1.2 Patch Notes for us!

[wtfayc]

I'm curious about deafening defense talent on PTS, does it still have passive damage reduction on shien or not?

 

Deafening Defense Talent Tier 5 Vengeance: Reduces all damage taken by 4% at all times and by an additional 15% while Enraged Defense is active. Additionally reduces the cooldown of Intimidating Roar by 15 seconds.

[Goretzu]

Obviously you didn't understand the issue here...

 

People complaining about the crash passive are people thinking about rated pvp and organized gameplay.

 

People (like you) whining about 3 more sec on smash are people who play rage spec. Nobody cares about rage spec as it's a dumb spec designed only to allow mentally challenged players to play sith warrior.

 

I'm not blaming you for playing it, and in fact I love rage spec and the diversity it gives to the game. One of the core aspect of our society is tolerance and I respect that!

 

But dude let's be clear for 2 sec : nobody serious about pvping in this game cares about rage.

 

The point of the discussion is : crash is a nerf and people want to know if Bioware did this nerf on purpose or if they meant to buff the class, in which case it's important to report them the flaws in their thinking.

 

 

 

This shows why they are messing up Rage spec with 1.2, it's at least as bad (for Rage spec) as the Crash issue (which is on-top of the direct Rage nerfs).

Edited March 19, 2012 by Goretzu

[DarthBandeth]

Why are my AOE tanking abilities getting nerfed when they're already vastly inferior to the other tanking classes?

[Zel_Kova]

BW. Im not so much uspet with the dps of the juggernaut cause we are not meant for damage. But our survivability sucks, other classes can hit through our heavy armor and we can barely hit through their "light and medium" armor! We dont need our talents rearranged as much as we need either dps buff or survivability buff. Listen to your juggernauts, we are gimped and need some attention. That is all i have to say. I know others may not agree and thats fine, but as for me, the jugg is broken and BW you are doing nothing to fix that in my opinion.

[Goretzu]

BW. Im not so much uspet with the dps of the juggernaut cause we are not meant for damage. But our survivability sucks, other classes can hit through our heavy armor and we can barely hit through their "light and medium" armor! We dont need our talents rearranged as much as we need either dps buff or survivability buff. Listen to your juggernauts, we are gimped and need some attention. That is all i have to say. I know others may not agree and thats fine, but as for me, the jugg is broken and BW you are doing nothing to fix that in my opinion.

 

With 2 DPS trees Jugganaunt are meant for DPS, or at least they need a big base surviabilty buff if not.

 

Currently in 1.2 Marauders will out-DPS, out-survive and out-utility everything but Tank Juggs.

 

That is plain daft, as why should anyone play a non-tank Jugg over a Marauder?

[Ansultares]

I just hope this patch doesn't release until mid-April.

[Kyllum]

1.2 is the patch that destroys juggernauts

[Goretzu]

1.2 is the patch that destroys juggernauts

 

I dunno about that, but it's certainly going to make some specs rather obsolete with things as they are.

 

It's nice for Marauders and Assassins though, so maybe that's Biowares idea.

[WarSiren]

1.2 is the patch that destroys juggernauts

 

Only if you're bad, and use rage as a crutch (Not saying rage is bad or doesn't take skill there's some very skilled rage players who go above and beyond, I'm saying it's the easiest spec to be "good" with) and aren't willing to learn how to replay it. Then sure yeah it destroys Juggs for those people while the people that are actually good will re-figure the class out and continue to excel with it.

Edited March 20, 2012 by WarSiren

[lordofdamornin]

Only if you're bad, and use rage as a crutch (Not saying rage is bad or doesn't take skill there's some very skilled rage players who go above and beyond, I'm saying it's the easiest spec to be "good" with) and aren't willing to learn how to replay it. Then sure yeah it destroys Juggs for those people while the people that are actually good will re-figure the class out and continue to excel with it.

 

I second this motion.

 

Riôt

[lost_jedi]

From the PTR on Sonic Barrier http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=369522

[sanctified]

AOE threat isn't important in this game. It's never been important. People basing the success of this class in its tanking role on ease of AOE tanking are foolish. For single target, Ever since taunt was revealed to have a stacking effect, the people who adjusted their rotation accordingly have aced the content in this game and now with crushing blow getting a 50% threat increase, it's over. Juggernauts will be as easy to use as Vanguards. You'd think people would be happy about that or something. Edited March 20, 2012 by sanctified

[Dirtysolutions]

BIOWARE:

 

Can you please put this issue at rest once and for all:

 

Is Juggernaugh AC Meant to be "a tank class" or is it supposed to be viable as comepetative dps (as in within 5% of top dps AC´s)?

 

The community, and certainly I am confused about this. Please clarify once and for all so we can stop bickering about this and get on to debate other issues, and in so doing have a progressive discussion.

 

It would really help all of us if you (BIOWARE) could make a big yellow post and put this issue to rest once and for all.

 

thank you devs for your understanding and willingness to support constructive discussion.

 

Edited March 21, 2012 by Dirtysolutions

[coldserpent]

BIOWARE:

 

Can you please put this issue at rest once and for all:

 

Is Juggernaugh AC Meant to be "a tank class" or is it supposed to be viable as comepetative dps (as in within 5% of top dps AC´s)?

 

The community, and certainly I am confused about this. Please clarify once and for all so we can stop bickering about this and get on to debate other issues, and in so doing have a progressive discussion.

 

It would really help all of us if you (BIOWARE) could make a big yellow post and put this issue to rest once and for all.

 

thank you devs for your understanding and willingness to support constructive discussion.

 

 

It's meant to be both. It says(very clearly, I add) when you decide to make that all important choice, Tank/Damage for its role. Great way to compare it: The Champion class in Lord of the Rings Online(for those who played it) has a tank role, and a single target dps role, and an aoe dps role(just like the Juggernaut). It can do all three very well. In fact, it more or less can play like a Champion in Lord of the Rings Online(again, for those who played it).

 

Tank/Damage. It was very clear in saying that if you actually read the description while deciding to choose to make a Juggernaut.

 

If you want to be a purely defensive warrior, by all means, go ahead. You can skill /gear for it, same as you can for damage dealing. You can even do hybrid and not totally faceplant. If people would open their mind a little, they might see more than just black and white.

 

And in case you missed it the first couple times, TANK/DAMAGE.

[OeSan]

List of Nerfs:

 

Force scream and Smash +3 sec to cd

 

aoe taunt CD nerfed (the talent that shortens it to 45 sec from 1 min is gone

 

Force choke nerf, the talent that shortens it to 47 sec from 1 min no longer does so

 

Crash, charge now has a 2 seconds stun, we already had a snare and an interrupt, this is only there to fill resolve, and once 2 Juggs jump on someone in pvp they will be immune. hutball is gonna suck for EVERYONE now.

 

Rage is losing 10% of its damage on smash, the +30% skill is now +20%.

 

 

And to top it off the rage tree now has the +20% smash dmg so marauders can do everything we do, only better.

======================================================

 

None of this is worth a heal that takes, as someone else put it, 14 rage. FOURTEEN.

Edited March 21, 2012 by OeSan

[Dirtysolutions]

It's meant to be both. It says(very clearly, I add) when you decide to make that all important choice, Tank/Damage for its role. Great way to compare it: The Champion class in Lord of the Rings Online(for those who played it) has a tank role, and a single target dps role, and an aoe dps role(just like the Juggernaut). It can do all three very well. In fact, it more or less can play like a Champion in Lord of the Rings Online(again, for those who played it).

 

Tank/Damage. It was very clear in saying that if you actually read the description while deciding to choose to make a Juggernaut.

 

If you want to be a purely defensive warrior, by all means, go ahead. You can skill /gear for it, same as you can for damage dealing. You can even do hybrid and not totally faceplant. If people would open their mind a little, they might see more than just black and white.

 

And in case you missed it the first couple times, TANK/DAMAGE.

 

No I didnt miss it , but it sure seems to be different opinions, perceptions or player-L2read-issues in that particular department. And since the issue comes up every time theres a discussion . Maybeit would help us moving forward if there was a big yelloq post sauing "No you are supposed to be able to perform according to AC.description" or "Sorry guys, typo - Its actually says TANK"

 

This "juggs arent supposed to do dps because they are a taaaank class" starts to get old real fast and putting that issue to rest once and for all could only move the discussion forward IMO.

 

spelling = just woke up

Edited March 21, 2012 by Dirtysolutions

[Goretzu]

List of Nerfs:

 

Force scream and Smash +3 sec to cd

 

aoe taunt CD nerfed (the talent that shortens it to 45 sec from 1 min is gone

 

Force choke nerf, the talent that shortens it to 47 sec from 1 min no longer does so

 

Crash, charge now has a 2 seconds stun, we already had a snare and an interrupt, this is only there to fill resolve, and once 2 Juggs jump on someone in pvp they will be immune. hutball is gonna suck for EVERYONE now.

 

Rage is losing 10% of its damage on smash, the +30% skill is now +20%.

 

 

And to top it off the rage tree now has the +20% smash dmg so marauders can do everything we do, only better.

======================================================

 

None of this is worth a heal that takes, as someone else put it, 14 rage. FOURTEEN.

 

 

 

Indeed it's a nasty list.

 

If they lowered the Rage/Focus cost of the heal a bit it would even things out a bit, at the moment I'm not convinced it's usuable.

[OeSan]

Not to mention its a weak HoT. It's not even synergistic with the rage tree, MAYBE the vengeance one since its got constant damage and rage regen.

[coldserpent]

No I didnt miss it , but it sure seems to be different opinions, perceptions or player-L2read-issues in that particular department. And since the issue comes up every time theres a discussion . Maybeit would help us moving forward if there was a big yelloq post sauing "No you are supposed to be able to perform according to AC.description" or "Sorry guys, typo - Its actually says TANK"

 

This "juggs arent supposed to do dps because they are a taaaank class" starts to get old real fast and putting that issue to rest once and for all could only move the discussion forward IMO.

 

spelling = just woke up

 

I think it's mainly this, for those who constantly whine that "tanks aren't supposed to do damage," or "juggernauts are tanks, not dps." If you roll a sith warrior, or jedi knight, read the class descriptions before making the choices. If you don't roll/have one, and are continuing to judge something based on what kind of armor it wears, either open your mind/do some research, or take that attitude to another game.

[dirtyv]

 

Crash is a nerf and people want to know if Bioware did this nerf on purpose or if they meant to buff the class, in which case it's important to report them the flaws in their thinking.

 

 

 

Thats all I want to know.

Edited March 21, 2012 by dirtyv

[bananaface]

Ima dps and I haz the ability to fill in a minor tank role if needed.

 

Wut does that make me?

 

A dps.

 

This mindless rambling of jelly people has taken us of the subject, the 1.2 changes for juggernaut.

 

Imo (and I'm pretty sure every jugg agrees) remove/change these changes:

crash added - fills resolve = bad

force alacrity removed - makes rage even more reliant on smash and gimping sustained dps even more

thrown gauntlet no longer reduces cd on threatening scream - people in general find it hard to hold aoe threat as tank jugg + pvp nerf wich is not needed.

huddle removed - should be put in a low immortal tier imo so vengeance still has acces to it.

decimate only giving 20% bonus dmg to smash - gimping aoe threat, making effort to improve shockwave smashes with 2 skills and gimp it with 2 others (makes no sense bro!)

enraged defender - costs too much rage for too less healing and makes you do 0 dmg and 0 threat while it's up thus it is only beneficial to ball carrieing while was implemented to increase the survivability for dps juggs.

Edited March 21, 2012 by bananaface

[squallNCloud]

Honestly Throw Gauntlet no longers lowers cooldown on threatening scream....WHY?!....30sec is an eternity to wait to use a AOE taunt...Which is the ONLY AOE taunt immortals have. WHY?! 24sec cooldown with a 6 agro was fine....I don't understand this idea.

[squallNCloud]

Also I have posted a thread to circumvent the issue of dmg/mitigation for immortals....might not help some but is great for leveling imo....Have been doing HM's with it and still doing great as a tank....AOE aggro and tanking work great....still pisses me off about the thrown gauntlet talent being re-vamped tho....congrats you made it COMPLETELY useless....might as well just get rid of it altogether.

 

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=372250

Edited March 21, 2012 by squallNCloud

[Elyx]

No I didnt miss it , but it sure seems to be different opinions, perceptions or player-L2read-issues in that particular department. And since the issue comes up every time theres a discussion . Maybeit would help us moving forward if there was a big yelloq post sauing "No you are supposed to be able to perform according to AC.description" or "Sorry guys, typo - Its actually says TANK"

 

This "juggs arent supposed to do dps because they are a taaaank class" starts to get old real fast and putting that issue to rest once and for all could only move the discussion forward IMO.

 

spelling = just woke up

 

I think that was his point (though he may not have communicated it in the best way). Bio has stated that all DPS specs are supposed to be within 5% of each other.

 

The confusion is not really confusion. It's ignorance. in spite of what Bio has said, In spite of the COMPLETE LACK OF REAL DATA to prove otherwise, people have been maintaining an immense level of ignorance about the whole issue. While being ignorant isn't a bad thing, it's the sheer fact that they are acting like it's FACT. That's whats causing the confusion.

[dirtyv]

Thrown gaunt is also wack now since unless they add something else, its just going to have a CD benefit for force push... which will likely not matter much since the resolve bars are going to be full so much quicker lol.