toastmuffin Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Hi, what is your ideal way to optimize Pyro burst? Assuming we have 30% crit/80% surge with access to both Power/Crit Adrenal and Crit+Surge/Power Relic. With Explosive Fuel (25% increase in crit chance), should i be stacking power and using crit/surge relic or just pure Power(including relic) and use base crit+EF? @10-15m (leaving out trinket/adrenals) My Rotation is Incendiary Missile ->Thermal Detonator->Rail Shot->Flame Burst->Railshot if procced if not, Rocket Punch ->TD Explosion->Finish with RNG Railshot from Rocket punch. Edited February 3, 2012 by toastmuffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vauleen Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Hi, what is your ideal way to optimize Pyro burst? Assuming we have 30% crit/80% surge with access to both Power/Crit Adrenal and Crit+Surge/Power Relic. With Explosive Fuel (25% increase in crit chance), should i be stacking power and using crit/surge relic or just pure Power(including relic) and use base crit+EF? @10-15m (leaving out trinket/adrenals) My Rotation is Incendiary Missile ->Thermal Detonator->Rail Shot->Flame Burst->Railshot if procced if not, Rocket Punch ->TD Explosion->Finish with RNG Railshot from Rocket punch. That's pretty much the rotation. Owing to the fact that we can't predict Railshot procs that's basically as optimal as it gets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevvy Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I always stack Power. My crit/surge is about 30%/80% so everything goes into Power. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I always stack Power. My crit/surge is about 30%/80% so everything goes into Power. ^ I sit at 39% Crit / 81% Surge (Tech). Power Adrenal + Power Relic = Ownage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dharagada Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I hate you all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevvy Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I hate you all. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dharagada Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Mainly cause I still haven't managed to get my crit and surge that high and it's annoying me and I'm jealous . Edited February 3, 2012 by Dharagada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) A lot of times I feel my power is low (lol +66 power). But having such high crit rate and damage seems to make up for it. (Fully buffed I sit around 45% Crit). I do have to figure out how to squeeze in an extra 1.5% accuracy though to get cap Run BP A Lot. Combat Tech Gaunts have a nice crit/surge enhancement you can pull out of them. (That's what I did for a lot of pieces and BP is a joke of a flashpoint anyways) Edited February 3, 2012 by exphryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevvy Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 Mainly cause I still haven't managed to get my crit and surge that high and it's annoying me and I'm jealous . Oh, gotcha. Well, I've been pretty fortunate with this toon as far as bags go. Much better than my first 50. So I know how it is. A lot of times I feel my power is low (lol +66 power). But having such high crit rate and damage seems to make up for it. (Fully buffed I sit around 45% Crit). I do have to figure out how to squeeze in an extra 1.5% accuracy though to get cap Run BP A Lot. Combat Tech Gaunts have a nice crit/surge enhancement you can pull out of them. (That's what I did for a lot of pieces and BP is a joke of a flashpoint anyways) I'm still sketchy on the Accuracy cap. You want 105% Tech Accuracy? And what happens once you reach the cap? Certain abilities become undefendable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACMessiah Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) I use rocket punch before flame burst, as it has a 45% chance to proc rather than 30%. Other than that that's the same rotation I have. Accuracy is a tricky one for us, as all of our abilities use tech, except for rail shot which uses ranged accuracy. So getting ranged accuracy up to 100 might be necessary. I haven't had the gear to test whether or not it's worth it. Edited February 3, 2012 by ACMessiah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sevvy Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) I'm a derp sometimes. Edited February 7, 2012 by Sevvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theangryllama Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 I use rocket punch before flame burst, as it has a 45% chance to proc rather than 30%. Other than that that's the same rotation I have. Accuracy is a tricky one for us, as all of our abilities use tech, except for rail shot which uses ranged accuracy. So getting ranged accuracy up to 100 might be necessary. I haven't had the gear to test whether or not it's worth it. It's actually to better to throw a flame burst in before the rail shot if you can imo. This is because rail shot automatically refreshes CGC when it hits thus giving you a chunk of extra damage on your rail shot from that first instant tick of CGC which depending on health and what you have popped at the time can be anywhere from 400-1000 extra elemental damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericdjobs Posted February 3, 2012 Share Posted February 3, 2012 (edited) Eh? Power has no DR... so it really is the best.. but you need your crit/surge at certain levels if you're going for PVP burst and not sustained pve damage. What is with people stacking crit? Your crit should be nowhere near 39%.. if it is, you are WASTING a lot of stats because of diminishing returns. The DPS gains you are getting from the increase in crit are far below what you would gain from going with power.. use a spreadsheet and see for yourself. Crit has a very low stat weight for pyro powertechs. Right now my Pyro powertech is sitting at 31.5% tech crit, 25% ranged crit 89% Critical Multiplier 412 Power Damage stats are: Tech: 674 Bonus Damage Ranged: 386 Bonus Damage Tooltips: Railshot: 1568-1896 base TD: 1937-1993 base FB: 895-961 base ACCURACY IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR PYROTECHS FOR PVE DAMAGE, remember this. Not only is it important because railshot is one of our main sources of damage.. it's also important because if you have a railshot dodged/deflected you totally **** yourself on heat.. even from the free ones (Because you don't vent 8 heat)... again accuracy is very, very important.. I'm still trying to figure out where it sits in relation to other stats.. and how much you should sacrifice to get it.. but it's very important! After 100% accuracy it simply reduces the target defense (not armor, that's a myth).. Defense is basically miss.. it's labled as dodged/deflect depending on the class. Railshot is a weapon damage attack so it uses ranged accuracy. The initial hit roll is accuracy vs defense, so any accuracy over 100 simply reduces the defense # of that roll. Accuracy rating is at about 256 right now. Edited February 3, 2012 by ericdjobs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mhak Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) When you explosive fuel, the adrenal that gets you the most band for your buck is the Rakata Surge Adrenal. In fact, if you're pyro and in full champ eliminator, surge adrenal is really always going to be your best bet because of the naturally high fire/RS crit chance you have. Popping Power adrenals I noticed my TDs and RSs critting in the low-mid 4ks, popping Surge Adrenals I've broken 5k with both skills. Add a power relic and it gets to mid-5ks. A Surge Adrenal + Power relic popped with Explosive Fuel has yielded silly results before with the TD > FB > RS combo. Those 3 moves are more than enough to kill people by themselves with all the listed things popped at once. 2k FB + 1k CGC, then a 5.5k TD + 5.5k RS + 1k CGC all hitting at once. Good night to nearly any fresh 50. In PvP gear they'll be at 10-20%. Edited February 4, 2012 by Mhak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACMessiah Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 It's actually to better to throw a flame burst in before the rail shot if you can imo. This is because rail shot automatically refreshes CGC when it hits thus giving you a chunk of extra damage on your rail shot from that first instant tick of CGC which depending on health and what you have popped at the time can be anywhere from 400-1000 extra elemental damage. Thanks, that makes sense now you've said it. I'll try and adjust to that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agroovesak Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 IMO: Power>surge>crit You do want a decent amount of surge, but BM implants+offhand+1-2 crit/surge main pieces is fine. After that, get crit to about 30% with IA buff and go full power imo. Surge starts hitting pretty big DRs quickly. I'm still kind of up in the air about accuracy for pvp. It only matters for rail shot, but RS is a big part of pyro's damage. The stats you lose to get 105% ranged accuracy are a lot though. =( Still kind of testing for exact setup. What my current plan is: BM elim implants/ear/belt/oh/wrist/mh. BM crit+surge relic and aim matrix cube. 4 piece columi (no access to rakata) combat tech all modded for max accuracy+power. 1 BM main piece with crit+surge modded. Aim stim + power adrenal or warzone pots depending on which adds more damage. (I'm guessing warzone pots.) As far as burst combo goes: IM->TD->FB->RS->RP You want the flame burst in there for a few reasons. One it gets CGC rolling which means you get an additional 400-1k on the rail shot. The other reason is it lets your RS hit at the same time as your TD goes off which means less time to react for healers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 (edited) One thing I've been fiddling with yesterday and today so far that has worked fairly well is: Dropping some of my BM Pieces (helm/legs/feet/glove) which has me lose about 2.5ish %damage/reduction form the Expertise loss. Replacing it with Columi Combat Tech gear. (for 8% Rail Shot Damage and a lot more Aim for even more padding on that, as well as a bit more endurance) -- Some enhancements switched out to some power/surge ones i had. (Rail Shot Tooltip has it at about 1875 Max damage) Crit, with IA Buff/Aim Stim/Sorc Buff hovers around 40% Which is still fairly high without the 15% Bonus from the Elimin set. While I don't get Rail Shot Crits "guaranteed" about like my PvP Set, they hit SO much harder and the added power/aim help TD Crits that much more. Been getting a lot more frequent 5k+ hits (with adrenal/trinket) then I ever have. Up to near 5.5K a few games in a row. I did change my playstyle up a bit though and don't try to take *everything* 1v1 since lets face it, that Crit bonus was amazing. But I find having the "sustained" helps against classes I previously struggled against (Maras) and then if I get a td/rs crit together it's pretty funny. Will play around a bit with this set a bit more to see how it goes before i decide to keep or go back to PVP Set bonus. Edited February 5, 2012 by exphryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toastmuffin Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 One thing I've been fiddling with yesterday and today so far that has worked fairly well is: Dropping some of my BM Pieces (helm/legs/feet/glove) which has me lose about 2.5ish %damage/reduction form the Expertise loss. Replacing it with Columi Combat Tech gear. (for 8% Rail Shot Damage and a lot more Aim for even more padding on that, as well as a bit more endurance) -- Some enhancements switched out to some power/surge ones i had. (Rail Shot Tooltip has it at about 1875 Max damage) Crit, with IA Buff/Aim Stim/Sorc Buff hovers around 40% Which is still fairly high without the 15% Bonus from the Elimin set. While I don't get Rail Shot Crits "guaranteed" about like my PvP Set, they hit SO much harder and the added power/aim help TD Crits that much more. Been getting a lot more frequent 5k+ hits (with adrenal/trinket) then I ever have. Up to near 5.5K a few games in a row. I did change my playstyle up a bit though and don't try to take *everything* 1v1 since lets face it, that Crit bonus was amazing. But I find having the "sustained" helps against classes I previously struggled against (Maras) and then if I get a td/rs crit together it's pretty funny. Will play around a bit with this set a bit more to see how it goes before i decide to keep or go back to PVP Set bonus. Saw your burst video today. Quite a different setup from the rest. Is your choice of PvE gear and the trinket/relic the reason of this(burst)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 (edited) Saw your burst video today. Quite a different setup from the rest. Is your choice of PvE gear and the trinket/relic the reason of this(burst)? Yeah, sorta. That video was just to show some "max" Burst potential getting lucky with crits and having all your clickies on. If you were to watch the huttball video I posted today you see *similar* (i.e 400-800 less per attack, but still 4k+ Rail crits) burst without trinkets/adrenals. On top of the Rail Shot damage increase, I gain (currently with my gear that is) 60 AIM which isn't nothing to sneeze about in terms of increasing some damage potential, while wearing my T2 PvE Gear. I'm hoping with the new BM Bag change and geting 15 Champ Commendations I can buy a lot of the Agent gloves for their sexy high end/power/surge enhancements and retry the eliminator set again. Edited February 7, 2012 by exphryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Beastwood Posted February 25, 2012 Share Posted February 25, 2012 It's actually to better to throw a flame burst in before the rail shot if you can imo. This is because rail shot automatically refreshes CGC when it hits thus giving you a chunk of extra damage on your rail shot from that first instant tick of CGC which depending on health and what you have popped at the time can be anywhere from 400-1000 extra elemental damage. No it isn't. You waste a potential refresh on railshot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theangryllama Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 No it isn't. You waste a potential refresh on railshot. Err flame burst isnt on a cooldown so there is nothing stopping you using it after anyway so there is absolutely nothing wasted (this given burst tends to be followed by a rocket punch then flame bursting fishing for procs anyway). Also if it procs your still getting the benefit of the heat reduction. Your phantom proc chance is not worth the guaranteed 2k+ damage you've just lost from the extra 2 damage tick of CGC and flame burst over just using incendiarys debuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hupepak Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 No it isn't. You waste a potential refresh on railshot. Im not understanding what you mean. Flame burst also refreshes railshot right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hupepak Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 Yeah, sorta. That video was just to show some "max" Burst potential getting lucky with crits and having all your clickies on. If you were to watch the huttball video I posted today you see *similar* (i.e 400-800 less per attack, but still 4k+ Rail crits) burst without trinkets/adrenals. On top of the Rail Shot damage increase, I gain (currently with my gear that is) 60 AIM which isn't nothing to sneeze about in terms of increasing some damage potential, while wearing my T2 PvE Gear. I'm hoping with the new BM Bag change and geting 15 Champ Commendations I can buy a lot of the Agent gloves for their sexy high end/power/surge enhancements and retry the eliminator set again. hey man can you post the spec you use? thanks much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exphryl Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 (edited) hey man can you post the spec you use? thanks much appreciated. http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#3010MZMsZfhrbdGGMs.1 You can move two points out of Energy Rebounder, or Vent Heat if you want. That is more of a personal preference thing to have both for me. Edited February 26, 2012 by exphryl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creatineted Posted February 26, 2012 Share Posted February 26, 2012 honestly i sit at 544 power 107 crit and 393 surge my crit % is 19% surge 78% and power as high as i can possibly get and i noticed every warzone my damage is substantially higher than it ever was when i stacked crit and surge was at around 28% crit for pvp i thought playing at 19% crit would be sketchy but its not as bad as one would think due to the railshot set bonus of 15% so my crits are topping 5k almost ever game at leats once and my damage numbers in huttball are now always consistantly in the 450k-600k range i guess some of it is preference but i just thinking stacking power benefits you much more increasing the damage of every ability you use I'm stilll playing around with some stuff but imo stacking power/surge > than stacking crit/surge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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