malistyx Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) I mean do not get me wrong, there are many aspects of SWTOR I find innovative and fun, but PvP is just NOT one of them. To make things worse what I used to enjoy the most in MMOs was pvp... To elaborate, while the atmosphere of the PvP environments seems right both in WZ and Ilum, the mechanics and the gameplay are just not there... WZ are fun up to a point with a decent setup and typical scenarios (except huttball which is kind of new). Doing them over and over does make them boring eventually though and some current balance issues/bugs don't help either. Specifically I am really waiting on the ability delay issues... This is a game breaker for me being melee as if the skill does not fire when it should, the other is out of range and rotation is ruined and i am most likely dead... Keep in mind here that this issue can greatly differ depending on computer setup. Second issue is CC in general. Sure I play melee and it affects me the most but apart from that I still feel the analogy of CC vs Resolve bar vs CC immunity is not working well. PvP imo should be about player skill not about getting chain CCed and once your resolve is finally full, rooted to death... Personally instead of CCs I would much rather see the use of more snares/roots and snare/root breakers. Mobility control while your commands ARE available to you sounds more skillful than just watching your toon die being enable to do much... Still I have faith that the balances will be looked over and the bugs will be eventually solved. What seems to be the obstacle that cannot be passed is the past 50 gameplay... Ilum is just NOT working as intended. I am sorry but PvP bags is not a motivation for open world PvP. Not to mention that our open world pvp currently feels idiotic to say the least... 30 people on each side just sitting there, with only the ranged being able to shoot within range and the melee waiting for someone to get pulled so he can be torn apart by 30 people... lots of fun.... I play on PvP server but other than the 10-12 people i have fought while leveling in the open world... nothing differentiates this type of server from a PvE one. There is no incentive to PvP in the world and the world, once you are done with the story does feel like a golf course (as noted in another post). I used to play SWG and while that game had serious issues and was underpopulated, its endgame did shine over what we currently have. Please Bioware, you certainly have the resources, do something to make things more interesting. The pure themepark era is dying with WoW, try to be innovative past 50... Raising to cap to 60 and adding more gear and flashpoints IS NOT THE WAY.... Edited February 3, 2012 by malistyx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadNewzzz Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 30 people on each side just sitting there, with only the ranged being able to shoot within range and the melee waiting for someone to get pulled so he can be torn apart by 30 people... lots of fun.... I agree and i really hope they atleast try to fix this broken pvp that we have. But about ilum, I am assassin so i got my 4 meter range... What i do is i cloak, look for a group of reps 4-6 in their front line then i make a lacerate sometimes 2 and then i sprint and force cloak out from there. When the ppl i hit dies i got a kill score so i don't have to stay on ilum for too long even as melee. But calling that PVP? eew no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pairadox Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Warzones were actually fun pre 50. Well.. when they finally kicked all the 50's out. I enjoyed it.... and then I hit fifty... and this has been my experience: Go to illum or warzone. Try desperately to avoid the following situations: 1) Anyone in actual pvp gear. 1v1 your getting facerolled. 2) Avoid getting ganked by more than one person, again... facerolled. 3) Stealth, attack, get noticed, die in two seconds, because all the fifty's already have full cent/champ gear. Honestly, pvp has been a complete excercise in frustration. Permastunned. Dead. Permasnared. Dead. Grav Spammed fpr 15k in 5 seconds from 35m away, with no way to even get close enough.... The list goes on and on. Im confused. I honestly am. I played Warhammer pvp. It was actually fun. The Lakes, the objectives. It was great. Did they fire all of those people? And keep the people that couldnt design a decent pvp system? Because quite frankly, this pvp system sucks. Im actually really disappointed in bioware. I expected much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezis Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 This is not the pvp you were looking for...move along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubblegumYeti Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Im confused. I honestly am. I played Warhammer pvp. It was actually fun. The Lakes, the objectives. It was great. If you had high RR of course. If not... the same would have happened You would get slaughtered in seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campaigner Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Yeah the gear imbalance in this game is nothing compared to Warhammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genesis_Shadow Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 <snip>. I encourage you to continue trying to gear up, because honestly, once you're on a level playing field again the 50 PvP is awesome; bioware acknowledge the rate of gearing is off, and I'm sure a fix WILL come around (just hopefully not the one they are talking about, that'll just widen the gap) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdAraujo Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) 30 people on each side just sitting there, with only the ranged being able to shoot within range and the melee waiting for someone to get pulled so he can be torn apart by 30 people... lots of fun.... This... As I play Rep, usually there are 10-15 Reps against 25-30 imps (during the week, weekends the difference is bigger). I'm a JK Guardian (undergeared), so, basically the only thing I can do is throw my saber, wait cool down, throw saber again. Eventually, a melee imp will get bored and will dive into Rep mass and if I'm fast enough, I can hit him once to get valor. Sometimes I get bored, jump into imps mass and If I'm lucky, I can Awe some healers before I die. I almost enjoy the fight when we are defending Rep base, 'cause sometimes I get a chance do shoot the cannons a lil bit before being zerged. It's tough to melee Ilum. Tougher without stealth. Edited February 3, 2012 by EdAraujo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phadde Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 PvP IS a huge part of the Endgame in an MMO and it needs to work! Make the differences between full PvP-gear and whatever you wear when you hit 50 alot more even! It's suppose to be competitive, not a matter of "Gearscore"! Leave that crap to PvE, where it actually works! Not to be an annoying fanboy, but look at Guildwars 2; You enter a PvP-match where everyone gets temporarily boosted to 50 and gains ALL skills (and talents, but that works less complicated in that game). Everyone starts with the same benefits (Apart from class). Also, the maps seems to be too small and the "high" maxhealth makes it more of a matter to have more teammates backing you up than the other when engaging someone in combat! -Small maps means that people WILL cluster up and join a fight very easily and very quickly. -High maxhealth makes Rotation>skillbased attacks and makes a bigger crowd a Huge advantage! Where the hell is the competitive PvP? I can't find any! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chado_ Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Open world pvp is a myth. I've played every mmo under the sun for pvp and people just don't do it with any consistency, regardless the size of the carrot. People just don't like losing mmos are, by design, all about getting yourself quantitative advantages. There is a reason people do instances, constrained pvp and call of duty till the cows come home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jestunhi Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 FYI I enjoy both warzone queues. Illum I tolerate for the daily most days, but if I chose not to I'm sure I could earn enough comms to buy a bag if I spent the same amount of time in warzones - so I don't lose out from not doing the daily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Efir Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 My vanguard is currently level 47, so im keeping up to date on all this 50 stuff. I have to be honest here, im not looking forward to it as much as i should be. I love the game so far, so hoping that im not disappointed when i get to 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdAraujo Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 PvP Wz < 50 are awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUKimster Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 It's not that kind of a game where skill is the only difference you have between players. I'm very sorry, but you will never find THAT kind of pvp here, gear always matters. Although there is, of course, a factor of skill, since there are loads of rubbish PVPers who still can't do much even in their full champ sets they got out of pure luck. As for the champ-geared 50s against the new 50s, the problem is that lots and lots of players somehow expect to jump into the 50s bracket with their 40-45 greens/blues and immediately start winning. When i levelled my main, there was no 50s bracket and i had to fight geared champs ALL THE TIME, not just when i hit 50. My advice is: don't despair and rage and don't drop PVP altogether. Take your time to find good PVE gear, look for the right mods on the GTN, read up on what stats combinations are better for your class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadNewzzz Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Open world pvp is a myth. I've played every mmo under the sun for pvp and people just don't do it with any consistency, regardless the size of the carrot. People just don't like losing mmos are, by design, all about getting yourself quantitative advantages. There is a reason people do instances, constrained pvp and call of duty till the cows come home. I think you have missed a game called EVE. There is a lot of very good open world fights, everything from 1 v 1, to 1k v 1k all the time and best gear does not always win. Send me a PM if you want a 3 weeks invite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chado_ Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 I think you have missed a game called EVE. There is a lot of very good open world fights, everything from 1 v 1, to 1k v 1k all the time and best gear does not always win. Send me a PM if you want a 3 weeks invite. I played eve for a long time. If you call gate camps and 4 hours of searching for every one good fight good pvp we've got different definitions of good open world pv. Also, eve fights are won in the fitting station, and knowing when to run. Beyond knowing what you're fighting there's very little real time skill involves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetflair Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 I never to go to Ilum. All gear I have is from Warzone commendations. My simple tactics in every game has been that I play as much as possible as very weak player. That forces me to optimize my talent trees and use abilities really well. So when I grind in Warzones medals I have very progressive development. First its pretty awful then I get better. When I get better with class in PVP I also get better gear. Longer I grind the better the results are. Same time I learn each battleground/wz inside out. Like chinese say, calculate thousand times but cut once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazdryk Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Mass PVP sucks in this game because there are no true tanks. In warhammer 2 healers could keep a tank up against 15 people. You need some way to break the ice and get mele across that 30m gap. Following a tank in warhammer helped a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctournys Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 I think you have missed a game called EVE. There is a lot of very good open world fights, everything from 1 v 1, to 1k v 1k all the time and best gear does not always win. Send me a PM if you want a 3 weeks invite. ... and yet, CCP quoted the brutality and unfairness of the PvP as the second biggest reason people cancel their EVE accounts and never come back, not once, but four times, during their roundtable panels at Dragon*Con this year... right before anouncing that they were firing all 200 employees at the Atlanta CCP office, cancelling the WoD MMO, and curtailing White Wolf's publishing business because they were bleeding money faster than a hemopheliac with an artery cut loses blood. The problem with World PvP is World PvP. it's never about fair, it's about getting zerged, and it has been in every game since UO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werewookie Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 The thing I most wish had been salvaged from Warhammer was the Dual Target system. For those who didn't get to play, you had an offensive and a defensive target at all times. This allowed a LOT of heals to work by draining the enemy. Incidentally, it also made it a touch easier to keep track of your charges if you were a tank or healer. It's probably well past the time they could patch in something like that though. The other big things Warhammer had that encouraged Open World PVP were the shifting course of the battles (pushing the enemy back would alter the Battlegrounds available and change the zone you were fighting in) the fort offense/defense that concentrated players, and player collision that allowed tanks to be meat walls in the most literal sense. Of course, they never could fix the imbalances both faction and class wise there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ireniicus Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 I agree with the OP...constructive comments and well articulated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noctournys Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Warzones were actually fun pre 50. Well.. when they finally kicked all the 50's out. I enjoyed it.... and then I hit fifty... and this has been my experience: Go to illum or warzone. Try desperately to avoid the following situations: 1) Anyone in actual pvp gear. 1v1 your getting facerolled. . Stop PvPing in the level 40 greens you were leveling in. There is ZERO excuse for anyone, even a guy who just hit 50 two days ago, to be in anything but head to toe purples. Do your dalies. Spend a little cash on the GTN DONE. BETTER gear than Centurion PvP gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nerfAvari Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 Open world pvp is a myth. I've played every mmo under the sun for pvp and people just don't do it with any consistency, regardless the size of the carrot. People just don't like losing mmos are, by design, all about getting yourself quantitative advantages. There is a reason people do instances, constrained pvp and call of duty till the cows come home. dunno, swg pvp on my server when i played was amazing, the only thing to ruin such a great game was, well..the devs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Assaultrooper Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 What exactly were youb expecting? Right now u get 3 awesome warzones that get old with time, but wow has about 9 bgs that get old with time :s I mean u can't expect them to make a rand warzone generator so that evrytime its "fresh". As for ilum pvp its old school world pvp at its best (or worse) 99 percent of the timr its stupid, alliance (reps) sitting next to their boss. But sometimes it gets to really shine when they finally manage to push u back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tifski Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 dunno, swg pvp on my server when i played was amazing, the only thing to ruin such a great game was, well..the devs Or the fact that SWG was bleeding players to WoW from day one. The devs tried to save something that wasn't any good to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts