DarthRavnos Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Bioware didn't make you sub for 3 months. You had 30 days to cancel. Why didn't you? Now that some improvements are coming, you feel entitled to a refund? Will you feel the same when 1.3 comes? Then 1.4? And so on? Contrary to what you might think, no one is forcing you to pay for the game. You made that choice. You can cut your losses if you feel ripped off. Honestly, if you are that upset with a company I dunno why you would keep paying them. Maybe you just like to complain? How do you know that the OP didn't get sold on the 6 month subscription? Kind of like seeing a brand new corvette and you purchase it. Then when you get home you find a weird smell on the inside you can't shake. Also, the engine is broke. But, you're locked into using the car for 6 months before you're allowed to return it. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cernow Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I've been enjoying the game enormously, but thats because I've been levelling several characters to 50 and mostly avoiding the endgame. The 1-49 levelling process is wonderful. A few nasty class storyline bugs aside, the experience is a smooth one and the whole levelling experience hangs together nicely and is very entertaining. It's at 50 that most of the ragged edges become apparent and you find lots of poorly thought out / rushed content with bugs, oversights and inconsistencies. Plus content that seems like an afterthought (this includes all the PvP) and content which feels out of kilter with the rest of the game. Much of the endgame content feels unfinished and in some cases ill-conceived. For example, the mess that is Ilum, the endgame gear that looks like it was designed for WoW, the confusing PVE and PvP gear progression, the lack of any real purpose for crew skills at endgame and lots more. It's as if they spent 5 years developing the levelling process with its wonderful storylines and voice acting and then with 3 months to launch someone whispered the word "endgame" in their ears, to much panic. 1.2 needs to address the endgame, the endgame and nothing but the endgame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymaniac Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 How do you know that the OP didn't get sold on the 6 month subscription? Kind of like seeing a brand new corvette and you purchase it. Then when you get home you find a weird smell on the inside you can't shake. Also, the engine is broke. But, you're locked into using the car for 6 months before you're allowed to return it. Just saying. 1 month, 3 months, 6 months it doesn't matter. You could cancel after 30 days. The OP is saying features should have been implemented from the get go. That is day 1. He went through 30 days without those features and felt it was still worth paying for. Now, that some of those features are coming, he wants a refund. With your analogy, it would be like getting a corvette knowing you have 30 days to return it. But despite the flaws you find, you decide not to. Then 6 months later, Corvette is actually fixing a bunch of the problems in your car without charging extra. And now you want to be refunded. That's just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceperson Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 How do you know that the OP didn't get sold on the 6 month subscription? Kind of like seeing a brand new corvette and you purchase it. Then when you get home you find a weird smell on the inside you can't shake. Also, the engine is broke. But, you're locked into using the car for 6 months before you're allowed to return it. Just saying. you can sign up for a 1, 3, 6 month sub when you register the game and still cancel in the first 30 days without being billed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macumba Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 If Bioware would have said, "SWTOR is not done, but since everyone is eager to play, we are going to release it early without some major features that will be forthcoming.", then would people have STILL BOUGHT IT? Answer: Yes. 1. you're right 2. swtor came with a lot more content from scratch than some other mmo 3. leveling was way too fast if this were a good old mmo (wow 1.0 also was similar to them) a lot more people would still not be at max level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaKnuckles Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 Then after 3 days you would still be here, complaining about the features that aren't in the game. No developer will every make anyone happy, particularly those self-entitled brats who think they should get for $60 every feature the game is ever going to have for however long the game runs. MMOs evolve. You can either get used to it, or stop playing them. Either way, the rest of us win. If I'm not mistaken we paid full price for the game. And, a monthly sub. A company like BW should have hit their deadline for release. If you call a 1/2 finished game a "win" then have at it man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ransom_BiC Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 and every other MMO I've ever played... ever ever. ^^This^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaKnuckles Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 (edited) yes but EA forced them to release early I 100% agree with you on that! It's still no excuse for them not to do something about it. Edited March 16, 2012 by DaKnuckles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRavnos Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Nothing new here. Every single MMO has released before the programmers/developers would have chosen to and then they have to play catch up. When is Guild Wars 2 going to be released? When it's finished. Guild Wars 2 is the largest project ArenaNet® has ever undertaken, and we want to make sure we take the time to do it right. Not every... However, I and couple million other folks find it enjoyable. As John stated, we have sold through 2 million units of the game since December. We currently have a little over 1.7 million active subscribers. The rest have either not started playing yet or have opted out. Your numbers are off a little bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbowsin Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 If they add everything they want to add before the release, then the game would never be released. Please spend your time learning how software development works and less time making new threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceperson Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Not every...) GW2? lol, those idiots couldn't even get jump included in their last game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Englefield Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 In answer to the thread title, yes that is true and it is exactly what Bioware wanted to launch with. Some might speculate that the launch date was forced upon them. Listening to some feedback from the guild summit it was clear that the legacy system was one of the first design decisions they took at a very early stage in development. To be honest I don't blame Bioware for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stupiddrummer Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 If Bioware would have said, "SWTOR is not done, but since everyone is eager to play, we are going to release it early without some major features that will be forthcoming.", then would people have STILL BOUGHT IT? Answer: Yes. This. I understand that MMOs are different because they get updates. But patches for MMOs are intended to add new content, not add fundamental elements of the game that should've been there from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRavnos Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 (edited) 1 month, 3 months, 6 months it doesn't matter. You could cancel after 30 days. The OP is saying features should have been implemented from the get go. That is day 1. He went through 30 days without those features and felt it was still worth paying for. Now, that some of those features are coming, he wants a refund. With your analogy, it would be like getting a corvette knowing you have 30 days to return it. But despite the flaws you find, you decide not to. Then 6 months later, Corvette is actually fixing a bunch of the problems in your car without charging extra. And now you want to be refunded. That's just silly. I am not sure where you are getting your information. But if I subscribe for 6 months and cancel 30 days in, BioWare is not going to refund me the 5 months remaining. So my analogy is correct. You are correct though, if BioWare fixes problems X, Y, and Z then it is a non-issue. If... EDIT: I am referring to your first billing. Edited March 16, 2012 by DarthRavnos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinrain Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 If I'm not mistaken we paid full price for the game. And, a monthly sub. A company like BW should have hit their deadline for release. If you call a 1/2 finished game a "win" then have at it man. You made the decision to pay that monthly sub after 30 days experience so theres not much point in crying about it now. And your opinion may be that its a half finished game but thats not the case (in my opinion) for the vast majority of subscribers. Everyone in my guild is having a blast, despite some things we'd still like to see in the game (like Guild Banks etc) and we think we're getting our money's worth. Since launch my guild has grown and grown with happy players who are enjoying their time and logging in regularly, we've lost one player in 3 months because the game wasn't to his tastes. If thats not your experience i'm sorry, maybe your in the wrong guild? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRavnos Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 GW2? lol, those idiots couldn't even get jump included in their last game... Pretty sure you can /jump and your character would emote jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reico Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Not every... Your numbers are off a little bit. Man are people going to be disappointed with GW2, fully instanced PVP, no PVP servers, and no endgame content outside of WvWvW which is instanced. And people complain about no endgame content in this game, yikes. I was hoping for more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceperson Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I am not sure where you are getting your information. But if I subscribe for 6 months and cancel 30 days in, BioWare is not going to refund me the 5 months remaining. So my analogy is correct. You are correct though, if BioWare fixes problems X, Y, and Z then it is a non-issue. If... you get 30 days included when you buy the game, you can play 30 days without a sub. seriously, are you really that dense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaKnuckles Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 If they add everything they want to add before the release, then the game would never be released. Please spend your time learning how software development works and less time making new threads. I worked in the game industry and I know about deadlines. MMOs should not get a pass. I find it really interesting and quite comical how some of you stick up for this game like I just called your mother a ______. We did not get what we paid for period... You can try to sugar coat it all you want and tell anyone that disagrees with you to just leave but the fact of the matter is it should have been a complete game experience at launch with just content and minor bug fixes from their on out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldrenath Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Anyhow, you all can flame all you want but IMO all your doing is letting BW know it's ok to rip off people because you're stuck in the mentality that just because of the SW content it's ok to charge people to beta test or pay for a unfinished product. My hard earned money is worth more to me than that... How did they rip you off on the sub money? If you paid for the game it came with 30 days included. 30 days is far more than enough time to know what a game does and doesn't have. If you paid for a sub after your 30 days, you didn't get ripped off. You KNEW what you were paying for, what was in the game and what wasn't. You then CHOSE to continue your sub. If you're unhappy about that, then that's too bad. But you had 30 days to try the game and know darn well what it does and does not have. Heck, I kinda agree with the OP. A lot of these features really should have been in at launch, and I find it slightly disappointing that they weren't. But I knew full well that they weren't before my first 90 day sub was charged, and I still happily paid the sub fee. Because while I admit the game has flaws, I still have a lot of fun when I log in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthRavnos Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I worked in the game industry and I know about deadlines. MMOs should not get a pass. I find it really interesting and quite comical how some of you stick up for this game like I just called your mother a ______. We did not get what we paid for period... You can try to sugar coat it all you want and tell anyone that disagrees with you to just leave but the fact of the matter is it should have been a complete game experience at launch with just content and minor bug fixes from their on out. ^--- This. QFT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XLJedi Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 (edited) Well sure we can all whine if we want... They could wait til forever and release it and still someone will have something to say about some missing feature or bug that shoulda been squashed in alpha-beta-gamma testing. Seems it was good enuff to win MMO of the year with a 4th Qtr 2011 release. It hit the stores right at holiday peak shopping time; I mean that's just good business sense. Any business exec with two brain cells to rub together woulda made that call. Perhaps the timing even helped spur the gaming population, which I think has some benefit to the community. I'm looking forward to the new content and have enjoyed playing thus far... Edited March 16, 2012 by XLJedi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claymaniac Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I worked in the game industry and I know about deadlines. MMOs should not get a pass. I find it really interesting and quite comical how some of you stick up for this game like I just called your mother a ______. We did not get what we paid for period... You can try to sugar coat it all you want and tell anyone that disagrees with you to just leave but the fact of the matter is it should have been a complete game experience at launch with just content and minor bug fixes from their on out. I don't necessarily disagree. A lot of features should be in at launch in MMO's nowadays. Heck, even after 1.2 there is stuff like LFG tool, multi specs etc. that I feel every MMO should have at launch nowadays. But what are you going to do. Its your choice, like I said. If you aren't having a good experience despite the flaws, why are you still paying? Its not rational to do so and then ask for a refund later when stuff does go in. That's not how life works. I can pay a monthly sub for my cable for a year. In year 2, they may add 10 new channels. I don't get to call them and ask me to refund the last year of subs just because those 10 new channels should have always been there. But somehow MMO players feel more entitled to random stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceperson Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I worked in the game industry and I know about deadlines. MMOs should not get a pass. I find it really interesting and quite comical how some of you stick up for this game like I just called your mother a ______. We did not get what we paid for period... You can try to sugar coat it all you want and tell anyone that disagrees with you to just leave but the fact of the matter is it should have been a complete game experience at launch with just content and minor bug fixes from their on out. Gamestop isn't the game industry. I'm curious what games you're looking forward to that you expect to have every feature in on day 1. Please say Diablo 3 is one of them (no pvp on release.) Starcraft 2 would be another good one (lol they're charging you for the same game 3 times over a 4-5 year period!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calimwulf Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 "Don't tell me you didn't know what you were getting for your $$$, because that's a damned lie and everyone knows it" OK... sure we have a difference of opinion. Anyhow, to each their own I didn't expect everyone to agree with me. But, what I do know is pretty much everyone in my guild and on my friends list all said the same things. I'm just throwing it out there for discussion and hopefully some sort of response by BW. Here's the thing. You can't call it a discussion if you call people who disagree with you liars. You might want to keep that in mind for the future. Regardless of how many nameless friends you have that agree with you a difference of opinion should never lead to verbal violence and name calling. TOR 1.0 was fully functional, but with bugs. 1.2 adds and fleshes out existing features. 1.2 also adds new content, has some class balances, as well as fixes additional bugs. Should 1.2 have been the initial release build? Heck if I know because I haven't gotten my hands on it yet, but without 1.0, the devs wouldn't have known exactly what their customers wanted. They would have been taking guesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts