Why do people say Sorcs/Sages are overpowered?

[Vudu]

From a sentinel perspective, I have one extremely short root and one channeled stun, I prefer to eat a knockback, pop camo and use that as my gap closer instead. They never see what hit them. =3

 

I'm not saying you do this, but too many times I've dropped xs flyby waiting for that marauder to come back and guess what? He does ... and stands right in those flames trying to kill me while I'm dodging 100% of his attacks.

[Morticoccus]

I'm not saying you do this, but too many times I've dropped xs flyby waiting for that marauder to come back and guess what? He does ... and stands right in those flames trying to kill me while I'm dodging 100% of his attacks.

 

Standing in the fire is not something I do. It's basically a no-brainer... And why pop evade when you have nothing to cleanse? That's a waste of energy for your cleanse skill once you want to get rid of snares/DOTs.

 

Also, after you hit evade? That's what the channeled stun's for =3

[Altruismo]

From a sentinel perspective, I have one extremely short root and one channeled stun, I prefer to eat a knockback, pop camo and use that as my gap closer instead. They never see what hit them. =3

 

Well, next time you see a sniper on a ledge you want to leap to and you can get within statis range, hit him with Stasis and then leap immediately when statis finishes.

Even if he blows his escape to break Stasis, you'll apply the root from the leap before he can get into cover. You then have 2 seconds of free beating and positioning yourself to not get knocked off, you may still get hit with Debilitate though, if he knows what's good for him, and that may be followed by a positioned knockback.

But then you're back to your method anyway.

 

Standing in the fire is not something I do. It's basically a no-brainer... And why pop evade when you have nothing to cleanse? That's a waste of energy for your cleanse skill once you want to get rid of snares/DOTs.

 

Also, after you hit evade? That's what the channeled stun's for =3

 

Sniper Evade doesn't cleans or remove snares.

Like I said, squishy.

 

Edit: sorry I misread you.

Sniper evade does not remove dots, and snipers do not have a cleanse.

They have a snare removal talent, that's 2 talent points to attach to a 45 second cooldown ability that has NO OTHER USE in pvp - the talent is in the 5th tier of the Lethality tree so it's not something all, or even most, snipers have.

Edited April 11, 2012 by Altruismo

[Morticoccus]

Well, next time you see a sniper on a ledge you want to leap to and you can get within statis range, hit him with Stasis and then leap immediately when statis finishes.

Even if he blows his escape to break Stasis, you'll apply the root from the leap before he can get into cover. You then have 2 seconds of free beating and positioning yourself to not get knocked off, you may still get hit with Debilitate though, if he knows what's good for him, and that may be followed by a positioned knockback.

But then you're back to your method anyway.

 

 

 

Sniper Evade doesn't cleans or remove snares.

Like I said, squishy.

 

Oh yeah, mixed that up with operatives XD

[Vudu]

Standing in the fire is not something I do. It's basically a no-brainer... And why pop evade when you have nothing to cleanse? That's a waste of energy for your cleanse skill once you want to get rid of snares/DOTs.

 

Also, after you hit evade? That's what the channeled stun's for =3

 

Dodge is 100% defense for 4 seconds (geared) and 3 seconds if not geared. I don't have anything that cleanses dots, unless you consider ballistic dampeners as a cleanse tool.

[lpsmash]

the class is not the class till 50.

 

honestly, if you had half a car built would it be the fattest ever zomg? no it wouldn't run.

 

Ya, except we're not talking about half a character here, at level 40 or something, you have the last talent point of your tree and most of your class abilities. From 49-50, it's more like adding a rearwinmg, a new paint job and polishing the windows.

 

Also, some people will complain about anything. Sorcerers/Sages can do a lot of damage in a warzone. ForceLightning/pebbles is a really annoying (note : annoying) spell to be on the receiving end and dots kinda hurt. As healers, they aren't that hard to down, but have a lot of utilities.

Edited April 11, 2012 by lpsmash

[Morticoccus]

Dodge is 100% defense for 4 seconds (geared) and 3 seconds if not geared. I don't have anything that cleanses dots, unless you consider ballistic dampeners as a cleanse tool.

 

Yeah, I confused it with the operative class bonus that allows it to cleanse stuff. Operatives are so rare to find however...

 

Oh well, the channeled stun counters it nicely anyhow.

[vimm]

See my above about root.

Catch a sniper who's moving with a gap closer (with a root) or anything else that roots and he doesn't have those two knockbacks until either the root is gone, or he blows a CC breaker and then enters cover and then uses the knockback before you stun him.

Or you can just stun him while he's in cover and then gap close, entrench is down more often than it's up.

And if you're ranged DPS, you don't need to close the gap or worry about the knockbacks.

 

Their biggest weakness is no DoT clear, as well.

[Fallenturtle]

The main thing people are forgetting, is that the sorc's bubble that absorbs 3k damage can be on a 17 second lockout instead of 20. Also, a smart sorc/sage will get them to interrupt the slower cast heal, or innervate and then use their big heal.

 

They can talent their knockback with a root function that it knocks you back at full resolve (have had this happen to me SEVERAL times on my op, my bh, and my sorc) and roots you, and can talent the bubble burst into a 3 second stun far up in the lightning tree.

 

now, I may be a bit bias in my hatred for sorcs because my main is an op, but I also have a level 50 sorc.

 

Reasons why I think the sorc is overpowered, with 1.2 in mind.

 

First, Healing: Sure, their big heal is now 2.5 seconds no matter what, but with 4 piece pvp and the talents their consumption only takes off 1% of their health in pvp. They still have their instant heal, innervate, 1.5 second heal, 2.5 second heal, and OP circle. They can not get the root, or the blinding on the bubble, but they don't need it. they have the heals to keep up with any damage. There is only one class that has an interrrupt on a short cooldown that can deal with all their heals, the sent/mara. Every other class with an interrupt is on a 12 second cooldown.

 

There is almost no class that can deal with an equal geared sorc healer.

 

Lightning: Rare in pvp, but can get the 3 second blind on their bubble, and aoe root on their knockback. UNLIMITED FORCE REGEN.

 

Madness/hybrid: you have force lightning without a cooldown, a dot that has a 2 second root that almost no one takes because hybrid is better, and even tho in 1.2 they took chain lightning out of the wrath proc, you can get better force with lightning spam, and I think there's some ways people are bringing in lightning strike for force regen/ extra burst, or going full madness.

 

 

As an op, It's a struggle to take on an equally geared sorc dps. I can do it if i get lucky.. Ie: stalking my prey til I see the bubble go down, get lucky with my stuns and crits, drop explosive probe and hope it crits..etc

 

For light armor wearer's they sure do have more survivability than most heavy armor wearers...

[Dietra]

The main thing people are forgetting, is that the sorc's bubble that absorbs 3k damage can be on a 17 second lockout instead of 20. Also, a smart sorc/sage will get them to interrupt the slower cast heal, or innervate and then use their big heal.

 

They can talent their knockback with a root function that it knocks you back at full resolve (have had this happen to me SEVERAL times on my op, my bh, and my sorc) and roots you, and can talent the bubble burst into a 3 second stun far up in the lightning tree.

 

now, I may be a bit bias in my hatred for sorcs because my main is an op, but I also have a level 50 sorc.

 

Reasons why I think the sorc is overpowered, with 1.2 in mind.

 

First, Healing: Sure, their big heal is now 2.5 seconds no matter what, but with 4 piece pvp and the talents their consumption only takes off 1% of their health in pvp. They still have their instant heal, innervate, 1.5 second heal, 2.5 second heal, and OP circle. They can not get the root, or the blinding on the bubble, but they don't need it. they have the heals to keep up with any damage. There is only one class that has an interrrupt on a short cooldown that can deal with all their heals, the sent/mara. Every other class with an interrupt is on a 12 second cooldown.

 

There is almost no class that can deal with an equal geared sorc healer.

 

Lightning: Rare in pvp, but can get the 3 second blind on their bubble, and aoe root on their knockback. UNLIMITED FORCE REGEN.

 

Madness/hybrid: you have force lightning without a cooldown, a dot that has a 2 second root that almost no one takes because hybrid is better, and even tho in 1.2 they took chain lightning out of the wrath proc, you can get better force with lightning spam, and I think there's some ways people are bringing in lightning strike for force regen/ extra burst, or going full madness.

 

 

As an op, It's a struggle to take on an equally geared sorc dps. I can do it if i get lucky.. Ie: stalking my prey til I see the bubble go down, get lucky with my stuns and crits, drop explosive probe and hope it crits..etc

 

For light armor wearer's they sure do have more survivability than most heavy armor wearers...

 

 

I'm guessing this rant is against hybrid sorc/sages? Cause if you are mostly in healing tree... not all of this applies...

 

Loved the bit "they have the heals to keep up with any damage"... does that include the damage you take when being attacked by 2 or 3 dps? :-) Cause I've seen many (good) sorc/sages go down fast when faced with those odds ... even with the force speed, slow, stun and bubble.

 

I don't think sorc/sages are OP. But I don't know enough about the hybrid tree to judge... but it's not (just) the hybrid tree that gets a nerf in 1.2

[Dissey]

The reason is simple, Too many tools

[VeetorDaal]

Because they havent played one themselves..

Many people look at charts and we can dish out dmg and heals over a full warzone maybe but most of it never actually kills anyone.

I dare anyone who says sorcerers/sages are overpowered to actually play one yourself and well see how OP you feel running away everytime someone focuses you..

[GrandMike]

This again?

 

To teribads they look overpowered (well anything does).

 

To people who know what they are doing...they are bench material.

[anticept]

The running theme here is people complain about things they can't kill.

 

I agree with most of what you've said above, but sages have more than a few tricks to escape death, and this is what most people whinge about.

 

If they say, Learn to slow, interrupt & focus fire the healers? You wouldn't see anywhere near as much QQ.

 

It´s not that you can´t kill them its just what they bring to the table

 

Speedbuff for themselves running through fires without damage scoring rush etc.

Friendly pull awesome for huttball.

Long mez easy to spec instant to any spec.

Stun.

Bubble.able to spec as a "aoestun".

AoePushback.Able to spec as bind.

Interrupt.

Slow.

Main damage ability has an inbuild slow.

Only class i´ve been able to get 5k heal (in every wz) off as a dps spec(31 madness)in pvp.

 

Those all are given to the class without picking spec so yeh some might consider it plenty.

And no this is not an QQ post i like the challenge of killing sorcs good ones are amazingly hard to bring down , but bad ones ... :D

[DarkSideTOR]

Because of the amount of tools available to them. GZ's explanation for not giving Troopers an interrupt is that they already have a large arsenal therefore it's not needed for their class.

Yet a Sorc/Sage has WAY more abilities than a Trooper. Sorcs are harder to kill, put up excellent dps numbers AND heals, can shield, pull, heal teammates, sprint, bubble, AE, dots, stuns, slows, roots, knockbacks etc. etc. etc.

 

They like to try to convince you it's ok 'cause they're squishy because they wear light armor and yet look at the heal/dps/kills columns at the end of WZ matches and you'll see what I'm talking about.

[unclekaula]

Because we are op'd. We have way too much utility.

[Chemic_al]

I dare anyone who says sorcerers/sages are overpowered to actually play one yourself and well see how OP you feel running away everytime someone focuses you..

 

Yeah, if you're focused fire you die.

 

I've seen troopers easily take on alot more focused dps than a sorc/sage ever could. Stupidly long KB, aoe cc.

[Dietra]

The only part overpowered about a Sorc is that if you've a pillar to hide behind, you can usually fight a Marauder or a Tankasin to a draw which puts you as the most powerful class in the game. By draw I mean that you can run away long enough that your pursuer may need several minutes to actually kill you, not that you actually have a chance of defeating either of those two guys, but in group PvP if you can make their most powerful guy chase you around pillars then you're definitely ahead elsewhere.

 

On my newbie level 50 Sorc I spend most of Alderran running between ramps and around pillars and can reliably shake off pretty much anyone no matter who they are. Of course if the enemy is smart they should just stop trying to chase a Sorc running away the whole time.

 

Lol if the enemy is smart they continue chasing... if you're a healing sorc... cause then you don't heal anybody... if you are a dps sorc... yeah they should stop chasing you :-)

[Dietra]

This again?

 

To teribads they look overpowered (well anything does).

 

To people who know what they are doing...they are bench material.

 

Thank you :-).

 

Do any of the people complaining about the OP-ness of sorc/sage actually play one? I keep seeing the complaints of this bubble... but I play a lvl 50 sage healer spec and my bubble goes down pretty fast.

 

Yes we have a stun, a slow, a knockback and a force speed. The mez thing only works if people are out of combat... fat chance of that happening in a warzone. I only have 2 instant dot heals. For the rest I need to stand still and be in LOS with those I heal (which means LOS with enemies as well).

 

The sage/sorc healers are also often the most focused ones in a warzone. And considering we have ligth armor, is it a bad thing we have a bit of survivability lol? If we didn't what would be the point?

 

Everybody is constantly looking at those scores... Do they also look at the nr. of deaths? And at the fact that those healers also heal them?

 

So basically all those people complaining about the OP-ness of a sorc or sage healer... don't really want to be healed in a warzone. At least that is what I get from this lol.

 

Well with the nerfs coming in 1.2 to not only the sage/sorc healers... you better hope you don't get your wish :-)

[anticept]

Thank you :-).

 

Do any of the people complaining about the OP-ness of sorc/sage actually play one? I keep seeing the complaints of this bubble... but I play a lvl 50 sage healer spec and my bubble goes down pretty fast.

 

Yes we have a stun, a slow, a knockback and a force speed. The mez thing only works if people are out of combat... fat chance of that happening in a warzone. I only have 2 instant dot heals. For the rest I need to stand still and be in LOS with those I heal (which means LOS with enemies as well).

 

The sage/sorc healers are also often the most focused ones in a warzone. And considering we have ligth armor, is it a bad thing we have a bit of survivability lol? If we didn't what would be the point?

 

Everybody is constantly looking at those scores... Do they also look at the nr. of deaths? And at the fact that those healers also heal them?

 

So basically all those people complaining about the OP-ness of a sorc or sage healer... don't really want to be healed in a warzone. At least that is what I get from this lol.

 

Well with the nerfs coming in 1.2 to not only the sage/sorc healers... you better hope you don't get your wish :-)

 

Yep but still that 2-3k that was meant for you is taken out by the bubble not OP but annoying and understandable because you have no def cds.

 

Mez works always if the target doesn´t take damage learn your class.

 

Yes but considering Merc/mando healers are pretty much a waste of dps to try and kill snapping a sorc/sage is much easier.

 

Try to understand that most people don´t want you nerfd we just envy your utility yes your dps is slowish but still ticks away people quite badly the inbuild slow in ligtning and pebbles is questionable since you have a spammamble slow ... why not give mercs/mandos a slow they need to do kiting too ? Interrupt yep would like to have one as a merc too but no deal.

 

Don´t worry even if ops/scouds are nerfed to the groud there will still be stealthing backstabbers out there and so will heal sorcs/sages even if you quit the nerf won´t stop good players playing their class and spec of choise.

[exphryl]

People believe Sorcs are Overpowered due to extrication in their Huttball winning the game for the other team.

 

The class needs serious help, both in Damage and in Healing in a PvP Environment. They are mediocre at everything.

[da_krall]

Because at level 28 I just don't see it.

 

I know, I know, not level 50, but with so many people in the past complaining about this Advanced Class you'd think that even at low levels we could faceroll, but this isn't the case.

 

Our main heal is a 2.5 second cast, which is easily interruptible by almost anyone.

 

Our damage is sub-par.

 

Our CC is good and that's what I enjoy about the class combined with the hybrid DPS/healer aspect, but there's not a single melee class at this level that has a problem sticking on top of us.

 

I can see that rock/lightning spam is annoying but so is tracer missile spam among other things. Being constantly slowed really not even that big of an issue given the gap closers and disables in the game presently.

 

Being ganked by three sorcs/sages is annoying/bad/whatever, but so is being ganked by three of anything, and I don't know about you but I'd rather be ganked by three of us than almost any other class, but maybe that's just me. Our burst damage isn't that scary and our slow is nothing more than an annoyance.

 

I understand that now people are properly geared lvl 50 sorcs/sages are nothing to be concerned about in any overpowering now, or so a lot of people tell me.

 

So why do people say that Sorcs/Sages are overpowered?

 

And with the nerfs coming in 1.2, is it worth levelling to 50? I'm not totally interested in PvP, I like to PvE as well, but I'm having a whole lot of fun of my BH so just wondering if I'd be better off levelling that instead? I also enjoy the stealth/healer concept and gameplay on my smuggler so maybe I might level that for my PvP and PvE healer instead of my sage.

 

People complain because sorc/saga can get away. Think about the average dumb human MMO player. The most frustrating thing for them is beating on someone getting them to 1/4 health then they run off or vanish with stealth.

 

The amount of rage i have heard about this dwarfs all other rage.

 

Which two classes got the massive nerfs first and the ones people cried about most? thats right the ones that have stealth and/or other escape methods (nevermind if you have half a brain and actually think what your doing instead of mashing button its easy to stop a stealther or sorc) However people like to complain before using a brain.

[da_krall]

 

Mez works always if the target doesn´t take damage learn your class.

 

 

The only useful pvp damage spec uses DOTs - without them you damage is pretty gimped. So mez are of no use to a sorc other than to hold of a second opponent.

 

Trooper damage, single target, burst, sustained and AOE, dwarfs that which a sorc put out.

[Dietra]

Yep but still that 2-3k that was meant for you is taken out by the bubble not OP but annoying and understandable because you have no def cds.

 

Mez works always if the target doesn´t take damage learn your class.

 

Yes but considering Merc/mando healers are pretty much a waste of dps to try and kill snapping a sorc/sage is much easier.

 

Try to understand that most people don´t want you nerfd we just envy your utility yes your dps is slowish but still ticks away people quite badly the inbuild slow in ligtning and pebbles is questionable since you have a spammamble slow ... why not give mercs/mandos a slow they need to do kiting too ? Interrupt yep would like to have one as a merc too but no deal.

 

Don´t worry even if ops/scouds are nerfed to the groud there will still be stealthing backstabbers out there and so will heal sorcs/sages even if you quit the nerf won´t stop good players playing their class and spec of choise.

 

Ok what mez are you talking about then? Cause as far as I know I only have force lift and that is not an instant cast for me, but can be done in combat true. I have stun. Is that what you mean? The mez of the shadow is instant when done from stealth. Used very often on me when I'm running from spawn to the battle lol.

 

As a full healer I don't do a lot of dmg, since I'm always healing... except when I get a bit ticked off at not getting any help from my team (when I'm once again killed by 3 imps). But the dmg that I then do is minimum.

 

Inbuild slow at pebbles... nice one... usually don't have time to use that when I'm healing myself... prefer to just hit the slow button. Which doesn't do me a whole lot of good when they still follow me and catch up

 

Btw... never said I would stop healing... I won't be defeated by a Bioware nerf lol... I'll just die more and heal less... but will still do PVP.

But I have already seen sages that respecced to dps in anticipation of the patch.

[Daex]

Btw... never said I would stop healing... I won't be defeated by a Bioware nerf lol... I'll just die more and heal less...

 

Damn, this is so sad, and true at the same time.

 

Have my regards! Juggernaut here who likes being healed and doesn't hate on healing sorcs/sages.