1.2 Hard Mode loot. Why raid when you can just run dailies?

[Bladedakoda]

Simple the more gear is given out the more people will sit on their hands and say I will just wait until 1.2 to get my gear. Its already being said in raiding guilds which need people for 2nd and 3rd groups.

 

Why are you paying $180 a year to play solo when you can buy Skyrim for $50. Its insane that you are paying for nothing. Really yes you are.

 

Why are you entitled to Hard mode raid gear by not raiding? You did not down the boss? I dont give a **** that you pay our $15 a month, Same can be said if you went to college and just randomly paid for classes and did not show. You did not earn a right to a degree just by paying for classes you never put effort into taking.

 

I am tired of people feeling they are entitled to things just because they Pay for something. YOU EARN ENTITLEMENT not given.

 

 

Why does it bother you so much what other people do? Oh cause you can not feel special? Yes i raid, no i don't care how other people get gear.

[meinfro]

You raid. Congratulations. Want to tell me how those that don't raid/can't raid can get better gear when, on my server, the 25 level 50 purple mods etc are 1m+?

 

Either way, I'd be spending my time doing dailies to fund getting better gear, why is cutting out the middleman and allowing me to get better gear by doing dailies any different?

Edited March 20, 2012 by Notannos
rude

[krinaman]

Simple the more gear is given out the more people will sit on their hands and say I will just wait until 1.2 to get my gear. Its already being said in raiding guilds which need people for 2nd and 3rd groups.

 

Why are you paying $180 a year to play solo when you can buy Skyrim for $50. Its insane that you are paying for nothing. Really yes you are.

 

Why are you entitled to Hard mode raid gear by not raiding? You did not down the boss? I dont give a **** that you pay our $15 a month, Same can be said if you went to college and just randomly paid for classes and did not show. You did not earn a right to a degree just by paying for classes you never put effort into taking.

 

I am tired of people feeling they are entitled to things just because they Pay for something. YOU EARN ENTITLEMENT not given.

 

So your goal is to force people to group with you?

 

Honestly? Raiding is so awesome and cool that we need to force people to do it? The sad truth is you are correct. If raiding doesn't give the best gear most raiders wouldn't bother. Because, quite frankly, most people would rather do anything than raid. Which should tell MMO developers to just stop wasting their time making raids altogether.

 

Why am I entitled to better gear for soloing? Why are you entitled to better gear for raiding? You say you need better gear to progress through the raids. Can't we have harder and harder solo content that you need to progress through as well?

 

Wait, I know, raiding is hard. Funny how that works, a million posts about how easy raiding is and how it's just giving loot away. But get into a hardcore/casual discussion and suddenly the same loot piñata face roll ez-mode raid is a hardcore challenge of epic proportions requiring the leetest of gear.

 

You complete content you get better gear, your character progresses. That's how these games work. From level 1 to 50 you can "earn" your gear solo or group. There is no reason you can't continue to "earn" your gear at end game the same way. The solo people will "earn" it the same way you do. By completing content.

 

Finally, there is nothing about the gear that makes it "raid" gear. It's gear with better stats that you get for completing end game content.

 

You all want to start declaring something "raid gear" then let's make it raid only gear. Let's make two identical sets of gear. All the same stats except the raid version suffers a 50% loss of stats outside of a raid. The solo set suffers a 50% loss inside a raid. There, problem solved, raiders get the best raid gear by raiding. Soloiers get the best solo gear by soloing. I'm a freaking genius I tell ya....

[drosalion]

Ok then

 

Give me an example of an mmo that is mostly solo content that is also mainstream and successful?

 

In fact, name one mmo that is considered successful that doesn't have end game raiding?

 

That's all I ask

 

To the first question, i would without a doubt argue SWTOR.

 

To the 2nd question, i would say GW2 almost certainly (although its not out yet)

[drosalion]

Because you did not Earn the gear. Period. Stop complaining that you are not handed something you do not earn. That is why people are pissed. Its going to hurt grouping more then people realize and ultimately be the end of anything resembling an MMO. It will be a MSO then.

 

Thats the stupidest argument. What is 'earn'? How is the guy that does 2 hours of daily every single day to get 1 piece of gear a week (if that) not 'earning' his gear compared to a guy that does 2 hours a week for multiple pieces of gear? In fact how is it that the guy doing 7x the work & time put in isnt getting better rewards?

 

You did not down the boss so why should you be given the loot?

 

Because the loot is obtainable via other avenues of progression. To be fair they're not getting loot from the bosses, only raiders do.. it just so happens that the gear is identical from both sources.

Edited March 20, 2012 by drosalion

[Tetrablade]

Dllaselle I am getting tired of you welfare people ruining Games because you do not want to raid. If you dont want to put the effort into raiding you should not get the gear. End of story. You do not need it. You people are Why the MMO community has crumbled to nothing but a big pile of ****. You feel that your $15 a month doing nothing but solo content = My $15 a month who runs a guild who works with people to get geared up to raid, then we raid and down boss content. You people CANNOT grasp the simplest concepts. You Raid you get Raid gear for downing a boss. You dont raid you dont get raid gear. End of story.

 

Wrong, but thanks for showing why raiders are stereotypical jerkwads.

 

I raid, in fact i'm a main healer of our core raiding group. But with my social life and professional life I find it hard to do other things in the game including pvp (not to mention the dwindling republic population but that is another post).

 

Anyways as much as I enjoy raiding, and this has the most interesting raids even if they aren't total challenges, I want to do other things then healing in those raids. If I get extra columi gear it goes to my dps build gear set. But until I get a full set and another person wants to heal i'm stuck watching raidboxes for 2+ hours.

 

There are perfectly legit reasons to run dalies to get raid gear. Not to mention more people with raid gear means a bigger pool to get people to raid if for some reason someone has to bail. We had to drop both raids over the weekend because we couldn't find a healer to fill a spot. So that means we missed a weeks worth of gear despite everyone else putting aside those 2 hours.

[Leoness]

Mommy said I can has them all straight away.

 

Mommy doesn't lie.

[Rosenwas]

Simply put.

 

If you spend time gathering a community, learning tactics, achieving things that others can't. You should get the best items in the game, this system is in every rpg, mmo, fps you name it. If you don't want to raid/dungeon/ranked pvp grind at 50...i find it weird that you want the equivilant gear from what is essentialy a timesink..not a progression of skill.

 

...what do you do in an mmo at endgame that isnt strive to get best gear and achieve as much as possible? make an alt? go do that then..give the raiders the gear they want because they keep communities going. Don't change a system that is common sense

 

Care bear mmos dont last because everyone walks around with a sense of achievement of the same thing..so the competitive edge disapears.swtor is great but it needs to stick to some core principles and not try to please the care bears..

 

What i dont understand is what people who don't raid would use the gear for at 50? that sounds much more epeen (ooh look at me mincing about the fleet with my new shiny armor) instead of using that gear to kill bosses and unlock content....gg bioware

[Tharzon]

Gear in MMOs is both a tool and a trophy.

 

If you didn't achieve something, you shouldn't have a trophy. If you aren't going to try to do the task, then you don't need the tool for the task.

 

I'm ok with some grindable good gear for dailies, but make it a tier or two below raid gear.

 

Then again, I'm chafed by 8m and 16m and further Hm and Nim dropping the same gear. I'm getting too old for this crappy entitlement culture. Get off my lawn and such.

[Zafeer]

Alright I honestly like this ALOT. I'm currently deployed to Afghanistan and Im only able to raid because a group of our raiders does OPs at Midnight EST. This equates to 730am my time. If it wasn't for them I can't even SEE the content. This alternate allows me to get gear through dailies (which are yet to be determined as difficult or not) and fill in pieces I normally wouldn't be able to get.

 

Flexibility is the real WIN here. Denying that is just being selfish.

[Windell]

I've had a similar discussion in a different thread about "whats the point?"

 

If the only reason you play swtor is to earn virtual rewards in the form of gear than i am sorry for you.

 

I like raiding with my friends, the gear makes that possible so i want the gear, but more than that i want to raid and see the content with my friends and play the game.

 

If the only reason you play is to chase the virtual stuffed rabbit across the greyhound track then your running in circles for no reason.

[Flain]

1.2 PvE Gear:

 

"Campaign" hard Raid Gear is Rating 146 (Mod Slot 61)

"Blackhole" Corellia Commendation Gear is Rating 146 (Mod Slot 61)

 

Whats the point of raiding in SWTOR when I can just run some faceroll dailies and get "hard mode" raid gear.

 

Raiding in this game keeps getting worse not better. GW2 out yet?

 

This is a good thing imo because it caters towards the casual players. You can't assume that everyone is in an active guild, you can't assume that someone else has the same amount of time you do to play the game. In order for BW to enable casual players to keep subbing to the game they must give them intensives and this is a very good one. Don't forget grinding dailies for this gear is likely to take far longer than those raiding, so that is the incentive to raid rather than grind dailies. But you can't ignore your casual player-base, that is very unfair so I'm glad BW is addressing this issue.

Edited March 20, 2012 by Flain

[Flain]

So you would penalise casual players because they don't have the same lifestyle as you do?... that's called being elitist. Fact is BW can't ignore their casual player-base, they are not getting epics for nothing they still have to put the grind work in day in, day out. And if by your own admission any idiot can do it then why don't you?, oh I know why it's because raiding gets you gear quicker anyway, you have that luxury many do not. Giving the option I'm sure many would rather raid than the endless grind of dailies, but to deny them a chance of getting better gear I think is wrong. Edited March 21, 2012 by Trineda
removed quote

[moomtazz]

Man what a BS system! So you mean to tell me the people that have jobs, families, other interests and who can't play 10 hours a day like I do will be able to get the same gear I do?

 

*** is that? Why am I sitting at home not working then? They already have money, cool stuff and all that IRL. Now you want to let them get the best gear to???? So unfair.

[Alchropie]

Stats of the Campaign gear still have not been released. I don't know how any of you can jump to conclusions and argue about it is beyond me.

 

.

 

you can go to the vendor on PTS and see it just like Rakata/Columi.

[Alchropie]

So you would penalise casual players because they don't have the same lifestyle as you do?... that's called being elitist. Fact is BW can't ignore their casual player-base, they are not getting epics for nothing they still have to put the grind work in day in, day out. And if by your own admission any idiot can do it then why don't you?, oh I know why it's because raiding gets you gear quicker anyway, you have that luxury many do not. Giving the option I'm sure many would rather raid than the endless grind of dailies, but to deny them a chance of getting better gear I think is wrong.

 

you're right. They can't. They did it perfect with the 1.0 stuff. Dailies gave (51) mods. Those were plenty to be able to casually run HM FP's to get Tionese (126) and Columi (136). The more hardcore players ran Op's for Rakata (140) Thus catering to all sides of the community.

[Flain]

Doing dailies takes you longer than a raid so if time invested = reward gained then dailies would win. You'll gear up much quicker if you're raiding regularly than by doing dailies. And nobody is giving you anything you still have to work for it and put the time in. BW can't ignore it's casual player-base, it's bad for business, and thankfully they have realised this and done something about it. But thanks for telling me to go jump off a bridge, it made me chuckle. Edited March 21, 2012 by Trineda
removed quote

[dskhury]

just let the dailie one with blue color and same stats and then the crying shall stop.

 

When an armor is released in this WOWish type of MMO's theres always a midterm betwen the old Tier and the new Tier.

 

It's obvious that one will be better than the other, people don't even have the stats on the test server, i don't even bother to understand why are people especulating this sort of information if there's NOTHING besides a names and a commendation cost to begin with.

 

What we know...

 

Campaign set - Comes by raiding

Black Hole set - Come by dailies

 

What ELSE do we know...

 

Four difficulty modes are currently available for this Operation:

8-player Story Mode,

8-player Hard Mode,

16-player Story Mode,

and 16-player Hard Mode.

 

In Nightmare Mode, defeating each boss now yields a chest that contains Black Hole Commendations. --> IMPORTANT

 

New Campaign vendors can be found on the Fleets. They sell Campaign gear for commendations earned in the new Operation: Explosive Conflict.

 

Stop crying, most likely the Black Hole set will be inferior by far against the Campaign Set, and even so, RAIDING will still be the better way to get the Black Hole Set... It's just a midset.

 

The game already did that on Flashpoints with Columi that were drops from NORMAL OPERATION RAID.

 

People just like to complaint, take you epeen and....

[dskhury]

apperantly i'm the only one that remembers that Columi is first of all, a raiding set.

[Gavin_Darkl]

Perfect Fix For ALL SIDES INVOLVED!

 

READ IT AND READ IT UNTIL YOU UNDERSTAND EVERY THING THAT GOES ON!

 

Now Here is how to properly fix the gear/PVE loot issue. Its Logical and it gives you what you want IF and ONLY IF you EARN IT.

 

Warning You will not be in full raid gear if you do not put the effort into earning it.

 

Warning you will not get full Hard Mode Raid gear without Raiding Hard Modes.

 

Warning if you expect to be handed gear don’t expect ANY respect from me, I do not respect people not willing to put the effort into something that they want. People that want handouts go play the sims.

 

Implement 2 ways of getting Hard Mode raid gear. First being the loot that drops off the boss, the second is token that drops of a boss that coupled with 14 “Gear Daily Commendations” can buy you 1 peace of gear. So if you want to buy the T2 Chest piece of the vendor and did not get a drop you can tank 14 Gear Daily Commendations and the 1 Token and buy it. THIS Augments you getting gear if you raid casually. IF YOU DO NOT DOWN THE BOSS YOU DO NOT GET THE TOKEN TO BUY THE RAID GEAR!

 

Implement a Vendor to BUY Story Line Raid Gear with just the GEAR Daily Commendations (GDC). So you can get Story Line Gear for 7 GDC . This is so that IF you want to gear up to do Hard Modes and are a casual it will get you geared up to Hard Mode Level FASTER. It will not give you the Hard Mode Gear.

 

Implement a Solo Gear Vendor that will have Presence gear. Here is an example of what stats presence gear will have on it. Endurance – 90, Cunning – 50, Presences – 200, Surge Rating 2, Crit Rating – 4 This gear will have Presence the primary stat, the other stats will be good enough for players to go into a hard mode flashpoint but not raids. This is the type of gear for people who only want the solo aspect of the game.

 

Implement 2 chains of 3 to 5 quest each which will drop 1 GDC of each chain. Implement 1 GDC to drop of the Daily heroic.

 

This will allow CASUAL RAIDERS to gear up and attempt to keep up with Progressive raiders and Hard core raiders. It will not give out gear, it will require they put their efforts into dailies to make sure they can gear.

This will allow SOLO Players to get SOLO Progression gear, then you can setup SOLO Class/Daily type quest where you can go into a quest instance like what they have out in the world right now and do something small that resembles a SOLO Flashpoint. However it’s not an hour long nor is it as in-depth it may only take 15 minutes and you can make the mobs HARD to the point that SOLO Players must use Med Packs and Adrenals to kill the mini boss. NO GEAR HIGHER THEN BLUE PVE WORLD DROPS WILL DROP OFF THESE MINI BOSSES. A good Amount of credits will. But No Epic Raid Gear, Nor your SOLO Gear. You have to spend time getting that gear by doing Dailies.

 

This should make anyone that is after the CONTENT that is casual or the solo type to be happy. If you are a SOLO player and WANT RAID GEAR, TOUGH **** you did not down a Raid boss, and do not Plan to raid, therefore you have not earned the right to the raid gear OUTSIDE OF STORY LINE GEAR. FYI Story Line Gear will not be good enough for the SOLO Flashpoint like Quest. Only SOLO Gear because it will make your companion better to the point they are better than you. This will not help you in Flashpoints much, and it will harm you in raids. If you choose to do either Flashpoint content or Raid content you must work at that content not be given it.

Edited March 20, 2012 by Gavin_Darkl

[Tharzon]

^ I didn't read all of that, but what I skimmed seemed to indicate we should load solo gear with presence, which isn't a bad compromise.

 

Same base ilvl with more presence at a subtraction of the secondary stats or main stat. Good compromise.

 

 

Sort of off-topic, but 4 freaking raid modes. I'm tired of that crap. I was tired of it in WoW too. 1 size and I would concede two difficulties. But seriously, lose one of the sizes (preferably 8m)

[Gavin_Darkl]

^ I didn't read all of that, but what I skimmed seemed to indicate we should load solo gear with presence, which isn't a bad compromise.

 

Same base ilvl with more presence at a subtraction of the secondary stats or main stat. Good compromise.

 

 

Sort of off-topic, but 4 freaking raid modes. I'm tired of that crap. I was tired of it in WoW too. 1 size and I would concede two difficulties. But seriously, lose one of the sizes (preferably 8m)

 

No its not a bad compromise because its made only for Soloing because you cannot bring your companion for most group content. Yes for leveling flashpoints, but no for Hardmode flashpoints or raids.

 

Is a person wants to raid they get the raid gear from raiding. It will require them to find a Hard mode raiding guild however thats not too hard if you look for guilds that raid and if you are willing to put the effort needed to raid. That means if a guild requires you to sign up for the raid, have healing stims, be on time, and be repair thats what you need to do. Most raiding guilds have requirements that are really not hard to achieve. Again if a person wants to and they are given the chance to they need to make it happen.

[Tetrablade]

No its not a bad compromise because its made only for Soloing because you cannot bring your companion for most group content. Yes for leveling flashpoints, but no for Hardmode flashpoints or raids.

 

Is a person wants to raid they get the raid gear from raiding. It will require them to find a Hard mode raiding guild however thats not too hard if you look for guilds that raid and if you are willing to put the effort needed to raid. That means if a guild requires you to sign up for the raid, have healing stims, be on time, and be repair thats what you need to do. Most raiding guilds have requirements that are really not hard to achieve. Again if a person wants to and they are given the chance to they need to make it happen.

 

Unless you are republic on half the servers. Everyone should have access to end level gear STATS. But the actual cool looking gear should be hard to obtain. Going the extra mile should reward in unique gear not required gear. Like the magenta crystal.

[Gavin_Darkl]

Unless you are republic on half the servers. Everyone should have access to end level gear STATS. But the actual cool looking gear should be hard to obtain. Going the extra mile should reward in unique gear not required gear. Like the magenta crystal.

 

 

Everyone does have access to end level gear stats. Its should not be handed to them.

 

I understand that republic side on all servers are not as heavy on raiding. The same can be said about people on my server. However its not Biowares problem that most casual\solo players went republic. For every 1 republic player that applies to my guild on the republic side we get 10 to 15 people on the empire side that wants to raid. This is just the way it is.

[Mindsplitter]

Sorry, but it's not raid gear if one can get it doing solo content. It's just gear. I'll get it faster doing raids, but if someone gets it doing solo content then it doesn't mean a thing to me. Why does this hurt you so badly? Why do you need to compare yourself to others? This is entertainment, not real life. Go outside and achieve something worth while. Meet a nice girl, have some children for gods sake and quit crying about your gear.