outraged at exotech being better then rakata (stims)

[Sylriana]

I think Rakata should be on par with Exotech, it makes the most sense...maybe if Exotech was so ridiculously prohibitive as to not be practical for regular use, but they aren't.

 

I do however, disagree with the people saying that Biochem should remain as it is on live and every other profession should be buffed up to the same level:

 

Crafting should be its own thing, not a mandatory requirement for everyone who wants to raid or PvP seriously. Balancing crafting that way is incredibly lazy and very poor design (because it doesn't actually do anything to make crafting itself good, it just tacks on some important skill bonus and makes crafting a means to an end rather than an end in and of itself).. so in that respect nerfing Biochem the way they are is a good thing.

[maxbaby]

I agree that Biochem needs to be nerfed but not to the Energized level.

 

I am Biochem. I supply raid with stims. I am collecting Exotech schems in ops atm.

So in close future I will be supplying my group with Exotech schems.

 

Don't you think that while supplying my friends with +128 main stat I will be sitting on my reusable Rakata with -16 main stat.

No, I will not. I will make myself 2 stims for the evening and be on par with with everyone for better performance.

Edited February 4, 2012 by maxbaby

[Soluss]

I think Rakata should be on par with Exotech, it makes the most sense...maybe if Exotech was so ridiculously prohibitive as to not be practical for regular use, but they aren't.

 

I do however, disagree with the people saying that Biochem should remain as it is on live and every other profession should be buffed up to the same level:

 

Crafting should be its own thing, not a mandatory requirement for everyone who wants to raid or PvP seriously. Balancing crafting that way is incredibly lazy and very poor design (because it doesn't actually do anything to make crafting itself good, it just tacks on some important skill bonus and makes crafting a means to an end rather than an end in and of itself).. so in that respect nerfing Biochem the way they are is a good thing.

 

As soon as the proposed changes go into effect with end game extractable mods and critable orange gear... synthweaving and armormech will be the must haves. They will be far ahead of where biochem currently is. They are already on par with the rakata gear + augment slots they can make.

 

I hope all you QQ'ers crafts get nerfed so you can no longer augment rakatas. I mean hey... its not fair to have a stat advantage is it?

 

All you QQ'ers do is get fun games nerfed to oblivion.

Edited February 4, 2012 by Soluss

[Voyle]

I don't get the money making argument, it's not like credits are overly useful in this game unless you're wiping on raids every 5 minutes or respeccing every day.

[Kirin]

I think it's ridiculous that any crafted item requires a certain craft and skill level to use. It really makes no sense when you think about it.

 

If crafts give statistical advantages to only the crafter, then they also have to be balanced so that all crafts are viable. Otherwise everyone goes Biochem or whatever else the FOTM craft is, and that's never fun. There's no point in having crew skills if only one is considered competitive.

 

I think Bioware should just remove the crew skill requirements on every item that has them, and allow crafters to trade everything they can make. That way, no craft ever becomes required because you don't need crafting ranks to use anything.

[Zatanic]

As soon as some more useful craft shows up its time to swap, for everyone who wants to be at the top of the foodchain. Simple as that.

 

Now you get max use from biochem without having it so there is no reason to have it, if something else can give another benefit.

[MaxDeeps]

I think they are thinking wrong with this change - every profession needs to have a tiny stat bonus for being max level - and the rakata stims are currently only a tiny bit better - what will happen is once they give cybertech and other professions there own bonuses biochem will be the worst crew skill lol

 

...

 

 

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

An infinite use stim that has worse stats than one you can buy still has worse stats. So then what's the point of Biochem? Nothing. A guild will need 1 or 2 to get Exotech patterns to make stims for the guild and that's it.

 

You aren't balancing Biochem, you're making it undesirable. You're making it into Cybertech or Armstech. Make the Rakata stuff as good as the Exotech stuff.

[Soluss]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

An infinite use stim that has worse stats than one you can buy still has worse stats. So then what's the point of Biochem? Nothing. A guild will need 1 or 2 to get Exotech patterns to make stims for the guild and that's it.

 

You aren't balancing Biochem, you're making it undesirable. You're making it into Cybertech or Armstech. Make the Rakata stuff as good as the Exotech stuff.

 

I think the best point was made by someone a page ago. I really dont even see how you can argue against it. If you are biochem why even bother with a reuasable when you will be making the exotech for everyone else anyways. Its nothing to make 2 extra.

 

There is no logic in having it be the same stats as a the consumable one. Its a poorly thought out nerf due to the cry babies on the forums. The first nerf was ok but this one is over the top.

 

If it is to go through then you need to give us rakata implants that we can crit augment on to compensate. Otherwise Synth, armor are the new FOTM and are far better then biochem.

 

You are taking the wrong direction with the constant nerfs to meaningless crap. 8 stat difference is not OP when compared to the 2 rakata pieces that can recieve 56 stat difference then everyone else. Not to mention when orange gear is critable and base mods are extractable from endgame armor. Biochem may have been viewed the best craft to people at the time but it is now the worst ... next to slicing of course.

 

Really Bioware... you cannot keep nerfing crafts and classes into uselessness. Which is basically what you just did. Now that synth and armor will be the best crafts to have, are they doomed for nerfage next? Do you see the down hill spiral?

Edited February 5, 2012 by Soluss

[SageH]

Yup because you get the Rakata right from the trainer, and only requires you to leach off a Ops to get the materials to craft it, and then you never have to craft them again, ever. That's pretty big savings, not only in credits but time too.

 

Time? You can craft while your asleep. Poor arguments are still poor.

 

Honestly, I don't think BW has any idea what they are going to do to salvage their crafting system. Because they don't, they are in panic mode because everyone plays the "Biochem is required for raids!!!!!" card. Raids in this game are so easy, a cave man could do it. Nothing in this game is "required" for raiding. You can walk into a raid immediately after hitting 50 and successfully complete it with an entire group of fresh 50's. I know, we did it.

 

All this blown out of proportion non-sense needs to stop. BioChems who spent their time/money leveling up their professions deserve their items being a tier above everyone else. I'm not going to get Rakata Bracers/Belt with +61 extra stats unless I drop BioChem and go Synthweaving so why are they getting my better stims?

 

BW has no discernible direction or design philosophy outside of taking a hammer to what works to pull the spotlight off what isn't working.

 

Basically, what BW is advocating is this. Start with Artificing and craft your Rakata relics with augment slots, then drop that and work up Synthweaving and crafting your amazing bracers/belt and then drop that and pick up BioChem. That way you'll have every advantage possible and then no one has to complain about what other professions get.

[SageH]

Couldn't have said it better myself.

 

An infinite use stim that has worse stats than one you can buy still has worse stats. So then what's the point of Biochem? Nothing. A guild will need 1 or 2 to get Exotech patterns to make stims for the guild and that's it.

 

You aren't balancing Biochem, you're making it undesirable. You're making it into Cybertech or Armstech. Make the Rakata stuff as good as the Exotech stuff.

 

This is absolutely correct, there no longer needs to be more than one or two biochems in a guild. They can make stims for the guild, and the guild provides the credits/mats to do so. This is exactly what my guild will most likely do, since they have effectively made there little to no reason to stay BioChem. Those that stay will only do so because the other professions are so poorly design it seems as though they were thrown together at the last minute. Those that don't will likely play Profession Roulette and go through Artificing/Synthweaving for those professions Rakata pieces since they don't have a profession requirement to use them.

[littleming]

Additionally, we've reduced the effectiveness of the BioChem exclusive Rakata Stimpacks to be equal to Energized stimpacks.

Regards

Georg

 

Tell me... where does it say Rakata will be the same as exotech? Fact in point... Exotech will now be SUPERIOR to rakata.

[Saiyanbob]

Compairing the stims to the rakata armors and saying the resuables aren't as good is silly considering your also forgetting about the reusable adrenal. You still get basically a 15 second mini buff that MORE than makes up for the armor stat differences. Sure someone could buy adrenals but on my server they are 10-15k each and you use prob 3 per boss fight (I believe its 90 sec cooldown) Thats ALOT of credits saved by having a reusable Adrenal. And most people dont buy adrenals because of the fact it would be 2-300k per night to do so and use them on every boss.

[Affics]

The biggest problem with rakata is that u need to pve to get it. They need to do the right thing and sell reagent for 1 bm commendation or smth. As for change i approve it.

[Delkerramak]

You guys are gonna laugh at yourselves once you realize that exotech stims can be DE'd for reuseable exotech

[maxbaby]

You guys are gonna laugh at yourselves once you realize that exotech stims can be DE'd for reuseable exotech

 

There's no indication of that on torhead.

[Mysquine]

Compairing the stims to the rakata armors and saying the resuables aren't as good is silly considering your also forgetting about the reusable adrenal. You still get basically a 15 second mini buff that MORE than makes up for the armor stat differences. Sure someone could buy adrenals but on my server they are 10-15k each and you use prob 3 per boss fight (I believe its 90 sec cooldown) Thats ALOT of credits saved by having a reusable Adrenal. And most people dont buy adrenals because of the fact it would be 2-300k per night to do so and use them on every boss.

 

Your wrong. 3 minutes - so pretty much twice every boss depending on when you use it. Adrenals arn't a need be and tbh I use the crit one as a tank to try and boost the dps because I get hit for sweet nothing in Instances already.

 

So Reusable adrenals are pretty much as useful as the adrenals in WZ I believe thats why they were changed in the previous patch. Nightmare - you might need adrenals but we've never used them.

 

So in reality, it doesn't really cost you much anyway because the fights are so easy and just mechanics based that you don't necessarily need to pop an adrenal.

 

The biggest problem with rakata is that u need to pve to get it. They need to do the right thing and sell reagent for 1 bm commendation or smth. As for change i approve it.

 

Oh noes one Hardmode really is so hard. Black Talon takes 20 minutes if that to do - take a few friends, and your done in no time. I understand where your coming from but well like I said, 20 minutes out of your day - even whilst your waiting for a PvP queue to pop really isn't much.

[Cyraxe]

um, i don't know what people are complaining about.....the exotech stims are NOT reusable, the rakata ones are. They stated that the rakata stims are intended to save credits over time. Where's the issue?

[vandana_]

Save money.

 

They wont save you any money cause you will not be using them.

[vandana_]

um, i don't know what people are complaining about.....the exotech stims are NOT reusable, the rakata ones are. They stated that the rakata stims are intended to save credits over time. Where's the issue?

 

The issue is Rakata will be worse than Exotech hence completely useless.

[Beergogglez]

Lol I love their method of thinking:

 

"HEY ALL BIOCHEM PEOPLE! WE'LL **** YOUR RAKATA BUFFS DOWN TWO DIFFERENT PATCHES TO EXOTECH AND MAKE EXOTECH NOT REQUIRE BIOCHEM"

 

So... in essence they took an overpowered crafting skill, nerfed it down to not be overpowered, this was fine. Then they took it a step further and allowed EVERYONE to be a biochem. Seriously?

 

Here's the logic, armor makers (synth/armormechs) can create their own rakata gear. Then they have a chance to crit to give them a PERMANENT+58 of their stat. But not only that, they can Reverse Engineer their gear to get even MORE stats on that rakata gear.

(source: http://www.torhead.com/item/bNDtJxP/rakata-force-masters-sash )

 

 

Now you're telling me my +22 stat and +13 power is too overpowered? You mean the whole reason something is called rakata making it a next tier item is not the way a game is suppose to be designed? That items DONT get better as you progress a trainer skill? A lvl 48 item HAS TO BE equal to a level 50 item? Got it. *golf clap*

 

 

So this patch is going to essentially make biochemists rich by trading exotech ****, but make almost everyone go to synthweaving and armormech until they craft their perfect rakatas, then wait for the orange gear to come out and craft themselves a really nice augmented set. Do you devs even play the gosh darn game? Do you wonder why people quit when you do such idiotic patches? You wonder why you need to have guild leaders come to Austin to tell you how to build your game?

 

 

Here's one hint, stop nerfing an already nerfed crafting skill only one month after the game is released, you do not know how bad this is going to affect the whole player base and economy. I mean you haven't even had enough time to see what your FIRST freaking nerf is going to do to the game and now you're already implementing a 2nd nerf? I will most likely quit the game after this patch releases if this is the kind of updates I can expect from BW.

 

Oh and for those that are just calling me a QQ'r I plan on staying biochem regardless, I already have 4 of the exotech recipes in my cargo hold (willpower stim/force adrenal/aim stim/ endurance stim) so I plan on making millions easily from this stupid patch. But what about those biochems who don't have it? They get nothing but a huge dump taken on them. Its sad that Bioware needs to do that to their players.

 

 

Tl/dr; Rakata is considered a next tier item, it SHOULD be better than exotech. +22 main stat/+13 power is not more overpowered than +58 main stat upgrade armor makers get from critting their rakata gear. But now you're giving people who have those +58 main stat rakata armors the same buffs a biochem can get? Really? You work hard for a next tier item, that item SHOULD be better not worse/same stats as one of a lower tier.

 

Torhead also says a white crystal gives 51 stats lol. And they say you get a 6th companion hk51 ....no you don't get anything if you RE rakata gear. Do you realise how much time it takes for a crit to happen? Or how much mats is needed?

[vandana_]

You guys are gonna laugh at yourselves once you realize that exotech stims can be DE'd for reuseable exotech

 

If that was true the Energized one could be also REd to reusable. And since they are making Rakatas equal to Energized that can't be the case as they would be duplicating schematics. That would make no sense.

 

On top of that, as someone said before, there is no such item as reusable Exotech on torhead/DH.

Edited February 5, 2012 by vandana_

[Excid]

Thread is amusing. Rakata should be equal to exotech. It is the main perk of being a biochem. Any raider that actually has a brain will be using exotech which nullifies rakata which nullifies the perk. Popping potions is still decent but not as useful since the last nerf. And the whole talk about "Its a rare drop!" is pointless. Unless you picked a dead server, the recipes are already out there in great abundance. Can't even tell you how many my guild has already.

 

Not a smart nerf imo but it happens. Once they fix the other profs, I'll probably go back to armstech. Kept the side profs for a reason.

[gibmachine]

Basically, for those that don't pvp, Biochem has no perk now.

 

Hell, Biochem has no perk for those that don't do nightmare raids since outside those, you don't even need adrenals to beat enrage timers no sweat.

 

Seriously, make those Rakata consumables equal to Exotech and this thread will cease to exist as everyone will be happy.

 

um, i don't know what people are complaining about.....the exotech stims are NOT reusable, the rakata ones are. They stated that the rakata stims are intended to save credits over time. Where's the issue?

 

If 1.1.2 change goes through, you're not saving money - you're wasting it. Saving money would happen if Rakata was to be equal to Exotech like every single Biochemist in this thread advocates. If it's gonna be equal to Energized, you're wasting money since you keep on using the sub-par stims and adrenals when you could spend them on something better.

Edited February 5, 2012 by gibmachine

[gibmachine]

double post Edited February 5, 2012 by gibmachine

[nichtganz]

I dont understand the nerf, with them fixing exotech chems why is rakata in issue the only advantage that rakata would have is that they are reusuable. Please bioware use a little common sense and reverse this awful change.