Concealment dps

[Zelurd]

So far from what I've gathered people are complaining about the 1.2 nerfs to concealment.

 

But as someone has already tested out in the PTS, concealment dps is about 1130, whereas marauder annihilation's is about 1207.

 

Now my question is:

With all the nerfs to every single abilities in our rotation, and the fact that annihilation isn't buffed (only carnage and rage), why are we still doing comparable dps in 1.2?

Theoretically, our dps should be higher than annihilation on live, but that's not what I heard - our rotation is clunky and has low sustained damage, and even more so in 1.2.

So can someone explain what's going on? Do we use new moves in our rotation in 1.2 to compensate for the nerfs, eg. overload shot?

 

PS. This is not a troll question. My op is only level 30 and I'm curious to know.

Thanks.

[DSafana]

The 2 biggest hits to our dps in 1.2 for PVP is the additional cooldown time on our 2 biggest attacks. Hidden strike and backstab. For full concealment spec that uses acid blade, this is even a bigger decrease in DPS.

Since the cooldown for both has increased this means our rotation does the same damage (all other things being equal), but and here it is. You can not use that rotation again as early as you could before. And since at level 50 your opening attacks can not take down anyone, you'll now be forced to run with the tanks and healers, who all have abilities to move faster than you. You will not able to do the job your suppose to do and aggravate their healers.

After our first attack series, we'll be standing there waiting for our abilities to refresh. In the mean time we'll have to use lower damage abilities, while their healers laugh at us and drop boulders on our heads.

It's bad enough that we can't chain our knive attacks now without waiting for cooldowns, This change will make it worse. and require us to add more Rifle shot in the rotation -No thanks

[Ahebish]

So far from what I've gathered people are complaining about the 1.2 nerfs to concealment.

 

But as someone has already tested out in the PTS, concealment dps is about 1130, whereas marauder annihilation's is about 1207.

 

Now my question is:

With all the nerfs to every single abilities in our rotation, and the fact that annihilation isn't buffed (only carnage and rage), why are we still doing comparable dps in 1.2?

Theoretically, our dps should be higher than annihilation on live, but that's not what I heard - our rotation is clunky and has low sustained damage, and even more so in 1.2.

So can someone explain what's going on? Do we use new moves in our rotation in 1.2 to compensate for the nerfs, eg. overload shot?

 

PS. This is not a troll question. My op is only level 30 and I'm curious to know.

Thanks.

 

Well after seing your numbers there that "someone" tested

 

Looks to me they dont' know what they are doing. On either class.

 

I just saw a post of sorc DPS post 1.2 from PTS. They are pulling 1600 in their hybrid spec.

 

400 damage is a HUGE difference compared to pure specs.

 

So that means 1 of 2 things.

 

1. Either the person testing it knows nothing about either class

 

2. Or the DPS parse is wrong for both classes.

Edited March 23, 2012 by Ahebish

[chuixupu]

Seeing our own numbers versus our Operation buddies is going to be the true test. Because some people are exceptionally good, and some people are exceptionally awful no matter what they're playing. A random anecdote from people we know nothing about or what gear they're wearing isn't helpful at all.

[subrosian]

Seeing our own numbers versus our Operation buddies is going to be the true test. Because some people are exceptionally good, and some people are exceptionally awful no matter what they're playing. A random anecdote from people we know nothing about or what gear they're wearing isn't helpful at all.

 

The L2P argument needs to stop.

 

Target dummy DPS is meaningless. In Operations, Marauders do significantly more DPS than Operatives because their DPS uptime is higher, and their abilities function correctly. Ranged DPS do even more damage, again, DPS uptime and ability function.

 

This is why Lethality *in practice* is so much better than Concealment. In Operations, Lethality can maintain its DPS via dots and cull while still at 10m. Even Shiv has far looser requirements than the vital Acid Blade / Backstab of Concealment.

[chillshock]

I'm not even sure they were aware of the Acid Blade relation, when deciding on the Backstab cd. I don't mind the Hidden Strike one... but Backstab will hurt! Edited March 23, 2012 by chillshock

[KonstantinT]

They should make acid blade proc off of Shiv too.

[goulet]

am i the only one who can't get their head around the rationale of comparing all dps to marauder as the benchmark for where it should be?

 

As long as they're in melee range they have unlimited "energy/rage", they dont have to deal with a finite energy pool that regens. They hit things get rage, and hit things harder by spending that rage. There's nothing to regen, as long as you're in range, its constant dps. Why is this the benchmark for comparison? .

 

Outside of mercs they're the only class that have their ability damage increased by both weapons. Everyone else may draw stats from mh/oh but never the weapon contribution of both.

 

As for comparing operatives too them,the 5% comment in particular.

-giving a % number is meaningless for comparison without looking at total damage numbers. if they do 100 damage and you do 95 that doesn't seem that big, if they do 1 million and you're behind by 50k thats the same % but is a bigger gap.

 

-theres a number of side by side comparisons that seem to suggest the 5% is inaccurate.

 

-Even if it is accurate it doesn't paint a complete picture

If dps were measured like an eeg (heart rate)

 

a marauder would be a flat line (more constant)

 

an operative would look like they're having a heart attack, it spikes, then falls flat. It may end up at 5 % in the long run, but when you look at it through the course of a fight the operative has far more down time.

[chuixupu]

The L2P argument needs to stop.

 

Target dummy DPS is meaningless. In Operations, Marauders do significantly more DPS than Operatives because their DPS uptime is higher, and their abilities function correctly. Ranged DPS do even more damage, again, DPS uptime and ability function.

 

This is why Lethality *in practice* is so much better than Concealment. In Operations, Lethality can maintain its DPS via dots and cull while still at 10m. Even Shiv has far looser requirements than the vital Acid Blade / Backstab of Concealment.

 

Not sure if you're just making a general comment or responding to me specifically...but if you were, I wasn't saying "L2P" at all, nor did I even mention target dummies. I just stated a fact that some people are good, some people are bad, some people have gear, some people don't. So if someone says to me "I saw X class doing X dps" with no further information, I can't really draw any solid conclusions from it. Hence, I said, seeing our performance personally in our own team's operations is what matters most. I've always been somewhat mediocre at whatever I do at best.

 

And I play Lethality, incidentally.

Edited March 24, 2012 by chuixupu

[Sarak]

This is going to BREAK ops, you will not be able to one vs one anybody with this nerf, sages especially, I mean come on, one hidden strike combo won't even pop their shield as it is now. And the whole business about constantly having to use acid blade because it falls off every 20 seconds is just plain bad. That ability needs to stay on like a regular buff does, for an hour. This patch is going to ruin Ops for anyone who plays concealment spec.

[Dampiel]

This is going to BREAK ops, you will not be able to one vs one anybody with this nerf, sages especially, I mean come on, one hidden strike combo won't even pop their shield as it is now. And the whole business about constantly having to use acid blade because it falls off every 20 seconds is just plain bad. That ability needs to stay on like a regular buff does, for an hour. This patch is going to ruin Ops for anyone who plays concealment spec.

 

ive always thought that it is silly for the heavies (commando/merc) to have a 35% armor penetration that costs them nothing while the operative gets 30% and that costs them energy

[Ahebish]

ive always thought that it is silly for the heavies (commando/merc) to have a 35% armor penetration that costs them nothing while the operative gets 30% and that costs them energy

 

35%?

 

Have you even played a powertech?

 

they have up to 90% armor pen.

[Uuhh]

35%?

 

Have you even played a powertech?

 

they have up to 90% armor pen.

 

It's ONE ability, High Impact Shot / Rail Shot. Exaggeration doesn't emphasize anything but stupidity.

[Humancentipad]

Tell me if my facts are correct here..

 

- Only white damage is mitigated by armor.

 

- Armor pen only affects white hits (rifle shot, overload shot, snipe for IA), it doesn't increase yellow damage.

 

It makes me feel slightly better about the upcoming BS nerf, instead of having an utter urge to go 100% healing or shelf my op.

 

 

 

 

What really gets me is how Ops STILL don't have a truly viable hybrid spec. If they would've left lacerate's dmg alone, a K. probe + lacerate build might have actually done well.

 

I guess the only class that's still cool to hybrid is Assassin. Hopefully that imba tank hybrid gets murdernerfed just like Carolina Parakeet did!

[trimetros]

if the armor defence works only on white dmg then why we get much lower hits on tanks? i think armor works for even yellow ...otherwise there s no point we have armor penetration buff from acid blade.. BW cant even write a tooltip right and ppl get confused..

[Malisaah]

i dont know if any one noticed when the jedi throw rocks and other stuff they hit more offten and do a hell of a lot more damage , i die in one blast of there rock throwing and when i off load all and i mean all my buffs hits and other stuff i got it still dose no damage to them or the other toons , we are so week so i started to build a juggernought and i putting away this weak marksman sniper this class is so useless in a fight i thought a sniper dose a great kill at long range but its not going to happen as the real snipers say one shot one kill in real life is a life saver but here its a joke.

[tynt]

It is hard to take these forums seriously when so many people still do not understand the mechanics of the game.

 

Armor mitigates all except elemental or internal damage.... Meaning weapon and force / tech ( yellow attacks are force or tech).

 

The sky is not falling and if we are over nerfed be sure that a future patch would balance us.... I still remember when the sky was falling last nerf patch...