Dungeon Finder Needed Badly

[Joretur]

You can't block a player from access. The only thing you can do is prevent them from getting into your guild and with as little people raiding at 50 that's not really an issue. Even if they are somehow a serious raider and you've managed to block them the major guilds, all they have to do is re-roll and your slander is gone.

 

You can't block them access to the game, no. You can, however, not group with them, not bring them into your guild and avoid them. When somebody starts gaining that reputation as being somebody to stay away from, they either A) change their ways or B) have to find other ways to play. They do not continue to force their evil shenanigans on others though.

[Touchbass]

You can't block them access to the game, no. You can, however, not group with them, not bring them into your guild and avoid them. When somebody starts gaining that reputation as being somebody to stay away from, they either A) change their ways or B) have to find other ways to play. They do not continue to force their evil shenanigans on others though.

 

I've noticed a few people acting like ***** in fleet, I like to run little tests here and there and decided I'd randomly write a few names down and /who them to see what they were up too. I've found them in FP's some of the time, so the the policing thing isn't working with this many people.

[Neiloch]

This whole community/repercussions thing is based on the idea that you are some how going to force someone into radical change by shunning them which just isn't going to happen. On a fundamental level people do not change outside of some huge life altering event or brain trauma. This is why tools built to simply avoid them work much better than tools and methods to get people to 'fall in line.'

 

This kind of small community self policing only works in SMALL COMMUNITIES. FYI several thousand or more isn't a small community. You are trying to equate servers to small quaint, 100-200 people towns when its more like different boroughs of New York city.

Edited January 29, 2012 by Neiloch

[Racheakt]

We have the beginnings of server based communities. They are mostly positive in nature so far, sharing of information through discussions. There are rivalries forming between guild based on pvp and pve already, good natured rivalries at this point. Would server based forums help in this? Yes, but there are already reputations being built and players recognized as knowledgeable, helpful and good team players. You also have reputations being built as players better to stay away from due to attitude or other reasons.

 

That is how I am seeing things so far, it could be decent on other servers, but Kaas City is doing fairly well so far...people actually communicate.

 

Anecdotal, All I see on my server is LFG spam and the randome Charlee Sheen reference.

 

Without server forms to look into communities and share in a real fassion no telling how good a community could form.

 

And to be fair in WoW even with x-relm LFD i could get a plesent converstaion on just about anything in general chat.

 

The community that you want is not going to happen in a rail based games like this one, The two best communities I was ever in were UO and AC, both were sanbox and no instancing. Games like this players are hidden away in thier private little copy of the game taking down large robots and oversized Jedi. In UO guils fough for resources in open world, in AC all dungeon were open to anyone -- it was not uncommon to hit an dungeon and fin another adventurer in there and team up.

 

I think wanting to force "community" is a fools errand that will fail unless there is a way to communicate in a real manner with ones server -- say a server forum OR something like PvE or PvP ranking boards.

 

IMHO both a DF (same or cross server) and server forums are not implemted for the same reason -- They ran out of time and both cost manpower BW does not want to spend. I say that because if the truely think a LFD kill the community, they would need to do anything to help communties form -- which they have not.

Edited January 29, 2012 by Racheakt

[ianroyal]

anything is better than the current 'spam general for well over an hour and still not find a group' nonsense. this is regardless of class or role. i read the first few pages here and what is up with the false dichotomy? you can have both a lfg tool(cross-server, even) AND choose to find groups, in your current manner. one has nothing to do with the other. i just want to run the content and anything that saves me the hours of finding ANY group would be superb. playing the actual game trumps community, imo. i'd rather get the small percentage of jerks, like i do in wow, and get to play than wait because some self-aggrandizing people think it will affect them. or, get rid of warzone queues.

[Darkulous]

I think people forget that even if a cross-server LFD was put in the game you can still form groups the same way we do now.

 

The LFD doesn't replace anything.

[Sendrel]

You can't block them access to the game, no. You can, however, not group with them, not bring them into your guild and avoid them. When somebody starts gaining that reputation as being somebody to stay away from, they either A) change their ways or B) have to find other ways to play. They do not continue to force their evil shenanigans on others though.

 

Translation:

 

Its not enough to ignore someone and NEVER have to group with them ever again. I'm not going to be happy unless I'm able to more effectively attempt to ruin their experience as well.

 

 

 

Its that mindset, more than anything, that destroys community.

[Joretur]

However, learning from others who have implemented the cross-RDF...it does affect those that don't utilize it, as they nerf them to make them easier for the users of the RDF.

[Sendrel]

However, learning from others who have implemented the cross-RDF...it does affect those that don't utilize it, as they nerf them to make them easier for the users of the RDF.

 

Hardmodes.

[BlueSkittles]

However, learning from others who have implemented the cross-RDF...it does affect those that don't utilize it, as they nerf them to make them easier for the users of the RDF.

 

Which is why some of us have suggested they keep Nightmare mode versions out of the Dungeon Finder. This way, old-school community people get to do it the old-fashioned way and Bioware can keep them really hard.

[Racheakt]

I think people forget that even if a cross-server LFD was put in the game you can still form groups the same way we do now.

 

The LFD doesn't replace anything.

 

I think the problem is they think it will take away more people forming groups in general fleet chat. -- which is true.

 

In WoW I played a tank, my brother played a healer. We used the LFD to pick up DPS, rarely did we have problems. Runs were friendly and chatty as we enguaged in conversation. I also used the LFD to hone my tanking skills in PUGs, later to go to maintank my guild in ICC.

 

I also think some folks want to be a big fish in a small pond rather than a common fish in the ocean. Nothing wrong with that. And this red herring that without a LFD we can somehow punish the "bads" by denying them groups is silly.

[Touchbass]

anything is better than the current 'spam general for well over an hour and still not find a group' nonsense. this is regardless of class or role. i read the first few pages here and what is up with the false dichotomy? you can have both a lfg tool(cross-server, even) AND choose to find groups, in your current manner. one has nothing to do with the other. i just want to run the content and anything that saves me the hours of finding ANY group would be superb. playing the actual game trumps community, imo. i'd rather get the small percentage of jerks, like i do in wow, and get to play than wait because some self-aggrandizing people think it will affect them. or, get rid of warzone queues.

 

Thanks for the post Ianroyal, we're posting on behalf of people like you Unfortunately Bioware is blocking a lot of our efforts at the moment but just like in WoW, we'll avail.

[Trenyc]

I think people forget that even if a cross-server LFD was put in the game you can still form groups the same way we do now.

 

The LFD doesn't replace anything.

 

Not the best argument ever. The number of people willing to go on dungeon runs is already limited now. If you put in a cross-server LFG tool, a lot of people will use it. That substantially reduces the pool of people who are willing to wait for a group to be thrown together using normal channels.

[Touchbass]

Here's the issue. 5 mans or 4 mans in this game can never be truly challenging due to the variety of classes/specs in the game. For example in WoW if they made a boss enrage so quickly that it required an insane DPS check, it would make having a Mage or Shaman mandatory for heroism which speeds up your haste. You can only truly start to balance stuff around the 10 player mark.

 

Also, in WoW if you don't elect to choose a X-LFD you won't receive the 15% bonus so the dungeon will actually be semi-difficult if you don't over gear it. Also, champion style timed modes are coming to WoW

[Joretur]

Hardmodes.

Those get nerfed as well, as people then start complaining that they can't do the same stuff others are doing. It just continues until you end up with Panda Land

[Doriath]

I wouldnt mind dungeon finder as long as it sticks to realm only.Make it easier to get groups together.

[BlueSkittles]

Those get nerfed as well, as people then start complaining that they can't do the same stuff others are doing. It just continues until you end up with Panda Land

 

No, they get nerfed in the normal progression scheme Blizzard has set up. As more and more guilds hit a wall and after the super-hardcore guilds are already farming the hardest content, it's only logical to add a slight nerf to allow more and more people to experience the content. NOT because people are whining.

[Touchbass]

Not the best argument ever. The number of people willing to go on dungeon runs is already limited now. If you put in a cross-server LFG tool, a lot of people will use it. That substantially reduces the pool of people who are willing to wait for a group to be thrown together using normal channels.

 

They don't have to wait around, they have guilds and the laundry list of friends they've made so they can get a group in 2 minutes easily. That is unless they have been lying about their current situation.

Edited January 29, 2012 by Touchbass

[Darkulous]

Thanks for the post Ianroyal, we're posting on behalf of people like you Unfortunately Bioware is blocking a lot of our efforts at the moment but just like in WoW, we'll avail.

 

After playing this game since release I played some WoW the last couple days and it was.....Refreshing. It's a great feeling to have ACCESS to ALL the content with the push of a button. Don't get me wrong, I like TOR and it has huge potential but its content right now is limited. Limited by server population, faction population, planet population and fleet population. Accessibility is the issue.

[Darkulous]

Not the best argument ever. The number of people willing to go on dungeon runs is already limited now. If you put in a cross-server LFG tool, a lot of people will use it. That substantially reduces the pool of people who are willing to wait for a group to be thrown together using normal channels.

 

"a lot of people will use it"

 

That's why they need to put it in.

[HoopzMV]

Asking for a LFD tool and having some good points in why we should have it is good and all, but what then if we do eventually convince Bioware to go with X-LFD? Yes, it'd be ideal to where we can choose to queue for X-server or same server, but to be honest, to me it sounds a little bit naive to think just having the option for same server will help; unless the bonuses for doing same server outweigh wanting to do X-server, then I don't see same server really being at all helpful.

 

The LFD tool is just for convenience sake to help more people get into the MMO content. I see more people wanting to do X-server than same server when, more than likely, the queues may be a lot shorter than the queues for same server; for there will be a lot more people to be able to group within the X-server queues. As there are a lot of players that don't really have the ability to play during prime time and the normal hours.

 

In my honest opinion, if any LFD tool is to be added, it really should be for Hardmode FPs; since with of how leveling is, it's optional to run FPs, while you can still easily level to 50, with just questing alone. For it's ridiculously easy to be overleveled for a planet, if you make sure: to do the bonus/side quests to the quests, do space dailies, and do the Bonus Series quests on the planet. Note of how I didn't mention Heroics/Area quests in that list, because they are optional to do, and if you do them, like FPs, they will easily help outlevel you for planets.

[Neiloch]

Not the best argument ever. The number of people willing to go on dungeon runs is already limited now. If you put in a cross-server LFG tool, a lot of people will use it. That substantially reduces the pool of people who are willing to wait for a group to be thrown together using normal channels.

 

How can anyone justify restricting an option people would PREFER to use so a lesser option remains the norm?

[Touchbass]

The number of people willing to go on dungeon runs is already limited now. If you put in a cross-server LFG tool, a lot of people will use it. That substantially reduces the pool of people who are willing to ...wait for a group by asking in /fleet for hours

 

That sounds like a great logic

Edited January 29, 2012 by Touchbass

[Touchbass]

How can anyone justify restricting an option people would PREFER to use so a lesser option remains the norm?

 

I had to scratch my head a few times while looking at that too

[Touchbass]

Asking for a LFD tool and having some good points in why we should have it is good and all, but what then if we do eventually convince Bioware to go with X-LFD? Yes, it'd be ideal to where we can choose to queue for X-server or same server, but to be honest, to me it sounds a little bit naive to think just having the option for same server will help; unless the bonuses for doing same server outweigh wanting to do X-server, then I don't see same server really being at all helpful.

People from populated servers need to help faction imbalances and low population server. There has to be a wait penatly if there is a same server option

The LFD tool is just for convenience sake to help more people get into the MMO content. I see more people wanting to do X-server than same server when, more than likely, the queues may be a lot shorter than the queues for same server; for there will be a lot more people to be able to group within the X-server queues. As there are a lot of players that don't really have the ability to play during prime time and the normal hours.

 

So true. Everyday more and more people are coming to this conclusion

 

In my honest opinion, if any LFD tool is to be added, it really should be for Hardmode FPs; since with of how leveling is, it's optional to run FPs, while you can still easily level to 50, with just questing alone. For it's ridiculously easy to be overleveled for a planet, if you make sure: to do the bonus/side quests to the quests, do space dailies, and do the Bonus Series quests on the planet. Note of how I didn't mention Heroics/Area quests in that list, because they are optional to do, and if you do them, like FPs, they will easily help outlevel you for planets.

 

 

Bioware wasted a lot of resources on those leveling FP's, many people would actually like to see them. People need them desperately for all FP's. On some servers it's impossible to find regular lvl 50 cause the player bubble has moved on to HM's.

 

When you have a ladder system of progress like regular instances --> Hard modes, when the player bubble moves PAST the regular instances you're basically SOL trying to get groups for them. That is why a X-LFD is needed and will be implemented

Edited January 29, 2012 by Touchbass