SWTOR was promising. I liked it untill now.

[AtomicWanderer]

Oh Im not suggesting that, I KNOW that.

 

I guess you won then. *golfclap*

[defiantlegacy]

So, go back to WoW or Rift.

 

Stop complaining, go do what you enjoy doing.

 

He is attempting to be constructive.

You are just obtrusive and counter-productive.

You can choose to agree, or you can choose to counter the argument with something equally intelligent and logical.

You have failed to do this.

You do not belong in this post

[oMGitsree]

Here's the thing: I really don't believe that WOW was perfect right out of the box. It had to build and develop content to become the game it is now. Wow did not start with all its content up front and it polished and fixed things over time. You are looking at WOW at it established point and glossing over its struggles at the beginning.

 

The point I am making is that it will continue its endgame content and build to be stronger over time. The game has been out a month. I have two characters at 50, but I don't feel bored because I want to go on to the next story and watch it play out. My suggestion, go back to playing Wow or whatever and come back when there is more content just for you. You make very valid points and criticism and I am not lambasting you for having an opinion. Hopefully through Patience we will see vast improvements over time.

 

That being said I do hope that Star Wars does take into consideration some of the complaints and works to improve things. I for one would like a bit more rewards for the PVE side as I really have no desire for PVP, but We shall see.

[Harabek]

I comprehended just fine. You went on some tangent about some guy telling him to go play WoW. Thus he's a fanboy. You clearly do not comprehend what fanboy means or you would be using it in the correct context.

 

It is also a reasonable assumption to say such things, as he is talking about how awesome WoW and Rift are and is incapable of thinking about things TOR does differently because they are things that he doesn't enjoy. Which makes him a fanboy by definition.

 

The OP didn't just make a post saying "WoW is better", he made an effort explaining which features he liked. Pretty useful feedback for the developers of a game that is losing subscriptions on a daily base. If someone only replies with "go play WoW" i do call that a fan-boy response.

 

I am happy for everyone who actually likes this game, i did too in the beginning. It's people like you that don't allow any other opinions next to "the game is awesome, the game is fine". I hate the typical "this game blows" posts as much as you do. That's why i think you should treat players fair that take a different approach.

[AaronPenick]

Good points. It hurts when the blinders fall off (they fell off for me on the 1.1 patch) Still hoping the get some key missing features in with 1.2 but doubtful.

[Merrinset]

The OP didn't just make a post saying "WoW is better", he made an effort explaining which features he liked. Pretty useful feedback for the developers of a game that is losing subscriptions on a daily base. If someone only replies with "go play WoW" i do call that a fan-boy response.

 

I am happy for everyone who actually likes this game, i did too in the beginning. It's people like you that don't allow any other opinions next to "the game is awesome, the game is fine". I hate the typical "this game blows" posts as much as you do. That's why i think you should treat players fair that take a different approach.

 

Like me huh? I didn't say word one until he stipulated that the things he didn't like couldn't be used as points against his argument, because he didn't like them. Nor have I ever said "this game is awesome, it's totally fine" as you are want to put into my mouth. I just don't think the game should be a carbon copy of <insert favorite MMO here>.

 

I could care less what someone's opinions are, as long as they're not close minded about what other people want too.

[Ghostfaced]

Allow me to reiterate...

 

http://26.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_liszozGFKT1qeve6qo1_500.jpg

[Arrys]

I understand everything you said and have heard it from the people who rush to end game level in every MMO launch in history. The only thing that changes is the MMO they compare the game to.

 

Basic fact SWTOR's content is 2 releases ahead of wow's initial release and includes both PvP and PvE content(WoW initial PvP content consisted of the people who rushed to 50 camping Tarren Mill). Is it an enjoyable world - yeah, Are the combat mechanics enjoyable - yeah, Is it immersive, yeah.

 

We obviously all left WoW for a reason. A) pretty much explored the world and want something new to explore being my reason. I won't say WoW was a bad game it's simply one I'm past, like a good book might I revisit it in time, perhaps.

 

Right now I'm wondering what this new book is going to throw at us and how it's going to evolve. It's got a proper foundation it's now in the dev's content release, balancing and creative hands. Worth sticking around to find out IMHO.

[Ahkronn]

Except WoW copied near everything it has from other MMOs.

 

That's the inherent problem with all you people posting WoW comparisons. You act like it is the messiah when it's just a crook. The only actual original thing that I can pull from WoW is the phasing added during WOTLK, that was the first time I'd ever seen it in a MMO.

 

You're also ignoring aspects that are different from the other MMOs just because they don't fit into your personal playstyle. If they did fit, you wouldn't have rushed to 50 to cry about no endgame. Your argument lost all credibility when you posted this.

 

People post comparisons to WoW because it both a very successful and widely known game.

Who cares who copied what from who? Ever game is in a way a copy of others.

 

It's called Genre Mechanics!

 

At the end, it's not a comparison that is in effect here. It's "What was good on other games and it's not on this one" aka "How could this be improved, based on what we know it works?"

 

Being excessively defensive about a game, rejecting any so called comparison is a great way to create stagnation of the product.

Market studies are exactly that. What do people like on other games that can be implemented, improved or adapted on a product, to create a better user experience?

 

The OP is quite well constructed and can be used by the dev. team to check what people would like to see.

Would implementing something used successfully on other game on this game ruin it? No, it would probably make it better, more appealing to a lot of people.

[notinsai]

i play both WOW and this. I wanted to like this game. really. However i find myself logging in to get my Ilum and WZ dailies done for battlemaster bags, then logging off. There doesn't seem to be much reward for time spent playing. Rest of the time I'm playing WoW as it has more on offer. Yes this game is only a month old but you dont release a game to compete with the juggernaut that is WoW and then offer a lot less for the same money.

 

Its like making a car to compete with the mercedes S class and selling it without airbags or climate control for the same price. And when your customers complain they get told "yes but the 1980 version of the S class didnt have airbags or climate control. We will have these features in the future, just not now."

 

A lot of features WoW introduced AFTER its release have since become industry standard. You'd think a 300 million dollar game would have at least tried to meet these standards if not improve on them.

 

When WoW was released the game at the fore was Everquest. They took the best features of Everquest, and improved them exponentially. Also they had time to correct the things they got wrong. This is because there weren't a 100 other MMOs on the horizon capable of stealing their customer base. Unfortunately for SWTOR, MMOs are now dime a dozen. They don't have the luxury of time. Customers will leave. Guild Wars 2 is on the horizon. I for one may be headed that way if things don't improve soon.

[DarthKhaos]

1) PvP:

PvP was promising. Huttball was new and enjoyable (imo) and the other two warzones were attractive and easy to get used to. However after playing these same three warzones over and over with no differentiation is a drag. Especially having to get to valor 60 for the best gear simply either farming rare empire kills in illum (I say rare because each one I attack has 5 people on back-up behind them) or farming those three warzones alot!!

 

"Why can you not play this game just because you enjoy playing?" I did enjoy playing but come on, be logical. Doing the same three things over and over simply doesn't maintain it's excitement.

Dude each Huttball match is so different. Sometimes it goes good sometimes it goes bad sometimes it so even anyone can win. Others are a toss up. No matter how many times I play (I got 2 chars that is doing NOTHING but PvP & Class quests) I have a blast except when we lose badly. I mean really really really badly.

 

I think part of the problem is you are burned out in the game rushing through stuff and playing too much. Watch a movie, hang out with friends, take a bath, do something other than play the game non stop and when you play it'll be a lot better. Too late for you now unless you take a couple months off.

[Quastou]

to all the fanboys who jump down everyone's throat every time someone mentions wow, let people vent. They are making post like this because they want the game to be great. They want to play it for years like they did with wow. Like it or not, wow is still the mmo to be compared too.

 

The only way this game will improve is feedback from the community. I'm sick and tired of every time someone criticizes this game, there are a flurry of posts by fanboys such as:

 

"this is perfect! Bw is going to herald in the second coming of jesus and can do no harm! Go back to wow. How dare you say something that could improve this game!"

 

^^^ qft!!!

[Zyanzor]

To the OP,

 

Go play WoW then? Don't sit there and tell me DPS didn't have to wait up to 30-45mins to get into a dungeon finder. Only Tanks and Healers had insta ques and good luck trying to find one in Trade chat which is flooded with ******* and that game has 10mil subs, why does it take so long for a DPS to get in a Dungeon? After 7 years Blizzard still hasn't figure that out.

 

As far as I'm concerned, what Bioware has done with SWTOR is great and it's only getting. Ether each week that passes and each content patch that's released. You don't have the patience anymore so my only solution to you is, go play WoW and stop flooding General Forums with this.

[notinsai]

To the OP,

 

Go play WoW then? Don't sit there and tell me DPS didn't have to wait up to 30-45mins to get into a dungeon finder. Only Tanks and Healers had insta ques and good luck trying to find one in Trade chat which is flooded with ******* and that game has 10mil subs, why does it take so long for a DPS to get in a Dungeon? After 7 years Blizzard still hasn't figure that out.

 

Really? Whats to figure out. More people play DPS classes than tanks or healers. This means there are a lot more DPSers queuing up than healers and tanks. Of course you will have a much longer queuing time as DPS. a 45 minute wait to get into a dungeon run definitely beats an 8 hour wait without getting a single run despite out-gearing said instance by a fair bit :/

 

Blizzard implemented dual specs so dpsers could queue up as tanks/healers as a secondary spec. This helped immensly. I don't think I've seen a queue longer than 10 minutes for a very long time now as dps. Geez if bioware let me dual spec i could have a tank spec for my shadow that i can use for dungeons. But oh well...

[DarthKhaos]

Really? Whats to figure out. More people play DPS classes than tanks or healers. This means there are a lot more DPSers queuing up than healers and tanks. Of course you will have a much longer queuing time as DPS. a 45 minute wait to get into a dungeon run definitely beats an 8 hour wait without getting a single run despite out-gearing said instance by a fair bit :/

You know you're saying the same thing he is?

 

Some people are claiming that DPS only had to wait 20mins in WoW. I had both a tank and a dps @ lvl 85 before I stopped playing and I've had 50 and 1hr+ wait times on my mage. It happens. Also remember they split it into battle groups. Some battle groups had more dps some had more tanks. In one battle group healers would insta queue other ones healers would have to wait 20mins. THAT is a fact.

[Khardoss]

While I agree with a few points in the original post, I'd also like to point out that the good majority of the items on those lists were items that were added to those games YEARS after launch.

 

Some of those features didn't occur in those "other" games until 5+ years later.

 

Seriously, give it a rest. And more importantly, post constructive suggestions in the Suggestions Forum about things you'd like to see, instead of coming on here and whining about how X game had Y feature 4 years after it was released and SW:TOR fails because it didn't have it at launch.

[jordanph]

While I agree with a few points in the original post, I'd also like to point out that the good majority of the items on those lists were items that were added to those games YEARS after launch.

 

Some of those features didn't occur in those "other" games until 5+ years later.

 

Seriously, give it a rest. And more importantly, post constructive suggestions in the Suggestions Forum about things you'd like to see, instead of coming on here and whining about how X game had Y feature 4 years after it was released and SW:TOR fails because it didn't have it at launch.

 

I was only comparing the things I thought was good in WoW to swtor. Swtor has only a few things I find good and that is it. WoW and Rift has the same as SWTOR but so much more. I only want the game to improve.

[Jxspyder]

They had enough time for that while developing the game.

Game should not be created while running already, game should be finished when its being released which is clearly not the case in here.

 

I seriously hate ppl with lvl 20 saying game is just fine for them when there is 95% of game still waiting for them. Just dont bother posting, you will do more good that way.

 

Actually, based on the list of suggestions.....they haven't had enough time to impliment all of these while developing the game.

 

And he's done about as much good as you, so what's that mean?

 

 

 

Why do you guys keep saying that...

Because you keep forgetting it.

[JeremyDale]

Hello

 

I got to level fifty about one month ago from now and I couldn't stop bragging about how amazing this game was. I was on these forums daily trying to fight away the people who hate this game and making suggestions for end game. Quite simply you can call me blinded and obsessed. I couldn't face denial that this game actually is bad.

 

Here I am now then telling you why I dislike the game and seeing if I can relate to those who back up this game that had promise but has lost it.

 

1) PvP:

PvP was promising. Huttball was new and enjoyable (imo) and the other two warzones were attractive and easy to get used to. However after playing these same three warzones over and over with no differentiation is a drag. Especially having to get to valor 60 for the best gear simply either farming rare empire kills in illum (I say rare because each one I attack has 5 people on back-up behind them) or farming those three warzones alot!!

 

"Why can you not play this game just because you enjoy playing?" I did enjoy playing but come on, be logical. Doing the same three things over and over simply doesn't maintain it's excitement.

 

2) PvE: Just flashpoint after flashpoint and the only reason to do it is for the gear piece at the end to be traded for columi. No decent gear any other way. Flashpoint drops were terrible. Took forever to find a full group even tho its only 4 man. No reputation gains to buy gear from reputation vendors etc. Just a boring one way street.

 

The reasons behind why WoW was enjoyable with PvP

• Dueling in durotar/elwynn added competitiveness against own faction. Cannot happen here because there is no dueling area within 10 seconds from the main part of the fleet without going through a loading screen.
  
• Arena. Yes arena added excitement to PvP and added competition. I enjoy competition and therefore is why SWTOR has lost its edge for me. No matter how much you hate arena it is still better than anything SWTOR has to offer at this moment. It consists of rewards if you are good and is not dependant on others. It feels personal to you making a team. Just endless hours could be spent trying to increase rating and the feeling of winning was great.
  
• Ratings for arena and battleground groups. Added competition and elitism. Made the community thrive in a bad or good way. Depends how you think about it.
  
• Battleground were alot larger than SWTORs and added an MMO feel to it. Mounting included.
  

 

The reasons behind why WoW was enjoyable with PvE

• It didn't just involve token rewards from dungeons. The actual gear from dungeons was useful. Made people have a sense of excitement when killing a boss waiting for loot to drop. Wasn't free access to token gear at the end of each dungeon.
  
• The token grind for gear that was worth XXXX amount of tokens wasn't long. It was only 2 weeks of lock time or so. Compared to SWTOR this is short.
  
• One of my favorite features of WoW when it was in WoW was the daily heroic where you had to kill a specific boss in a specific dungeon.
  
• Dungeon finder was easy to use and using it gave rewards.
  

 

The reasons why WoW was enjoyable

• Community was larger and auction house was thriving. Had an actual economy. Felt good.
  
• Events that took place when events took palce in reality. E.G christmas events that gave you decent rewards from doing christmas stuff or valentines day etc etc.
  
• You could re-do you characters hair style at the barbers.
  
• Professions felt great once they were leveled to the max. Felt like you achieved something.
  
• Fishing, Archaeology, First aid etc
  
• You could attack the enemy cities. Also attack towns and cities alone as long as you avoided elites because guards were only normal mobs. In SWTOR guards are champions for most places.
  
• Flying mounts
  
• Quick travel with portals.
  
• Daily quest zone had dailys close together and it interacted with opposite faction. So it could also be pvp. Zones were small and easy to complete. Not a drag. Illum daily area doesn't have much zones shared with imperial and is quite the drag in illum.
  
• Guilds had reputation/amazing rewards for being exalted with guild. Heirlooms to level alts with. Mounts etc.
  
• The ammount of gear varied massively and it wasn't allways the vendor gear that was the best. Unlike SWTOR where you can only rely on vendor gear.
  

 

The reasons why Rift was enjoyable for me (I played no part in pvp so I have no idea what it is like)

• Frequent world events / updates. Rifts opened and invasions happened where community would group up.
  
• Zones were shared with opposite faction at higher level instead of split into two halves.
  
• PvE gear was aquired only from bosses. Vendor gear was not necessary the best gear again. Also crafted gear was good and there was crafting daily/weekly.
  
• Crafting was updated frequently
  
• Training dummys
  
• Multiple currencys from rifts. Allowed purchase of gear that could be used at end-game level.
  
• Reputation mounts.
  
• Reputation
  
• 10-man instances were completely different to 25-man. 10 man rifts were available and 5 man.
  
• two tiers of dungeon at launch.
  
• and more!
  

 

I agree with you on all your points regarding SWTOR. And it's nice to see an ex-fanboy man up and admit he was wrong. So you get kudos for that.

 

I disagree with you about WoW being an ejoyable game though. I thought it sucked

 

Just about every criticism you make about SWTOR can be applied to WoW as well- it's just WoW did have remnants of it's older more appealing self and that did add to the game - where-as SWTOR jumped right in and copied WoW's formula from the get-go.

 

Bottom line is SWTOR tried to become WoW and didn't succeed. It gets boring pretty fast - that's the bottom line. Tt's a great game for a couple of months - but after that it's "meh".

Edited February 2, 2012 by JeremyDale

[Jxspyder]

Its quite sad how you compare the launch of swtor to the launch of wow. Unless you have no track of time it is 7 years later. The launch should be alot better. But it should be compared with cataclysm since that is 2011/2012 standard of MMOs. Don't compare this release to a 7 year old one. geez.

 

Yes, I'm fully aware that it's been 7 years later. In those 7 years, has development time drastically been reduced? No, it hasn't.

 

But let's compare it to Cataclysm. Completely unplayable with drastic server outages and major bug issues. And all they did with Cataclysm was take a finished work and modify it. Which tends to be a lot easier than starting from scratch. Oh, and how much new content did Cataclysm introduce again? Come on, you want to compare Cataclysm's launch to TOR....so go for it.

 

 

 

The OP didn't just make a post saying "WoW is better", he made an effort explaining which features he liked. Pretty useful feedback for the developers of a game that is losing subscriptions on a daily base. If someone only replies with "go play WoW" i do call that a fan-boy response.

 

I am happy for everyone who actually likes this game, i did too in the beginning. It's people like you that don't allow any other opinions next to "the game is awesome, the game is fine". I hate the typical "this game blows" posts as much as you do. That's why i think you should treat players fair that take a different approach.

 

The problem with that useful feedback, is that quite a bit of it has already been announced as being in development. Then there's the stuff that he's apparently expecting out at launch that took years of post-launch development time to work out. And then there's one or two items that are already in the game, but apparently the OP is unaware of that.

 

The feedback on these items is about as relevant and helpful as complaining that WoW has had 3 full expansions, while TOR has only had a single content update. I mean, *** right?

 

Oh, and I'd really like you to source that whole "losing subscriptions on a daily basis" part. Please, feel free to enlighten us all on that one.

Edited February 2, 2012 by Jxspyder

[theAdt]

This game has a huge amount of growth potential. It's Star Wars. And that is why I stay.

 

WoW has run out of lore (Panda and Pokemon time!) and has dumbed down everything to the point that it's an unrewarding experience to devote time playing. After so many years, there are a lot of nice-to-have things that Blizzard put into that game. There are also a lot of really stupid dumbed down god-awful systems. We can only hope that Bioware has the ability to look at other games and pull in what works, and leave what doesn't.

 

Content is key. Tools and systems are things that can be put into place and worked on over time. These are things that you know will get better as the game develops over the coming months. But you can look back at Blizzard and their current xpac of LOLs and then next xpac of LOLs and know that the content in that game is done. Regardless of some well-refined systems that work ... the story is stupid, the game is uninteresting, and the ridiculous rehashed boring content that is there - is dumbed down to the point that an armless child could headbutt his way to heroic tier.

[JmaGzor]

You do realize of course you are explaining how great the economy of WoW was, after years and years. The game hasn't even been out for 2 months and your expecting a polished game that has millions of users. Forgetting that it already has almost 2 million in 2 months, you need to give it time, cant expect it overnight..

[Morpain]

Actually was interested in this post till it became a post about what you liked about all other games, then I lost interest. If those games are so much more enjoyable then play them. Easy fix.

[BrianDavion]

Really good post. I think the dueling area is something a lot of people overlook.

 

dueling areas would be bad for the game, a MMO is balanced around group balance,

[imalright]

First of all this game has only been out for a month and second of all this is bioware's first MMO, sure it doesn't have a LFG system but i can easily find a group on the imperial fleet, and when rift started it didn't have very good features until 6 months in then it became a success.