Nymaeria Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 No, I'm not missing the point. What is so epic about deciding to do kill x, retrieve y, and kill z amount of mobs in a different location any different than the original place you started? All the quests, all the progression, all the leveling paths...whether you roll a gnome and go to darnassus, roll an orc and go to Taurus, ect...to level...its the exact same thing. There really isn't any freedom in the game, you are bound by what level you are as to where you go, and quite honestly, in some areas...you are forced to go to other areas due to lack of quests. Not exactly freedom in my book. You ARE missing the point. OP was asking if the world was going to open up like WoW's or if it was going to stay on the same 1-track road the whole way. WoW has tracks, it's not "freedom" nor do I think many people are saying it is. The point that you are most definitely missing is that WoW has . . . let's say, 8 different tracks while SWTOR has 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daekarus Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I can go to Warzones and PvP whenever I want too in TOR... what's your point? EVE is not a sandbox, it's an illusion of one. Until you have a ship powerful enough to survive... i.e. be High level. Just like all MMOs. I played EVE for 2 years. Don't tell me what I know. You must've missed a lot in your time there. Some people join nullsec corps right away and move out there for corp ops immediately. They can mine immediately, and PVP in groups immediately too. Will they be more effective as they get their fitting skills maxed? Of course. But really... to claim it's an illusion of a sandbox... by that standard, real life isn't a sandbox because you have some measure of progression even if you jump from place to place. Honestly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Yeah and you can go fight level 40 mobs at level 10 in this game. Doesn't mean it's a sandbox game. The difference is that when I play TOR I have the feeling that I'm playing a single player game with co-op capability. The linear progression is so blatant I might as well be playing KoTOR. 90% of all content is developer driven as opposed to Eve's player driven. I compare Eve and galaxies to TOR because those are my most recent MMO experiences. I've never played wow so I can't really use that as a comparison. When I think of Sandbox, I think of player involvement/interaction. I've made peace with the fact that TOR isn't sandbox, but I didn't really expect it to be so in-your-face about it. Edited January 24, 2012 by Minack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Does anyone else have this feeling like the game is controling them instead of you controlling the game?? I've never experienced that in this or any other video game I've ever played. That's a very strange, and I would think, creepy feeling. It would really unnerve me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BothanFourTwenty Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 That f***ing balloon to the datacron. I love that balloon. I can't count how many Republic players have accepted duels with me just to get stunned then knocked off the thing lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarjarloves Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Hoth and Tatooine are two of the emptiest zones in this game. Why do people keep praising them for being so large, when all that size is empty space? Across all of Hoth, only the Star of Coruscant is a notewothy landmark. On Tatooine? Can you name one landmark on Tatooine? The Sarlacc pit; you know, I didn't even see the pit, and I've got the whole damn map explored. At least try to promote some of SWTOR's stronger zones. They definitely could have. GW's %damage based system (I'm not familiar with it, only have heard reference of) would have been better suited to the multiplanet structure basically forced by the IP. Outlaws Den, The Dune Sea and Anchorhead come to mind. Oh and the Sarlac Pit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proto Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I am only lvl 13 or so but I just can't get into this game. I always have a feeling of being led like a dog on a chain because the worlds/quest enviroments are so linear. I always feel like I am being led down a tunnel, and at the end the next quest starts that will further lead me down another tunnel and maybe this one has a 90 degree turn. I dont have the feeling like I am in a world that I can go anywhere I please like in other mmorpgs I have played. Does it get better at higher lvls? Should I stick with the game? Does anyone else have this feeling like the game is controling them instead of you controlling the game?? Thanks in advance for your feedback It will also be like this for every character you create. Even if you go with a totally different class, the zones and NPC's you will talk to and the areas you'll go to are nearly identical besides voiceover. Even some of the quests are pretty much the same. It makes you wonder where the hell they spent all that money because if you take away 'star wars' and voice acting, you're left with a game that wouldn't even succeed if it was F2P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ansultares Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Most of Kalimdor is empty space as well. 60% of the area you NEVER even set foot on because the majority is just filler and not quest related at all. Unless of course you just WANT to run down past that line of trees because it may be a shortcut to where you are going. Just because it has trees everywhere and critters running around that does not equal content. So basically both games are exactly the same. I think we are all in agreement on that point.Again, you may not have bothered, but there was content there. Except for Azshara; release Azshara felt like so many SWTOR zones do. For example, I'm a Night Elf; I can follow an all-elf quest line up and down Kalimdor. Or, if I rolled undead, it's all over northern eastern kingdoms. Humans? Southern eastern kingdoms, crossing over with some of that undead content in northern eastern kingdoms. Dwarves? Mostly along the eastern side of eastern kingdoms. Orcs and Tauren got lumped in somewhat, but Barrens was absolutely massive, plus it had Tanaris, which most alliance would skip. Each of these had five plus zones, most of which you probably overlook because you probably took a fairly consistent path through the game as soon as you felt you could. You can say that SWTOR zones are bigger, but these zones had so many more quests, so many more interesting camps to clear through, and was far less punishing on explorers for having far fewer dead-ends (really it had practically no dead ends, but w/e). Like I said, it wasn't until my fourth and fifth 60s that I even bothered to explore all this content that I had left ignored, that had been sitting there since release. Edited January 24, 2012 by Ansultares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surakis Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Hoth and Tatooine are two of the emptiest zones in this game. Why do people keep praising them for being so large, when all that size is empty space? Across all of Hoth, only the Star of Coruscant is a notewothy landmark. On Tatooine? Can you name one landmark on Tatooine? The Sarlacc pit; you know, I didn't even see the pit, and I've got the whole damn map explored. You might have to turn the monitor back on while exploring then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surakis Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 The difference is that when I play TOR I have the feeling that I'm playing a single player game with co-op capability. And that is what moving goal posts looks like. Crush a point being made and suddenly they're off to make another, irrelevant point. /golfclap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) And that is what moving goal posts looks like. Crush a point being made and suddenly they're off to make another, irrelevant point. /golfclap Yes because the blatantly linear aspect of TOR couldn't possibly affect the way the game feels when played. Let me move that goalpost just a little closer for you... Edited January 24, 2012 by Minack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jswizzle Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 The single player with co-op was last weeks catch phrase. Or so I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surakis Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Yes because the linear aspect of TOR couldn't possibly affect the way the game feels when played. Let me move that goalpost just a little closer for you... That wasn't the point being made. I countered that just being able to fight in areas where your are effectively out-leveled doesn't make the game non-linear or a sandbox game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 The single player with co-op was last weeks catch phrase. Or so I thought. You're right. It's about as stale as TOR's endgame right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discosoc Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Load of crap. WoW is just as linear as any other MMO. I think what he means is that in WoW, you have options for where you level. There are usually 2 or 3 different zone in any given level range to choose from. In that aspect, there are more leveling options available. The difference is that the story in WoW is faction and zone dependent, and in SWTOR it is class dependent. When you level up in WoW, it doesn't matter if you are a Paladin or a Warlock or whatever; you will experience the same story and questline as everyone else there, for better or for worse. In SWTOR, as you progress through your story, you get absolutely no reference to what else is going on in the galaxy. There are no side remarks in conversations about how "recent intelligence from an Imperial Agent has provided us with an opening" or whatever, which subtly tie the stories together. The end result is kind of the same though. In WoW, you would inevitably move from one zone to another, experiencing a loosly-connected plot line. When you roll a new character, you can choose to level in a different set of zones. In SWTOR, the same is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnoggyMack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Let me move that goalpost just a little closer for you... Cundiff will still miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Birdmen Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Load of crap. WoW is just as linear as any other MMO. Just not as linear as this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheFieryBalrog Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 All games are linear. Look up the definition. All games essentially put you in a giant box. You can't leave the box, you can't do anything other than what is programmed into the game. False. Linearity is a spectrum. Saying "all games are linear" is meaningless and entirely ignores how people use the word with respect to games. I suggest you learn a little about game design before making flat-out false statements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jswizzle Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 False. Linearity is a spectrum. Saying "all games are linear" is meaningless and entirely ignores how people use the word with respect to games. I suggest you learn a little about game design before making flat-out false statements. Did you just make that up? lol Linear is from the latin. Drawn by lines. It's a mathematics term Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannic Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) How is this different from any other MMO? Play Eve Online. Theme-park isn't the only model for an MMO. MMO's don't even have to have levels. Progression can be a money-based progression rather than levels. End game can be designed around players and guild politics rather than instanced content. There are no established rules for how things have to be other than there needs to be the ability for many players to play the game online at the same time. The problem is there are 3 million MMO'ers out there who started with WoW and think WoW is synonymous with "MMO" even though WoW is just one type of MMO. WoW is just the one that all the big publishers copy because it worked for Blizzard. (Note, it hasn't really worked that well for anyone else, but apparently they don't take note of that.) Edited January 24, 2012 by Mannic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) That wasn't the point being made. I countered that just being able to fight in areas where your are effectively out-leveled doesn't make the game non-linear or a sandbox game. You didn't counter anything. You quoted my post in response to what someone else said about Eve being an illusion. In Eve, if I go to nullsec and loot/salvage wrecks (hell, even fight others) I'm actually considered part of the game. In TOR if I go to Ilum at level 17 and loot chests it's considered an exploit. See the difference? Edited January 24, 2012 by Minack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minack Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Cundiff will still miss. Dayum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sevev Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I am only lvl 13 or so but I just can't get into this game. I always have a feeling of being led like a dog on a chain because the worlds/quest enviroments are so linear. I always feel like I am being led down a tunnel, and at the end the next quest starts that will further lead me down another tunnel and maybe this one has a 90 degree turn. I dont have the feeling like I am in a world that I can go anywhere I please like in other mmorpgs I have played. Does it get better at higher lvls? Should I stick with the game? Does anyone else have this feeling like the game is controling them instead of you controlling the game?? Thanks in advance for your feedback I know what you can do instead, go play Star Wars Galaxies...... oh wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azzras Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Only lvl 13.... /thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deewe Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 We've been knowing since a long time the game would be on rails. Devs stated many times, in TOR choices matters. You choose your Class then: - Your character'species are limited - Your choice of type of weapon is defined and unique - Your type of gear is defined - Your gear color palette is defined - Your space ship chassis is defined - Your companions are set - Your character bio and story s defined Well in fact choices matters so much that you only have one choice: your class. then you are mostly on rails. Other example in say, Wow, your character can choose to use an axe or a sword or a pole arm. In TOR most of the classes don't even have a choice of weapon types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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