Smash/Sweep 's 1 SECOND delayed animation despite being INSTANT.&Mara feeling rushed!

[Eltohan]

So, when in the mother of god's name are we gonna AT LAST being able to Smash people without praying NOT TO get knockback'd once on two tries average ??!

 

I do not deny the "skill" required for Assassins/Shadows - Sorcerers/Sages to use this wonderful ability, but the fact that EACH TIME we get bumped like a wet towel IT DOES NO DAMAGE (even if we get to smash the floor) and what's worse:

 

As Rage/Focus spec, the 4 stack buff is INDEED CONSUMED FOR NOTHING (not to say if you try to get a damage big enough to "burst your bubble" you use some adrenal and/or relic... to bad you lost 10 sec of setup for nothing)

 

It's good to "fix" delayed combat responsiveness (*cough* 10 fps in VoidStar against the door when all the crap is going on though *cough*) it's sad to see this issue still going on and NO WORD ABOUT THIS

 

There is so much knockback atm, how can you plan on how/when to smash people ? If you try to finish off people when they get packed, too bad, knock back. If you have to use your aoe stun (which contrary to some knockback/root and others stuns, does fill up the resolve bar ALOT) to then break it by using your smash it's stupid, cause this aoe stun is on a pretty large CD and cost 3 rage !

 

And when your teamates are also knockbacks-happy you can't smash anything except dead floor (that's another issue but not the same at all even if ... Smash would instead as advertised being freaking instant maybe will we see it do damage in this case)

 

I dunno, why letting Juggernauts being able to charge and being CC or knockback immune after that, but no, Marauders/Sentinels are too strong already (no they're not).

 

When I see Jugg/Guardians taking twice the time a Mara/Sent to be killed, it's sad indeed, especially when they can outdamage us in the same Rage/Focus spec

 

(hint: Decimate, first tier of Vengeance Tree: +30% flat damage increase dealt by Smash ability. Who cares about dual wielding lightsabers, you get 6% melee damage increase in the same tier, when we get woot ! 36% more 'damage' in our offhand (which is used in calculating the base damage of skills, this is subpar)...

 

Even the pseudo common skill tree is not identical... Not to talk about our lolbonus sets.

 

And on top of that, I see everyday Juggs in the Marauder's advertised look, you know that one:

http://swtorhumanrelations.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/sith-marauder1.jpg No one cares atm cause we're all in the same high end sets, but when we'll be able to extract the armor/expertise mods for eg., do you think I'm gonna use my so-called "marauder" robe of Black Talon ? The same skin being available in heavy armor flavour, how ironic.

 

Dunno why we have medium armor, there is no medium armor at light/dark side NPC vendor anyway (well there is for IA) /facepalm

 

Call me crazy, but the consensus on our server is that there is nearly never any STR loot anyway (not couting T1,T2,T3 tokens), and on top of that, why the hell would you differentiate it into TWO armor classes ? /sigh

 

Overall, it feels like our class was designed at the last minute, just like Operatives/Smuggler's healer spec

 

I hope some people can agree on this, and if not, well who cares.

 

 

ADDENDUM:

 

This is why Juggernauts can pump out much MORE damage in their Smash then Marauders :

 

http://i.imgur.com/c4BBY.jpg

 

 

No wonder you can do 7K crits as a Jugg/Gard when I struggle to get my 5K medal... You still get the +30% crit damage in force abilities (thus Force Scream, which hit quite hard already and you get to have a free rage one when Force Charging, and you get one Rage once each 6 sec via a talent in Rage tree too, wonder why this "common" talent tree isn't identical)

 

Thus; 1100 base damage. X2 for having 4 stacks of ShockWave. X2.25 for being crit (X1.95 cause you end up at 95% surge crit damage multiplier after a relic pop up, add to this 30% for being a force ability crit) X the whole by another 1.30 for Decimation.

 

Thus: 1100X2X2.25X1.3 =6430 hand down without counting POW Adrenal in which case it's even more imba:

(565 power= roughly 129 more base damage) 1230X2X2.25X1.3= 7195 !

 

No wonder Juggs/Gardians can do more damage in their Rage/Focus spec than a Marauder/Sentinel ... Design flaw for the win ?

Edited February 5, 2012 by Eltohan

[Gremin_DaHutt]

I agree fully. Whenever I go to sweep the enemy immediately recognizes this and will knock me back midjump and no damage occures. If its instant then the damage needs to be instant, not waiting until my sweep lands.

[GameNirvana]

I couldn't agree MORE!!!!! I'm so sick of Smashing before I get attacked but being stopped mid attack just because the ability isn't actually "instant". This is sooooo annoying. What's worse, is the move may or may not finish the animation and still not work, but then we are left waiting for it to come off CD.

[Kejiro]

stop crying you crit for 6-7k aoe. nuff said

[Barrechor]

Indeed, It happened just the other day in PvP. I was fighting 2 guys and got one to 5% HP and had built up my 4 stacks of singularity. Popped my pot and relic and hit my FS keybind.

 

He does the force sweep shuffle (Animation glitch), jumps up..... and I die mid air.

 

Instant my arse.

[MorgonKara]

Smash is a brutally powerful ability if you spec for it. AOE Force damage that cannot be defended. You just need to know how to time it right so you don't get knocked back.

 

For example; Charge - Intimidating Roar - Smash

Edited February 5, 2012 by MorgonKara

[Barrechor]

stop crying you crit for 6-7k aoe. nuff said

 

No one crits for 6-7k AOE you clown. For starters, the damage FS does differentiates between classes. Heavy armor guys will take less than 5k most times and thats a fully buffed FS (Exp boost/Relic/Adrenal).

 

The only people who will take a good 5-6k crit is a fresh 50 in light armor. Seriously, get your facts right before you spread your dumbarsed misinformation.

[Kejiro]

No one crits for 6-7k AOE you clown. For starters, the damage FS does differentiates between classes. Heavy armor guys will take less than 5k most times and thats a fully buffed FS (Exp boost/Relic/Adrenal).

 

The only people who will take a good 5-6k crit is a fresh 50 in light armor. Seriously, get your facts right before you spread your dumbarsed misinformation.

 

ORLY? maybe you should get your facts right before you spread your dumbarsed misinformation !

 

This is your proof and hes fighting without healer and without a chest... nuff said again?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BwLo3st0rqg

[Gremin_DaHutt]

I am fully aware of how to time it right, in fact I do not use the ability most of the time unless there is 2 or more enemy bunched up. I can understand watching 1 player for their CD's but the whole team is another matter. The ability says instant, and its not happening instantly is our issue.

[Idockdudes]

lol I have been in the shoes of the OP before, but my rage never brought me here.

 

Anyway with all of the ability delay/staggering issues I have on my knight I have been forced to change my playstyle to anticipate and mitigate the problem. I do pretty well and it only costs me a lit bit of performance.

 

I understand changing my playstyle and tactics to face certain classes or players. Its just kind of sad that I have to change the way I play to make up for a bad game.

[Eltohan]

Bumping this by the way.

 

This is why Juggernauts can pump out much MORE damage in their Smash then Marauders :

 

http://i.imgur.com/c4BBY.jpg

 

 

No wonder you can do 7K crits as a Jugg/Gard when I struggle to get my 5K medal... You still get the +30% crit damage in force abilities (thus Force Scream, which hit quite hard already and you get to have a free rage one when Force Charging, and you get one Rage once each 6 sec via a talent in Rage tree too, wonder why this "common" talent tree isn't identical)

 

Thus; 1100 base damage. X2 for having 4 stacks of ShockWave. X2.25 for being crit (X1.95 cause you end up at 95% surge crit damage multiplier after a relic pop up, add to this 30% for being a force ability crit) X the whole by another 1.30 for Decimation.

 

Thus: 1100X2X2.25X1.3 =6430 hand down without counting POW Adrenal in which case it's even more imba:

(565 power= roughly 129 more base damage) 1230X2X2.25X1.3= 7195 !

 

No wonder Juggs/Gardians can do more damage in their Rage/Focus spec than a Marauder/Sentinel ... Design flaw for the win ?

[Eltohan]

stop crying you crit for 6-7k aoe. nuff said

Stop spreading lies.

 

Max a Mara can get is 5K5 hands down.

 

1100 base damage. 1230 with a 565 power adrenal.

 

X2 for 4 stacks of ShockWave. X2.25 (95% surge crit damage mulitplier after a 225 surge relic, being at max 80% base multiplier by sacrificing accuracy to up my surge and 30% bonus crit damage on force abilities)...

 

1230X2X2.25 =5535, IF YOU CAN DO IT (knockbacks for the win)

 

Read my above post for why Juggs/Gardians are really OP compared to Mara/Sent.

 

Nuff said.

[MorgonKara]

Idn, it seems to me that all the classes deal with similar issues. The only abilities that don't seems to have some kind of animation delay are the instants that don't trigger the GCD. It's difficult to have quick counter-reactions in this game, you have to anticipate situations when you go into combat and know what abilities to use for each GCD. 9 times out of 10 when I get countered it seems more like luck than reaction.

[Barrechor]

ORLY? maybe you should get your facts right before you spread your dumbarsed misinformation !

 

This is your proof and hes fighting without healer and without a chest... nuff said again?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BwLo3st0rqg

 

lol one guy crits 7k against Light Armor fresh 50s. Hes running with Rakata stims/adrenals and is popping Expertise buffs like candy.

 

What you are saying is that he is the average player, which he is not. I could probably go find some vid off youtube showing a guy doing 5k crits with TM against light armor fresh 50s.

 

Or a video of Sorcs critting for 5k against a light armored fresh 50.

 

The video is quite clear, that he only hits for 3.5-4k with an average built FS against heavy armor, and hell hit for 4.5k average against light armor with a standard built FS.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble numbnuts but its not the class thats OP, its his stims and adrenals. Oh and those are getting nerfed again so, cya later.

[MorgonKara]

Bumping this by the way.

 

This is why Juggernauts can pump out much MORE damage in their Smash then Marauders :

 

http://i.imgur.com/c4BBY.jpg

 

 

No wonder you can do 7K crits as a Jugg/Gard when I struggle to get my 5K medal... You still get the +30% crit damage in force abilities (thus Force Scream, which hit quite hard already and you get to have a free rage one when Force Charging, and you get one Rage once each 6 sec via a talent in Rage tree too, wonder why this "common" talent tree isn't identical)

 

Thus; 1100 base damage. X2 for having 4 stacks of ShockWave. X2.25 for being crit (X1.95 cause you end up at 95% surge crit damage multiplier after a relic pop up, add to this 30% for being a force ability crit) X the whole by another 1.30 for Decimation.

 

Thus: 1100X2X2.25X1.3 =6430 hand down without counting POW Adrenal in which case it's even more imba:

(565 power= roughly 129 more base damage) 1230X2X2.25X1.3= 7195 !

 

No wonder Juggs/Gardians can do more damage in their Rage/Focus spec than a Marauder/Sentinel ... Design flaw for the win ?

 

Scream isn't free/low cost unless you spec points into Immortal.

Edited February 5, 2012 by MorgonKara

[Sir-Coffee]

lol one guy crits 7k against Light Armor fresh 50s. Hes running with Rakata stims/adrenals and is popping Expertise buffs like candy.

 

What you are saying is that he is the average player, which he is not. I could probably go find some vid off youtube showing a guy doing 5k crits with TM against light armor fresh 50s.

 

Or a video of Sorcs critting for 5k against a light armored fresh 50.

 

The video is quite clear, that he only hits for 3.5-4k with an average built FS against heavy armor, and hell hit for 4.5k average against light armor with a standard built FS.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble numbnuts but its not the class thats OP, its his stims and adrenals. Oh and those are getting nerfed again so, cya later.

 

This.

[Trivialed]

lol one guy crits 7k against Light Armor fresh 50s. Hes running with Rakata stims/adrenals and is popping Expertise buffs like candy.

 

What you are saying is that he is the average player, which he is not. I could probably go find some vid off youtube showing a guy doing 5k crits with TM against light armor fresh 50s.

 

Or a video of Sorcs critting for 5k against a light armored fresh 50.

 

The video is quite clear, that he only hits for 3.5-4k with an average built FS against heavy armor, and hell hit for 4.5k average against light armor with a standard built FS.

 

Sorry to burst your bubble numbnuts but its not the class thats OP, its his stims and adrenals. Oh and those are getting nerfed again so, cya later.

 

Actually if you watch the full video he kills some geared 50s with 5k+ crits as well. Also stims and adrenals aren't getting nerfed again they are just being able to be used by everyone who doesn't have biochem as well. Rakata's getting minor nerf but nothing that will stop those numbers from happening.

 

Sorry to say but maybe you need to get your facts straight.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Trivialed

[Eltohan]

ORLY? maybe you should get your facts right before you spread your dumbarsed misinformation !

 

This is your proof and hes fighting without healer and without a chest... nuff said again?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=BwLo3st0rqg

Just proved my point. Luciela is a Gardian (Jugg) thus getting a free 30% overall damage boost to Smash in his Vengeance tree. Mara/Sents get to dual wield (what a joke) thus max 5K5 damage.

 

Juggs/Gards can crit upto 7K2. Mara/Sent can't.

 

Juggs/Gards are CC-Knockbacks immune after a Force Charge/Obliterate. We aren't.

 

Juggs/Gards can push people 50 meters away. We can't.

 

Juggs/Gards wear heavy armor. We wear stupid medium armor (refer to why it's stupid for us not to wear heavy armor as well, being that there are only those two AC to wear STR gear... Wait there is neraly none of that gear except T1-T2-T3 anyway)

 

Like I said, stop spreading lies.

 

And like I said, MAra/Sent is a rushed designed class. Overall, Juggs/Gards are superior.

 

EDIT:

If you wore your glasses grandpa, he does indeed have a healer on his back at all time

Edited February 5, 2012 by Eltohan

[Barrechor]

Actually if you watch the full video he kills some geared 50s with 5k+ crits as well. Also stims and adrenals aren't getting nerfed again they are just being able to be used by everyone who doesn't have biochem as well. Rakata's getting minor nerf but nothing that will stop those numbers from happening.

 

Sorry to say but maybe you need to get your facts straight.

 

Not all biochem stuff is going to be usable by everyone, just PvE schem drop stuff. You will rarely hit any geared 50 with a 5k FS but it will happen once in a blue moon.

 

Oh and you do realise that the video is a montage right? Meaning hes took bits from all of his fights and put them together!?!?! People like you seem to be of the opinion that we all run around hitting guys for 7k all the time, which is complete fantasy. Every class gets lucky crits from time to time, this guy has just managed to record some of his for your viewing pleasure.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Barrechor

[MorgonKara]

Just proved my point. Luciela is a Gardian (Jugg) thus getting a free 30% overall damage boost to Smash in his Vengeance tree. Mara/Sents get to dual wield (what a joke) thus max 5K5 damage.

 

Juggs/Gards can crit upto 7K2. Mara/Sent can't.

 

Juggs/Gards are CC-Knockbacks immune after a Force Charge/Obliterate. We aren't.

 

Juggs/Gards can push people 50 meters away. We can't.

 

Juggs/Gards wear heavy armor. We wear stupid medium armor (refer to why it's stupid for us not to wear heavy armor as well, being that there are only those two AC to wear STR gear... Wait there is neraly none of that gear except T1-T2-T3 anyway)

 

Like I said, stop spreading lies.

 

And like I said, MAra/Sent is a rushed designed class. Overall, Juggs/Gards are superior.

 

EDIT:

If you wore your glasses grandpa, he does indeed have a healer on his back at all time

 

Roll a Juggernaut.

[Sir-Coffee]

Actually if you watch the full video he kills some geared 50s with 5k+ crits as well. Also stims and adrenals aren't getting nerfed again they are just being able to be used by everyone who doesn't have biochem as well. Rakata's getting minor nerf but nothing that will stop those numbers from happening.

 

Sorry to say but maybe you need to get your facts straight.

 

Let's see him get a crit over 5k+ without using Stims + Relics + Expertise buff. Exactly, he can't.

 

I am a Jugg in full Champion/battlemaster, and my highest crit was a 5600. While you are correct, in the form that he DOES actually get a 5k+ crit on a geared person.

 

It still doesn't change the fact that he is using buffs that everyone else can use. Therefore, every class is OP.

 

Find me 1 video of a Jugg getting a 5k+ crit on a guy with full expertise, and he doesn't pop ANY CD. Also, post a picture of the Juggs gear, since he has to change up his enhancements/mods so he can maximize his crit. Not every Jugg does this. Most just keep the gear they currently have, and don't change their useless stats.

 

Sorry to say, but maybe you need to get your facts straight.

[Eltohan]

Not all biochem stuff is going to be usable by everyone, just PvE schem drop stuff. You will rarely hit any geared 50 with a 5k FS but it will happen once in a blue moon.

 

Oh and you do realise that the video is a montage right? Meaning hes took bits from all of his fights and put them together!?!?! People like you seem to be of the opinion that we all run around hitting guys for 7k all the time, which is complete fantasy. Every class gets lucky crits from time to time, this guy has just managed to record some of his for your viewing pleasure.

Yeah I made a quick crappy HuttBall vid, where I could only crit for max once or twice 4K5 on quite geared people, then comments were like "noob do a montage we don't wanna see the whole warzone herpderp"

 

And now I see people using those montage vids like we can crit nonstop 7K +

 

I swear :

 

http://cdn.overclock.net/9/9b/9b02501a_dont-know-if-trolling-or-just-very-stupid.jpeg

[Lina_Inverse]

The sorc/sage and assassin/shadow knockback isn't instant btw. It has a similar animation/delay time as smash (I play both a 50 assassin and marauder). It's super annoying when you go in to knock a commando or merc or sniper off a ledge and they hit theirs while you're in mid animation because theirs is instant and your skill won't fire but will go on cd (so I know what you're talking about).

[Eltohan]

Let's see him get a crit over 5k+ without using Stims + Relics + Expertise buff. Exactly, he can't.

 

I am a Jugg in full Champion/battlemaster, and my highest crit was a 5600. While you are correct, in the form that he DOES actually get a 5k+ crit on a geared person..

Just prove my second point on Luciela's MMO-Champ thread, he shows bits of aoe, when he does get 7K crit by stacking all those buffs is against fresh ungeared light armor people (usually those that aren't in his focus, IE a sorc or assa in his back if you look closely)

[Eltohan]

The sorc/sage and assassin/shadow knockback isn't instant btw. It has a similar animation/delay time as smash (I play both a 50 assassin and marauder). It's super annoying when you go in to knock a commando or merc or sniper off a ledge and they hit theirs while you're in mid animation because theirs is instant and your skill won't fire but will go on cd (so I know what you're talking about).

Yeah I know buddy. Same issue. Those skills are labelled as instants but in fact you do some ninja's jumping in mid air animation

 

Fact is , 5 times on 10 tries you do get to knock us back without us being able to deal any damage thus wasting our CDs and buffs. It also seems that your knockback is a bit quicker though (and wider).

 

I remember on the upper "corridor" in huttball, when I was hopping one level down , and a sorc was doing his knockback on the upper one, I got bumped despited being on the lower level already (server latency FTW !!!

)

 

Anyway. They fixed the so-called ability delay, but we still play blind as you have to guess 1 sec in advance