occurred.

 

If it was so great then why are you not playing SWGEMU? It's SWG pre CU. It's free and its out there.

 

 

Instead you are here posting about how great SWG was on TOR forums.

Lol it's so far from complete it doesn't even have half of the features I'm mentioning implemented yet. Believe me I would be otherwise.

 

The fact is this is a STAR WARS forum area, not the TOR general discussion.

If you aren't open to discussion about other star wars products/ideas aside from ToR, then don't come to the Star Wars area.

 

because SWG was terrible before the CU and NGE. the game didn't get really good until like 3 months after Trial of Obi-Wan.

wat

Edited December 25, 2011 by Clinical

[Sabster]

The WORST part:

PLAYER CITIES/housing/guild halls/etc

Fixed that for you. Player cities was one of the worst ideas ever. Specially when the people started quitting and those cities became abandoned.

[-kobie-]

You are underestimating how important something like that is. To call it "fluff" shows that.

 

No, it's fluff.

[Clinical]

Fixed that for you. Player cities was one of the worst ideas ever. Specially when the people started quitting and those cities became abandoned.

 

The benefit of player cities was way better than the negatives back when the game was in its prime (2003-2005, which is the time I'm aiming this thread at)

 

And I only played a few times in the NGE, and they did do a structure wipe of old structures what was it a year or so ago? And it did clean it all up nicely.

 

Again though you're acting like I'm praising the game as if there were no flaws, I'm saying they had a great player housing/city system compared to anything else we've seen - that isnt to say it wasnt without flaws, a new MMO would just need to incorporate a type of pruning that after so much inactivity any buildings you had would be stored with their belongings in your inventory.

 

Would work fine.

 

No, it's fluff.

You can really only call it that if you didn't play the game and understand how much support they added to the game's atmosphere.

Edited December 25, 2011 by Clinical

[AriochX]

It really was the community that made that game so easily to love playing. I didnt play everyday to run on foot from Bestine to Wayfar or keep doing that walk many times daily while waiting for mounts and vehicles. It wasnt because I had to play for a year to unlock Jedi.

 

It was because I was frineds with the people I was playing with. The people I met in the game.

 

We built cities together for our guilds and had a real economy that REALLY was player driven.

 

These two things alone would lock in players for a very long time if they were implemented into SWTOR.

 

I did meet new friends in the cantinas and the buff lines, but I hated being forced to go to these areas and sit through the loooong wait. I can do without that.

 

 

But I would love to be able to work on guild projects like cities or PvP bases again.

 

I was also thinking if you could give characters decoratable apartments in cities to store their things and meet with friends that it would be a great thing!

 

Other than adding these things, this game has nailed what SWG missed! I wish we could combine the two.

 

 

Death to WOW! Let the reign of SWTOR begin!

[AriochX]

If it was so great then why are you not playing SWGEMU? It's SWG pre CU. It's free and its out there.

 

 

Instead you are here posting about how great SWG was on TOR forums.

 

 

I helped develop a few things for these SWGEMU jerk offs. They are a bunch of credit/work stealing total *****s. If you dont play on their servers, I dont recommend it. Its run by egomaniacs who enjoy toying with the other players.

Edited December 25, 2011 by AriochX