Arkerus Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 THis will never go live as it is. This is ridiculous to say the least. This will only further push the "winners" ahead of the pack. This is like saying the race winners get better engines and then next year they get to trade those engines for the new version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuthroat Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 What some of you forget: if you modded your bm gear and threw away the sometimes useless accurracy mods, then you won´t get your bm gear upgraded. (See latest dev q&a). good point but as long as we can turn it in for warhero i dont really hafve an issue with this, although the increased expertise may suck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malkara Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 This info was in the 1.2 PTS patch notes. Did no one read them? "New War Hero PvP vendors can be found on the Republic and Imperial Fleets. They sell the new War Hero and Rated War Hero PvP sets for Ranked Warzone Commendations and the equivalent Battlemaster piece." In the "Items and Economy" section under the "Vendors" sub head Every one here needs to LEARN TO READ..... They sell the new War Hero and Rated War Hero PvP sets for Ranked Warzone Commendations ANDthe equivalent Battlemaster piece." it clearly says AND, not OR, which means???? ooh thats right you need BOTH the BM equivalent item AND Rated War Zone Commendations to buy War Hero gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardya Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Is the new gear so much better that it will make a huge difference or is it a small gap. If it's a small gap and people have an enjoyable grind while at the same time not making it gear vs gear, I am happy. Let the grinders grind and let those who don't grind not grind. This is called being reasonable and understanding both sides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicain Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 PVP players generally have some sort of competitive spirit in them, yes? Check Skill should trump any other factor, yes? Ok Why not give everyone equal gear then, or use the bolster system to have everyone up to par with full WH stats? Some players just want to roflstomp others and want their gear disparity to win matches for them. Full stop. That's humanity. Some just have a superiority complex. Some players dont want everything handed to them, we want to get better as we play, and build gear so when we meet a player just as skilled as we are, gear gets to be the tie-breaker. You're over structuring pvp, which is why it sucks now, so you feel you have a 'fair chance at pvp'. I don't want a fair chance at pvp, I want to compete and fight and not have what I can or can't do micro managed by people who feel pvp is some socialized experience. ok ill gladly quit your gear treadmill (did it once several years ago with WoW, it's easier this time since i know what's coming) now all you gear grinding, pve'ers will have the game all to yourself..... how many people are on your server now? oh and why play this game instead of WoW? glowbats? ya we will see how long this game takes to go F2P. In short your right if we were looking for anything different than a RPG/WoW why are we here? P.S. unsubbed. Good, bye, the actual people who want competitive pvp are glad people like you are gone. Enjoy your socialized pvp in where ever you land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RefugeASSASSIN Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 They ought to give you the option to trade in your Champion gear instead (provided you have the Battlemaster Equivalent gear) Since its going away and its ugly as sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elorei Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 This. Don't play an RPG if you don't like grind/progression. It is the main point of an RPG. It is sad that these kids today think this is true. When you were in diapers, we played real RPGs, and they had none of this grind crap for gear. Hell, your gear broke and got looted all of the time. The main point of an RPG is gear grinding? I feel sorry for you, you missed out. Which of the letters in RPG stand for gear grind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugerot Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 how are you complaining that war hero tier requires you to already have bm gear..i commend bioware for this change would you take a fresh 50 into a hm op?...no..they need to have gear first...if you think you deserve to be in rated warzones with no gear when everyone else is full war hero...your insane..thank you bioware...you have rejustified the fact that ive farmed so much for valor rank... the people that want the top tier gear handed to them are the noobs that dont deserve it..and probably join a warzone...screw it up and then leave and abandon there teammates go farm just like everyone else had to noobs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympic Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 It is sad that these kids today think this is true. When you were in diapers, we played real RPGs, and they had none of this grind crap for gear. Hell, your gear broke and got looted all of the time. The main point of an RPG is gear grinding? I feel sorry for you, you missed out. Which of the letters in RPG stand for gear grind? Right??? Where in hell did people start thinking that the point of games is to grind for gear? That is the dumbest crap I've ever heard. If an individual makes it HIS/HER reason for playing the game that's fine, but to believe that the reason for playing a game is to grind is weird to me. I play to do fun things, not grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redshirtricky Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Some players dont want everything handed to them, we want to get better as we play, and build gear so when we meet a player just as skilled as we are, gear gets to be the tie-breaker. You're over structuring pvp, which is why it sucks now, so you feel you have a 'fair chance at pvp'. I don't want a fair chance at pvp, I want to compete and fight and not have what I can or can't do micro managed by people who feel pvp is some socialized experience. The perfect example of irony. How does having no IWIN-by-gear issues translate to "over structuring" of pvp? If anything, the Tier Gear grind that BW's got implemented is exactly "over structuring" pvp. Levels 1-49 aren't anywhere near as gear dependant. A level 30 something can kill a 40 something because levels and gear don't really matter. They both have most of their skill sets to work with. Thanks for your honestly. You believe that GEAR should be a tie breaker when it comes to pvp players. It shouldn't be skill vs. skill alone. It's skill + I've-grinded-enough-gear vs. comparable skill + I've-not-grinded-as-much-therefore-I-lose. It all comes down to this: This game will need to continue their gear-to-win structure because it's the incentive. Judging from what the replies on this post has gotten, most pvp'ers who've grinded their BM gear don't want others to have it because "they worked for it" NO FREE LOOT! You want that gear?! You have to suffer just like we did! So BW will have to keep adding more and more gear tiers to keep the treadmill going. 1-49 was largely about teamwork + skill = more wins. At 50 it's gear = more wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jugerot Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 ok ill gladly quit your gear treadmill (did it once several years ago with WoW P.S. unsubbed. your probably the same wow noob that couldnt achieve a 2200 rating to get the best gear ...gear treadmill?..people with no gear dont belong in ranked warzones...period..you bring the whole team down...KYS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerain Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 LOL this is stupid, how can they have RANKED warzones, yet not have people in equal gear? LOL This is stupid, how can you play an MMO and not expect to do any work to play it. I know next they'll get out free top tier pve gear for us to play in. Also the gear gap isn't that bad. Champ to BM is nothing and there is no reason to cry about it as BM to WH won't be huge either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delease Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 God, ya mean i have to put in time to get the best gear? Pfft! I want it handed to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solonius Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Is BM gear that has been re-modded eligble for trading in? Or does anyone not know this yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stradoo Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I love how people automatically assume that if you're over 70 Valor that you participated in the "Valor Exploit." I'm currently 69 Valor (about 2 bubbles left to 70) and not once did i participate in any exploit to get to where I am today. It's nice knowing that I'm two BM comms away from full BM. I'm sure I'll get there before 1.2 hits production. Another thing thing to add... I can count on one hand the number of times I've quit matches. I hope a lot of you cry babies quit. Tired of reading about it each day. "Come back again when you can't stay so long!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mSum Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 Why is this bad? Are you guys saying you'd rather have lesser geared people in ranked WZs? BW is making it so you have to be well geared to enter a ranked WZ....right? So that it's fair and more competitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mSum Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I love how people automatically assume that if you're over 70 Valor that you participated in the "Valor Exploit." I'm currently 69 Valor (about 2 bubbles left to 70) and not once did i participate in any exploit to get to where I am today. It's nice knowing that I'm two BM comms away from full BM. I'm sure I'll get there before 1.2 hits production. Another thing thing to add... I can count on one hand the number of times I've quit matches. I hope a lot of you cry babies quit. Tired of reading about it each day. "Come back again when you can't stay so long!" I also think it's funny that people think a high valor rating = good. You can hide in a corner every BG and get valor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Assassin Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 I'm a hardcore PVPer in full BM gear (PRE free valor for all patch). And I think it's a hideously bad idea. AS A PVPER I want PEOPLE to fight, and I VASTLY prefer a system where full participation in PVP isn't gated by gear. I'm also 100% certain that the fact some people have the time to mindlessly 'grind' hundreds of hours for gear does not make those people better PVPers, or that it makes PVP more enjoyable. i too am a pre-valor 'sploit BM. (1st on my server ) and the PvP system here is a mess!!! i want fair, enjoyable PvP. and the gear grind DESTROYS this. 10-49 PvP is so successful because there is NO EXPERTISE!! where skill and teamwork determine the outcome of a WZ, not expertise ratings. i say, drop the expertise from PvP, and introduce a new PvP related bonus to ranked WZ gear. whereas, the PvP stat will only be relevant in ranked WZ's... leave unranked WZ's PvP stat free. bring back skill and teamwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muteownz Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 i am very sad to hear all the gear i just grinded will obsolete... it really makes me not even want to play anymore. i haven't even logged on in the past few days. if i'm gonna have to start over again i may as well do it in another game. :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mSum Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 i too am a pre-valor 'sploit BM. (1st on my server ) and the PvP system here is a mess!!! i want fair, enjoyable PvP. and the gear grind DESTROYS this. 10-49 PvP is so successful because there is NO EXPERTISE!! where skill and teamwork determine the outcome of a WZ, not expertise ratings. i say, drop the expertise from PvP, and introduce a new PvP related bonus to ranked WZ gear. whereas, the PvP stat will only be relevant in ranked WZ's... leave unranked WZ's PvP stat free. bring back skill and teamwork. If they remove expertise it won't be fair. People who raid will be the best geared players in the game and own your ***. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhealThar Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 There's two sides of the spectrum here. One wants gear easily accessible so that it's a competitive environment in rated warzones. The other wants rated warzones to require BM gear so it remains a competitive place. I agree with both. If they didn't have a gear requirement or gear wasn't easy to get but you could still queue, what would be the point? They would essentially just be random warzones that you get ranked and the best gear from. I'm against a gear treadmill, and no, getting 2200 in World of Warcraft doesn't make you a good PVPer, that isn't even duelist on some BGs. A good pvper is someone who doesn't need a gear disparity to feel better, they get the sense of accomplishment from merely defeating their opponents and knowing they really are better than them. GW was the first "MMO" to understand what PVPers want, there is no set rules in what an MMO must entail, so anyone that removes the gear treadmill and carrot on a stick mentality will win the hearts of pvpers. Bioware is heading in the right direction making gear more accessible, I just think since they allow solo queue, you should be required to have full Battlemaster gear before entering a ranked warzone or there really isn't a point in having them with the current system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mSum Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) i am very sad to hear all the gear i just grinded will obsolete... it really makes me not even want to play anymore. i haven't even logged on in the past few days. if i'm gonna have to start over again i may as well do it in another game. :/ I don't see why it's obsolete. I think people are confused...or hell, maybe I am. As I read it, nothing changes for non-ranked WZs. You will not be able to buy Champ or Centurian gear, but so what. If you have those now why would you want more? You enter non-ranked WZs and earn BM and War Hero gear to replace your current Champ and Centurian gear. Then when you are geared you enter ranked WZ and buy Ranked War Hero gear...which is the same as War Hero but a different color. Why did ClogMan say: "1) Ditch all Champ + cent gear. 2) Buy a recruit PvP set for 500K." Unless the stats are way better than Champion, which I can't imagine. So he's wrong or trolling. Edited March 23, 2012 by mSum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AAmedeo Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 i am very sad to hear all the gear i just grinded will obsolete... it really makes me not even want to play anymore. i haven't even logged on in the past few days. if i'm gonna have to start over again i may as well do it in another game. :/ Why do you think its going to be obsolete? You will still have it and it will have same stats (except expertise may be boosted on it). Just because some gear will no longer be available, and other armor will become available does not reduce your ability to use what you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flem Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 (edited) Nobody is going to grind BM gear twice Did you miss the part where you can now get a full BM set faster than you can currently get a BM mainhand!? This isn't my favorite move, but it's not a huge hurdle either. I love how all the qqr's are completely ignoring the fact that it costs a lousy 11k creds to get FULL BM GEAR, WHICH is about 2% better than champ gear This, on the other hand, isn't correct either. Current BM is only fractionally better than Champ, but with Bio effectively lifting the Expertise cap and doubling per-piece Expertise on BM, it will be significantly better than Champ (and, obviously, Recruit) once 1.2 hits. Edited March 23, 2012 by flem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Assassin Posted March 23, 2012 Share Posted March 23, 2012 If they remove expertise it won't be fair. People who raid will be the best geared players in the game and own your ***. that's assuming there would be no "PvP gear". i see nothing wrong with tier 2 gear (as i see it called), being a reward from PvP...just remove the Expertise on NON-RANKED gear. i.e. Columni = BM or champ gear. your valor rank + ranked WZ valor would allow you access to expertise stat'd gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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