Doamy Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 How is it proven? By participation skyrocket after they added it to the game? What came first, chicken or the egg? I personally can't say if the LFG made more people come into WoW, or it was gaining popularity before, and they got asked to implement something to make it easy for new players to get groups they would have missed being behind the leveling curve, or whatever... Both sides are anecdotal, trying to disprove one or the other like most in this thread have gets no-where. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchbass Posted February 12, 2012 Author Share Posted February 12, 2012 How is it proven? By participation skyrocket after they added it to the game? Subs reach highest peak after it's included Check Subs stabalize for the longest after the last raid of expansion Check Blizzard increases its functionality Check Other major MMORPG's are adopting it Check People believe Bioware gots there minority because instead of casual money Check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tic- Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) I haven't read every post here so someone may have pointed this out but...the cross server queing relates to warzones not flashpoints. FP's weren't mentioned at all And how long do you think it will take for them to do that? Just a matter of time. Folks will be hollering for x server flashpoints Edited February 12, 2012 by Tic- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverprovidence Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Subs reach highest peak after it's included Check Subs stabalize for the longest after the last raid of expansion Check The one with Arthas? The one who was effectively the main character in the warcraft III games for all intents and purposes? That didnt have a SLIGHT effect? How do you explain the sub incline pre-LFG tool then? . Clearly it wasnt the tool because tool+arthas should have made a vertical rise in subs. Blizzard increases its functionality Check Other major MMORPG's are adopting it Check People believe Bioware gots there minority because instead of casual money Check I believe you left out 'wow loses subs' about three times there. No explaination for that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 What came first, chicken or the egg? I personally can't say if the LFG made more people come into WoW, or it was gaining popularity before, and they got asked to implement something to make it easy for new players to get groups they would have missed being behind the leveling curve, or whatever... Both sides are anecdotal, trying to disprove one or the other like most in this thread have gets no-where. Well it is a factt backet up with numbers by Blizzard that LFD tool was very popular and it skyrocketed participation numbers of people doing dungeons overall. All other things mentioned in this thread, destroying commuinity, meeting only ninjas and douches via cross server features are subjective and only oppinions of different people. Like i stated earlier, i did lot more dungeons after LFG was added, but on the side when possible, i did runs with guildies like i did from launch of WoW. After atleast 200 LFD dungeon runs with randoms i only failed to complete about 5-10 instacnes and ninjas and douches i met druing those runs can be counted by my fingers. Some have other oppinions but only fact is that people used it cause it had more pros than cons. res of this debate is nonsense and personal oppinions made to sound like majority this and majority that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The one with Arthas? The one who was effectively the main character in the warcraft III games for all intents and purposes? That didnt have a SLIGHT effect? How do you explain the sub incline pre-LFG tool then? . Clearly it wasnt the tool because tool+arthas should have made a vertical rise in subs. I believe you left out 'wow loses subs' about three times there. No explaination for that? And how is that related to LFD tool or ruined community? Your oppinion? Game is 7 years old and on natural decline till next expansion? It lost 100k subs in last 3 months when ToR lost 300k in a month? Whats your point? how is this related to this thread in any way? Dunno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariacan Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 In the dev. Q&A on Feb 10th Dual Spec got confirmed and now an interview with Stephen Reid has just confirmed they are looking into a cross server flash point finder which is huge considering they said they didn't like the notion originally. http://toroz.com.au/2012/02/stephen-reid-qa-summary-transcript/ Who won? Who is next? You decide! EDIT: For people skeptical or lazy Simon – Any plans for an LFG tool? SR: Definitely being looked at including cross-server Flashpoint tool. Definitely wanting to do. EDIT 2: The above is not "word for word" and there is a podcast that you can listen to and the LFD part comes around 26:10. Under no way or form does he say LFD Is coming cross server but he confirms that they are in fact looking at it which is HUGE from their previous stance. Big win for casuals? this game is the very definition of casual mmo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) Big win for casuals? this game is the very definition of casual mmo. Ofc it is, all gaming companies that has big budgets will have to make casual friendly games to cover up to cost. No one wants to make outdated MMOs for 300k players when they can create big games for millions of users. Edited February 12, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyforb Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Huh, all it does is remove the cost of changing specs when its required of you to further your play. As in, many times we respec just because the group needs it for tonight's run. How is having the ability to do so without paying each time change any of that? if anything its required because the talent system in this game is such an atrocious pile. and finally, no one is making you change your play style. That's the problem though. If your guildies need a certain spec for tonight's run, sorry, but you shouldn't be able to go. Certain specs do certain things, and you stick with them, just like classes, otherwise we wouldn't have specs to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 That's the problem though. If your guildies need a certain spec for tonight's run, sorry, but you shouldn't be able to go. Certain specs do certain things, and you stick with them, just like classes, otherwise we wouldn't have specs to begin with. Im glad that majority and BW disagrees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthtoph Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) All I hear is "soon" regarding features that pretty much every other MMO launches with, as in, guild bank, lol. If anything, it's pathetic. Edited February 12, 2012 by darthtoph Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyforb Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Im glad that majority and BW disagrees. And why do you disagree? If you can't come up with a good, solid reason why you disagree with me, you're pulling an incredibly obvious bandwagon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariacan Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Ofc it is, all gaming companies that has big budgets will have to make casual friendly games to cover up to cost. No one wants to make outdated MMOs for 300k players when they can create big games for millions of users. That's what leads to an over saturation of the market with WoW-alikes. What this genre really needs is some real innovation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jswizzle Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) That's what leads to an over saturation of the market with WoW-alikes. What this genre really needs is some real innovation. Real innovation? Like it's so simple. You can't take the established rules of RPGs and break them apart because it would be "cool". It won't be cool. The formula is good, we like the formula. Give me story, choices, and character progression in a persistent world that will evolve and I'm in. Edited February 12, 2012 by Jswizzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 And why do you disagree? If you can't come up with a good, solid reason why you disagree with me, you're pulling an incredibly obvious bandwagon. Dual spec gives diveristy for guilds and helps developers to make more complicated boss fights when people can switch tanks to dps and from healers to dps and vice versa. It aint very productive to anyone to have backup people waiting online just to get into one boss fight and then get locked from rest of the place. If 2 bosses need 3 tanks and 4 needs 2 tanks then you just kick the 1 tank on 4 of those bosses instead of him speccing to dps ? I play/d Pve and PvP, your ideal is for me of having 2 characters of same class that i want to play just for PvP and PVE instead of of me playing 1 character and swicth specs to do both? Whats your solid reasoning for people to have just 1 spec other than you just saying thats the way it should be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 That's what leads to an over saturation of the market with WoW-alikes. What this genre really needs is some real innovation. You can create an game company that uses 60-300mil on creating a game with your innovations. Just dont use DaoC, SWG or other kinda niche games as a model or your company ends there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyforb Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Dual spec gives diveristy for guilds and helps developers to make more complicated boss fights when people can switch tanks to dps and from healers to dps and vice versa. It aint very productive to anyone to have backup people waiting online just to get into one boss fight and then get locked from rest of the place. If 2 bosses need 3 tanks and 4 needs 2 tanks then you just kick the 1 tank on 4 of those bosses instead of him speccing to dps ? I play/d Pve and PvP, your ideal is for me of having 2 characters of same class that i want to play just for PvP and PVE instead of of me playing 1 character and swicth specs to do both? Whats your solid reasoning for people to have just 1 spec other than you just saying thats the way it should be? That's part of promoting diversity in guilds. It encourages people to say, "This other guy may not be in full Rakata, but we need one less tank and one more dps. We oughta take him." To me, dual spec destroys the chances of some players being able to get decent gear in a timely manner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) That's part of promoting diversity in guilds. It encourages people to say, "This other guy may not be in full Rakata, but we need one less tank and one more dps. We oughta take him." To me, dual spec destroys the chances of some players being able to get decent gear in a timely manner. So thats your reasoning why not to have dualspecs? ok. Edited February 12, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terminova Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Dual spec gives diveristy for guilds and helps developers to make more complicated boss fights when people can switch tanks to dps and from healers to dps and vice versa. It aint very productive to anyone to have backup people waiting online just to get into one boss fight and then get locked from rest of the place. If 2 bosses need 3 tanks and 4 needs 2 tanks then you just kick the 1 tank on 4 of those bosses instead of him speccing to dps ? I play/d Pve and PvP, your ideal is for me of having 2 characters of same class that i want to play just for PvP and PVE instead of of me playing 1 character and swicth specs to do both? Whats your solid reasoning for people to have just 1 spec other than you just saying thats the way it should be? No, dual spec requires them to make encounters even harder and forces them to take excessive shift-speccing into account for each and every raid. And then people complain they are too complicated, too hard. I haven't seen any solid reasoning from you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 (edited) No, dual spec requires them to make encounters even harder and forces them to take excessive shift-speccing into account for each and every raid. And then people complain they are too complicated, too hard. I haven't seen any solid reasoning from you. They have different skill levels and people used to complain that WoW had boring non innovative fights. They have to make nightmare modes more harder and challenging and for smaller guilds dual spec is a good thing cause they dont always have right classes/specs with fully geared waiting to jump in. Also i want to PvP and Pve on same character instead of making 2 chars of same class for it. Dual spec is one thing that almost everyone has wished on forums casual or not and im sure its same ingame. Like it or not, they are catering for the masses and thast why they are making the game more accessible to players with or without your support. Edited February 12, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acri Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 As a hardcore player, I'm not sure how this is specifically a big win for casuals considering that I also am in favor of these changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Striker Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 If they throw up a teleporting, cross server queue LFG system, I'm out of here. Same here. My 2 accounts will be gone. I left Rift when it was implemented, I'll be out of here too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Same here. My 2 accounts will be gone. I left Rift when it was implemented, I'll be out of here too. Im thinking of resubbing, have fun in other games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ariacan Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Real innovation? Like it's so simple. You can't take the established rules of RPGs and break them apart because it would be "cool". It won't be cool. The formula is good, we like the formula. Give me story, choices, and character progression in a persistent world that will evolve and I'm in. So you want MMOs as a genre to stagnate and produce nothing but wow clones? You need to break and change the rules to innovate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 So you want MMOs as a genre to stagnate and produce nothing but wow clones? You need to break and change the rules to innovate. No one is gonna do that with their money on the line. But you are free to try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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