Can World PVP Be Saved? [Constructive Ideas Please]

[BegaTasty]

really funny thing is, you see all the wow generation saying that world pvp cant be done, world pvp si "unfair" world pvp "has never been done in anything but fail gamez" as they call it

Yet

 

UO the game was about killing those "Anti dogs"

Asheron's call the game was about killing Bloods...

 

There were no battlegrounds back then, Daoc was the first to bring in BG's unluckily (or unlucky) depending how you see it, they were great, but after that things fell apart.

The one tihng all these games had in common was blisteringly good world pvp... Because it can be done an it has been done.

There were no shiny gravytrains back then because you got "gear" from lots of different places, but gear then was less about stats an more about looks.

[darth_knine]

yep, and you have to go out of your way to fly over to Ilum...so there has to be a reason why you go there

 

in something like SWG - you were already there, so it was easier to interact with others

 

 

....

 

how about instead of zones you have whole planets that can be conquered by one faction or the other and build stuff on them

 

and you actually have to fly to those planets (instead of loadscreens) so you have space combat getting there

 

and you can build space defenses, etc.

 

In SWG you could also fly to planets and fight along the way if you chose to do so...funny how all the SWG haters have been quiet since the reality of this game set in. It's like damn SWG wasn't so bad after all...

[ForceWelder]

Totally agree...I think with a few improvements Ilum could actually be good.

 

The key is what you mentioned - this has to be play tested.

 

A lot of the patch hate right now is from the fact that these patches haven't been tested well or the major glitches would've been noticeable.

 

Right now, a lot of that hate is justified until we can roll canned 50's or copy our characters to test - there's no way for us to test Ilum effectively right now otherwise, or any other level capped changes.

 

Give me a chance to copy over my 50 to a test server and I will gladly test anything Bioware wants. The problem is without this option it means rolling a character on a PVP server from 1 - 50 when population density is questionable at the best of times.

 

And I will be hanged if I am going to pay my money to Bioware just so I can push my way to max level just so I can further test their patches.

 

Meet your player base half way Bioware and you may be surprised by the reception you receive from those same players.

[AstralProjection]

The biggest thing I think that would help PvP, and should be fairly easy to implement (?), would be to take the city flipping of SWG and put it here, and then have like a World PvP panel in the codex or Mission Log that tells players all over the server who owns what cities, to make it competitive. When you see you're losing the WAR (this is Star Wars after all) because you own less cities, you're going to want to go take some cities. And the faction that owns the most cities gets XP buffs for all players that are currently leveling alts or newbies, as well as buffs to Damage/Healing/Mitigation.

 

How sweet would it be if you felt like you were actually fighting for something?

 

Hey Nwahs! Thanks for coming to add to the discussion. I totally agree - sometimes all it takes for meaningful world PVP is to feel like you're making an impact on the server, even if it's a temporary one that the enemy can overwrite.

 

Aside from the sandbox part of SWG, the Galactic Civil War was admittedly fun for most people because the universe actually felt like it was AT WAR.

 

Many people have slammed TOR for that since Beta on the forums, and since the NDA lifted in public. It would be nice to feel like we were at war outside of cutscenes.

 

Current game design makes it difficult to pull this off with certain areas off limits to other players, but even giving us this functionality in the "shared" areas of planets is better than nothing.

 

There was something fun about shuttling into a town to find it filled with a bunch of NPCs that attack you, and the occasional guerrilla PVPers. Factional pride would usually kick in and make people start flipping. There were so many points to control at any given time even with factional imbalance there was room for the underdog side to run around and get their victories in here or there.

[Sintifa]

Ill be honest, ive not read near enough of this thread to know if this has been posted, but i have read enough to get the general idea. An idea of mine that someone elaborated on yesterday somewhere on these forums was to be able to invade the opposing factions fleet.

 

The extended idea led into ideas of it being a random point during the week/weekend were an alarm can go off in your own fleet capital allowing access to a ship that is attacking the other factions fleet. You are dropped off on their fleet and you can actively pvp with a goal (kill a grand moff or something) for some reward (valor??)

 

Very basic idea that has a world of options - Obvs you would have the attacks at different times to each other, you can have a safe zone on the fleet where you cant be PVPd etc.

 

Something like this, in my opinion, would be great. It could happen more or less frequently or be advertised on forums a week in advance to give people enough notice where they should (or should not) be to take part.

 

 

Very brief idea but im on a very rushed lunch break

[AstralProjection]

It's a shame really too because many of the same players are here playing TOR. We could have excellent battles. I'm still hopeful though.

 

Thanks for posting guys...like I said earlier I agree with you...this has very little in common with SWG PVP, or other good systems that players were fond of.

 

You have the right attitude...if we stay hopeful and put out a helpful message to the dev community we can get some traction and see PVP be taken in a direction that's both fun and rewarding. Right now it just does the latter, and once you're geared up, nobody cares to do it anymore.

 

There *has* to be more to the game than gear. Period.

[AstralProjection]

Ill be honest, ive not read near enough of this thread to know if this has been posted, but i have read enough to get the general idea. An idea of mine that someone elaborated on yesterday somewhere on these forums was to be able to invade the opposing factions fleet.

 

The extended idea led into ideas of it being a random point during the week/weekend were an alarm can go off in your own fleet capital allowing access to a ship that is attacking the other factions fleet. You are dropped off on their fleet and you can actively pvp with a goal (kill a grand moff or something) for some reward (valor??)

 

Very basic idea that has a world of options - Obvs you would have the attacks at different times to each other, you can have a safe zone on the fleet where you cant be PVPd etc.

 

Something like this, in my opinion, would be great. It could happen more or less frequently or be advertised on forums a week in advance to give people enough notice where they should (or should not) be to take part.

 

 

Very brief idea but im on a very rushed lunch break

 

That's an excellent idea - as long as you keep it connected to the fleets, but not interrupting the quest/training/vendor hub that the fleet serves as it would be fine.

 

I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for guild v guild capital ship battles, but I'll believe it when I see it in yellow text ; )

[AstralProjection]

really funny thing is, you see all the wow generation saying that world pvp cant be done, world pvp si "unfair" world pvp "has never been done in anything but fail gamez" as they call it

Yet

 

UO the game was about killing those "Anti dogs"

Asheron's call the game was about killing Bloods...

 

There were no battlegrounds back then, Daoc was the first to bring in BG's unluckily (or unlucky) depending how you see it, they were great, but after that things fell apart.

The one tihng all these games had in common was blisteringly good world pvp... Because it can be done an it has been done.

There were no shiny gravytrains back then because you got "gear" from lots of different places, but gear then was less about stats an more about looks.

 

I hate to say it, but I kind of agree as I touched upon in my OP - not that gear itself is the problem, but WoW made it acceptable to take everything BUT the gear out of the game, and now that passes as an MMORPG.

 

The gear is harmless, as long as you give the world more depth than that. Right now gear is the only thing we have to care about. People don't world PVP on average in TOR because they want incentives. They can't protect their capitals or cities, just maybe intercept a few griefers at outposts here or there.

 

They can't build a permanent place in the world. As beautiful as the environments are (and I *love* the art guys, don't get me wrong), they aren't OURS.

 

Give us one or the other, a way to shape the PVP landscape, or a way to personalize the world as a guild or individual, and suddenly a whole new point to the game opens up.

 

Of course you're going to get flamed like crazy if a PVP daily quest isn't working, in Ilum or in a Warzone - because the only reason people are doing them is to get gear, and without the reward that gets you the gear, you're left with an angry player, and to some, a person that just wasted 15 minutes of their life.

 

Personally, I will run a warzone sometimes just for the sake of PVPing, but I'm not the norm. Most people are just doing it for their quest credit.

[AstralProjection]

yep, and you have to go out of your way to fly over to Ilum...so there has to be a reason why you go there

 

in something like SWG - you were already there, so it was easier to interact with others

 

 

....

 

how about instead of zones you have whole planets that can be conquered by one faction or the other and build stuff on them

 

and you actually have to fly to those planets (instead of loadscreens) so you have space combat getting there

 

and you can build space defenses, etc.

 

I agree. A lot of people are saying it's too much of a change and the game would need an overhaul - I really don't think so. The way they've put the game together could actually make it pretty simple.

 

Would it be that hard to shuttle to "Sandbox Zone #1" when you get to Ilum instead of "XXX Orbital Station" when you get to a planet?

 

It doesn't even have to share the same space as the main Ilum PVP playground and it would still be fun as long as we can build or to make the devs happier, *purchase* (I know you guys love credit sinks) buildings or defenses that we can attack and destroy (even if it's just a temporary destruction so you don't make people too mad, e.g. it's razed to the ground for a day, and comes back tomorrow).

 

I don't think *anyone* would miss the orbital stations, even though they do kind of make sense from a realism standpoint ; )

[ArcadesSabboth]

I grew up on Ultima Online and long for the freedom to fight anyone, anywhere in the world (town guards notwithstanding). I also miss PvP with consequence. However, I realize it's unrealistic that any game going forward would impose such harsh restrictions, so I'd settle for more FFA zones in SWTOR and would like to see incentives tacked on to populate them. I posted my own topic suggesting Ilum be remade similar to Outlaw's Den, but if Ilum's battleground in the western section of the zone isn't right for FFA given the bases, vehicles and lore, create an entirely new zone with:

 

- FFA fighting between imperials and republics

 

- respawning chests with basic rewards such as consumables/credits/commendations to give incentive for guilds/groups to hold specific areas for a time and not go without compensation in the event they go unchallenged.

 

- Add a nightly event with a chest that spawns ilvl 136-140 PvP epics but takes 60-120s channeled to open so that your guild/group has to successfully hold the area to reap the rewards. The nightly event would always happen at a set time, similar to WoW's Gurubashi Arena so players would know when to show up and it would be a feeding frenzy of PvP.

 

- In its essence, the FFA zone would be like a conquerable "town" that gives its occupants incentive to hold it down and remain there for a time

 

 

Very few people go to Outlaw's Den because the tangible rewards are almost non-existent and without a pre-planned time its not worth going out there just to stand around.

[AstralProjection]

I grew up on Ultima Online and long for the freedom to fight anyone, anywhere in the world (town guards notwithstanding). I also miss PvP with consequence. However, I realize it's unrealistic that any game going forward would impose such harsh restrictions, so I'd settle for more FFA zones in SWTOR and would like to see incentives tacked on to populate them. I posted my own topic suggesting Ilum be remade similar to Outlaw's Den, but if Ilum's battleground in the western section of the zone isn't right for FFA given the bases, vehicles and lore, create an entirely new zone with:

 

- FFA fighting between imperials and republics

 

- respawning chests with basic rewards such as consumables/credits/commendations to give incentive for guilds/groups to hold specific areas for a time and not go without compensation in the event they go unchallenged.

 

- Add a nightly event with a chest that spawns ilvl 136-140 PvP epics but takes 60-120s channeled to open so that your guild/group has to successfully hold the area to reap the rewards. The nightly event would always happen at a set time, similar to WoW's Gurubashi Arena so players would know when to show up and it would be a feeding frenzy of PvP.

 

- In its essence, the FFA zone would be like a conquerable "town" that gives its occupants incentive to hold it down and remain there for a time

 

 

Very few people go to Outlaw's Den because the tangible rewards are almost non-existent and without a pre-planned time its not worth going out there just to stand around.

 

Those are great suggestions, and would play to the current state of the game - that is, acquiring gear to improve your character. A lot of the changes I've suggested are larger scale, but that doesn't make them better.

 

I'm looking for good ideas like these that don't necessarily force the devs to rethink the whole MMORPG state of the union, and could be implemented fairly quickly (within a few months) as well. This fits that mold. As with anything we'd have to test it (Give us character copy to PTR please!), and make sure it wasn't exploitable but still do-able - but the idea has merit.

 

As long as objectives aren't in a straight line or centralized for the zone I think it would work. Until population imbalance is addressed, PVP zones need to spread out the population more. Zerg v Zerg battles bore people quickly or are outright disliked in most cases, and the servers can't handle them anyway.

 

I would also suggest tokens over an actual item - less chance for abuse or fighting for loot and ninjalooting among PUGs, etc. If you make the item too easily attainable it will just draw a massive zerg that will lag things down so much it will either be way too easy, or way too hard, to pull of that 60 second click. Stack 30 players on top of each other and it's pretty hard to target the one you want ; ) Huttball, anyone?

 

The PVP in this game is totally salvageable. I think the lack of attention toward it right now has to do with the fact that they'd lose way more subs if they didn't keep end-game instances coming, but I know Gabe knows there are issues and has seen these forums, and hopefully is taking some of these to heart as they're developing new zones and fixing current ones.

 

I've said it like 5 times in this thread, but I can't stress it enough, BioWare, we desperately need ways to properly test your end-game content. We're willing to do it. I have a job and kids though - there's no way I'm leveling a test character to 50 no matter how much I care about the game ; )

[Valmier]

The biggest thing I think that would help PvP, and should be fairly easy to implement (?), would be to take the city flipping of SWG and put it here, and then have like a World PvP panel in the codex or Mission Log that tells players all over the server who owns what cities, to make it competitive. When you see you're losing the WAR (this is Star Wars after all) because you own less cities, you're going to want to go take some cities. And the faction that owns the most cities gets XP buffs for all players that are currently leveling alts or newbies, as well as buffs to Damage/Healing/Mitigation.

 

How sweet would it be if you felt like you were actually fighting for something?

 

 

 

Absolutely agree, this would be far more rewarding and interesting than the usual eternal gear grind that drives PVP in several games (like WOW).

[catnipkiller]

Why do you need 1000 lazors flying arround the map? does this help the lag problems everyone has ? NO you just dont care, if you did care you would trash everything but the the control points to save your dieing game. Last nite in illum i was getting 2-7 fps and i have 2x 5870 2gb edtion that would go to 0-5% used due to HUGE server side lag. why cant u run the servers on better systems as it feels liem the servers are way too datted to run 100 man pvp runs. Lets get real now you think people will stay arround just to get 2 fps? O well Tera online or guild wars 2 will be out and there pvp will work so im just going to have to wait till then cuz BW dont care about pvp.

[AstralProjection]

Yeah, the game not working with nice hardware is a big concern catnip, I agree. A lot of times I don't blame the game developers as much as the hardware manufacturers - poorly written code is much more a mainstay of PC hardware developers than it is of big budget game developers. Drivers are notoriously poorly written, both in GUIs and the actual code that makes them work.

 

That's more of a discussion for another thread though - the lasers made the zone interesting for me, and don't seem to be the source of the lag from what I can tell - it's more the large groups of players and stacked visual effects. Turning down your visual settings for Ilum will help - more for dealing with ability effects than anything that needs to be done to cope with the battle in the background. It sounds like there's a bigger incompatibility at hand that the CS team will have to figure out in your case though, because you have a pretty solid system and there's no excuse for 1 FPS.

 

On a side note, I missed this from yesterday, but woot, at least they're listening somewhere about this stuff (from StephenReid):

 

"I wanted to also address concerns about the Public Test Server. We're working towards enabling character transfers so you can move your own character across and test new patches. Other ideas to allow the testing of high-level content have been explored, but ultimately character transfer is what we want to allow for everyone."

[Lostpenguins]

I'm not really against 2 faction system, but what really is world PvP? It's basically Ganking. It doesn't matter if it's 1 stealthed rouge versus someone questing or a group of 10 people grouped together picking off lesser numbers... it's ganking.

 

Am I against it? Not really. I've always played on PvP servers and don't rage/foam when someone kills me... over, and over, again. That's what I get for choosing PvP.

 

But the days of roaming PvP are dead. That died with:

Flying Mounts

Instanced Zones

Group teleports to dungeons

Segregated questing areas

 

In Rift and SWTOR you never even need to see the other side in open world after you're done questing. All instances are done from the safety your fleet. Even when I was leveling I almost never saw a Republic.

 

The only thing you can save is to make Ilum better. Where the purpose of the zone is to PvP. But the way it's built now, doesn't work.

 

Make rare nodes prevalent.

Make the zone smaller.

Add in NPC's for each side that can be used to complete quests and dailies.

Add in neutral NPC's that both side need to kill.

Resolve issues with faction imbalances. My idea is to set up Ilum sort of like WoW's Alterac Valley or Dota. Have waves of mobs be sent from each side. As the mobs move farther from their main base, they become weaker. That way, if the the Empire are pushing near the main camps base, they are facing Champion level mobs. That would be tough to deal with and help keep the Repubs from being pinned in their base.

[Lohengrin]

It's been mentioned a few times here, and I agree that DAoC would be a great model to follow - speaking from my own anecdotal perspective, DAoC was the MMO that got me into PvP. It was fun, engaging, and meaningful. The problem now - as with anything - is in implementation.

 

Three factions all but guaranteed that no single faction would dominate for a long period of time - on the server I was on Hibernians were underpopulated, Mids were the powerhouse, so we had an 'alliance' with Albion ... over time, Albion became the powerhouse so we allied with Midgaard, rinse, repeat. We became the powerhouse, and the others allied against us - it was fun, dynamic, and engaging! Unfortunately, I don't see how SWTOR could implement a third faction easily - it would mean new mirror classes, new voice acting, quests, etc. As great as I think it would be, I don't see it as a near-term fix.

 

Frontier battles and Relic raids also had meaning - it was NO small feat to take a relic, but the bonuses were worth it. If everyone in your faction globally got a x% exp bonus then you can absolutely be certain that when the invasion cry went out people would run to defend strongholds, chokepoints, etc. People would patrol planets looking for scouts, potential raids forming ... I don't know, maybe I'm an idealist or just old school, but the current mechanic of 'grind the daily/weekly for bags' is not much of a motivating factor. There is no faction pride, no sense of urgency, and the only thing it motivates me to do is roll more alts.

 

Anyways, that's my two credits worth ... for what it's worth

[Tacopx]

really funny thing is, you see all the wow generation saying that world pvp cant be done, world pvp si "unfair" world pvp "has never been done in anything but fail gamez" as they call it

Yet

 

UO the game was about killing those "Anti dogs"

Asheron's call the game was about killing Bloods...

 

There were no battlegrounds back then, Daoc was the first to bring in BG's unluckily (or unlucky) depending how you see it, they were great, but after that things fell apart.

The one tihng all these games had in common was blisteringly good world pvp... Because it can be done an it has been done.

There were no shiny gravytrains back then because you got "gear" from lots of different places, but gear then was less about stats an more about looks.

 

It was correctly implemented in DAOC. Sub 50's got to pvp and prepare themselves for lvl 50 pvp, keep sieges etc. After a certain level you couldn't join a BG anymore. I don't remember exactly what lvl that was anymore. I think 34-39 was the highest BG?

 

I've said a thousand times that world pvp cannot coexist in a game that also has an instanced pvp system. People will always choose the lazy route and click on the 'queue' button.

 

It also doesn't help that there is no meaningful reason outside of completing daily/weekly to pvp on Ilum. It is simply not fun and changes need to be made fast or BW will lose the interest of a lot of ppl that sub mainly for pvp.

 

Warzones get old quickly as well when 9 out of 10 matches are huttball. Once ppl hit rank 60 a lot of ppl only pvp for the BM bags or quit entirely.

 

Disappointing really because I can see a lot of potential in the game.

[tomroark]

Can it be saved?

 

Not with this dev team.

 

/unsubscribe.

[AstralProjection]

To Lostpenguins and Tacopx, I get where you guys are coming from, but one of the things I'm trying to discuss besides just "what is world PVP", is how to make it meaningful, and bottle the lightning again.

 

Games HAVE succeded in making it fun. It can be unfair at times, if the design is wrong, but there are ways to make players care about the game that don't involve gear, that's one of the biggest things I'm pushing in this thread. It can even work with two faction games with careful design, even though three makes it way easier.

 

Specifically, controlling, shaping, or having any say in the fate of your server makes people care. Warzones are to get gear, they're mostly fair fights, and that's where you go to PVP for items, the things that have some effect on your character. I see no reason why that can't coexist with meaningful PVP outside though.

 

There's more factional pride in these games than you'd think, even when we play both sides, we usually try to help the side we're playing on at the time. When players see cities or planets or zones under control of the enemy faction, there will be lots of players who seek out to take them back just for the sheer fun and realism of putting the War back in Star Wars.

 

Like I said at the end of the OP, I want BioWare to do some real surveying of the subscribers and find out what they want - City of Heroes did it all the time, and it had one of the happiest, most constructive communities I've ever played in. It gives you an honest idea of what the players want without saying "Nobody will PVP on the map if there are warzones". I respect that, but I disagree. I don't want to beat a dead horse, but getting gear isn't what makes PVP fun - it's one of the things that keeps players playing, but there are other ways to motivate beyond shinies. I guess I have more faith in people than a lot of us do on here.

 

Greed is a great human motivator, but for lots of us, there's a whole lot more to life than that ; )

Edited February 9, 2012 by AstralProjection

[Aethyrprime]

Check the suggestion link in my signature. Object based land control world pvp at it's finest. Either they do this or they lose us.

[Internicio]

Here’s my idea…nothing new really. The goal is to generate new missions and pvp opportunities.

 

Once you (probably a group such as a guild) complete a series of objectives (quests, pvp objectives, etc.) you unlock the ability to purchase an asset. There could be a variety of these assets such as mines, droid factories, trooper training grounds, sith holocron storage, whatever. Think “Guild A Droid Factory”. A stock, pre-defined layout would be fine, but being customizable would be even better.

 

This asset gets inserted into the world (or on one of many different available worlds) where everyone can interact with it. Immediately upon purchasing the asset a mission is generated for the opposing faction (or if it makes sense for rival groups in the same faction). This mission is to take out or shutdown the new asset.

 

To protect the asset you can defend it yourself or hire security. If it’s attacked, everyone in the guild gets a message that the facility is being attacked – being able to see it (through purchased security cameras, for example, would be even better) . Some mechanism should be put in place so this makes sense, such as the asset generates income that can be used to pay for the security guards, etc.

 

That’s the basics; it can easily get more complicated from there.

 

edit: And as mentioned in someone else's post, you could make the asset not permanently destroyed, but just so it has to respawn later.

Edited February 9, 2012 by Internicio

[AstralProjection]

Here’s my idea…nothing new really. The goal is to generate new missions and pvp opportunities.

 

Once you (probably a group such as a guild) complete a series of objectives (quests, pvp objectives, etc.) you unlock the ability to purchase an asset. There could be a variety of these assets such as mines, droid factories, trooper training grounds, sith holocron storage, whatever. Think “Guild A Droid Factory”. A stock, pre-defined layout would be fine, but being customizable would be even better.

 

This asset gets inserted into the world (or on one of many different available worlds) where everyone can interact with it. Immediately upon purchasing the asset a mission is generated for the opposing faction (or if it makes sense for rival groups in the same faction). This mission is to take out or shutdown the new asset.

 

To protect the asset you can defend it yourself or hire security. If it’s attacked, everyone in the guild gets a message that the facility is being attacked – being able to see it (through purchased security cameras, for example, would be even better) . Some mechanism should be put in place so this makes sense, such as the asset generates income that can be used to pay for the security guards, etc.

 

That’s the basics; it can easily get more complicated from there.

 

edit: And as mentioned in someone else's post, you could make the asset not permanently destroyed, but just so it has to respawn later.

 

That's a great idea - and similar to how supergroup base raids worked in CoH once they were implemented...in CoH once you had purchased X item for your base, which even gave a small buff to your group (guild), your base then became raidable and the opposite faction could choose to raid it from a list, and go in and destroy said buff item, basically. Your guild chose the hours you were raidable, IIRC, but it's been years. In CoH, since the item gave a buff, it would destroy those features but not the entire base. You could rebuild the item but it again became vulnerable to raiding at set times. As you said, we can also do temporary destruction which would be equally fun.

 

It was pretty fun when people actually did it - problem was that CoH didn't even add *PVP* until a couple years later with an expansion, so by the time it got in there too much fervor had died down and the game didn't have the population to make it a revolutionary, widely used feature.

 

I would love that, and like I said earlier, no reason new instanced "expansion" areas can't be accessible from Orbital Stations instead of landing on the quest shard...the modular way the maps are done in this game should make it easier to add player used/player editable zones, from what I can tell.

Edited February 9, 2012 by AstralProjection

[FodderofCannon]

Good discussion.

 

 

I think there are some really great ideas out there but I think we need to be a tad more realistic as to what can actually be accomplished in this game. I know a lot of you want a sandbox style pvp game (as I would as well) but I don’t think that’s terribly realistic given what we know about the game to date and what we should reasonably expect its direction to go.

 

I purpose that we think about this a little more like the devs actually have to think about it. We have to ask a slightly different question. We can all come up with great ideas, but in the end ideas are going to be the most practical for the current situation?

 

We need to establish a hierarchy of needs, and then decide what is most important and pressing that needs fixing/changing and that CAN BE REASONABLY DONE by the developers. A epic sandbox pvp game as much as I would love it is not going to reasonably happen. So we have to ask the hard questions:

 

What are most pressing issues in order of importance?

(note: not the only important things, but we should try to prioritize)

For me:

 

1) Zerg. This creates a horrible laggy game for most people, and its basically no fun any way. I know some people like the "freedom" of the zerg, but in reality its not fun for the vast majority of the player base.

 

2) Faction imbalance. This relates to zerg for my solution, as they are part and parcel of the same problem.

 

3) Purpose. Right now its just farming kills to get gear. Most of us agree this is not only dull as hell, but basically makes pvp a one trick pony with nothing to work towards as a community of pvp'ers.

 

4) Rewards. Gear is not enough for pvp. We need territory, or other sandbox related things that allow us to take ownership of the battle, instead of it being just a place to run around get your points and leave.

 

 

What are the best, and easiest to implement, solutions to these? Lets try think like economists, need to find the cheapest and the most effective fix.

 

Or do people have their own list of priorities that are different from mine?

Edited February 9, 2012 by FodderofCannon

[Ajudicated]

 

What are most pressing issues in order of importance?

(note: not the only important things, but we should try to prioritize)

For me:

 

1) Zerg. This creates a horrible laggy game for most people, and its basically no fun any way. I know some people like the "freedom" of the zerg, but in reality its not fun for the vast majority of the player base.

 

2) Faction imbalance. This relates to zerg for my solution, as they are part and parcel of the same problem.

 

3) Purpose. Right now its just farming kills to get gear. Most of us agree this is not only dull as hell, but basically makes pvp a one trick pony with nothing to work towards as a community of pvp'ers.

 

4) Rewards. Gear is not enough for pvp. We need territory, or other sandbox related things that allow us to take ownership of the battle, instead of it being just a place to run around get your points and leave.

 

 

What are the best, and easiest to implement, solutions to these? Lets try think like economists, need to find the cheapest and the most effective fix.

 

Or do people have their own list of priorities that are different from mine?

 

I agree with all the points that you bring up.

 

The thing that gets me personally is these are things that are so obvious. Unfortuantly BW and the game designers put there heads in the sand and hoped things as quoted would sort themselves out naturally. It hasn't, and I it wont unless a few key areas addressed.

 

There is another suggestion thread going around which is adevertised by BW community moderators that has some very good ideas for PvP.

 

Its very interesting to note though, all the ideas/issues in this thread are 80% the same issues/ideas in all other threads about PvP etc.

 

So we as a forumn/gaming community seem to all be reading the same PvP book and are on or around the same page.

 

BW/EA/Game Designers/Testers/, need to pick up the PvP book and catch up to where we all are.

[Gankdalf_]

Easy

 

Stop putting up barriers to keep factions apart on planets.

Lower the level of base guards

Put more quests in each others half of the planet

Stop putting Reps at one side of planet and Epm on other, sack the fool who did this.