Official: Over 1.7 million active subs, 2 + mil sold

[Sparklehorse]

Indeed. And it ultimately doesn't matter how many subs TOR retains, there will always be people who say it has 'failed'. They're already saying it, and they will never stop.

 

You have to admit though, it is quite fun to watch them grasping at straws.

[HavenAE]

Here's why I laugh.

 

A timeline with Glooms and doomers and negative Nancies : we'll call them Nancy.

 

And everyone else.

 

 

Pre-launch:

 

Nancy, "This game sucks I beta tested. I'm not buying it."

 

Everyone else "That's okay if you don't like it you don't have to buy it."

 

Nancy, "This game will be lucky to sell 1 million copies"

 

Everyone else "Actually it's already got 900k box pre-orders in NA alone not accounting for digital and "Europe.

 

Nancy "Yeah I can just make up numbers too."

 

 

Post Launch:

 

Nancy "This game sucks I'll bet not even 500,000 people are playing this game right now"

 

Everyone else "Actually it's sold over 2 million copies and it has a peak concurrent userbase of 350,000"

 

Nancy "only 300k? lol that's so low. this game is pathetic I'm going to cancel my account right now come watch me."

 

Everyone else "Actually thats a pretty high number for a PCU, but cancel your account if you want ya know."

 

Nancy "Well look at all of the other posts like mine, no body like this game it'll lose most of it's players when the first 30 days runs out. Everyone knows that's when most games fail. Stupid fanboy."

 

 

 

Post first billing cycle:

 

Everyone else "Hey got this information here. Says SWTOR has sold over 2 million copies it has 1.7 million active subscribers."

 

Nancy "Yeah riiiight! Maybe when it launched, those numbers aren't current."

 

Everyone else "Nancy? You're still here? I thought you canceled your account. Anyway it says right here over half of the people are through with their first free month."

 

Nancy "Oh well that's probably 49% of 1.7million and they'll be gone next month."

 

Everyone else "Okay maybe, I doubt that's the case but it's possible."

 

Nancy "It doesn't matter anyway it's at the 3 month mark where most games fail. Everyone knows that fanboy."

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which that last bit is possible and most games that are going to fail do so by that third month. However, negative Nancy and her bros and sisters have been proven wrong time and time again. Let's hope the trend keeps up.

 

Actually with 2 million units (highest I've seen is 2.5m) sold, and to still have 1.7m of them around (even if only 51% are actually subbing) is pretty impressive.

[Sparklehorse]

Remember that the published data is from dec. 31st ... within the 30 days free of all the preorder, first day and xmas starters.

 

 

 

Somebody hasn't been reading the thread.

[wifeaggro]

Here's why I laugh.

 

A timeline with Glooms and doomers and negative Nancies : we'll call them Nancy.

 

And everyone else.

 

 

Pre-launch:

 

Nancy, "This game sucks I beta tested. I'm not buying it."

 

Everyone else "That's okay if you don't like it you don't have to buy it."

 

Nancy, "This game will be lucky to sell 1 million copies"

 

Everyone else "Actually it's already got 900k box pre-orders in NA alone not accounting for digital and "Europe.

 

Nancy "Yeah I can just make up numbers too."

 

 

Post Launch:

 

Nancy "This game sucks I'll bet not even 500,000 people are playing this game right now"

 

Everyone else "Actually it's sold over 2 million copies and it has a peak concurrent userbase of 350,000"

 

Nancy "only 300k? lol that's so low. this game is pathetic I'm going to cancel my account right now come watch me."

 

Everyone else "Actually thats a pretty high number for a PCU, but cancel your account if you want ya know."

 

Nancy "Well look at all of the other posts like mine, no body like this game it'll lose most of it's players when the first 30 days runs out. Everyone knows that's when most games fail. Stupid fanboy."

 

 

 

Post first billing cycle:

 

Everyone else "Hey got this information here. Says SWTOR has sold over 2 million copies it has 1.7 million active subscribers."

 

Nancy "Yeah riiiight! Maybe when it launched, those numbers aren't current."

 

Everyone else "Nancy? You're still here? I thought you canceled your account. Anyway it says right here over half of the people are through with their first free month."

 

Nancy "Oh well that's probably 49% of 1.7million and they'll be gone next month."

 

Everyone else "Okay maybe, I doubt that's the case but it's possible."

 

Nancy "It doesn't matter anyway it's at the 3 month mark where most games fail. Everyone knows that fanboy."

 

 

 

 

 

 

Which that last bit is possible and most games that are going to fail do so by that third month. However, negative Nancy and her bros and sisters have been proven wrong time and time again. Let's hope the trend keeps up.

 

Actually with 2 million units (highest I've seen is 2.5m) sold, and to still have 1.7m of them around (even if only 51% are actually subbing) is pretty impressive.

 

Nancy is correct that the 90 day mark is the secondary burn off point after that the user base stabilises and will churn those form the 30 day and 90 day mark as subscribers. My guess is nacy is still subbed though she has nothing better to do.

[Caldurjyoh]

What is wrong with people on these forums?

 

People hating SWTOR or loving SWTOR just for doing that are .... plain. Just plain. Am sure you get what i mean.

 

Who cares if SWTOR has 100 Million Subs, and WOW another 100 Million subs? I get no money from either of them for that and i surely wont see a penny in the future either.

 

What is see though is that the best developer and the one that takes care of my needs as a gamer will get my monthly sub. I dont buy crappy yearly plans either. I rather pay a few bucks more a month (Euros actually for me lived too many years in the US before, habbits are a ****** to get over HAHA ), and have the freedom to drop them when they act as BW did this past month in my eyes.

 

All i care is that:

I go online to play and the servers are dead

 

I have maintenance taking place at the same time in EU and US and AU and all Asia soon enough (break it up already, do rolling starts for fixes and think of your customers and make all people happy BW whats up with your management team? )

 

I have bugs that need to be fixed (fix not create more with each patch to), the issue of grouping during and after leveling

 

I have crappy textures and the game needs crazy amounts of power to run what should be able to with an average machine

 

Issue with the engine the game was build on (i doubt that will change since a whole game was build upon, but that can be fixed to work at least properly so that PVP and end game PvE is worth a try),

 

and many other issues that HAVE to be addressed.

 

When these would at least be addressed in a proper manner and BW gives some heads up to the people paying them, ofc we would stay and pay subs.

 

If i stayed from Vanilla on for 7 years with WoW and paid my sub every month, and moved here in hopes that i would find a game to play for as long, it should mean enough to BW to bother to at least try to make me happy.

 

Like me i know for a fact all my friends canceled their subs cause of the above reasons. We cant all be haters and crazy people.

 

Soz for the long post :S

[Emeda]

If you break even on a hot-dog stand, you don't need a ton of profit over that "break-even" point to call yourself profitable.

 

If you break even on a game that cost as much as SWTOR did and only maintain that break-even, or show a minor profit- you're not going to be considered profitable because you're spending MASSIVE amounts of resources, including the big one: time, to get... what you put in.

 

Profitability for something on the scale of SWTOR is not the same as profitability for your paper route. No one will be impressed if SWTOR makes a few million dollars per year after expenses and costs.

 

All that said, I'm totally confident in SWTOR's ability to deliver major profits as part of EA's larger portfolio.

 

thats 7.5 million a month not a year. that ends up to almost 100 million a year. If you still think making 100 million above breaking even is a slight profit then I dont know what to say.

 

There is not more overhead that they need between 500,000 and 1 million players that they dont already have.

 

Also when they say they need 500,000 to break even thats understanding that that is with thier current work staff. Its not like they would cut 1/2 thier staff if they only had 500,000 players or would have ro hire more for a million or have to add more servers or have to add to R&D for future content.

[Nemmar]

Wow.. 1.7m!!

 

That's like.... 1/10th of WoW's subs...

 

Blizzard fanboys, the most hilarious.

 

Oww maybe you should wait to hear blizzards numbers before you claim superiority, i predict it will have lost another 1,5 millions. Once SWTOR releases in eastern markets... its gonna be even more fun to watch. Are you sure you're on the side of the "victor"?

 

Seems like hate alone isnt enough to stop SWTOR, awww too bad for you.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Nemmar

[Biogood]

Many people underestimate trion. There is a reason why that studio has some of the most talented and creative people in the industry. It's because they dont answer to anyone but the player's. rift is hands down the best MMO released in the last 7 years. Wallstreet is crazy for these guys to go public. they just got shot in the rear wwith a huge lump of money to produce new content for rift and Devolp a new engine for liscensing.

 

My guess 2012 and 2013 will be a battle between Trion and BW for the top tier Sub based MMO. and as i see it Trion has far less restrictions . People calll rift a fail MMO yet its growing and has less churn then WOW does currently. people fail to relalize that Trion gets 100% of the subscriptions .they have no liscense and everything they do is in house.The publisher got the Box sales and thats it.

 

 

If rift is so great why is it lying dead in a gutter while wow and swtor spit on its corpse. The game even started with over 60 servers at launch, and now its down to 17....

 

So obviously it must not have been that great?

Edited February 2, 2012 by Biogood

[Nemmar]

 

All i care is that:

I go online to play and the servers are dead

 

 

The thing is that isnt true.

 

It's really hard to point this out without beeing rude to the person.

 

Let me try to put this in the simplest way possible.

 

WoW and clones = one landmass with cities and people on it (these are each continent).

SWTOR = 30 landmasses (every planet) and one space station.

 

The landmass on SWTOR is several times that of WoW and others. Its a massive game. WoW funnels players to a small area giving the impression that there are loads of players.

SWTOR spreads them out.

 

This should be obvious to anyone that playes the game.

 

Your generalization is hardly the truth. The servers are healthy and filled with people. You're just not used to a game where everyone gets funneled to different landmasses.

 

I dont expect you to understand this, wich is why its difficult to explain.

 

If you want proof of what im saying, go on WoW log in and lvl a new character. You will see almost No one the whole game until you hit max level.

 

Oh btw... this is where you go /care the game isnt as i want it to QQQQQQ. Game is gloomed and doomed. Yeah... we got past that stage now. Its a sucess.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Nemmar

[Caldurjyoh]

The thing is that isnt true.

 

It's really hard to point this out without beeing rude to the person.

 

Let me try to put this in the simplest way possible.

 

WoW and clones = one landmass with cities and people on it (these are each continent).

SWTOR = 30 landmasses (every planet) and one space station.

 

The landmass on SWTOR is several times that of WoW and others. Its a massive game. WoW funnels players to a small area giving the impression that there are loads of players.

SWTOR spreads them out.

 

This should be obvious to anyone that playes the game.

 

Your generalization is hardly the truth. The servers are healthy and filled with people. You're just not used to a game where everyone gets funneled to different landmasses.

 

I dont expect you to understand this, wich is why its difficult to explain.

 

If you want proof of what im saying, go on WoW log in and lvl a new character. You will see almost No one the whole game until you hit max level.

 

How about instead of me going to wow to level a character you go read what MMO stands for and go in SWTOR on ANY light or standard server (not hard to find one ) and try to come across someone while you play. Exemptions to these are starting areas and fleet.

 

I dont care if there are 1 million people playing on a server. I care that while playing one does not play with anyone other than once in a blue moon cause the game is designed as a single player game.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Caldurjyoh

[Mekrath]

Thats not at all true. COH 100k subs ro so and has had plenty of expansions and content added. AOC was around 70k subs two expansions later its still getting content updates. Plenty of mmos have survived and had content updates at 100k subs. But it would be bad for THIS game because THIS game cost 200 million dollars to develop those others did not.

 

I was talking about this game. Other games could survive 100k subscribers, a project of this size couldn't.

[Safiir]

How about instead of me going to wow to level a character you go read what MMO stands for and go in SWTOR on ANY light or standard server (not hard to find one ) and try to come across someone while you play. Exemptions to these are starting areas and fleet.

 

I dont care if there are 1 million people playing on a server. I care that while playing one does not play with anyone other than once in a blue moon cause the game is designed as a single player game.

 

So every mmo becomes a single player game after the first couple of weeks of release/new expansion?

[Mekrath]

If rift is so great why is it lying dead in a gutter while wow and swtor spit on its corpse. The game even started with over 60 servers at launch, and now its down to 17....

 

So obviously it must not have been that great?

 

Is that true? Last I heard Rift was very profitable and growing.

[HavenAE]

I was talking about this game. Other games could survive 100k subscribers, a project of this size couldn't.

 

According to EA this game can survive on 500k subs actually.

[Kharzon]

This is actually one of the crappiest games every made. I hate to say it, but there's not 1.7 active subs now. EA knows this. This is a half a billion dollar flop. /thumbsup.

[Dovafeyn]

This makes no sense.

 

According to the forums, about 6million plus have unsubbed to this game. How can it still be going if more people have unsubbed than bought the game

 

WHY YOU NO MAKE SENSE FORUMS!!!

[Kharzon]

Is that true? Last I heard Rift was very profitable and growing.

 

My roommate plays Rift. More then 17 servers on his list. Hate to break it to you but Rift got easymode right, with a good storyline and content. I personally do not like the easymode, but my roommate loves it.

[Thorun]

According to EA this game can survive on 500k subs actually.

500k would be breaking even actually.

 

Q: You've previously said you need about a half million subscribers to be profitable, is that still the case?

A: At 500,000 subscribers, we'd break even. At a million, we'd be making a profit but nothing worth writing home about. As it scales up from there, we're talking about a nice profit. At this point with the successful launch, we can take the worst case scenarios off the table.

 

even colored it for you.

[Mekrath]

According to EA this game can survive on 500k subs actually.

 

You realize that 100k is less than 500k, right?

[HavenAE]

You realize that 100k is less than 500k, right?

 

Naww REALLY?!

 

 

 

You my friend should be an astronaut, you got that math **** DOWN.

Edited February 2, 2012 by HavenAE

[Mekrath]

Naww REALLY?!

 

 

 

You my friend should be an astronaut, you got that math **** DOWN.

 

I'm confused then

 

I said the game couldn't survive on 100k subscriptions, and you replied that 'EA said they could survive on 500k actually' as if you were correcting me.

[HavenAE]

I'm confused then

 

I said the game couldn't survive on 100k subscriptions, and you replied that 'EA said they could survive on 500k actually' as if you were correcting me.

 

Because you make it sound like this game needs millions and millions of subscribers to be successful. 500K isn't hard to accomplish in an MMO, not really.

[Mekrath]

Because you make it sound like this game needs millions and millions of subscribers to be successful. 500K isn't hard to accomplish in an MMO, not really.

 

Not sure how saying the game couldn't survive with 100k subscriptions makes it sound like it needs millions, but fair enough.

 

My original statement was in response to someone who said 'why should we care if the game has 100k or 10 million subscribers as players' and I was just stating why 100k would be a problem.

[Emeda]

Because you make it sound like this game needs millions and millions of subscribers to be successful. 500K isn't hard to accomplish in an MMO, not really.

 

I know an MMO that lost over 1/2 of that number in its first month and was a success. 500,000 people is nothing.

[Jett-Rinn]

Blizzard fanboys, the most hilarious.

 

Oww maybe you should wait to hear blizzards numbers before you claim superiority, i predict it will have lost another 1,5 millions. Once SWTOR releases in eastern markets... its gonna be even more fun to watch. Are you sure you're on the side of the "victor"?

 

Seems like hate alone isnt enough to stop SWTOR, awww too bad for you.

 

Yeah I kinda love to shut them up when they find out it took months for WoW to get it's first million....and most analyst think that there are currently between 1.5 and two million WoW subs in North America and Europe....since Blizzard refuses to break down he numbers and the fact that Argent Dawn one of NA most populated servers is now a ghost town I would say they are being generous.

 

And before the hate squad labels me a TOR fanboi, I still play WoW I just have accepted that the games heyday is gone.