The Klingon Defence Forces Vs The Imperial Fleet

[PeepsMcJuggs]

I see a flaw in your plan.. Klingon wouldn't get near a crate of tribble. Maybe they can trick Kirk or Picard in doing it for them.

 

As someone else said earlier Thrawn would win in hand down. There also the big if Q wasn't the one responsible for brigging a Klingon fleet in SW in the first place. Q is the biggest troll of ST.

 

Didn't the Klingons commit mass tribblecide?

[Gantoris_Aym]

Star Trek is Dumb.

[PeepsMcJuggs]

Star Trek is Dumb.

 

Totes.

[BlackLotus]

Didn't the Klingons commit mass tribblecide?

 

It's a tribble, i'm sure some survived.....

[VelddryneDrakx]

Totes.

 

oh god, i almost spit coffee on my keyboard, i so should have seen that coming

[AshenK]

We really need to look at a few things for this.

 

The first big one is FTL, now the Imperials have from what I've read up on a over all faster FTL drive via Hyperspace. The Klingons, Feds, whomever have Warp Drives that can be used at any time. By this I mean where a Imperial Ship needs to calculate a jump to Hyperspace, a Star Trek ship just can jump to Warp whenever they want.

 

That said now we have to look at Sub Light drives and well Star Trek looks to have one over on the Empire here. Imperial Capital Ships are not know for being the fastest ships around, maybe the unshielded fighters could keep up with a Bird of Prey going at full Impulse. Really when it comes to the FTL and Sub Light drives I'll give it to the Klingons, their ships are going to be much faster.

 

As for Weapons and Shields on their ships the Imperials have it slightly over the Klingon's in this one. Turbo Lasers from what I've seen are insanely powerful so it wouldn't shock me if they can two shot a Bird of Prey, if not one shot. When it comes to Shields however the Imperials have one big fault that everyone over looks. The Shield Towers on a ISD, it's a big weak point for the Imperials. I mean you have Rebel Fighters that take down ISD's by blowing those up and well now you have an unshielded slow moving target.

 

So yeah when it comes to the power of said weapons the Imperials have a one up on the Klingons, the Shields however have a big weakness that the Klingon's can and will exploit. Also keep into mind that tho Klingon Weapons are somewhat 'weaker' then the Imperial stuff, Star Trek Weapons themselves are very user friendly and very fire and forget. So a fast moving Bird of Prey could just move in, lock onto those Shield Towers with Torpedo's and kiss that ISD's Shields good bye.

 

Thus that brings me to another part sensors and other things that their ships will have. And the Imperials flat out will hate Klingon Ships, why? Cloaking. The Klingons will use the time honored tactic of move in cloaked, decloak, fire, recloak. Well the smart ones, the others will scream in bloodlust and rush in firing at everything in sight. So the big question is can Imperial Sensors be able to pick up on a Cloaked Bird of Prey? Maybe. I can't for the life of me remember how good sensors in Star Wars are.

 

So okay yeah the Klingons are looking a little ahead however they are going to be dealing with a force much bigger then they are. And even tho the Klingons have some slight things over Imperial Ships, Imperial Ships can take a ton of punishment. Klingon and Star Trek ships from what we've seen love having systems on them go down even with the slightest amount of damage taken.

 

Over all yes the Imperials would win a full on war with the Klingon Empire. However it's going to be a costly war for the Imperials. They are dealing with a foe who will keep them in a long running guerilla style war, oh yeah a ISD can blow up a BoP with a few shots however small fast light ships with a cloak are going to have a field day wrecking ISD's. More so then that any ground battle is going to have Klingon's who they themselves can take a ton of punishment with hand disruptor's doing a number on Stormtroopers.

 

Really I think the Empire would get the feeling that the Klingon's are too much trouble then what they are worth and go pick on the Feds or someone.

[Wolfninjajedi]

We really need to look at a few things for this.

 

The first big one is FTL, now the Imperials have from what I've read up on a over all faster FTL drive via Hyperspace. The Klingons, Feds, whomever have Warp Drives that can be used at any time. By this I mean where a Imperial Ship needs to calculate a jump to Hyperspace, a Star Trek ship just can jump to Warp whenever they want.

 

That said now we have to look at Sub Light drives and well Star Trek looks to have one over on the Empire here. Imperial Capital Ships are not know for being the fastest ships around, maybe the unshielded fighters could keep up with a Bird of Prey going at full Impulse. Really when it comes to the FTL and Sub Light drives I'll give it to the Klingons, their ships are going to be much faster.

 

As for Weapons and Shields on their ships the Imperials have it slightly over the Klingon's in this one. Turbo Lasers from what I've seen are insanely powerful so it wouldn't shock me if they can two shot a Bird of Prey, if not one shot. When it comes to Shields however the Imperials have one big fault that everyone over looks. The Shield Towers on a ISD, it's a big weak point for the Imperials. I mean you have Rebel Fighters that take down ISD's by blowing those up and well now you have an unshielded slow moving target.

 

So yeah when it comes to the power of said weapons the Imperials have a one up on the Klingons, the Shields however have a big weakness that the Klingon's can and will exploit. Also keep into mind that tho Klingon Weapons are somewhat 'weaker' then the Imperial stuff, Star Trek Weapons themselves are very user friendly and very fire and forget. So a fast moving Bird of Prey could just move in, lock onto those Shield Towers with Torpedo's and kiss that ISD's Shields good bye.

 

Thus that brings me to another part sensors and other things that their ships will have. And the Imperials flat out will hate Klingon Ships, why? Cloaking. The Klingons will use the time honored tactic of move in cloaked, decloak, fire, recloak. Well the smart ones, the others will scream in bloodlust and rush in firing at everything in sight. So the big question is can Imperial Sensors be able to pick up on a Cloaked Bird of Prey? Maybe. I can't for the life of me remember how good sensors in Star Wars are.

 

So okay yeah the Klingons are looking a little ahead however they are going to be dealing with a force much bigger then they are. And even tho the Klingons have some slight things over Imperial Ships, Imperial Ships can take a ton of punishment. Klingon and Star Trek ships from what we've seen love having systems on them go down even with the slightest amount of damage taken.

 

Over all yes the Imperials would win a full on war with the Klingon Empire. However it's going to be a costly war for the Imperials. They are dealing with a foe who will keep them in a long running guerilla style war, oh yeah a ISD can blow up a BoP with a few shots however small fast light ships with a cloak are going to have a field day wrecking ISD's. More so then that any ground battle is going to have Klingon's who they themselves can take a ton of punishment with hand disruptor's doing a number on Stormtroopers.

 

Really I think the Empire would get the feeling that the Klingon's are too much trouble then what they are worth and go pick on the Feds or someone.

 

Question though...how would the Klingons know at first to attack the globes on a star destroyer to take out the shields? Don't forget they also have one underneath, so unless they know where to attack they are just blindly going to fire at the star destroyer until they figure this out.

[AshenK]

Question though...how would the Klingons know at first to attack the globes on a star destroyer to take out the shields? Don't forget they also have one underneath, so unless they know where to attack they are just blindly going to fire at the star destroyer until they figure this out.

My money would be on the Klingon sensors for that one, granted it may take some scans or a battle or two, we know that the Feds have good sensors and are able to pick up on things like that. The Klingon's may have ones that are not up to what the Feds have however they are still good. More so then that look at where the Shield Towers are, right above the command center of the ship. That's kinda another big flaw as if those Towers become targets the command decks are right below them.

 

And from what we've seen if one or both of those go even with a back up underneath the Shields are going to be gone on top if not becoming just weak to a point that the Ship is still going to take a good amount of damage.

 

[Edit] I also forgot to take into account one little thing of Star Trek Tech that the Klingon's have and the Imperial's don't have. Transporters, those can also play a big if not huge part in any battle. A Star Destroyer's Shields go down? The Klingon's will more then likely beam Warrior's over to the Ship, if not just beam a primed Torpedo over to a nice area on the Star Destroyer like oh the main reactor room.

Edited February 1, 2012 by AshenK

[Arokel]

true, but there 1 man attack vessels, and wont be able to fight large ships that are hidden, and can cloak in and out of cambat.

 

The ability to cloak a ship is insignificant next to the power of the Force.

[Gantoris_Aym]

Darth Vader, Darth Sidious, and the DEATH STAR. probably enough there.

[DarthMoord]

We really need to look at a few things for this.

 

The first big one is FTL, now the Imperials have from what I've read up on a over all faster FTL drive via Hyperspace. The Klingons, Feds, whomever have Warp Drives that can be used at any time. By this I mean where a Imperial Ship needs to calculate a jump to Hyperspace, a Star Trek ship just can jump to Warp whenever they want.

Imperial ships do not require calculating a jump to go to do a hyperspace jump, they're only necessary because hyperdrives are so fast that even a minute in hyperdrive and you risk slamming into a planet or star.

 

That said now we have to look at Sub Light drives and well Star Trek looks to have one over on the Empire here. Imperial Capital Ships are not know for being the fastest ships around, maybe the unshielded fighters could keep up with a Bird of Prey going at full Impulse. Really when it comes to the FTL and Sub Light drives I'll give it to the Klingons, their ships are going to be much faster.

That's funny, Star Wars: Complete Cross Sections clocks a Venator at 3000Gs of acceleration where The Next Generation Technical Manual puts the Enterprise-D at a mere 1000G. Is your argument that the Klingon's have impulse drives that are over three times more efficient than the Federation?

As for Weapons and Shields on their ships the Imperials have it slightly over the Klingon's in this one. Turbo Lasers from what I've seen are insanely powerful so it wouldn't shock me if they can two shot a Bird of Prey, if not one shot. When it comes to Shields however the Imperials have one big fault that everyone over looks. The Shield Towers on a ISD, it's a big weak point for the Imperials. I mean you have Rebel Fighters that take down ISD's by blowing those up and well now you have an unshielded slow moving target.

Those aren't shield generators, the shield were down before the communication globes were blown up. They were blown up to demonstrate that 'yes the shields are down' rather than just show you a random Imperial officer telling you so. Additionally Star Wars weapons are vastly beyond Trek-tech. The main phaser array on a Galaxy-class like the Enterprise-D is a 3.6 gigawatt weapon, the light guns on one of the twenty year old Acclamators are 300 million gigawatts. An Acclamator's shields dissipate 70 trillion gigawatts and the medium turbolasers on the Acclamator are 838.6 trillion GW weapons.

 

So yeah when it comes to the power of said weapons the Imperials have a one up on the Klingons, the Shields however have a big weakness that the Klingon's can and will exploit. Also keep into mind that tho Klingon Weapons are somewhat 'weaker' then the Imperial stuff, Star Trek Weapons themselves are very user friendly and very fire and forget. So a fast moving Bird of Prey could just move in, lock onto those Shield Towers with Torpedo's and kiss that ISD's Shields good bye.

Debunked.

 

Thus that brings me to another part sensors and other things that their ships will have. And the Imperials flat out will hate Klingon Ships, why? Cloaking. The Klingons will use the time honored tactic of move in cloaked, decloak, fire, recloak. Well the smart ones, the others will scream in bloodlust and rush in firing at everything in sight. So the big question is can Imperial Sensors be able to pick up on a Cloaked Bird of Prey? Maybe. I can't for the life of me remember how good sensors in Star Wars are.

Your analysis is wrong.

[Mephane]

That's funny, Star Wars: Complete Cross Sections clocks a Venator at 3000Gs of acceleration where The Next Generation Technical Manual puts the Enterprise-D at a mere 1000G. Is your argument that the Klingon's have impulse drives that are over three times more efficient than the Federation?

 

Those figures say nothing about actual speed or acceleration. So a Venator's engines produce 3 times the force of a galaxy class, but the actual acceleration also depends on the mass of the ship, and if I am not mistaken a Venator is considerably more massive than a galaxy-class.

[MustrumRidcully]

Yeah shleds absorb damage in star trek, think in star wars it more deflects though unsure.

 

Though it it is a bit like apple and bananas, we could argue this stuff all day.

 

Bananas, hands down.

 

I mean, they are even shaped like an Australien hunting weapon. And you know Australia is basically the most dangerous continent on Earth, so any weapon from there must be superior!

Edited February 1, 2012 by MustrumRidcully

[GhostRiderLSOV]

Those aren't shield generators, the shield were down before the communication globes were blown up. They were blown up to demonstrate that 'yes the shields are down' rather than just show you a random Imperial officer telling you so.

 

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/ISD-72x_deflector_shield_generator_dome

 

And in X-Wing, etc. games, those globes are the Star Destroyers' shield generators.

 

Edit: Then again http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sensor_globe

 

There has been some controversy as to whether the domes on Imperial Star Destroyer bridge towers are actually sensor globes, or shield generators. Richard Edlund, one of the SFX artists on ROTJ, noted in the February 1983 issue of Cinefex that they were "radar domes", i.e for sensor purposes.

 

Later guidebooks from Dorling Kindersley devoted to the worlds and vehicles of the films, performed what was said to be "the most thorough research done on the vehicles" according to a LFL blurb in Star Wars Insider 68. These books also labeled them as sensor globes, but with local-area shielding vanes, instead of being the main shield generators on-board the ship.

 

Well, it's a weird matter I guess.

 

Perhaps they were the main shield generators in games, exactly because they were an easy target. :/

Edited February 1, 2012 by GhostRiderLSOV

[DavieDe]

got to give it to the empire also if we are including x-wing games n such then some of those small fighters could do hefty damage ie missile boat for the win

[SNCommand]

Having a Star Trek vs Star Wars discussion is like having a Anything Else vs Warhammer 40K discussion.

 

Star trek is too rooted in realism to be able to fight the silliness in Star Wars numbers. In Star Wars the Empire could ram enough Star Destroyers down at the Klingons that they would run out of power or ammo before the Empire ran out of ships.

[Lugtor]

Having a Star Trek vs Star Wars discussion is like having a Anything Else vs Warhammer 40K discussion.

 

Star trek is too rooted in realism to be able to fight the silliness in Star Wars numbers. In Star Wars the Empire could ram enough Star Destroyers down at the Klingons that they would run out of power or ammo before the Empire ran out of ships.

 

This.

 

But then for the fun of it:

 

Imperials have Interdictors (in the movies area that is)

 

-> no warping, and slowed down for the klingons

 

The Imperial ships are larger by an insane quantity.

 

-> Every Star Destroyer hosts a small army of troops for boarding and invasion, and also several squadrons of bombers and fighters to deal with fast ships and bomb run small to medium targets. and in comparisson to imperial ships, the klingons have no capital ships. In fact only the Borg Supercubes would pose any fair match in size, numbers and firepower to ISDs. And there is only ONE in The First Contact and it needs a whole fleet to take just that one out.

[Yfelsung]

Whenever a modern Star Trek star ship has run into a culture that uses lasers they've usually remarked how lasers are literally incapable of damaging their shield or hull.

 

Since Star Wars ships use lasers, I think they're going to have a problem.

[Rayla_Felana]

Whenever a modern Star Trek star ship has run into a culture that uses lasers they've usually remarked how lasers are literally incapable of damaging their shield or hull.

 

Since Star Wars ships use lasers, I think they're going to have a problem.

 

Big problem with that, star wars lasers=/=star trek lasers, ONE Victory II class Star Destroyer turned an entire planet into slag by itself once, obviously there is a difference here.

[Yfelsung]

Big problem with that, star wars lasers=/=star trek lasers, ONE Victory II class Star Destroyer turned an entire planet into slag by itself once, obviously there is a difference here.

 

Not necessarily. They used a mining laser to destroy a planet in Star Trek (well, a mining laser and some red matter).

 

A planet is rock, and laser goes through rock, but a star ship has shielding and materials that could very well make it practically immune to laser fire.

 

It's not necessarily the size as much as the material and tech.

[Lugtor]

star wars has lasers and blasters.

i dont know any reference if laser are lasers as we know them. but the blasters are plasma, shaped and put to speed by magnetfields. shields might dissipiate those magnet fields.

but star wars also knows of torpedos, missiles, bombs and boarding pots. so they wouldn ot be weaponless.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Lugtor

[Rayla_Felana]

Not necessarily. They used a mining laser to destroy a planet in Star Trek (well, a mining laser and some red matter).

 

A planet is rock, and laser goes through rock, but a star ship has shielding and materials that could very well make it practically immune to laser fire.

 

It's not necessarily the size as much as the material and tech.

 

Yes but once again, you and many others assume the lasers in the star wars universe are the same as in our's, such assumptions shouldn't be made lightly and hence why trying to make these scientific comparisons are pointless, the demonstrations of each ships' power should be the comparisons made here.

 

I am still yet to see anything the Klingons could use to take out the Eclipse II itself, the most impressive ship in the whole of star wars.

Edited February 1, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

[Yfelsung]

They could always board the Eclipse and take the thing.

 

Considering your average Klingon receives as much training in hand to hand combat as Jedi, they'd be able to overrun a ship mostly full of Imperial soldiers quite fast.

 

Especially considering they have transporters.

[Rayla_Felana]

They could always board the Eclipse and take the thing.

 

Considering your average Klingon receives as much training in hand to hand combat as Jedi, they'd be able to overrun a ship mostly full of Imperial soldiers quite fast.

 

Especially considering they have transporters.

 

You would need an enormous army, which the Klingons do not have, even so, as far as i remember, shields need to be down to transport, the Eclipse's shields were powerful enough to directly smash into another massive ship and take no damage whatsoever.

 

Also they didn't just have your typical stormtroopers, they had imperial guard and Emperor's red guard as well, also Klingons do not have the force, and hand to hand combat against the Mandalorian red guard? that sounds like more of a bloodbath than a fight.

 

You also have to remember the Klingons would also be taking on Eclipse's enormous escort fleet.

 

Also this is an all out war, there would be all the other SSDs to worry about as well, not to mention the thousands of Interdictors, Victory Is, Victory IIs, Acclamators, etc...

 

Then let's not forget the innumerable amount of fighters, bombers, etc.... the Imperial Navy has.

 

Really, how was this meant to be winnable by the Klingons in the first place?

Edited February 1, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

[Wolfninjajedi]

You would need an enormous army, which the Klingons do not have, even so, as far as i remember, shields need to be down to transport, the Eclipse's shields were powerful enough to directly smash into another massive ship and take no damage whatsoever.

 

Also they didn't just have your typical stormtroopers, they had imperial guard and Emperor's red guard as well, also Klingons do not have the force, and hand to hand combat against the Mandalorian red guard? that sounds like more of a bloodbath than a fight.

 

You also have to remember the Klingons would also be taking on Eclipse's enormous escort fleet.

 

Also this is an all out war, there would be all the other SSDs to worry about as well, not to mention the thousands of Interdictors, Victory Is, Victory IIs, Acclamators, etc...

 

Then let's not forget the innumerable amount of fighters, bombers, etc.... the Imperial Navy has.

 

Really, how was this meant to be winnable by the Klingons in the first place?

 

I'm thinking because of shields and stealth...mostly stealth.