Sorcerers are becoming the next Bright Wizards

[Jest]

Thats because most did not know Op's were the burst class,but they sure did know the inquis/sorc was stun,heal,bubble,damage etc and everyone wanted to be the reincarnation of Darth Maul.

 

So what happened when the Op's showed up the "Kids" said no no nooo we cannot let this happen,we were meant to be the true burst class,that is what they want,they always do,but they want everything with all the effects.

 

Human's are selfish animals,get to over 30 or better yet 40 years of age (You may be i do not know,there is selfish people at all ages too) and you know all there is about 14 to early 20 year olds and the expectations and false illusions they have,it's not their fault,its part of growing up.

 

So the cycle continues in the mmo world of dumbing down and nerfs with little understanding and developers cater to the lowest common.

 

Sorcs/Inquis is that class in this game period.

 

Anyone who thinks a Sage/Sorc is a "burst class" clearly doesn't know what the meaning of Burst is. Balance/Madness Sage/Sorcs work much more like Warlocks from WoW and Tele/Lighning Sage/Sorcs work a bit more like Mages. Neither of those specs affords the ability to explode an enemy in a <5 GCDs unless there's a significant Gear/Level discrepancy.

 

Ops were complained about by everyone.. including Scoundrels because there's a number of things that made them too much, NOT just their DPS output. things like not having to be perfectly behind their target to get the backstab ability off. DPS output is the most obvious complaint because it was screamed the loudest but check the Repub vs Imp imbalance threads and you'll see plenty of other things that when combined with High DPS output, had them stronger than they should be.

 

A Class needs to be balanced if A) They can kill any other class easily in a 1v1 and/or B) They can kill multiple other classes simultaneously, easily.

 

Sorcs/Sages can not do that. Everyone complains about when you get multiples in a WZ but that's honestly true of any class. JK's/SW's can Force leap to you one after the other and essentially keep you stunned without setting off resolve and kill you before you can do anything.

 

Multiple BH's can spread their AoE out and smash the snot out of multiple enemy players.

 

Multiple Gunslingers/Snipers can burst coordinate and burn guys down insanely quick, from a distance, no sweat. And they have much higher single target DPS than any Sorc/Sage. There's just fewer of them because they're a P.I.T.A. to level.

 

The screams for Sorc/Sage nerfs started early on due to their relative strength at early levels compared to other classes. Ops/Scoundrel nerf calls came quickly and loudly and completely replaced Sorc/Sage calls because it was THAT extreme of an imbalance.

 

Now we're back to Sorc/Sage nerf calls because people still don't understand the class. That and there's a lot of angry Smugglers/IA's who want to bring someone down with them.

[Cegenaus]

Oil so your saying mercs are not one spell wounder I win healing , high very high dps aoeing heavy armor using spider healing op fotm class.

Hahahahahaha

 

i am saying arsenal is not a one skill class nor heavy on the healing. dps is all we have and im pretty sure sorc is the FOTM class tbh

 

btw, english, learn it

[Sathid]

Anyone who thinks a Sage/Sorc is a "burst class" clearly doesn't know what the meaning of Burst is. Balance/Madness Sage/Sorcs work much more like Warlocks from WoW and Tele/Lighning Sage/Sorcs work a bit more like Mages. Neither of those specs affords the ability to explode an enemy in a <5 GCDs unless there's a significant Gear/Level discrepancy.

 

Ops were complained about by everyone.. including Scoundrels because there's a number of things that made them too much, NOT just their DPS output. things like not having to be perfectly behind their target to get the backstab ability off. DPS output is the most obvious complaint because it was screamed the loudest but check the Repub vs Imp imbalance threads and you'll see plenty of other things that when combined with High DPS output, had them stronger than they should be.

 

A Class needs to be balanced if A) They can kill any other class easily in a 1v1 and/or B) They can kill multiple other classes simultaneously, easily.

 

Sorcs/Sages can not do that. Everyone complains about when you get multiples in a WZ but that's honestly true of any class. JK's/SW's can Force leap to you one after the other and essentially keep you stunned without setting off resolve and kill you before you can do anything.

 

Multiple BH's can spread their AoE out and smash the snot out of multiple enemy players.

 

Multiple Gunslingers/Snipers can burst coordinate and burn guys down insanely quick, from a distance, no sweat. And they have much higher single target DPS than any Sorc/Sage. There's just fewer of them because they're a P.I.T.A. to level.

 

The screams for Sorc/Sage nerfs started early on due to their relative strength at early levels compared to other classes. Ops/Scoundrel nerf calls came quickly and loudly and completely replaced Sorc/Sage calls because it was THAT extreme of an imbalance.

 

Now we're back to Sorc/Sage nerf calls because people still don't understand the class. That and there's a lot of angry Smugglers/IA's who want to bring someone down with them.

 

I never said they were a burst class,they do however slow burn,all that matters is time,the end is the same.

[Jest]

I never said they were a burst class,they do however slow burn,all that matters is time,the end is the same.

 

I wasn't saying you called them burst. I was saying that those who think "we should be the burst class" in regards to Sorcs/Sages have no clue what's going on.

 

And yes Sorc/Sage dmg is sustained. That makes it much easier to fight through and heal through. For the relative survivability that's a good thing for maintaining balance.

 

Give any class time and they'll kill you. The object is to not allow that.

[Sathid]

I wasn't saying you called them burst. I was saying that those who think "we should be the burst class" in regards to Sorcs/Sages have no clue what's going on.

 

And yes Sorc/Sage dmg is sustained. That makes it much easier to fight through and heal through. For the relative survivability that's a good thing for maintaining balance.

 

Give any class time and they'll kill you. The object is to not allow that.

 

Sustained verse a true burst like my class,but you also have a bubble that can mitigate my initial burst making it null and void and then i cannot use it again unless i use my get out of jail free card Vanish that is on a two minute timer,what you are claiming or not seeing is that the Sorc is the one class that eat's up many classes,not the smuggler classes,and you would know that if you are doing the 50 brackets.

 

Inquis/Sorc and most tanks now if even geared can kill the op's class,that is fact.

So how many classes is that four? yah thats balance.

[Auxili]

Look, another one of these threads. OP, like every other person qqing about Sorc, simply needs to practice PvP.

 

shield lasts through one dps rotation. So, in about 6s, you can burn down the shield. You then have 14 seconds to pump out enough dps to kill a cloth-wearing caster. Can't do it? Ur Bad.

 

Probably the worst thing I've seen written in this thread.

 

You know how energy and ammo works, right? We dont have a pool of mana to work with. If we use a burst damage rotation on your shield (which is what everyone has to do to break it), then we're at a deficit.

[Bastion-fox]

I wish I could spec and have a 120% speed boost on a 20s CD.

I wish I could have a shield that absorbs damage and then stuns when broken.

I wish I could snare from 30m with no CD.

I wish I could knockback all surrounding enemies 20m.

I wish my AoE knockback rooted my enemies.

I wish I had an instant 30m CC that stuns when broken.

I wish I had all of that in one spec like Sorcs do.

[Zarthorn]

All classes are overpowered if you do not capitalize on their weaknesses. Most of the people who are claiming sorc are overpowered are not doing that.

 

I have gotten over 600k damage in voidstar 5 times but it has nothing to do with me being good or playing an overpowered class. It everything to do with the other team letting me. When I face good teams, I need to push to do half that much damage as it is hard to DPS when some melee is continually trying to shove their lightsaber down my throat.

 

just interupt right? does not stop my grav spamming commando, just means I use another ability until grav comes back.

 

Just LOS? ok ill bombard the corner you ducked around with mortar volley or you know walk around back into los?

 

poor arguements aplenty.

[Orlylol]

Its not growing pains m8. The class is overpowered in its current form and anyone with half a braincell knows it.

 

The only people who deny it are the Sorcs themselves and they arent biased much.

 

totally agree

[Slurmez]

Its not growing pains m8. The class is overpowered in its current form and anyone with half a braincell knows it.

 

The only people who deny it are the Sorcs themselves and they arent biased much.

 

this

 

problem is you can be effective either dps or healing regardless of spec with significant survivability

 

I built mine DPS but I can still heal and support incredibly effectively, yeah its not as good as a heal spec one obviouslybut its still too much. Warhammer had DPS tactics which built in a heal debuff so you couldnt fill two roles as easily

[Feebish]

The only thing about Sorc/Sage that needs to be looked at is healing. To see it take 2 or 3 people to take one down because they heal for sooo much is a little crazy.. otherwise I think they are fine, but maybe that's just me.

 

Let me just clear this up for you.

 

Yes its hard for 2-3 people to kill a heal spec Sorc/Sage with guard and a tank assisting them. If you can't bring down a DPS sorc with 3 *********** people you are terrible. They cannot heal for ****.

 

I assure you that without guard, and without healing spec, it is not difficult to bring them down. The "Uber Bubble" shields for less damage then most abilities do if they crit.

 

The main issue people are having is a completely delusional image of the class. People see heal specs and go wow they heal a lot, then they see DPS specs and go wow they have good DPS, and then the smash them together into some kind of Super-Sorc that doesn't exist and claim that they are good at everything all the time.

 

Hybrid specs allow decent single target healing (that is completely unsustainable) with sustainable 'average' damage. DPS specs allow more damage. Healing specs allow AoE and sustainable healing.

 

What I think is happening is that people are seeing Hybrid spec sorcs who completely outgear them and are whining about why they're having such a hard time killing them 1v1. I play a Jedi Sage, and a full heal spec to boot. I play the most survivable, sustainable talent spec of a Sage that exists and I explode into itty bitty pieces if I get targeted by a Merc, OP, or Sentinel.

 

Another piece of advice. You should need more then one person to kill a healer. This concept you people think of as balance for Sages where you can just walk up to them and say "**** YOU" and 1v1 them in 5 seconds is completely asinine. A healer has always had to be more survivable then your glass cannon DPS because they are always focused. Remember that a hybrid spec Sorc has good single target healing. You wont solo them. You shouldn't be able to solo them. It's really as easy as having one other person use interrupts interchangeably with you.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Feebish

[benedryl]

The wrong class was nerfed first basically.

 

I view the Operative/Scoundrel as more of a nuisance, with a big burst that isn't that difficult to live through(this forum is filled with massive exaggeration on how powerful the class truly is).

 

The Sorcerer on the other hand is just ridiculous, the way the game is played right now, I would rather have a Sorc on my team than an Operative, they have way more utility and burst damage doesn't win Warzones, utility does.

 

If the Operative/Scoundrel were as close to as overpowered as this forum would have you believe, the Warzones would have 10 of those each game, however the only class that is consistently getting a 50%+ representation in warzones is the Sorc, and we all know why.

[EternalFinality]

Sorcs are absolutely overpowered, not easy to kill, and put out too much damage and/or healing while retaining insane utility.

 

1 on 1 Sorcs are not overpowered.

 

In group PvP they sure as hell are. Which occurs more often in this game?

Edited January 27, 2012 by EternalFinality

[Raijinvince]

this

 

problem is you can be effective either dps or healing regardless of spec with significant survivability

 

I built mine DPS but I can still heal and support incredibly effectively, yeah its not as good as a heal spec one obviouslybut its still too much. Warhammer had DPS tactics which built in a heal debuff so you couldnt fill two roles as easily

 

This is absurd. If your one 3 second mediocre heal that's 100% susceptible to setback is really too strong, then EVERY spec with a healing tree is too strong. There's nothing unique or special about the healing of a sorc with 0 points in the healing tree.

 

The only real problem with sorcs is the amount of CC/snares/etc available in a half Lightning half Madness build. The healing in that build is pathetic, and the damage is very much non-bursty and comparable with any other dps build.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Raijinvince

[Sathid]

Let me just clear this up for you.

 

Yes its hard for 2-3 people to kill a heal spec Sorc/Sage with guard and a tank assisting them. If you can't bring down a DPS sorc with 3 *********** people you are terrible. They cannot heal for ****.

 

I assure you that without guard, and without healing spec, it is not difficult to bring them down. The "Uber Bubble" shields for less damage then most abilities do if they crit.

 

The main issue people are having is a completely delusional image of the class. People see heal specs and go wow they heal a lot, then they see DPS specs and go wow they have good DPS, and then the smash them together into some kind of Super-Sorc that doesn't exist and claim that they are good at everything.

 

Hybrid specs allow decent single target healing (that is completely unsustainable) with sustainable damage 'average' damage. DPS specs allow more damage. Healing specs allow AoE and sustainable healing.

 

What I think is happening is that people are seeing Hybrid spec sorcs who completely outgear them and are whining about why they're having such a hard time killing them. I play a Jedi Sage, and a full heal spec to boot. I play the most survivable, sustainable talent spec of a Sage that exists and I explode into itty bitty pieces if I get targeted by a Merc, OP, or Sentinel.

 

Another piece of advice. You should need more then one person to kill a healer. This concept you people think of as balance for Sages where you can just walk up to them and say "**** YOU" and 1v1 them in 5 seconds is completely asinine. A healer has always had to be more survivable then your glass cannon DPS because they are always focused. Remember that a hybrid spec Sorc has good single target healing. You wont solo them. You shouldn't be able to solo them. It's really as easy as having one other person use interrupts interchangeably with you.

 

So your admitting that it takes two to three people to take down an inquis/Sorc sorry but thats not the way this game was intended and with multiple of these toons in WZ's like the Imperials always have is very very unbalanced,everyone see's it,but the fact of the matter is,is that you guys are 60% of the given population across the board when i do Wz's atleast.

 

Then you guys have the audacity to call for nerfs on the smugglers,just unbelievable.

[Raijinvince]

So your admitting that it takes two to three people to take down an inquis/Sorc sorry but thats not the way this game was intended and with multiple of these toons in WZ's like the Imperials always have is very very unbalanced,everyone see's it,but the fact of the matter is,is that you guys are 60% of the given population across the board when i do Wz's atleast.

 

Then you guys have the audacity to call for nerfs on the smugglers,just unbelievable.

 

Any heal spec'd class should, and does, require more than 1 person to take them down assuming all things equal (gear, skill, etc). He was saying healer, not a dps spec'd sorc. Also, why do you keep saying inquis/sorc? Do you mean sage/sorc?

 

Here's his quote:

 

Let me just clear this up for you.

 

Yes its hard for 2-3 people to kill a heal spec Sorc/Sage with guard and a tank assisting them. If you can't bring down a DPS sorc with 3 *********** people you are terrible. They cannot heal for ****.

 

I assure you that without guard, and without healing spec, it is not difficult to bring them down. The "Uber Bubble" shields for less damage then most abilities do if they crit.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Raijinvince

[Sathid]

This is absurd. If your one 3 second mediocre heal that's 100% susceptible to setback is really too strong, then EVERY spec with a healing tree is too strong. There's nothing unique or special about the healing of a sorc with 0 points in the healing tree.

 

The only real problem with sorcs is the amount of CC/snares/etc available in a half Lightning half Madness build. The healing in that build is pathetic, and the damage is very much non-bursty and comparable with any other dps build.

 

YOu have stuns to use to then heal,i can never get my mediocre heal off,it would be pointless to even try but people see it routinely with the sorcs/inquis.

[Rallic]

i am saying arsenal is not a one skill class nor heavy on the healing. dps is all we have and im pretty sure sorc is the FOTM class tbh

 

btw, english, learn it

 

Ya that's why my guild just retooled onto the pub side of are sever out of the 20 or so doing it I rolled a gunslinger the rest commandos some heals for spider healing the rest dps. Lol are spec group is nothing but commandos , but ya they are not op at all.

[Raijinvince]

YOu have stuns to use to then heal,i can never get my mediocre heal off,it would be pointless to even try but people see it routinely with the sorcs/inquis.

 

One stun that lasts 4 seconds. Even if they begin the cast asap, that's 1.5 gcd wait time and a 3 second cast. Meaning maybe if you don't break the stun AND don't have a range interrupt, they can get 1 heal off for...maybe 2500 - 3k...IF it crits.

 

And in the quote of mine, I'm telling you the 20/21 Light/Madness builds do have too much CC. I propose moving at least one of them to deep healing. But the healing they have in dps spec is pathetic, and honestly NOT the problem you're having. Or heck, even get rid of one like the blind on shield break. I honestly believe that only a small tweak to the CC in the lightning/madness build is necessary to bring sorcs in line. I don't actually believe that there's any problem with deep healing builds. I consistently find other classes with competing healing totals at the end of a wz.

Edited January 27, 2012 by Raijinvince

[Cegenaus]

Ya that's why my guild just retooled onto the pub side of are sever out of the 20 or so doing it I rolled a gunslinger the rest commandos some heals for spider healing the rest dps. Lol are spec group is nothing but commandos , but ya they are not op at all.

 

lolwut?

[Koderius]

I think the ppl who are playing that class are either blind of seriously mentally challenge to deny that your class have way too much utilities for just one class.

 

Like one of the poster said since the nerf of OP/Soundrel is coming more and more you are seeing just sorcerer in WZ.

 

The only weakness of the Sorcerer are the player behind his keyboard. I start to lvl one almost 50 now and the only class that is giving me a hard time in WZ is a sentinel or marauder.

 

But the sorcerer can keep lying to themself.

[Foch]

I love this!! once Ops get nerfed, sorcerers wont be able to quickly try to deflect to Ops needing nerfs..

Everyone playing sorc cause they are now the FOTM class after Ops will be nerfed, and good!!

Edited January 27, 2012 by Foch

[Sathid]

I think the ppl who are playing that class are either blind of seriously mentally challenge to deny that your class have way too much utilities for just one class.

 

Like one of the poster said since the nerf of OP/Soundrel is coming more and more you are seeing just sorcerer in WZ.

 

The only weakness of the Sorcerer are the player behind his keyboard. I start to lvl one almost 50 now and the only class that is giving me a hard time in WZ is a sentinel or marauder.

 

But the sorcerer can keep lying to themself.

 

I rolled one last week to get a better understanding of the class,i do not wish to see any class unbalanced,apparently my main is getting the bat hard soon so im off to have what remaining time i have to play it in Wz's.

 

The inmates are running the asylum.

[Piriste]

I wish I could spec and have a 120% speed boost on a 20s CD.

I wish I could have a shield that absorbs damage and then stuns when broken.

I wish I could snare from 30m with no CD.

I wish I could knockback all surrounding enemies 20m.

I wish my AoE knockback rooted my enemies.

I wish I had an instant 30m CC that stuns when broken.

I wish I had all of that in one spec like Sorcs do.

 

this.

[Piriste]

I love this!! one Ops get nerfed, sorcerers wont be able to quickly try to deflect to Ops needed nerfs..

Everyone playing sorcers cause they are now the FOTM class after Ops will be nerfed, and good!!

 

Ops/Scoundrels never were FoTM.. they were just overpowered.

 

FoTM requires more than 20 people playing the class.